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  • Originally posted by RavenMadness View Post
    Really? I can name more then 12 QB's I would rather have than Flacco at this point. I'm not going to lie. I'm not the biggest Joe Flacco fan. I think he turns the ball over far too often and I question his ability to lead a team from behind. Don't get me wrong I like the kid...Just not as much as you guys.
    Dear Lord its the Kyle Boller argument all over ............ AND I'M ON THE OTHER SIDE! :-?

    Magical sig by OSUGiants

    SSAEL....... its a new revolution!


    Originally posted by Job
    On another note, Nicklas Backstrom is amazingly good.
    Meanwhile, in hockey the other night, the Washington Capitals' Eric Belanger gets hit with a stick, loses EIGHT teeth, has an instant root canal in the locker room, comes back out and PLAYS and never says boo.

    So new rule, NBA: Unless you have a root canal at halftime, SHUT UP AND PLAY!

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    • HAHA what a time that was in NFLDC history. That was pretty intense. There were heated battles, but I still love all my fellow Ravens fans no matter what.

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      • I'm just saying. Joe Flacco is not a franchise quarterback...Is he good? Yes. But at this point I would only consider Brady, Manning, and brees franchise qbs.

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        • I wouldn't consider Flacco a franchise quarterback. People throw around that term much too loosely. Being an established starting QB does not necessarily make you a franchise quarterback. There are probably around eight of them and Flacco isn't quite on that level yet.

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          • Until after this season.

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            • Thank you Tackle! That's exactly what I'm trying to say. Although I'll disagree with you a bit and say that there are only 3 franchise QB's...Not 8.

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              • I guess it all depends on your definition of a franchise QB. Personally I feel Flacco is in the top 8-13 range of QBs. He is obviously a established starting QB w/ a lot of talent.

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                • As of now I would rank Joe Flacco in the 12-15 range. As for my definition of a franchise QB.

                  A QB that no matter the supporting casts around him finds a way to win ball games, not the ability to throw a pretty pass in between two defenders, but wins in the playoffs even when the going gets tough. Which is why I leave Flacco off the list. Sure, he has three playoff wins under his belt but I truly believe if we had manning,brady, or brees we would have been in the superbowl.

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                  • Originally posted by RavenMadness View Post
                    Joe Flacco a franchise QB??? A little far fetched imho.
                    Originally posted by BigDawg819 View Post
                    No words can describe how ridiculous that is...............
                    Relax guys, I meant he's our franchise not Bulger. If he goes, so do our playoff hopes. Without him we aren't playoff contenders, simple as that. However, I do believe that he is well on his way to being a pro bowl caliber QB. He's been great his first two years and has had a great offseason. I love everything he's done, you can complain all you want about turnoves (24 INT's in 2 years) but he's taken us to the playoffs in back-to-back years, WON in the playoffs and brought us winning seasons. Guy's a winner.

                    Originally posted by RavenMadness View Post
                    Really? I can name more then 12 QB's I would rather have than Flacco at this point. I'm not going to lie. I'm not the biggest Joe Flacco fan. I think he turns the ball over far too often and I question his ability to lead a team from behind. Don't get me wrong I like the kid...Just not as much as you guys.
                    What's not to like about him? I'd take a few turnovers as long as he wins games.

                    And please, name the 12 QB's you'd take over him? All I can think of are Brees, Brady, Manning, Rodgers, and Rivers. You can say Schaub, but he has a great offense but never took em to the playoffs. Same with Romo(up until this year), I wouldn't take Big Ben o Favre... So please, name all 12

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                    • I wouldn't say your season will be gone if Flacco is not in the lineup. You have a very good running game and a very good defense. I think Bulger would manage just fine IMO. Give Bulger a decent line and he'll do well.

                      Steelers on the other hand? Yeah, Ben is our franchise and we'll be hurting without him if we were in the playoffs or had a harder stretch of games in the first couple of weeks.

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                      • Originally posted by BmoreBlackByrdz View Post
                        Relax guys, I meant he's our franchise not Bulger. If he goes, so do our playoff hopes. Without him we aren't playoff contenders, simple as that. However, I do believe that he is well on his way to being a pro bowl caliber QB. He's been great his first two years and has had a great offseason. I love everything he's done, you can complain all you want about turnoves (24 INT's in 2 years) but he's taken us to the playoffs in back-to-back years, WON in the playoffs and brought us winning seasons. Guy's a winner.



                        What's not to like about him? I'd take a few turnovers as long as he wins games.

                        And please, name the 12 QB's you'd take over him? All I can think of are Brees, Brady, Manning, Rodgers, and Rivers. You can say Schaub, but he has a great offense but never took em to the playoffs. Same with Romo(up until this year), I wouldn't take Big Ben o Favre... So please, name all 12

                        Are you serious? If Flacco goes so does our playoff hopes? Am I hearing this right? The Ravens run the football more then anybody else in the league and in Flaccos rookie season were ranked 4th in rushing and 28th in passing. This past season he was ranked 18th out of all the starting QB's. Not to mention we have had the 3rd BEST scoring defense the past two seasons and have forced more turnovers then any other NFL team in the league. People complain about Joe Flacco not having a supporting cast. Give me a break...QB's around the leauge would kill for the cast Flacco has. We could easily put 12-15 other QB's behind center and we would not miss a beat.

                        Ontop of his 24 interceptions the past two seasons he has fumbled the ball 19 times! Luckily, only 4 or 5 of those have been lost. These turnovers are going to get us nowhere in the post-season.

                        Speaking of the post-season do we even want to mention these stats? 57/120 (47.5% completion percentage) for 660 yards, 1 TD, and 5 INT's over a span of 5 playoff games!

                        Also, if Flacco has proven us anything it's that he can't lead a team from behind. He dinks and dunks (fine by me) and lets his running game and defense do the rest. Whenever, the Ravens need to throw the ball on a consistent basis is where you see Flacco crumble.

                        While the guy wins football games it really shouldn't be that hard with his cast. We could probably put Matt Leinart or Kyle Orton behind center and still get the same results we have gotten with Joe Flacco.

                        You can argue all you want that the play-calling limits Flacco's stats and big game ability but when you fumble the ball 19 times and throw a combined 24 INT's, you must play to your strengths and clearly running the ball and not letting Flacco win the game for us is the best way to win games.


                        As for the 12 other QB's I would rather have then Joe Flacco.

                        I'll start with the obvious.

                        1) Peyton Manning
                        2) Tom Brady
                        3) Drew Brees
                        4) Aaron Rodgers
                        5) Phillip Rivers

                        6) Big Ben- While Ben has made more turnovers then Joe Flacco he has 2 SuperBowl Wins. His defense has been just as productive as Flacco's, has a worse offensive line, worse running game and gets POUNDED every game. His scrambling ability and the way he runs around in circles dodging defenders left and right is something NO QB's in this leauge have. Sure, Ben makes some turnovers but he comes back with some incredible plays you will NEVER see Flacco make. Once Joe Flacco can prove that he can put his team on his back like Ben does, he will gain my respect.
                        7) Matt Schaub- Houston's defense is mediocre at best and hardly ever force turnovers and the running game is extremely inconsistent. Despite Kubiak's history they only average like 3.5 yards per carry. If Schaub were a Raven we would be scary. I always thought we should have got this guy...
                        8) Eli Manning- We all saw how good this guy is when his defense performs and the rushing attack is on all go. The Giants D and running game really let them down in 2009 and this guy is a consistently in the playoffs when his defense is top 12 in scoring.
                        9) Matt Ryan- He let me down last year but him and Michael Turner were both injured. He still finished with 22 TD's.
                        10) Donovan McNabb- Now this would be interesting. His WR's are similar to what he had in Philly, but he never had the rushing offense and commitment towards running we do.
                        11) Carson Palmer- As much as I cant stand this guy I would take him over flacco. The most accurate QB in the NFL.
                        12) Tony Romo- This is tough. As much as I can't stand Romo and Palemr because of their playoff records. I would have to take Romo over flacco. He's demonstrated plays that we have yet too see Flacco make. Jason Garrett is the most overrated OC in the NFL. Despite having mammoths of an offensive line he continues to pass. If they ran the ball like the Ravens and the D didn't choke I think he would have a few more wins in the playoffs.

                        Let's ask oursleves this question. If Joe Flacco were on a team like the Bears does anybody think they would have won more then 4 games? Personally, I would put Flacco in the Leinart, Orton, Cutler, and Cassell category.

                        I think Flacco has been blessed with a sound supporting cast and any of the above QB's I mentioned would be an upgrade over Flacco.

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                        • Citing Carson Palmer as the most accurate QB in the league is beyond idiotic. He consistently hangs his receivers out to dry, and there have been vocal complaints about that from players before. He has no touch on his passes and is all velocity. He throws a pretty spiral, but he is far from accurate. Drew Brees is far and away the most accurate QB in the NFL, lets make that very clear.

                          As for your argument, its terribly flawed. While Ive been overly critical of Flacco in the past, he has shown alot of poise and great potential in the last 2 years. Dont forget, many of the so called franchise QB's you named were guys who were allowed to sit on the bench for several years and learn, not expected to do anything (Here Im looking at Rodgers and Rivers). Even Brees needed time to bloom, and Id venture to say without looking up the stats that Brees' first 2 seasons were similar to Flacco's. Everyone deserves a learning period, and even though this is a what have you done for me lately league, its clear that Flacco can and will win us ball games with the team assembled around him. Its his 3rd year, I expect big progression, and while he might not actually BE a franchise quarter back, he is our franchise's quarterback.
                          Originally posted by Mr. Goosemahn
                          The APS is strong in this one.
                          Originally posted by killxswitch
                          Tears for Fears is better than whatever it is you happen to be thinking about right now.

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                          • Originally posted by RavenMadness View Post
                            Really? I can name more then 12 QB's I would rather have than Flacco at this point. I'm not going to lie. I'm not the biggest Joe Flacco fan. I think he turns the ball over far too often and I question his ability to lead a team from behind. Don't get me wrong I like the kid...Just not as much as you guys.

                            What's that mean? I could think of 12 guys I'd rather have over Matt Ryan too, or Matt Stafford, just because your not a top 10 QB in the league after 2 seasons means nothing. How many other QB's make that type of a jump that fast?
                            Last edited by LonghornsLegend; 06-26-2010, 09:21 PM.





                            Originally posted by Scott Wright
                            I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

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                            • Originally posted by A Perfect Score View Post
                              Citing Carson Palmer as the most accurate QB in the league is beyond idiotic. He consistently hangs his receivers out to dry, and there have been vocal complaints about that from players before. He has no touch on his passes and is all velocity. He throws a pretty spiral, but he is far from accurate. Drew Brees is far and away the most accurate QB in the NFL, lets make that very clear.

                              As for your argument, its terribly flawed. While Ive been overly critical of Flacco in the past, he has shown alot of poise and great potential in the last 2 years. Dont forget, many of the so called franchise QB's you named were guys who were allowed to sit on the bench for several years and learn, not expected to do anything (Here Im looking at Rodgers and Rivers). Even Brees needed time to bloom, and Id venture to say without looking up the stats that Brees' first 2 seasons were similar to Flacco's. Everyone deserves a learning period, and even though this is a what have you done for me lately league, its clear that Flacco can and will win us ball games with the team assembled around him. Its his 3rd year, I expect big progression, and while he might not actually BE a franchise quarter back, he is our franchise's quarterback.
                              Poise and Potential? Yup. Your right. All those duck fart interceptions and fumbles showed some excellent poise.

                              While you make a valid argument about many of those QB's sitting on the bench, I just don't see the skill set that Flacco has ever matching those guys. If he improves then I will be happy, heck we won a superbowl with Trent Dilfer...The bottom line is Flacco is no franchise QB. At the most their is 4 and Flacco is not one of them and if the Ravens want too be a dominant team Flacco is going to have too improve.

                              I'll give Flacco another year...I just won't be surprised if he doesn't take a giant step.

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                              • And the 12-15 QBs in the NFL who we could replace Flacco and not miss a beat are not on the Ravens, they are on other teams. If Flacco goes down I am not saying we will be contending for the #1 pick but he is clearly our best option at QB.

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