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  • Originally posted by cowboysforever
    Please Thule, don't get stuck on one name when I have mentioned six. Making a broader point to set a strategy for proceeding.

    Player for player is tough, yes, but it done and would point out picks are a form of currency that grease the trading wheels. It is why money beats bartering as a form of establishing value and facilitating trades.

    Ginn as a 1? I only see three for this year draft -- Jarret, Rice and Johnson -- that have talent and bulk for year 1.

    Ginn is too small and reminds me very much of Glenn with worse hands and worse route runner.

    Smadjia, Gonzalez, Breaston, R Moore are a few talents which can help.

    Of the other cboy wrs -- Austin looks like a 1 but he is green. Does hav
    e speed and size that Hurd and Crayton don't have.
    I love Ginn as a prospect personally. He has the potential to be as good as Steve Smith (CAR). With the illegal contact rule in place...guys like smith/glenn/santana all have had more success. 6'1 is a decent heighth for a WR. He has that 6th gear that noone else really has. He is in the same speed class as guys like Hester. He simply has the speed that is unteachable.

    I don't know how sold I am on him being the #1 guy. But it seems that Hurd is being groomed to be that guy. Now I don't think thats the best football move...but he would be a great compliment to Ginn. Hurd/Ginn/Crayton would be a very formidble WR corps. If Austin ever develops we would have alot of talent out there.

    The only problem is...we dont' have a chance at Ginn he seems to be a lock for the top 15.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by cowboysforever
      Top 5 Defenses don't give up 42 points in three quarters at Home with the chance to lock up a bye and home field advantage for a play off game.

      Sorry your assertion this D is good is wrong. This defense has a horrid time matching up with teams that have good TE and RB packakes in the pass game. Horrid.

      With respect to Roy and James being heart and soul players with big contracts I think my response is contracts are not guaranteed and at times just cuz a guy is excess for us or a bad fit does not mean he is bad for other teams.

      This is my WR argument in reverse and why even Davis has value as a SS in spite of his FS deficits.

      Again, need to have a strategy to contemplate and execute this proposal. If you think D is good enuff then you stay the course.

      I don't -- too slow in the middle of the field. From NT to MLB to Safeties.

      This is why we have the problems we have Defensively.
      Why don't we trade Roy Williams for Shawn Springs..and then convert Springs to FS and have Davis as our SS. Would you support his idea. :roll:

      Comment


      • Originally posted by thule
        This is a good WR class in the draft....but TO will be here next year. Hurd and Crayton have prooved that they deserve a shot at playing for us next year. Austin has been great on kick returns...and has potential to maybe be that number 1 guy. No matter how you slice it we have two young guys who look like solid possesion recievers with a peak of #2. Who do you bring in. Sidney Rice....I could see that but I don't really see how he fits in. do you carry 6 WR's with you on gameday...highly unlikely. Parcells doesn't even like to carry 5. I mean if we have a shot at a guy like Ginn I will cheer my lungs out....but lets face it we need a future number one guy who can contribute right away at some level...and I just don't see that guy this year.
        you're my boy, thule..
        you said everything i wanted to say..
        I think that some people are understimating what TO brings to this team.. Our rbs are not seeing 8 men in the box because of him.. Yes he had a lot of dropped balls, but how many plays does he make for us this year? You give him the ball and he will fight for the first down..
        I don't know why we should cut/trade him for a guy who so far has shown nothing like White, Jenkins, Williamson and so on.. Yeah, Hurd, Crayton, Austin have potential, but they'll never be TO. I think that Owens is the biggest reason why we have a top 5 offense.. Or maybe the second one, the first is that we don't have Bledsoe as our QB anymore..

        We had an horrible game sunday. But what about when we falled to 3-3? How many people were saying our season was over and so on? There are too many fans who are overreacting to this loss..

        Ok, they score 42 points on us. And now our defense sucks?? Every team had bad games.. The last time I checked San Diego allowed 41 point to Cincinnati. And I think they have arguably the best defense in the league (or top 3 for sure)..

        I'm sick for this loss but, as bbd said, it's one loss. We had only lost one game since Romo became our starter, that's the second one. Maybe we won't have home field advantage, but this team has showed me that they have the talent for a good playoff run..

        And speakin about trading player on defense is crazy.. We are playing as a top-5 defense. Next year we'll have some key player in their third year in the league.. We'll have an improve defense.. it's stupid to dismantle it, we're building chemestry.. Maybe Bradie is slow, but how many plays is making for this team?
        The only area of concern on defense are FS and backup NT. We need a true FS and we can grab one..

        But fact is, we have a very good an talented team. The best team we had in years.. So why shall we dismantle it? We just have to keep some utility players and see our players develope year to year..


        In Bob We Trust

        John Madden's wedding video business

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ddPHJWkPvU

        Comment


        • Originally posted by cowboysforever
          Top 5 Defenses don't give up 42 points in three quarters at Home with the chance to lock up a bye and home field advantage for a play off game.

          Sorry your assertion this D is good is wrong. This defense has a horrid time matching up with teams that have good TE and RB packakes in the pass game. Horrid.

          With respect to Roy and James being heart and soul players with big contracts I think my response is contracts are not guaranteed and at times just cuz a guy is excess for us or a bad fit does not mean he is bad for other teams.

          This is my WR argument in reverse and why even Davis has value as a SS in spite of his FS deficits.

          Again, need to have a strategy to contemplate and execute this proposal. If you think D is good enuff then you stay the course.

          I don't -- too slow in the middle of the field. From NT to MLB to Safeties.

          This is why we have the problems we have Defensively.
          Jesus what is wrong with you, one bad game and you throw the defense under the bus. From what I know, in a 3-4 defense the MLB and NT do not have to be speed guys, that's what you have those stud OLB for. Bradie James and AA have played great all year, and they have one off game and you call them out as loser? Now you wanna trades up the ying yang, to get speed, not taking into account we have one of the best rush defenses in the league. I'm very glad Parcells doesn't think like you. Christ

          Comment


          • Thule, did you lose a bet or something? What's with the sig?

            Comment


            • Hi Thule,

              With respect to Springs at FS I dunno enuff of Springs. I would assume a 3rd player picked in the draft who is injury prone may convert nicely to FS.

              Why Deadskins would want two SS who can't cover by accepting Williams is an open question.

              But again I go back to strategy, we need at least two position upgardes in the middle of the field with much more speed. Guys who can cover.

              Take your pick of two -- Roy, Keith, Akin, Bradie or Fergie. I select Keith and Bradie.

              Comment


              • Thule, with respect to you SD comparison at Bengals I must potest.

                1 SD was on the road
                2 SD was not in a must win
                3 Carson Palmer
                4 They effectively shut down Cincy in the second half
                5 SD won
                6 SD is vulnerable in pass game and not the best D in league but boy can they pass rush
                7 Big injuries on D for that game.

                Cowboys D is over rated. Why? Because the players that where expected to greatly improve -- Canty, Spears and Ware -- have not and the others are same as last year except for Fergie.

                Sorry, but this D had one game they played to potential. Indy.

                If Spears, Canty, and Ware can become above average pass rushers we would be talking a different story. If this where the case, I would put them in SD's class right behind Baltimore.

                Baltimore has no weakness that is severly exploitable and is the only team in the league to say that.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by cowboysforever
                  Hi Thule,

                  With respect to Springs at FS I dunno enuff of Springs. I would assume a 3rd player picked in the draft who is injury prone may convert nicely to FS.

                  Why Deadskins would want two SS who can't cover by accepting Williams is an open question.

                  But again I go back to strategy, we need at least two position upgardes in the middle of the field with much more speed. Guys who can cover.

                  Take your pick of two -- Roy, Keith, Akin, Bradie or Fergie. I select Keith and Bradie.
                  Why in the hell would we have to upgrade Roy, Akin and Bradie? They Do there jobs of tackling, hitting and stuffing the run. And they do it very well. Despite what you think it takes more then speed to make a great defense. And when did it become that a NT had to be fast? And if you didn't know, and I'm guessing you don't looking at you ignorant and sometimes moronic posts, we just gave Bradie and Roy extensions, so your plan to get rid of him will probably never come into fruition. Sorry to burst your bubble.

                  Comment


                  • Of all the Cowboy WR who can be a 1 -- Austin has the body type and speed. Dunno about hands, work ethis or quickness.

                    Crayton and Hurd are slow but both have GREAT HANDS. But really guys, these are two 3/4 receivers at best.

                    Gin may be fastest guy in draft but Johnson and Rice look to be lock 1 receivers IMHO. Gotta see Jarret's 40 cuz he may be another M Williams who can be extracted cheap from Detroit.

                    Moore in Miami has all the talent but ...... Another U head case.

                    Breaston is Ginn but cheaper if a bit slower though bigger.

                    Smardzjia is a two -- possesion guy who is not any better than Gonzalez from OSU.

                    Who else in the draft?

                    Manningham in UoM might be best 1 next year. DeSean is another Ginn for next year. But they are both sophmores. Maybe Monk from Arkansas and the big guy from Rutgers?

                    Hey, how about signing Johnson from Houston? Aint he a UFA this year? Skip drafting a WR cuz we aint gettin one of the top three.

                    Anyway....

                    Comment


                    • Paul, please don't point out the obvious with respect to contracts.

                      That BP and JBJ have handed out some odd contracts to Ayodele, James, Williams and Kosier are not lost on me.

                      Kosier and Ayodele where not even wanted by their teams and was the source of some serious questions.

                      James and Williams (TO and Vanderjerk) are seemingly JBJ emotionalism if you ask me.

                      With respect to NT speed -- please don't torture my argument for more speed as proposing a CB for NT. Silly strawman argument.

                      But a NT with more speed and quickness between the hash markd would nice. Maybe a little upfield push. Maybe Shaun Rogers who is in Marinelli's dog house?????

                      Comment


                      • welcome to the forums Al Davis!

                        Comment


                        • My biggest concern about Atlanta is containing Vick running and Crumpler over the middle against our safeties and LBs who struggle covering good athletic TEs. I'm also concerned about our OTs pass blocking Kerney and Abraham. Atlanta seems to be banged up with injuries that may play a large factor in the game especially if Dunn or Norwood or even both can't play. I'm not sure if Abraham is healthy and playing but he presents a big challenge for whichever OT he goes against. If we can stop their run game I think we'll win fairly easily but that's a lot easier said than done. I'm definitely concerned about the game in general for all the implications it holds, we really control our own destiny if we win.

                          I really hope our D has learned from their mistakes against NO especially as it relates to the short throws to the FB in the flat as Atlanta has a really good FB in Griffith.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by dpl85
                            My biggest concern about Atlanta is containing Vick running and Crumpler over the middle against our safeties and LBs who struggle covering good athletic TEs. I'm also concerned about our OTs pass blocking Kerney and Abraham. Atlanta seems to be banged up with injuries that may play a large factor in the game especially if Dunn or Norwood or even both can't play. I'm not sure if Abraham is healthy and playing but he presents a big challenge for whichever OT he goes against. If we can stop their run game I think we'll win fairly easily but that's a lot easier said than done. I'm definitely concerned about the game in general for all the implications it holds, we really control our own destiny if we win.

                            I really hope our D has learned from their mistakes against NO especially as it relates to the short throws to the FB in the flat as Atlanta has a really good FB in Griffith.
                            Thank you! That was getting tedious.


                            "You know what charm is: a way of getting the answer yes without having asked any clear question."
                            Albert Camus

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by dpl85
                              I'm also concerned about our OTs pass blocking Kerney and Abraham.
                              Kerney has been on IR for 3-4 weeks now. Chauncey Davis hasn't been doing much in his place, so we should be able to double Abraham a lot.

                              Abraham has been playing. He has been playing pretty well too.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by fryman
                                Originally posted by dpl85
                                I'm also concerned about our OTs pass blocking Kerney and Abraham.
                                Kerney has been on IR for 3-4 weeks now. Chauncey Davis hasn't been doing much in his place, so we should be able to double Abraham a lot.

                                Abraham has been playing. He has been playing pretty well too.
                                He's getting healthier, which is scary. I'm also concerned about Coleman up the middle. He's an excellent pass rushing DT.


                                "You know what charm is: a way of getting the answer yes without having asked any clear question."
                                Albert Camus

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