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2009 Draft: Who/What Positions are we Drafting?

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  • Originally posted by josh07039 View Post
    As much as I would love to have a Rutgers guy, a guy like Underwood is no what we need. We have 3-4 guys that could potentially be good slot guys and that is exactly what Underwood is. I am of the belief that if we take a WR it should either be a blue chipper or not at all. We have a few guys that show potential, what we need is a straight up Number 1 with size/speed/yac/jump ball ability/etc. I know its tough to find, but we can't be like the Titans and keep trying to take guys late hoping they become a top flight guy down the road.
    i defintely agree about the WR...dont think we need a late round slot guy cuz thats what stuckey and clowney are, unless someone with a lot of potential slips...i think if were filling a guy who we think could be a starting WR soon for us, has to be in the 1st 2 rounds...wouldnt mind taking a redzone guy like ramses barden late though
    JETS

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    • Originally posted by josh07039 View Post
      I think the guys that have the potential to be a #1 are
      Crabtree
      DHB
      Maclin
      Britt

      Obviously Crabtree is gone and we aren't gonna trade up nor would I want to. DHB worries me because his production isn't nearly as good as his athleticism which worries me. Maclin has the production and definitely has speed. However, he is only a red shirt sophomore which may mean he will need longer to be productive and he always looked a bit frail to me. As for Britt, my concerns are that he is from Rutgers and I am blinded by all the amazing things he did for the school. However, seeing him on a regular basis makes me believe that he could be a #1. He obviously has the size, he has shown the speed and YAC and he has shown toughness on jumpballs. Granted he did it in a less than stellar conference, but he showed that he has all the tools necessary.
      Your concerns are warranted to an extent. He didn't put up the numbers you would from someone with his talent, but he was quite handicapped. He played in a run-oriented offensive scheme and with a QB that made Reggie Ball look like Mark Sanchez. Yet, he still managed to put up numbers to Calvin Johnson; who was also in a pretty crappy position.


      DHB - 138 receptions, 2,089, 13
      CJ- 178 Receptions, 2,927 yds and 28 tds


      CJ was a 6'5 235 lb freak who ran a 4.3ish 40, but didn't completely dominate the league like someone would expect. What people were going on was his body control, great hands etc. IE. measurables.

      DHB is 6'3 205 lbs with blazing speed, possibly sub 4.3 40, and incredible leaping ability. He has shown to not only be a deep threat, but runs good crossing routes, can catch in traffic.


      While he is not the prospect that CJ was, he does have decent fairly solid production and the measurables to warrant the pick. I personally believe that he would be a perfect pick for us if we do decide to go that route.

      "When it's third and ten, you can take the milk drinkers and I'll take the whiskey drinkers every time."

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      • Saw you made the same post on JN lol. I'm inclined to agree...to an extent. Calvin's basically got DHB's numbers half again in every statistical category. They look a lot more similar than they actually are because the catches are in the 100's and the yards are in the 2000's.

        I get the point and do agree production isn't everything and in Heyward-Bey's case the offense and quarterback play really hurt him. But why didn't they manage to get him the ball more? It's not like he was the ONLY weapon on that offense, just the best one. Clemson game for example where he takes that reverse for 76 and gets run down at the 4 by Hamlin. It's the third quarter and that's his first touch of the game. I've got to believe they could have done a better job getting him the ball if it were not for some weaknesses.

        His hands for instance are solid but could be a little better IMO, and he's not the kind of guy that really likes contact. He can take good angles running after the catch but really has no shiftiness and basically goes down on contact.

        That said his measurables are silly, he's a great fit for what we need for this offense, and he could easily develop into an elite #1 in the right situation. If we start to run the rock and have some guys to take pressure off of him...maybe this could be the right situation. Plus I supposedly worked with his dad this past summer so that'd make it kind of cool to have him on the Jets...anyway I go back and forth on him, could end up being great or not so much he absolutely has some concerns. Not the kind of guy I'm going to be screaming TAKE DHB if he's on the board at 17 come draft day but I also will absolutely find a way to like the pick if we make it.

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        • Well Heyward-Bey doesn't have the hands CJ does, he's obviously not as big, and he can't jump as high, so at that point, it already makes it hard to compare. I mean, just saying he'll be a receiver but not as good as Calvin is kind of an obvious statement to begin with.

          But about the QBs... well, Maryland's were much better. They really weren't anymore run-oriented than Ga Tech (who was actually very run-oriented, predicated more on ball control and defense), and at least the Terps QBs completed half of their passes. If you remember Ball, you remember one of the worst QBs to ever play the position.

          And a major difference between DHB and CJ is that CJ improved from his Freshman year to his Junior year. Nevermind that he had the lesser QB and he was one of the nation's most highly touted players by his Junior year, but his numbers actually shot up. DHB actually only gained in the rushing department. CJ saw a decent amount of double teams as well, which I don't remember all too much with DHB (but I could be wrong). And he was never much of a big game performer.

          I don't know. There's a lot I don't like about DHB, originating from the fact that he went to Maryland.
          Ohio State Buckeyes Duke Blue Devils New York Jets St. Louis Cardinals San Jose Sharks Seattle Mariners

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          • Oh and because I'll start to pimp him in full force in about a month or so...

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWakmo3_m2s
            Ohio State Buckeyes Duke Blue Devils New York Jets St. Louis Cardinals San Jose Sharks Seattle Mariners

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            • Originally posted by thetedginnshow View Post
              Oh and because I'll start to pimp him in full force in about a month or so...

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWakmo3_m2s
              He's a stud as well. It's going to be interesting to see what direction we go with our first rounder. I'm sure things will shake out as the year progresses, but this is the first year where I really have absolutely no idea what direction we'll be heading in. It's fairly exciting.

              "When it's third and ten, you can take the milk drinkers and I'll take the whiskey drinkers every time."

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              • Originally posted by thetedginnshow View Post
                Oh and because I'll start to pimp him in full force in about a month or so...

                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWakmo3_m2s
                Well, I'll say this. I think Hicks as a future in the NFL and if I thought the Jets just needed *a* wide receiver, I'd be fine with Hakeem Nicks. But I see the Jets current receivers and I see a need for a guy with elite speed who can stretch the field which I don't think Nicks has.

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                • Originally posted by Crickett View Post
                  Well, I'll say this. I think Hicks as a future in the NFL and if I thought the Jets just needed *a* wide receiver, I'd be fine with Hakeem Nicks. But I see the Jets current receivers and I see a need for a guy with elite speed who can stretch the field which I don't think Nicks has.
                  I agree I like Nicks but he does not have the blazing speed or the hieght. Either we take someome who can burn his defender on deep routes or get a tall WR who can get the jump balls.

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                  • Originally posted by Crickett View Post
                    Well, I'll say this. I think Hicks as a future in the NFL and if I thought the Jets just needed *a* wide receiver, I'd be fine with Hakeem Nicks. But I see the Jets current receivers and I see a need for a guy with elite speed who can stretch the field which I don't think Nicks has.
                    Yeah, that's just something I guess I disagree with everyone else on. Since there isn't some phenom like a CJ in here or maybe the second coming of Steve Smith (the better one), we'd just be getting a burner in this draft if we went with a speed guy since none of the "elite speed" guys in this draft happen to be particularly good route runners nor are they especially physical. I don't know. That's just not something I particularly want to waste an early round pick on, and I'm not entirely sure Clowney can't almost bring exactly what they'd bring to the table. But with Nicks, I just feel like we're getting the best WR, and I don't think it really matters if you get a guy that can really stretch the field if you're getting a higher caliber WR. We'll see though.
                    Ohio State Buckeyes Duke Blue Devils New York Jets St. Louis Cardinals San Jose Sharks Seattle Mariners

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                    • Originally posted by thetedginnshow View Post
                      Yeah, that's just something I guess I disagree with everyone else on. Since there isn't some phenom like a CJ in here or maybe the second coming of Steve Smith (the better one), we'd just be getting a burner in this draft if we went with a speed guy since none of the "elite speed" guys in this draft happen to be particularly good route runners nor are they especially physical. I don't know. That's just not something I particularly want to waste an early round pick on, and I'm not entirely sure Clowney can't almost bring exactly what they'd bring to the table. But with Nicks, I just feel like we're getting the best WR, and I don't think it really matters if you get a guy that can really stretch the field if you're getting a higher caliber WR. We'll see though.
                      I'm going to have to agree to disagree. Again, I think Nicks is a good prospect, but a big play guy is the thing I look at the Jets receiver corps and see lacking. That and I think back and remember (probably worse than it actually was) Laveranues Coles running down the field with opposing cornerbacks tattoed on his ***.

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                      • For DHB I like him but he worries me. The height/speed combo is nice. He can absolutely blow by guys and score a touchdown for you. But I kind of question his ability to go up and get a contested ball, make a catch in traffic, and even run after the catch. His leaping ability and hands are alright, but not as nice as I'd like to see. Strength is a huge weakness IMO, he seems to just go down immediately after contact, and that's strange with the freaky Maryland weight program. No shiftiness either, basically if he can beat you to the pylon going to a straight line with his speed he's got you but otherwise he'll go down. For the tools he has you'd like to see more production. I get the run-oriented offense and I do think the quarterback play was worse his soph and junior years than frosh year but that doesn't quite explain it enough for me. I do like him though and would end up liking the pick, but at the moment I have serious reservations.

                        On Nicks I do agree with everyone else that we could use a guy to stretch the field. Somebody that can separate on their own, get downfield, push the safeties back, take some pressure off the other wideouts and even the run game a little, and force the corners to play off a little. I just think it would loosen up the opposing defenses. Last year I thought Pennington was the issue but towards the end of the year with Favre we had the same problems. Playcalling to an extent is to blame but I think the wideouts have to shoulder some of it also. Nicks is awesome and I love what he does after the catch. I'd absolutely welcome him in here with open arms, and hell if he runs like 4.4 maybe he jumps up to our range. He's got the nastiness and could help the "all-weather" offense. That said I'm not sold on the fit, but I love him as a player so it's hard to say no to a situation like that. The one thing that really helps his cause is he has a nose for the endzone and can make big plays, he just doesn't provide the field-stretching ability I covet.

                        Finally, of the WR's in the draft I think I've made it known my favorite is Maclin. I do think he brings more than just the pure speed which is nice. His frame is a concern but he's got decent height, can make catches in traffic, is willing to go over the middle, has soft hands, runs solid routes, and can make things happen both downfield and after the catch. I think he provides the best of both worlds to an extent with the only issue being strength, but I trust him more after the catch than DHB because he's got a little shiftiness in him. Point being I think he brings more than just speed to the table which is why I think he'd be a fantastic fit. And on top of it he produced very well and can return punts allowing Leon to focus on kicks.


                        EDIT:
                        I've got to say I watch Nicks and I see a slightly stronger slightly more explosive Cotchery, but maybe that's just because I'm watching him at the college level. Still, it makes me wonder what he really adds to our WR corps, not that I don't like him.
                        Last edited by derza222; 01-27-2009, 04:15 PM.

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                        • Originally posted by Crickett View Post
                          I'm going to have to agree to disagree. Again, I think Nicks is a good prospect, but a big play guy is the thing I look at the Jets receiver corps and see lacking. That and I think back and remember (probably worse than it actually was) Laveranues Coles running down the field with opposing cornerbacks tattoed on his ***.
                          I definitely see where you're coming from. I think it's just what you take out of our WR woes. When I see them out there, I don't see WRs that "play big", nor do I see receivers that are especially physical, and to me that hurts us more than anything. Cotch I give a pass because he at least seems to be trying, but Coles is a little girl. Because when I think back, I remember Coles not fighting for a ball or Coles not fighting for extra yardage. Personally, I just want a receiver that's more than a small-ish deep threat. Like take... Lee Evans or even Santana Moss. Good receivers, but I think they'd add very little to our team opposed to someone like Boldin, Jennings, or Ward. And if there was someone in this draft like a Santonio Holmes, I'd be all for it, but I don't really think that's what Heyward-Bey is. I feel that it takes a certain sort of receiver to be a "cold-weather" receiver, and I don't know if I see a lot of that. And, if the sole reason to bring one of these receivers in was just to stretch the field, I'd rather see what Clowney could do with a healthy season.

                          In any case, I think we're definitely going to grab a WR at some point because at the very least we lack solid depth. I guess it's just a matter of when it happens.
                          Ohio State Buckeyes Duke Blue Devils New York Jets St. Louis Cardinals San Jose Sharks Seattle Mariners

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                          • Originally posted by thetedginnshow View Post
                            I definitely see where you're coming from. I think it's just what you take out of our WR woes. When I see them out there, I don't see WRs that "play big", nor do I see receivers that are especially physical, and to me that hurts us more than anything. Cotch I give a pass because he at least seems to be trying, but Coles is a little girl. Because when I think back, I remember Coles not fighting for a ball or Coles not fighting for extra yardage. Personally, I just want a receiver that's more than a small-ish deep threat. Like take... Lee Evans or even Santana Moss. Good receivers, but I think they'd add very little to our team opposed to someone like Boldin, Jennings, or Ward. And if there was someone in this draft like a Santonio Holmes, I'd be all for it, but I don't really think that's what Heyward-Bey is. I feel that it takes a certain sort of receiver to be a "cold-weather" receiver, and I don't know if I see a lot of that. And, if the sole reason to bring one of these receivers in was just to stretch the field, I'd rather see what Clowney could do with a healthy season.

                            In any case, I think we're definitely going to grab a WR at some point because at the very least we lack solid depth. I guess it's just a matter of when it happens.
                            Funny, that's EXACTLY the kind of WR I'd like to see us draft. Literally when i think of wideouts Holmes is THE guy. Kind of why I like Maclin, I think if used properly he could play a Holmes-esque role only he's not quite as bulky. But yeah if we could find a wideout in that mold that's exactly what I'd like. Not sure if I made that clear enough lol.

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                            • DHB scares me...nicks i think will be a very solid WR at some point but idk if hes the fit that we need...maclins the ideal fit, and im still unsure where i go after that...DHB, nicks, britt, harvin...the combine i think will help a little bit
                              JETS

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                              • Originally posted by derza222 View Post
                                Funny, that's EXACTLY the kind of WR I'd like to see us draft. Literally when i think of wideouts Holmes is THE guy. Kind of why I like Maclin, I think if used properly he could play a Holmes-esque role only he's not quite as bulky. But yeah if we could find a wideout in that mold that's exactly what I'd like. Not sure if I made that clear enough lol.
                                I think this might be proven to be incorrect. Holmes weighed in at 5'10.5" and 188 lbs at the combine and Maclin is reportedly a sure 6' and closer to 6'1" and about 200 lbs. That was why I am in love with Maclin; he has the same speed, agility etc. as all the smaller receivers, but is much bigger. I just feel that Maclin is going to be long gone by the time we're picking.

                                "When it's third and ten, you can take the milk drinkers and I'll take the whiskey drinkers every time."

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