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  • Originally posted by thegreatone View Post
    Okay, Joe has definitely shown he could take over. He won us the game in ATL. The defense cost us that one. He played excellent against NE, but Cam went conservative and our D choked. Also, last year him and Rice put the team on their backs against Minnesota (one of the best teams in the NFL that year, at there place), but the D and kicker choked.

    As for the second Pittsburgh game, I'll admit that was a bad throw. But why you have Flacco in the single back formation on 4th down when the o-line was playing terrible and the whole country knew the pass was coming is beyond me, when we all know Flacco is at his best in the shot-gun.

    As for the playoff game, Flacco didn't play great but not many QB's do @ Pittsburgh, but the guy made a great TD throw to Q which was dropped. And for the last drive, Ben is the same way. He'll have 3 bad plays, and than he'll make a brilliant play on 3rd or 4th down, which Joe made. (Housh dropped)

    You got to remember where Joe is coming from. He was supposed to be a project who wouldn't be ready until a couple years. Players have admitted that there are no audibles built in to the offense. How is Flacco supposed to make them? Also, Flacco has said he wants more control and input in the gameplan. Unless you want him to throw tantrums in front of the media, I really don't know what else he can do.

    Its way too early to assume Flacco will only be a 2nd tier QB. That is an absurd assumption for only a 3rd year QB, whose only improved each and every year.

    For a QB who had a bad o-line, terrible OC and a bunch of WR's who don't compliment each other one bit, Flacco had a damn good year.
    I certainly appreciate your optimism and wish I felt the same way. However, as for the audibles, even if they aren't built into the offense, that doesn't mean it is impossible. He can change the play in the huddle, or he can work with the receivers to establish some sort of hot route system. It's not like we run 100 different formations. Say we're in Single back, T-right, slot left - there is nothing that is stopping Joe (besides Cam not wanting him to do it) from stepping back to shotgun, sliding Rice for a protection and calling a new route tree, one new route, or even keeping the same routes and running the play from shotgun where he does, as you pointed out, read the defense better.

    As for Joe taking over in Minnesota, Ray Rice had 10 catches for 117 yards (including a 63 catch and run), which is all on Ray, who also rushed 10 times foe 77 yards and two scores. That was Raymell taking over. One of my biggest problems with Joe is that he consistently dumps the ball of to Rice, who then gets the yards. Yes, he obviously makes good passes to other players, but when his primary read is a hitch route over the middle by the running back, it lets the defense close down over the middle.

    Yes, part of this is Cam calling conservative plays, but it's not like deep routes are eliminated from the playbook. Yeah, we don't have a lot of deep threats, but the receivers have proven they can get deep and make catches down the field. My problems with Joe are 1) he rarely takes those chances, electing to throw the short safe pass instead and 2) despite his huge arm, he is unbelievably inaccurate down the field, often shorting his passes on 1-on-1's down the sideline. Also, he also forces it deep for no reason, when he's got a safety over the top, much like the first Cincinnati game this year (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/201009...als#tab:watch), at ATL (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/201011...cons#tab:watch) and the playoff game at Pitt (I realize I bring up Pitt a lot and its just one game, but he needs to beat them and Big Ben to take his game to the next level)

    Just think about this, Joe threw the ball more than 30 times in 12 games this year (14 counting the playoffs), and threw for 300 yards once, 301 against the worst team in the league (Carolina). That is not a quarterback taking over a game.

    I will give Joe solid props for the Atlanta game. I was very impressed by his performance. He made a key third down pass to Boldin and a great throw to Heap in the endzone, while Rice again had a great catch and run of 20+ yards. Joe had no chance to come back after that last score so I don't blame him at all for that loss. If there was one thing to critique though, it's that he was outplayed by Matt Ryan, who had 0 run game and only Roddy White to rely on, which is really my whole point about Joe. He seems to almost come up short in these big primetime games. Yes, a lot of it has to do with playcalling, but I'm not willing to put all the blame on Cam. Yes, I think Cam is an awful playcaller and needs to be gone. But he's not, so we won't go anywhere until Joe rises above that, which he is fully capable of doing.

    I know a lot of yall will disagree with me. Just understand my frustration. We have had a great team these past three years, but can't beat the best teams, mostly because of our offenses inability. Yes we need new receivers, but three guys with 600+ catches and an above average tight end aren't exactly among the leagues worst. Yes Cam sucks and needs to go, but like I said, coaches coach and players play, and Joe has not played with that fire that the top quarterbacks in the league do play with.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by America View Post
      I certainly appreciate your optimism and wish I felt the same way. However, as for the audibles, even if they aren't built into the offense, that doesn't mean it is impossible. He can change the play in the huddle, or he can work with the receivers to establish some sort of hot route system. It's not like we run 100 different formations. Say we're in Single back, T-right, slot left - there is nothing that is stopping Joe (besides Cam not wanting him to do it) from stepping back to shotgun, sliding Rice for a protection and calling a new route tree, one new route, or even keeping the same routes and running the play from shotgun where he does, as you pointed out, read the defense better.

      As for Joe taking over in Minnesota, Ray Rice had 10 catches for 117 yards (including a 63 catch and run), which is all on Ray, who also rushed 10 times foe 77 yards and two scores. That was Raymell taking over. One of my biggest problems with Joe is that he consistently dumps the ball of to Rice, who then gets the yards. Yes, he obviously makes good passes to other players, but when his primary read is a hitch route over the middle by the running back, it lets the defense close down over the middle.

      Yes, part of this is Cam calling conservative plays, but it's not like deep routes are eliminated from the playbook. Yeah, we don't have a lot of deep threats, but the receivers have proven they can get deep and make catches down the field. My problems with Joe are 1) he rarely takes those chances, electing to throw the short safe pass instead and 2) despite his huge arm, he is unbelievably inaccurate down the field, often shorting his passes on 1-on-1's down the sideline. Also, he also forces it deep for no reason, when he's got a safety over the top, much like the first Cincinnati game this year (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/201009...als#tab:watch), at ATL (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/201011...cons#tab:watch) and the playoff game at Pitt (I realize I bring up Pitt a lot and its just one game, but he needs to beat them and Big Ben to take his game to the next level)

      Just think about this, Joe threw the ball more than 30 times in 12 games this year (14 counting the playoffs), and threw for 300 yards once, 301 against the worst team in the league (Carolina). That is not a quarterback taking over a game.

      I will give Joe solid props for the Atlanta game. I was very impressed by his performance. He made a key third down pass to Boldin and a great throw to Heap in the endzone, while Rice again had a great catch and run of 20+ yards. Joe had no chance to come back after that last score so I don't blame him at all for that loss. If there was one thing to critique though, it's that he was outplayed by Matt Ryan, who had 0 run game and only Roddy White to rely on, which is really my whole point about Joe. He seems to almost come up short in these big primetime games. Yes, a lot of it has to do with playcalling, but I'm not willing to put all the blame on Cam. Yes, I think Cam is an awful playcaller and needs to be gone. But he's not, so we won't go anywhere until Joe rises above that, which he is fully capable of doing.

      I know a lot of yall will disagree with me. Just understand my frustration. We have had a great team these past three years, but can't beat the best teams, mostly because of our offenses inability. Yes we need new receivers, but three guys with 600+ catches and an above average tight end aren't exactly among the leagues worst. Yes Cam sucks and needs to go, but like I said, coaches coach and players play, and Joe has not played with that fire that the top quarterbacks in the league do play with.
      I definitely feel your frustration. I became a fan in 2003, so I wasn't even watching when this team won the SB. Ever since I've been a fan we've had championship caliber defenses year in and year out, but the offense always screws it up.

      And I agree Joe doesn't play like a top QB, but not many 3rd years QB's do. Look at Matt Ryans playoff game. Also, there career stats are basically identical.

      I agree coaches coach and players play, but go look at Rivers and Brees's stats under Cam. Other than 1 year from Brees, their stats are right on par with Flacco's this year. You wouldn't say neither of are tier 2 QB's would you? I bet you would've while they were under Cam.

      I'm not the kind of person that puts too much blame on a coach. In fact those who did do that never made sense to me. But with Cam, I totally change my mind. The guys holds players back. Did Joe make mistakes? obviously, but hes still a young QB, which we all seem to forget.

      Also, for those of you who say Flacco should adjust to the offense not built around his best attributes:
      That is unheard of in the NFL. You build your whole offense around your QB, not the other way around.

      Comment


      • Good to see Koch locked up also. He was really a good weapon as a punter and was consistent at putting the ball inside the 20 (1st alternate to Shane Lechler.) Now we can focus on some of our biggest targets.

        http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/r...,7685986.story


        Originally posted by Scott Wright
        Don't be a stranger. Jordyzzzz would want you to stick around. ;o)

        Touch Fuzzy, Get Dizzy

        Comment


        • I say, we let go 9 players & re-sign 14.
          QB Marc Bulger: re-sign (1 yr)
          LB Prescott Burgess: cut
          CB Chris Carr: re-sign (3 yr)
          G Chris Chester: cut
          OT Jared Gaither: re-sign (2 yr)
          WR T.J. Houshmandzadeh: cut
          S Dawan Landry: re-sign (3 yr)
          FB Le'Ron McClain: re-sign (2 yr)
          OT Tony Moll: cut
          DT Haloti Ngata: re-sign (6 yr)
          WR Donte' Stallworth: re-sign (2 yr)
          CB Fabian Washington: cut
          CB Josh Wilson: re-sign (3 yr)
          OT Marshal Yanda: re-sign (4 yr)
          WR Marcus Smith: cut
          FS Haruki Nakamura: cut
          SS Tom Zbikowski: re sign (2 yr)
          OT Oniel Cousins: re sign (2 yr)
          DT Lamar Divens: cut
          RB Jalen Parmele: cut
          DT Kelly Talavou: re-sign (1 yr)
          LB Tavares Gooden: re-sign (2 yr)
          LB Jameel McClain: re-sign (3 yr)
          -
          sign Chiefs DE Jeff Fitzgerald
          sign Panthers CB Richard Marshall
          sign Texans WR Jacoby Jones
          -
          1st- CB, Jimmy Smith.
          2nd- OLB, Brooks Reed.
          3rd- C, Stefen Wisniewski.
          4th- WR,Cecil Shorts.
          5th- RB, Noel Devine.
          6th- ILB, Brad Jefferson.
          7th- FS, Mark LeGree.
          GO RAVENS

          Comment


          • Originally posted by GoRavens View Post
            I say, we let go 9 players & re-sign 14.
            QB Marc Bulger: re-sign (1 yr) Agreed
            LB Prescott Burgess: cut
            CB Chris Carr: re-sign (3 yr) Definitely agreed
            G Chris Chester: cut
            OT Jared Gaither: re-sign (2 yr) I guess
            WR T.J. Houshmandzadeh: cut Agreed
            S Dawan Landry: re-sign (3 yr) No thank you
            FB Le'Ron McClain: re-sign (2 yr) Not happening. He could get way more than 2 years from somewhere else
            OT Tony Moll: cut
            DT Haloti Ngata: re-sign (6 yr)
            WR Donte' Stallworth: re-sign (2 yr) Agreed
            CB Fabian Washington: cut
            CB Josh Wilson: re-sign (3 yr) Agreed
            OT Marshal Yanda: re-sign (4 yr) Agreed
            WR Marcus Smith: cut
            FS Haruki Nakamura: cut
            SS Tom Zbikowski: re sign (2 yr)
            OT Oniel Cousins: re sign (2 yr)
            DT Lamar Divens: cut
            RB Jalen Parmele: cut
            DT Kelly Talavou: re-sign (1 yr)
            LB Tavares Gooden: re-sign (2 yr) Strongly disagree
            LB Jameel McClain: re-sign (3 yr) Disagree
            -
            sign Chiefs DE Jeff Fitzgerald No thanks
            sign Panthers CB Richard Marshall You can't bring Carr and Wilson back, and than sign Marshall
            sign Texans WR Jacoby Jones If very cheap I agree
            -
            1st- CB, Jimmy Smith. How many CB's are you getting? Who is where? Foxy, Wilson, Carr, Marshall, Webb, and now you bring in Smith?
            2nd- OLB, Brooks Reed. Would love it
            3rd- C, Stefen Wisniewski. No chance in hell he makes it here
            4th- WR,Cecil Shorts. Like it
            5th- RB, Noel Devine. Like it
            6th- ILB, Brad Jefferson.
            7th- FS, Mark LeGree.
            My thoughts in bold.

            Comment


            • Ill cringe if/when Gooden comes back. He is terrible. I know Id love to see him come through and be a legit starter so we can have one 52 from da u pass the torch to any 52 from da u. But the guy is terrible. Fragile as Samari Rolle, as physical as fabian washington. Overpurses more then any LB i have ever seen.


              I also dont want Landry back. What exactly does Landry do that Zbi cant? Also Zbi is better at coverage then Landry

              Comment


              • Totally agree with the above post

                We have no need for Gooden

                as for what you said about Zbikowski. The guy is a pure baller. His natural fit is at SS but when he filled in for Reed at FS, he still would turn in solid performances. I love the guy, and he needs to start over Dawan.

                Comment


                • Zbi was a monster in 2009. He had a INT in every game he played,but had 2 taken back from penalties. And he had that big one against PITT that was taken back by a horseshit penalty on Frank Walker.


                  Id love to see Zbi at SS he can actually cover. I dont get why we have Landry starting. It seems like Harbaugh puts players in who work harder and are nice guys instead of the better football player.

                  Comment


                  • Agree with both above posts. Gooden sucks and Zbi should be starting at SS. I would like to bring in a safety somewhat early in the draft anyway. Ed Reed's future will continue to be an unknown and I don't trust Haruki back there at all. He's a great ST guy but he's consistently getting burnt when he's in coverage.

                    Comment


                    • Landry should be gone, and Ahmad Black should be his replacement.

                      Comment


                      • I was thinking, while Reed was on PUP Zbi played back and he was never really beaten deep (I cant remember it happening off the top of my head.) We could send him deep and let Reed freelance and try to jump routes etc. it would be like making Reed the SS and Zbi FS. Obviously Reeds health would be a legit concern but if Reed is healthy Id like to see that.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Ravens1991 View Post
                          I was thinking, while Reed was on PUP Zbi played back and he was never really beaten deep (I cant remember it happening off the top of my head.) We could send him deep and let Reed freelance and try to jump routes etc. it would be like making Reed the SS and Zbi FS. Obviously Reeds health would be a legit concern but if Reed is healthy Id like to see that.
                          I say we keep Reed at FS. He doesn't need to be in the box taking unneccesary hits.

                          Comment


                          • ya that is the biggest concern. Just brainstorming. At least we can all agree Landry gotta go, Landry cant cover or tackle. Zbi can cover and is just a BAMF. Lets see Hines Ward start his **** with Zbikowski.

                            Comment


                            • Hines Ward would still start **** with Zibby he aint afraid of nobody, and he would still make plays. Thats what Hines Ward does, he talks and backs it up and thats why the Steelers beat us now and always will beat us when the games are big. They have a tougher, more resiliant, and hungrier team than we have.
                              HALL OF FAMER!
                              PUT ART MODELL IN THE HALL OF FAME!
                              JUSTIN BLACKMON IS A GOLDEN GOD!

                              Xbox Live - Kevown8999

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by EdReedUnstoppable View Post
                                Hines Ward would still start **** with Zibby he aint afraid of nobody, and he would still make plays. Thats what Hines Ward does, he talks and backs it up and thats why the Steelers beat us now and always will beat us when the games are big. They have a tougher, more resiliant, and hungrier team than we have.
                                oh sweet! if you feel that way, then why don't you just go root from them then?

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