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  • You cant say he has shown enough to be a legit #2. He may very well become that but, the guy has 18 catches and has been used primarily as a deep threat. And no one was game planning for Miles Austin...he was an unknown guy. His yards would come easier. You may think he can be a good #2 but, he has not shown anything yet, considering he doesnt even have one start under his belt. The same can be said for Hurd, I think he'd be a fine #2 receiver but, he hasnt had much of an opportunity. He atleast has a start but, it's a small sample size. Austin is not guranteed to be this amazing talent as a starter...right now, he's all hype. I want to see who ever gets that job, actually earn it, in a hard fought position battle come camp/preseason. Austin/Crayton/Hurd...whoever performs the best, should get the job. Austin has a great opportunity here but, a lot of people seem to be jumping the gun. He is anything but legit, until he actually does it.

    Thanks BoneKrusher^

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    • I'm with D and burns on this one... Crayton was a good signing... he's very reliable. You need this type of player. I don't know if Hurd could easily replace him as some of you are saying, what I know is that Crayton makes a lot of clutch cacthes on third downs. Yes I know he dropped that ball against the Giants, and I still hate him for that! But we'll know how reliable he is and he also has a good chemistry with Romo. Austin, Hurd, Stanback are all sort of unproven... would you have trusted them to play in Crayton position? Honestly I wouldn't... It's not like Crayton is making Michael Jenkins (ATL) type of money.. his contract is fair..

      Anyway I don't care that much about our #2 WR... We know that with TO gone Witten is our first option and Roy the second. Then we got Bennett, Felix/Marion, Crayton/other WRs... Our scheme doesn't need a great number 2... we'll be fine with a guy who can stretch the field, make some damage down field and keep the safeties from stacking the box... So yes, I think Austin will be fine.. But I also think a lot of other players would be fine in that spot...
      It all depends on how Roy Williams will perform...


      In Bob We Trust

      John Madden's wedding video business

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ddPHJWkPvU

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Modano View Post
        I'm with D and burns on this one... Crayton was a good signing... he's very reliable. You need this type of player. I don't know if Hurd could easily replace him as some of you are saying, what I know is that Crayton makes a lot of clutch cacthes on third downs. Yes I know he dropped that ball against the Giants, and I still hate him for that! But we'll know how reliable he is and he also has a good chemistry with Romo. Austin, Hurd, Stanback are all sort of unproven... would you have trusted them to play in Crayton position? Honestly I wouldn't... It's not like Crayton is making Michael Jenkins (ATL) type of money.. his contract is fair..

        Anyway I don't care that much about our #2 WR... We know that with TO gone Witten is our first option and Roy the second. Then we got Bennett, Felix/Marion, Crayton/other WRs... Our scheme doesn't need a great number 2... we'll be fine with a guy who can stretch the field, make some damage down field and keep the safeties from stacking the box... So yes, I think Austin will be fine.. But I also think a lot of other players would be fine in that spot...
        It all depends on how Roy Williams will perform...
        Who else on our roster is going to be our deep vertical threat if we loose Austin? TO was that deep threat before and without him and possibly Austin, we really don't have that threat.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by D-Unit View Post
          So how do you feel about Stanback filling in for Austin and picking up a 2nd rounder in the process?
          I think Stanback is not a vertical threat but if it happens, it happens. I won't toss my Cheerios or anything.

          What does get me burned up, however, is how "easy" some fans are letting go of Austin and celebrating a Second (for a young player with upside) while kvetching over older players on the downside going getting tossed.

          I would have let Williams go, James go, TO go, FLO go, Crayton and had the courage to bring up the youth. Jason Elam, Ryan Fowler, Austin/Stanback/Hurd and McQuistan/Free. I just think the TEAM performance won't be much different after about 6-8 games when you let a 2-3 year VET with talent replaces an older Vet.

          But that is me, I like what Pittsburgh and Indy do YEAR IN YEAR OUT. It makes sense to me. Wish we could do this in Valley Ranch.
          Last edited by herniateddisc; 04-10-2009, 10:56 AM.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by herniateddisc View Post
            I think Stanback is not a vertical threat but if it happens, it happens. I won't toss my Cheerios or anything.
            Really? You do realize that he ran a 10.4 100m in college? He's got serious speed.



            D-Unit

            So how do you feel about Stanback filling in for Austin and picking up a 2nd rounder in the process?
            D, I'm starting to warm to the idea of letting Austin go and take that 2nd rounder.

            I would rather keep Austin, but the reality is that he has had trouble staying healthy just like Stanback. Stanback has speed so he brings that same element that Austin does. Stanback has shown enough in him limited pre-season work that I think he would be at the very least a "servicable" WR.

            And lets not forget Romo. I'm not saying Romo is Brady, but Brady has had success with guys that didn't have the ability that Stanback has. If Stanback can run a good route and catch it, Romo should be able to deliver the ball. There are many teams out there that have had success with nothing special at WR.
            In war, you win or lose, live or die - and the difference is just an eyelash.


            -Douglas MacArthur

            Comment


            • It's one thing to rely on Miles Austin, but Stanback? He can't even stay healthy long enough to fully develop at WR, has he even had one solid game as a WR yet? I mean I love his skill set and all, but relying on him at WR is just way beyond crazy if you asked me.


              We have got to stop mentioning his name as far as what he can to do contribute or help, ANYTHING we get at this point is a bonus, but has he even finished a season yet? He's a marginal KR who kept leaving his feet and jumping in the air, his shoulder keeps popping out, I can't think of 3 good catches he's ever made in a game time situation, the list goes on and on.


              I know a 2nd for Miles is great value, but if it just creates another huge hole I'm not in favor of that, even if we do move up for Oher or someone...We don't have any speed at WR without him, and expecting Stanback to contribute is just setting yourself up for dissapointment.





              Originally posted by Scott Wright
              I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by herniateddisc View Post
                For the life of me, I can not understand why people say he "had done nothing at the time to show that he was ready to take over"

                Under that theory Woodley from Pitt would still be on the bench and thy never would have let Foote go. Harrison would be on the bench and Porter would still be playing.

                Whether folks like it or not, you have to project a young player in a back up slot when felling out keeping an older one.

                No doubt Crayton is a fine #3 but Hurd would be just as good. Austin is not worthy of a #1 but he has shown enuff to be a legit #2. But you hvae to play them for crying out loud. Same goes for Carpenter.

                While it is nice to say player earn time in training camp, it is in games that performance matters and some guys just don't practice well.

                So what's your gripe Bob? Did signing Crayton stop us from getting that huge FA signing that year? Did that tie up the cap space for us so we were limited in what we could do? It amazes me that you think a cracker jack contract to Crayton somehow stopped Hurd from getting better or progressing which makes no sense to me.


                If Hurd had started to eclipse Crayton what makes you think he wouldn't pass him on the depth chart? Nobody owes Patty anything, he isn't and never was entrenched as a starter, if we EVER had a better option he would of been in there, which is why when Miles started to break out last season we saw Crayton move down because we wanted Miles explosiveness on the field, and Crayton is STILL making way more then him.





                Originally posted by Scott Wright
                I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by LonghornsLegend View Post
                  It's one thing to rely on Miles Austin, but Stanback? He can't even stay healthy long enough to fully develop at WR, has he even had one solid game as a WR yet? I mean I love his skill set and all, but relying on him at WR is just way beyond crazy if you asked me.


                  We have got to stop mentioning his name as far as what he can to do contribute or help, ANYTHING we get at this point is a bonus, but has he even finished a season yet? He's a marginal KR who kept leaving his feet and jumping in the air, his shoulder keeps popping out, I can't think of 3 good catches he's ever made in a game time situation, the list goes on and on.


                  I know a 2nd for Miles is great value, but if it just creates another huge hole I'm not in favor of that, even if we do move up for Oher or someone...We don't have any speed at WR without him, and expecting Stanback to contribute is just setting yourself up for dissapointment.
                  I understand your point, but depending on Austin is a risk, too. It's not as big a risk as Stanback, but Austin hasn't been healthy either.

                  I think if Austin is gone, we almost have to go out and get a stop gap type of guy and draft another kid.
                  In war, you win or lose, live or die - and the difference is just an eyelash.


                  -Douglas MacArthur

                  Comment


                  • I just don't see this HUGE HOLE that we'll create with Austin's departure.

                    The HUGE HOLE is already there. And it was created by the loss of TO. I have major worries about whether or not Roy can pick up the slack.

                    If there was anything I learned from last year AFTER the addition of Roy... It's that this offense DOESN'T even have enough balls to go around for a #2 WR. The #2 WR in this offense is a complimentary player.

                    Austin is bound to have a better year than last, but that's not saying much. It would simply come out of opportunity. IF he returns, I have NO problem with that.

                    However, I think we can find a better deep threat and kick returner in the draft *cough* Brandon Tate *cough*.

                    The 2nd round pick could pay HUUUUGE dividends.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Macarthur View Post
                      I understand your point, but depending on Austin is a risk, too. It's not as big a risk as Stanback, but Austin hasn't been healthy either.

                      I think if Austin is gone, we almost have to go out and get a stop gap type of guy and draft another kid.
                      That's true, but I think his deep speed and relationship with Romo would be huge, I think it would be alot to ask of a rookie to step in from Day one and help out...I'm not thinking it's a lock for Austin to produce a whole lot, but he does have alot of things the other WR's below him don't have.






                      Originally posted by D-Unit View Post
                      I just don't see this HUGE HOLE that we'll create with Austin's departure.

                      The HUGE HOLE is already there. And it was created by the loss of TO. I have major worries about whether or not Roy can pick up the slack.

                      If there was anything I learned from last year AFTER the addition of Roy... It's that this offense DOESN'T even have enough balls to go around for a #2 WR. The #2 WR in this offense is a complimentary player.

                      Austin is bound to have a better year than last, but that's not saying much. It would simply come out of opportunity. IF he returns, I have NO problem with that.

                      However, I think we can find a better deep threat and kick returner in the draft *cough* Brandon Tate *cough*.

                      The 2nd round pick could pay HUUUUGE dividends.


                      I guess it depends on what we do with that 2nd, so you could be right, but I don't want us to start getting cute with too many picks because we don't have much to show for from the entire drafts in 06 and 07, and the two we did hit with(Spencer and Folk), Spencer hasn't even really made a huge impact yet.


                      It's promising with last years draft though, and depending on what we came out of it with I wouldn't hate losing Austin, but it's not like Roy hasn't been nicked up himself the past few years.


                      If he has to miss 3-4 games, then what do we do at WR?


                      There are some other ideas I like though, like entertaining trading for Jason Peters(long shot but still), trading up for Oher, giving up a 6th for Roscoe Parrish to be our slot man and PR guy to name a few.





                      Originally posted by Scott Wright
                      I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

                      Comment


                      • Legend, I agree that it's unlikely that a rookie WR would jump right in. That's why I think we have to sign a stop gap guy like Holt or Matt Jones to bridge that gap to the kid.

                        I like the idea, too, of getting Parrish to return punts. That is one area we are severely lacking. And he hasn't been a great WR, but he might do better being with a higher caliber QB.

                        What do you guys think it would take to get Jason Peters?
                        In war, you win or lose, live or die - and the difference is just an eyelash.


                        -Douglas MacArthur

                        Comment


                        • Both of the 2nd's we we would have, and a massive contract giving him roughly 11 million a year lol, in other words expensive all around...It might of been realistic had we not given all that money to Flozell *shrugs*.


                          Holt would be nice if he's still available, I'm sure he wouldn't mind playing here, I don't want Matt Jones because of all the other stuff, Holt is the perfect guy to compliment Roy honestly, but somebody would have to put a bug in his ear and tell him to wait before making a decision.





                          Originally posted by Scott Wright
                          I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by LonghornsLegend View Post
                            Both of the 2nd's we we would have, and a massive contract giving him roughly 11 million a year lol, in other words expensive all around...It might of been realistic had we not given all that money to Flozell *shrugs*.
                            I wonder if they would take one of our 2nds this year and another 2nd next year?

                            If 2 2nds is the cost for Peters, I'm in. We would have to be creative on the contract so that it's more cap friendly on the front end. Keep in mind, after this year, all that TO money goes away.


                            Holt would be nice if he's still available, I'm sure he wouldn't mind playing here, I don't want Matt Jones because of all the other stuff, Holt is the perfect guy to compliment Roy honestly, but somebody would have to put a bug in his ear and tell him to wait before making a decision.
                            I agree that Holt would be the better option. I think Holt on a 2 year deal (the intention is that he only plays 1) and then a guy like Tate takes over in year 2.
                            In war, you win or lose, live or die - and the difference is just an eyelash.


                            -Douglas MacArthur

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by D-Unit View Post
                              I agree. Crayton's signing was relatively cheap. What's wrong with it? He's been good for us. Other than the 1 dropped pass in the playoffs, he's been our most consistent "hands" guy at the position.

                              As much as I like the progress Austin has made (and let's not kid ourselves... he used to drop everything)... Let's not presumptiously assume that all of a sudden he's got what it takes to be a #1 in this league. I'm listening to you guys say that and I'm taken aback. Don't be like the Giants fans who thought Domenick Hixon was good enough to fill in for Plax. Austin was often the 5th wheel... now some are saying he could be #1? We need to take a chill pill. If we got a 2nd round for him, that would be fair and I'd take it. Stanback or Hurd should be ready to step up and replace his production. If not, we know what we need next year and we know that we can free up 2 spots by cutting Stanback and Hurd. They've been unknowns for too long. It's time to find out.
                              Amen to that. Now I'm sure y'all can look at my location and tell that I'm a huge Crayton homer, but the guy has done pretty well for himself. Two years ago he got 50 catches being the number 3 option. That's not bad when T.O. and Witten are your two top threats that are going to be too good no to consistently throw to. Then last year he had a down year, but who didn't? The whole offense had some well documented struggles last year so it's not like he was the only one that saw a drop in production. Austin's progress has excited me, but he still hasn't shown that he can be a number 2 guy in the league. At this point he's a speed guy with good quickness that knows the system. His hands have gotten better, but they were highly suspect just two years ago. If you really want to get technical Miles Austin wishes to develop into a guy like Crayton. Crayton has decent quickness, really good hands, and nice route running. He's the perfect slot guy, and with T.O. gone his numbers will go up again. You gotta remember that last year Roy came in, and that took away a ton o catches for Crayton. It won't be so crowded, and Crayton can go back to being that 3rd option instead of the 4th. Next year should looks like this in terms of receiving options:
                              -Roy Williams is the number 1 guy. His long arms, speed, and strength can do wonders.
                              -Witten. What more needs to be said about the best tight end in the game?
                              -Crayton has had some real success as a number 3 before. He can get 50 catches and 7 touchdowns again being the 3rd guy.
                              -Bennett is a steal. He'll get a lot of red zone looks, and he'll become a guy that gets third downs I bet. He's the real breakout guy of next season with T.O. gone.
                              -Austin's speed is perfect for this spot. He's still pretty raw, and he works best when teams don't game plan for him.
                              -Hurd is Crayton part 2. A guy with some really nice hands and quickness. He'll probably get some nice catches here and there, but he is working with a crowded cast on receivers and tight ens. Also throw in Felix and Barber in the mix.
                              "If you have one finger pointing at somebody, you have three pointing towards yourself."
                              ~Nigerian Proverb

                              Da riddum is too much for you.
                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nKx27QrgO0

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                              • The problem I have with letting Austin go is that we've put 3 years into developing this guy. He was a raw FA from stinkin' Monmought College! Do you really want the Jets to reap the rewards of that investment--assuming Austin pays off?

                                The 2nd round pick we get in return is not that great--52--and most rookie WRs don't contribute a great deal the first couple of years anyway. I like Crayton as a 3rd receiver, but I have no faith in Stanback.

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