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  • #16
    Originally posted by draftguru151
    The original poster made the question sound completely different. It is if everything is the same except the QB throws more in one and less in the other. Same OL, same QB, same offense, same WR, same everything, except one throws 40 times and one throws 30. It is quite obvious the guy who throws 40 times will be sacked more often.
    Well off-course. But I don't think that was his question.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by draftguru151
      The original poster made the question sound completely different.
      Did I? Lets see...
      Originally posted by draftguru151
      If a QB throws more passes he will be sacked more, that's just plain common sense.
      No, it is not just "plain common sense". If a QB throws more, he has the POTENTIAL to be sacked more... you keep saying "he will be sacked more", and it just isnt true. You're making it a fact, and it isnt a fact.

      It has a lot to do with other factors.

      The only way a QB will NEVER get sacked is if he NEVER passes the ball. No team in the history of the NFL has gone a full 16 games without attempting a pass, and there's a good chance it wont happen in the future. A QB can throw 500 times in a season and never be sacked, while another QB throws once and get sacked during his only attempt. You CAN NOT make it a fact... you CAN NOT say "if a QB throws more passes he will be sacked more"... because it IS NOT TRUE. You make hypothetical situations, and i've given you one there (in bold). If you bring real life situations into it, i've already proved it.
      Originally posted by draftguru151
      If a QB throws more passes he will be sacked more, that's just plain common sense.
      That's the argument both you and "baronzeus" were trying to make, and it isnt true.

      Originally posted by draftguru151
      The original poster made the question sound completely different. It is if everything is the same except the QB throws more in one and less in the other. Same OL, same QB, same offense, same WR, same everything, except one throws 40 times and one throws 30. It is quite obvious the guy who throws 40 times will be sacked more often.
      Here... i'll give you an example.

      You're suggesting that if both situations are exactly the same. Lets take a quarter. You're basically saying this:

      "If I flip a quarter 10 times, and if I flip a quarter 20 times, i'll get more tails with 20 flips than 10 flips." And it isnt true. You can flip 20 times and get all heads, and flip 10 times and get all tails. Sure, the chance is 50/50, but it doesn't always maintain a 50/50 percentage. The CHANCE is the same, but the OUTCOME isnt an exact amount.
      Left NFLDC: 20080918.

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      • #18
        obviously if you pass more the odds are your sacks will be higher. however it's not always gonna be true. their are a lot of other variables.

        Sig thanks to mockalicious

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        • #19
          Originally posted by jackalope
          obviously if you pass more the odds are your sacks will be higher. however it's not always gonna be true. their are a lot of other variables.
          My point exactly.

          Of COURSE doing something more increases the odds, but "draftguru" made this statement:
          Originally posted by draftguru151
          If a QB throws more passes he will be sacked more, that's just plain common sense.
          That is a false statement.
          Left NFLDC: 20080918.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by jackalope
            obviously if you pass more the odds are your sacks will be higher. however it's not always gonna be true. their are a lot of other variables.

            such as oline, and tendancies to hold onto the ball..

            guys like culpepper and vick hang on to the ball way to long...


            Go Ravens!

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            • #21
              technically if you're doing the 'all things being equal' stipulation...then if peyton manning drops back 3000 times, he's going to be sacked more than if he dropped back 3 times....which still proves nothing but that point should be correct
              SCA Prowler is my Xbox Live Gamertag
              Fire Caldwell!!!

              Prowler's Newb Guide

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              • #22
                It's a bit of both.

                Understand that the quality of the offensive line and the coaching will be the primary driving factor in the quality of the blocking, or the lack thereof.

                However, every time a player drops back to pass is another time that he could get sacked.

                A team with just as bad an offensive line as another that passes the ball half as much as the other, with all things being equal, will logically have half as many sacks.

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                • #23
                  A lot of factors, but Brett Favre does a good job of scrambling away or just getting away from pressure.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by draftguru151
                    The original poster made the question sound completely different. It is if everything is the same except the QB throws more in one and less in the other. Same OL, same QB, same offense, same WR, same everything, except one throws 40 times and one throws 30. It is quite obvious the guy who throws 40 times will be sacked more often.
                    I dont think that TL has any kind of legit argument against this (TL, I read the whole topic, and your argument is the equivalent of a four year olds). He completely butchered the question in the topic which resulted in a lopsided vote. As a mod, abuse your powers. Please.

                    Sig by rainbeaukid2
                    Originally posted by yodachu
                    Everyone pwns the Rams.

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                    • #25
                      No.....

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                      • #26
                        For the Raiders as an example. Andrew Walter was getting sacked almost every time he dropped back. The team mostly ran the ball b/c our passing game was innefective but every 3rd and long we passed and Walter would get sacked b/c 1) our OL is pathetic 2) he is a statue....thats why he got sacked all day every game, not because the Raiders passed too much...

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by NGSeiler
                          Originally posted by yodachu
                          Bulger's were due to the O-Line being dip-shits for a few weeks.
                          Only a few weeks?
                          No, I was trying to be nice.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by yodachu
                            Originally posted by NGSeiler
                            Originally posted by yodachu
                            Bulger's were due to the O-Line being dip-shits for a few weeks.
                            Only a few weeks?
                            No, I was trying to be nice.
                            A few can be used to classify seventeen.






                            BTW, what thread was this in?


                            Originally posted by Scott Wright
                            Terrellezzzzzzzz Pryorzzzzzzzz!
                            Originally posted by njx9
                            do i tell you when to flip the burger?

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                            • #29
                              How about this one....

                              Take two QB's... Lets say QB #1 is named Hank and QB #2 is Jon Kitna and put them behind the same Oline. Hank will get sacked less because he is not Jon Kitna, Jon Kitna's decisions in the pocket knock his Oline down a notch. I should know, I watched that small handed man play for way too long.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Tubby
                                Originally posted by draftguru151
                                The original poster made the question sound completely different. It is if everything is the same except the QB throws more in one and less in the other. Same OL, same QB, same offense, same WR, same everything, except one throws 40 times and one throws 30. It is quite obvious the guy who throws 40 times will be sacked more often.
                                I dont think that TL has any kind of legit argument against this (TL, I read the whole topic, and your argument is the equivalent of a four year olds). He completely butchered the question in the topic which resulted in a lopsided vote. As a mod, abuse your powers. Please.
                                No... if you read the argument, go back and try again.

                                Originally posted by draftguru151
                                If a QB throws more passes he will be sacked more, that's just plain common sense.
                                That's what he said... that was the argument he was trying to make. And, it isnt true. This is the NFL, and you see it every week. It doesn't matter how many times the QB drops back to pass in the NFL... if Peyton Manning drops back to pass 30 times, he may get sacked once. If Walter drops back to pass 15 times, he may get sacked 3 times. How, after looking at the stats, can you argue this?

                                I'm not going to sit here and say "If a QB has the same everything and drops back to pass 30 times, then 20 times, he'll get sacked more with the 30 times". Why? First of all, this is the NFL. We have proof. We dont need these little hypothetical situations when we have REAL FACTS that we can use. You can sit there and think of all of the imaginary situations you'd like to that help prove your point... but none of them are true and none of them happen. Then, you've got my situation... the NFL. In the NFL, there are many reasons as to why a QB gets sacked... and it IS NOT JUST THE NUMBER OF PASSING ATTEMPTS!

                                Originally posted by draftguru151
                                If a QB throws more passes he will be sacked more, that's just plain common sense.
                                I'll post it again.

                                Originally posted by draftguru151
                                If a QB throws more passes he will be sacked more, that's just plain common sense.
                                That's what he said... that was the argument he was trying to make. "But! But! If he throws it 3,000 times or 5 times!..." NO! That isn't just "more"... "more" is "If he throws it 3,000 times or 2,995 times, is it a FACT that he will be sacked more?" The answer is no. It is not a fact.
                                Left NFLDC: 20080918.

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