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  • Originally posted by JBCX View Post
    Why would I want to use a site that subjectively grades players when instead I can show you actual, you know, statistics that describe a player's performance?

    Did you not read what footballoutsiders posted? 3.2 yards per pass. That means he allowed fewer yards per pass than ANY other CB in football. He simply did not give up completions of any note last year. He was excellent in coverage. If you watched any Eagles games, you'd agree.

    I don't even understand, how as a Giants fan you could possibly say Asante gets "burnt" because every time the Giants play the Eagles, the only time Eli ever throws to Asante's side anymore the football is usually coming back in the opposite direction and the Eagles offense takes over, right?
    Um...dude first off, calm down. Second off, use the right part where it shows you the completion percentage per a certain yardage, gives them grades vs run and pass, and then grades them by those statistics in a much more detailed manner than your site.

    Do you understand that, you know, 3.2 yards per pass is not a specific enough stat to tell me that he wasnt burnt. If I watched Eagles games Id understand he was rarely in man to man, but played zone and had MUCH LESS RESPONSIBILITY than most corners do.

    I don't even understand, how as an Eagles fan you could possibly come in and troll on a conversation where I say in a matchup, that Asante WOULD get burnt, instead of your false statement that i said he DID get burnt.

    Now, lets play some tape. I clearly recall Nicks making Asante look like stupid in his rookie season, so I'll relook some more film to see if there was anything else. Or you know, you can keep trolling and putting words in my mouth.

    Comment


    • yeah, watched the last two years, didnt see samuel play man once, good thing you guys are moving to a more man-style defense with DRC and Nnamdi where samuel will be out of place.

      The 3.2 is soo misleading bc asante plays zone with little to no responsibility, basically playing curl to flat, maybe a little deeper (7-12 yards)

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yL1o0TxAkCk

      Comment


      • I hate those stat sites. They make football into a damn math class. Just watch film and the concepts being run. See the Xs and Os of the game, and break that down.

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        • Originally posted by Boss+Manning=Banning View Post
          I hate those stat sites. They make football into a damn math class. Just watch film and the concepts being run. See the Xs and Os of the game, and break that down.
          If you actually watched any Eagles games from 2010 then you'd agree with me. The only CBs that were burnt last year were whichever scrub they had playing opposite Samuel on any given day.

          Comment


          • wait, people are still trying to justify asante is a good CB? my lord, when will it stop? the dude can't tackle and has average man skills. as a zone corner and ball skills, he's top notch...but outside of that, he's rather pedestrian
            We ALL bleed scarlet
            New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
            UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
            Originally posted by PalmerToCJ
            BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.

            Comment


            • The Giants have signed OG/OC Chris L. White

              Take that Eagles!!! LOL

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              • Originally posted by Boss+Manning=Banning View Post
                I hate those stat sites. They make football into a damn math class. Just watch film and the concepts being run. See the Xs and Os of the game, and break that down.
                Well i did both, I hope that makes him go away. Bottom line, the way Asante has been used by both the eagles and new england is more like a QB spy than anything else. His responsibility is considerably less than a traditional corner's but they do this because it pays off.

                Now moving to a new defense, if he's in this role then let's get some longer routes going bc their safeties are clearly a weakpoint, but if he is not and is forced into even off man, he's probably going to get burnt based off of his forty time (4.49 which he clearly trained for bc he ran a 5.4 as a sophmore in hs which is freakin slow) and now he's 30. So there, we'll see what happens.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by JBCX View Post
                  If you actually watched any Eagles games from 2010 then you'd agree with me. The only CBs that were burnt last year were whichever scrub they had playing opposite Samuel on any given day.
                  But I didnt say he got burnt, i said he will in a man on man matchup with Manningham or Smith. So your argument has nothing to do with what i said.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by BaLLiN View Post
                    But I didnt say he got burnt, i said he will in a man on man matchup with Manningham or Smith. So your argument has nothing to do with what i said.
                    Asante can shut down any of the Giants receivers in his sleep.

                    I think all of major yardage and points scored in the last two Eagles-Giants games by the Giants were all on running plays, completions to the TE, or completions to the left side of the field against Dimitri Patterson (especially in the last one). I don't remember any of the Giants WRs having good days in either game except when they were burning Dimitri Patterson, who is obviously not an NFL-caliber player.

                    In the first game especially, Eli was absolutely terrible and threw more picks than TDs, due to no small part the fact that Asante basically makes Eli his personal b**** in every Eagles-Giants game.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by BaLLiN View Post
                      Well i did both, I hope that makes him go away. Bottom line, the way Asante has been used by both the eagles and new england is more like a QB spy than anything else. His responsibility is considerably less than a traditional corner's but they do this because it pays off.

                      Now moving to a new defense, if he's in this role then let's get some longer routes going bc their safeties are clearly a weakpoint, but if he is not and is forced into even off man, he's probably going to get burnt based off of his forty time (4.49 which he clearly trained for bc he ran a 5.4 as a sophmore in hs which is freakin slow) and now he's 30. So there, we'll see what happens.
                      I am just talking in general, no one specific. I see those stat sites mentioned on various boards, and it comes one big stat throwing contest between posters. Very annoying to watch. Pretty much it goes:

                      I have a football point... Throw those numbers and stats, as if the person worked in an accounting field, and then the other guy tosses it back, and molds it for his argument.

                      Stats are good, but at the end of the day, my advice is just watch the game. The eye in the sky doesn't lie.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Boss+Manning=Banning View Post
                        I am just talking in general, no one specific. I see those stat sites mentioned on various boards, and it comes one big stat throwing contest between posters. Very annoying to watch. Pretty much it goes:

                        I have a football point... Throw those numbers and stats, as if the person worked in an accounting field, and then the other guy tosses it back, and molds it for his argument.

                        Stats are good, but at the end of the day, my advice is just watch the game. The eye in the sky doesn't lie.
                        Numbers don't lie either.

                        If the numbers say that a CB held opposing passers to 3.2 yards per attempt... what that means is that you take the yardage total for all passes attempted in his vicinity, and then you divide that number by the number of attempts made. Easy, right? If *any* long completions were made, or even multiple long completions, it would skew the final figure and inflate it to reflect that. The fact that his total yards per attempt given up is as low as 3.2 means that Samuel simply did not give up many, if any at all, long completions. And the fact that 3.2 yards per attempt is the lowest of *ALL* cornerbacks in the NFL means that he was, basically, the best cover cornerback in the entire NFL last year.

                        Why is it so hard to respect stats in this game? Either he gave up a bunch of completions, and it would show in that figure, or he didn't. Period. You don't need to watch every game to understand that statistic and what it means.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by JBCX View Post
                          Numbers don't lie either.

                          If the numbers say that a CB held opposing passers to 3.2 yards per attempt... what that means is that you take the yardage total for all passes attempted in his vicinity, and then you divide that number by the number of attempts made. Easy, right? If *any* long completions were made, or even multiple long completions, it would skew the final figure and inflate it to reflect that. The fact that his total yards per attempt given up is as low as 3.2 means that Samuel simply did not give up many, if any at all, long completions. And the fact that 3.2 yards per attempt is the lowest of *ALL* cornerbacks in the NFL means that he was, basically, the best cover cornerback in the entire NFL last year.

                          Why is it so hard to respect stats in this game? Either he gave up a bunch of completions, and it would show in that figure, or he didn't. Period. You don't need to watch every game to understand that statistic and what it means.
                          Before I even discuss anything, I just want to point out that you're on the Giants team forum section. If we want to be massive homers it's well within our rights as fans. Coming here to cry (and troll, btw) because you didn't like what a Giants fan on a Giants fan board said about an Eagles player makes you appear belligerent and, quite frankly, foolish. If we say something regarding an Eagles player that you think is horse **** on the general forums, NFL forums, or anywhere else - feel free to share your opinion on how we are incorrect. Trying to do so in the comfort of our team forum is asinine, though.

                          In addition, I'd just like to point out the lunacy of trying to use pure statistics in the game of football. I'm the first person to support advanced statistics in other sports where they are applicable, such as baseball. I'm a huge fan of sabermetrics, and other forms of stats for baseball, but trying to judge the value of a corner back when schemes, style of defense, man coverage vs. zone coverage, as well as any number of variables, is laughable. I think we can all agree some statistics are invaluable in football, but the idea that the effectiveness of a corner can be judged purely by statisitics is silly.

                          Not to mention it's hilarious how you keep telling us to "OMG DOOD WATCH ALL THE GAMEZZZZ" and then have the urge to tell us about two games a year where Eli has been zomgpwnnneeeed by Samuels. Samuels is a ****** corner. Isn't that counter-intuitive to your argument? Tell us to watch all the games, and then focus primarily a small sample size of games?

                          But yeah, my transcending point is don't come onto a team specific forum and act like a tool. We don't mind Eagles, Cowboys or any other teams fans speaking here (you're certainly not prohibited from doing it by any means) but don't antagonize Giants fans with your Eagle homerism bull ****. You have your own forum to do that, and one that we typically don't jump onto in order to dispute any claims you may make about our players.

                          Anyways, I SAY GOOD DAY SIR!
                          (shameless self-promotion)
                          Like video games? Subscribe to my Youtube Channel!
                          https://www.youtube.com/user/Forenci

                          Comment


                          • stats can be skewed, absolutely. Is YPC true of a runners ability, or a ****** OL? You can twist and turn most stats to your argument. Stats can also be quite telling as well, but they aren't the end all to every argument.
                            plus, if a player is "good" or not, can be quite subjective, and I've seen enough Asante Samuel over the past 4-5 years to safely say, as an all around corner, I find him to be quite pedestrian. He excels in zone coverage, baiting QB's and has superb ball skills, but his "tackling" is absolutely atrocious and his man skills are below average
                            We ALL bleed scarlet
                            New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
                            UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
                            Originally posted by PalmerToCJ
                            BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.

                            Comment


                            • Plax is a Jet. I pretty much knew he wasn't coming here, especially after Eli pretty much dissed him.

                              Guess what that opens the door for guys? :)

                              Come onnnn, don't you wanna say "He got Moss'd."

                              Doesn't that roll off your tongue perfectly?


                              Well, anyway, looks like we're gonna have to hope Mario/Barden can consistently beat DRC. Mario runs the wrong route half the time and Barden is always hurt. Awesome.

                              Cruz did well in practice yesterday. I think we got something there fellas. If he tears it up this preseason, why not throw him in as our 3rd WR?

                              Comment


                              • I wasn't really aboard the Plax bandwagon to begin with. I think we've really got something with Jernigan. I'm a big fan of his. I think he could be a real explosive playmaker for us. I know he's just a rookie, but I'm excited about him.
                                We ALL bleed scarlet
                                New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
                                UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
                                Originally posted by PalmerToCJ
                                BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.

                                Comment

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