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  • Originally posted by hcbrad08 View Post
    Forum Mock Draft Date: 03/26/2008

    2008 JETS' DRAFT SELECTIONS

    TRADES:

    1) The Jets trade the 6th Overall Pick to the Dallas Cowboys for the 22nd & 28th picks in the 1st Rd and in the 28th pick in the 3rd rd 92 overall:
    This trade occurs as Oakland passes on Darren McFadden because of a severe amount of needs and a glut at the RB position. The Jets ideally trade down to the Dallas Cowboys who covet McFadden. 6th pick = 1600 / 22= 780 28= 660 This leaves the Cowboys 160 points in value off. Trading their 3rd rd pick as well the Cowboys are still short in value by approx a late 5th rd pick the Jets pull the trigger anyway bc draft day value is rarely recieved. The trade benfits both teams. Dallas is a more complete team with less needs and can afford in the eyes of someone like Jerry Jones to trade up. The Jets despite spending a lot in FA need more playmakers. The Jets like the trade bc they now have a 3rd rd pick in a draft where there are a lot of starting caliber players in those middle rounds and they can also save cap room, not having to pick at the top of the 1st rd after spending almost all of the 25 million they had under the cap after last season.

    2) The Jets trade Chad Pennington to the Chicago Bears for the 14th pick in the 3rd rd, 78th overal and a conditional (low round) draft pick in 2009:
    Rex Grossman did just sign a 1 year deal with the Bears but they lack a proven veteran after trading Brien Greise. Pennington stabilizes the position for the Bears and allows them stability when the Grossman experiment inevitably fails to groom a young QB. He will compete with Grossman and when he starts will fit in very well with their run first playaction style. The Jets trade Pennington as they cannot afford to keep him on the roster as a backup with a 7 million dollar cap number. He may compete but the Jets drafted Kellen Clemens and built a big offensive line up for the young QB to aid his development something the Jets' brass never did for Pennington. Why would they start now?

    3) The Jets trade Dewayne Robertson to the Denver Broncos for the 10th pick in the 5th Rd. 138th overall:
    The Jets need to clear Robertson's cap number and it would be better to regain a 5th rd pick they lack after the Kris Jenkins deal. Kris Jenkins is the NT for the future so DROB is out. Denver recieves a potentially better player in the 43 although that remains to be seen. They do the deal bc their defensive line looks like a train wreck. It was initially thought the Jets could recieve more for RObertson but failed physicals and contract talks are killing the deals. The Jets settle for a 5th Rd and sacrifice the other picks for the sake of the cap number they would clear.

    SELECTIONS

    22:1a) Limas Sweed - WR - TEXAS:
    The Jets are in need of a playmaker on offense. Some may argue that's why the Jets should draft Darren McFadden. However, with the newly assembled OL staff Thomas Jones and Leon Washington, perhaps with a later draft pick, will be able to produce plays. The Jets redzone offense last season was aenemic. With a power running game and big recieving threat the Jets will attain a very productive, multifaceted offense. It could also produce one of the best recieving cores in the NFL. Coles, Cotchery, Sweed, Stuckey, Baker, Smith, Franks. Hard Worker one of the best WR before the wrist injuries. Our type of guy. Great Value esp since we dont need to put his wrist over the middle alot and can use him as a 3 wr/#1 wr in red zone until his wrist is cleared.

    28:1b) Quentin Groves - OLB - AUBURN:

    Despite signing Calvin Pace the Jets need more pass rushers on defense. By drafting Groves the Jets would have a rotation of pass rushers in Pace, Thomas and Groves that could like the WR position go from below league average to elite. The Giants prove you can never have too many pass rushers. While people marvel at Vernon Gholstons physicality and strength they lose sight of Groves Strength combined with his speed. Groves production did drop this season but his stock wasnt hurt badly bc an off year for him is better than a lot of college players. Auburns all time sack leader and loves working out. He dropd yes, about 15 spots. Jets save money on these 1st two picks as opposed to picking at 6. About 5 million. 2007: 8.2 mil 6: Landry / 1.7 mil 22:Quinn & 1.5 mil 28: Staley.

    36:2) Kentwan Balmer - DE - NORTH CAROLINA:

    The Jets are to say the least getting Long in the tooth at 34 DE. Coleman is ideal size and productive but Ellis despite high energy and effort is undersized to effectively run the system. Ellis would not be a backup but part of a great rotation and he could be used as that hybrid LB/DL blitzer standup system (i dunno what to call it). The Jets have potential DEs in Brown and Mosley for the future who could start one day with balmer. The depth and effectiveness could be great for a while. Coleman, Balmer, Ellis, Mosley, Brown. 64 310 is perfect size for the 34 DE position and we dont deal with bad fits for the system with someone like this. Could be our Richard Seymour. SOme might be concerned with this pick bc he had one year of production but it jsut so happened to occur when Butch Davis became his coach not under the typical crappy UNC program...Davis said hes a not just a one year wonder.

    78:3a) Roy Scheuning - OG - OREGON STATE:

    Some might look at this pick as strange considering we just signed Alan Faneca. However if you look at the depth the Jets lack on the OL, you might say we need someone who can plug this year and perhaps develop into an elite starter. Schuening before Branden Albert entered the draft was the top guard. We also have to worry about OT but considering the Jets drafted RT Bender last year and that is where he is best suited to play one wonders what happens if Dbrickashaw Ferguson goes down. Faneca would move to LT (he did it twive for the steelers for decently long stints and was VERY effective) and we could plug in Schuening at LG. For that matter if anyone got injured this would allow us flexiblitiy with no one really to speak of behind Moore and Faneca I like his size style of play and intangibles. If we can draft for the future we can sustain success. Fits the mold, our type of guy.

    92:3b) Trae Williams - CB - SOUTH FLORIDA:
    Great compliment to Revis. Good ball skills. Good size can get bigger and will make our secondary more legitimate. He got picked on a lot bc no one wanted to throw at Jenkins and produced well. Hard worker and fits the mold

    102:4a) Jonathan Goff - ILB - VANDERBILT:
    He provides great depth and will be Bartons successor. Great tandem with Harris. Bolsters the front 7 on D a lot. could also help pass rush by assoc. If he is in at ILB Barton can go back to his natural position of OLB and that would only help our perimiter pass rush. Groves, Pace, Thomas, Barton, Bowens.

    104:4b) Tashard Choice - RB - GEORGIA TECH:

    Tashard Choice is a physical runner who was really productive even after teams started keying in on him after Calvin Johnson left. He would be a great back to bring in for the seemingly power running game were going to establish. It would keep TJ fresh as he has been for his entire career. Help us in the future. Much better and more physical than Cedric Houston and Jets fans were excited to see Leon TJ and Cedric last year, now they get to see a team who will pound the ball and dictate the pace of a game.

    138:5) Dexter Jackson - WR/PR - APPALACHIAN STATE:

    Leon can't return punts well but provides a good KR tandem with Justin Miller. I think with the loss of Mike Westhoff the Jets need to bring in another dyanamic playmaker for ST to try to make up for the loss. Jackson does that for the PR game and could also be a poor mans Santana Moss (better than Sinorice) in the passing game. Not a huge factor but a deep threat, speedster we lack.

    165:6) Bernard Morris - QB - MARSHALL:
    Drafting a QB seems excessive but if the Jets sign a veteran to backup Clemens a developmental prospect is not a bad Idea. He has great measurables and a good arm. Joe Gibbs said he was a pleasure to coach at the East West Shrine game. We could keep him on the roster to develop and if clemens doesn work out we could draft or sign another QB without worry bc Morris would have been a 6th Rd. in a draft of 10 players. That said hard worker and i think will be a find for whoever takes him. At least a solid backup in the future. Could maybe even contribute like Brad Smith ST and some plays on O or D. Just a thought. I like him as a prospect.

    196:7) Bobbie Williams - FS - BETHUNE COOKMAN:
    I like Williams size and speed. Hes physical and fast for his size. He plays quick and I saw enough of his game to see that he could possibly develop into a starter. He could be a nice compliment to Rhodes and at least would provide good depth behind Rhodes Elam Hawkins and Smith.


    (Semi)Final Assessment Going Into The 2008 Season:
    These moves would allow the Jets to get younger at a lot of positions and prove they believe in drafting to develop a franchise. Ten picks as we saw in 2006 can turn a team around quickly. And considering our offseason we could make strides and become a perenial contender quickly. The key is make those trades. If they take place there are a various scenarios in the draft that I would like I think the one above is the best for the reasons I mentioned. This would also be a viable draft in terms of the CAP and would help us sustain success in that aspect of the football business.

    2008 Improvements:

    Red Zone Offense. Overall Style of Play- Offense and Defense. I love the idea of having little to no responsibility on Clemens Shoulders. I want him to play like Rothlisberger when they won the Super Bowl. Not caliber of play but Style...Throw a max of 25 times a game and a lot of them (considering the red zone targets) are TDs. Its a great way to win and develop a QB at the same time.

    2008 Remaining Weaknesses:
    Right Side of the OL. Woody is a ? and his backup is ?? I might change the pick in the 3rd round from Schuening to John Greco who could play RT and OG but Im operating under the assumption Woody will play well this year and Schuening has a higher grade. I think we could be looking at RT again next year if Woody breaks down and Bender doesnt show something. QB is also a ??? going into the season. This year will determine if Clemens remains with the team. My guess though is that he plays well enough to at the very least buy another year as starter.

    Win- Loss Predicition for the season barring impactful injuries:
    11-5Wins 11...Losses 5...If the Jets play the way we think they will, smashmouth, to set up a big to effective passing game they can win and make those 5 plays that determined the games which they lacked in about 7 games last season. I think they could also become a spread em out offense if clemens lives up to 3/4 of potential. I like the defensive changes and only hope they resign Kerry Rhodes. I think if this draft happens the Jets D will be GREAT for a LONG TIME. 11-5 isnt impossible but is unlikely I know But considering the jets' schedule as opposed to last years when we had the 6th hardest in the NFL going into the season and the Patriots had the 6th easiest

    Wow this took a long time...Definitely my biggest post... Can't Wait to see the rest of yours.

    30 DAYS!

    Other than Gholston and or Jake Long, nothing would make me happier on draft day than a Sweed/Groves combo in round one (that is assuming McFadden drops). As a plus the Boys could always deal MB III for a decent pick if they wanted.

    I dont see the Bears going for Penny (doesnt have the arm for the windy city) and I think teams are awating D-Rob getting cut instead of a trade. And lets face it, they may not be able to sign all of their picks unless he is a goner one way or the other unless Tangini works some cap magic. But I definitely like DE, ILB & OG being addressed too...
    J. MESS

    Comment


    • I'm going to try and do a no trades mock, not sure if I'll like how it works out but we'll see how it goes. Just so I don't give us a player I don't think will be there at six I'll mock out the first 5 picks as I see them in a couple different scenarios. I'm having the most trouble with St. Louis at 2 so I'll play everything off three picks I'm going to give them.

      1. Miami: Chris Long- I'm pretty sure this is going to be the pick, it's St. Louis that's going to throw things off.

      2. St. Louis: Vernon Gholston/Glenn Dorsey/Jake Long- They're said to be high on Gholston but at the same time aren't sure if his value is this high. Dorsey's injury concerns are supposedly overblown and they're said to like him. Meanwhile, Long's probably the pick if Pace isn't coming back.

      3. Atlanta: Glenn Dorsey/Jake Long/Glenn Dorsey- I'm not sold on the Ryan pick here quite yet and think they try and grab a guy in the second. Defensive tackle seems to be a need so the Dorsey fit could be good especially with intangibles, if he's not there I guess they go Long.

      4. Oakland: Jake Long/Vernon Gholston/Darren McFadden- Figured I'd put the Gholston and McFadden picks in here as I think they're both possible. Long may be ideal but I think if he's on the board Al goes Gholston, Chris Long may be the favorite here but I doubt he's available.

      5. KC: Sed Ellis/Jeff Otah- Not sure who I lean but I'd guess its going to be one of these two and both will be on the board and neither affects us.

      Which leaves us with a few possibilities:

      Vernon Gholston- If the Rams go Dorsey or J. Long and Oakland goes DMC we could end up with Gholston.

      Darren McFadden- If Oakland goes Jake Long or Gholston I see McFadden being on the board here.

      DRC/Leodis McKelvin- Corner is a need but I'd really rather not address it at 6.

      Limas Sweed/Devin Thomas- See corner, except I'd rather go corner I think because the value's better

      Derrick Harvey- Could have the value here, lots of people have him going 7 to the Pats so why not 6 to us?


      I do think what we're going to do if we don't stand pat is trade to a team in the 9-15 range, pick up a third and possibly a future pick depending on where we're trading back to. Teams may want to leapfrog the Pats to get whoever they're trying to trade for. I just don't think the Cowboys scenario is realistic, Jones's interest in DMC is a smokescreen and I think if anything they trade to our spot to jump ahead of the Pats and take not DMC but DRC who they supposedly love and the Pats could definitely have an eye on. Regardless I think we trade down in the 9-15 range get back our third and trade for less value than the chart would indicate purely for the sake of moving back a little and getting better value where we pick. Teams are hesitant to move up and I'd definitely take less value for 6 if Gholston's not there if it meant getting a trade down. In that case I say we're targeting:

      a wideout (Sweed?)
      Harvey if he slips
      Groves
      Balmer
      DRC

      Which are probably the same guys we're looking at taking at 6 if we don't trade down and that terrible scenario happens. So we save a lot of money and pick up a pick in the process, I don't care if it's a third or a second or future picks or whatever I think it's a good move overall. Second round range target guys like Cason, Avril, etc depending on who we pick in the first and then look at mid round guys like a Monk at WR. Regardless I do think with our high second we're in great position to pick up a good player so as long as we use that pick well and don't make a completely boneheaded move I'll be happy with our first. Would like to fortify the front 7 and pick up a big wideout this draft, those are my priorities. Something like:

      Trade with NO, pick up a third:

      Sweed
      Avril
      Bryant
      Goff
      McGlynn
      Bowman (CB)
      Morris (stealing the pick hcbrad I like it but I wanna make sure you get cred)

      Would be pretty nice, not great but it does give us a little help on D and then addresses depth issues on O in later rounds. Wouldn't mind a RB in this draft purely if the value presents itself though.

      Without trades realistically I guess I'd go with:

      1. Harvey (probably best fit, nice OLB potential)
      2. Dre Moore (size at end)
      4. Monk (nice potential size/speed combo)
      4. Goff (ILB to develop in 4th)
      6. Bowman (CB) (maybe Ike if he's there but a high reward guy in the 6th, small school potential)
      7. Pedro Sosa (depth & versatility, not sure if he's there but that's what I'd look for. disappointed it ended up getting put off till the 7th)
      Last edited by derza222; 03-26-2008, 09:34 PM.

      Comment


      • I thought we said the 30th? I guess I was way off then damn.

        Comment


        • No way we get a 3rd for Chad. No way. I think Denver cooled on DRob for now. I like the picks, though.

          Comment


          • Jenfanmack...If the market dictates that Josh McNown is valued at a 3rd rd pick and brian Griese at a 5th to 6th rd pick and Chad is better than both he gets that value. I think Chad in the right West Coast or running style system is a more than effective player and easily garners a 3rd rd pick, I could have gone higher bc Chad IMO and anyone with half a brain is much better than McCown. Its not about perception of value but precedent.
            Last edited by hcbrad08; 03-27-2008, 08:37 AM.
            QB, OG, OLB, WR, CB, MLB, RB, FS

            Exactly Why The Jets were the Coolest Team in the NFL under Rex, but Bowles is the man-see Arians speech:

            http://kissingsuzykolber.uproxx.com/...x-in-town.html


            http://kissingsuzykolber.uproxx.com/...e-for-you.html

            Comment


            • im not gonna quote the mocks because their huge but

              hcbrads mock:
              would be ecstatic if that happneed...however i dont think chad gets a 3 (i would guess 4), if he is even traded (which i dont think he will be), and i dont think he would be as good of a fit in chicago as you say because (like somebody beat me to) his arm isnt strong enough for the windy city...the only thing i would disagree with is round 3 where i woudl go corner with 3a (still would like williams at 3a even though i think we can get better, like if there left maybe godrey or scandrick) and then i would rather mike mcglynn because of his versatility to play and probably start at one point at both OG and OT...but LOVE the draft where we get great value and address all of our needs...however, idk if sweed will last till 22

              derzas mocks:
              i would be fine with them, i wouldnt love them as much as hcbrads but you kept it more basic and realstic because we shouldnt really assume all those trades... i woudl prefer your 1st to your 2nd but would be fine with either...we address all our needs but i jsut thinkg that waiting till 4th round to address WR (as intriguign as monk is), is too long

              good work guys (i also really like how you both mentioned goff, because i really like him and he is my top choice at ILB for the value that we woudl get him, and maybe even me top choice at ILB overall)...ill hopefully get my mock out soon but ive been really busy lately so well see
              JETS

              Comment


              • i konw this is mock time...but how does dan connor fair in the 3-4 as an ILB?

                i would assume he would be pretty good, but i dont konw too much aobut him...does anybody konw? also wht do you guys think aobut if he is capable as a 34 ILB of taking him in the 2nd round (if available)?
                JETS

                Comment


                • Obviously hcbrad's mocks are better than mine, I just tried to keep it simple to not get my hopes up. As for not addressing the wideout position till the fourth, I really didn't see much of a better option to be honest. Early guys I see us targeting are Sweed and Hardy, maybe Thomas and I kept away from Kelly because of his knees. I don't really think any of those three are worth the pick at six, but I also think they're all gone in the second too. If somebody's there I jump on it but I'm not convinced they'll be around and I wanted to keep it realistic. I also prefer my first mock to my second but I wanted to give no trades a shot.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by hcbrad08 View Post
                    Jenfanmack...If the market dictates that Josh McNown is valued at a 3rd rd pick and brian Griese at a 5th to 6th rd pick and Chad is better than both he gets that value.

                    But here is the thing you're forgetting.

                    1. Josh McCown is not better than Brian Griese.
                    2. If Josh McCown is worth a 3rd rounder, then Derek Anderson is worth half the first round.

                    The point is, using these guys as bench marks is probably not a good idea. Any more than A.J. Feeley for a second round pick.

                    Comment


                    • Vilma got a 2nd round pick at best right? Why in god's name would Chad garner a 3rd round pick?

                      Comment


                      • Vilma garnered a 4th this year and (with easy incentives) a 2nd next year.

                        I know McCown and Griese are not good examples I just think if the Jets let Pennington go...which makes sense for the cap and to say to Clemens YOUR TEAM SHOW US SOMETHING, NO MORE PETTY DISTRACTIONS. I also just dont like the idea of Pennington a popular guy with vocal Lav Coles and others in the locker room hanging over the franchise like a black cloud.

                        I only want chad if he straight up beats out clemens or if he takes a paycut (which I highly doubt) and remains the backup.

                        You all know I love Chad and maybe Im inflating his value...but you have to admit Tannebaum would look foolish to get less for chad than McCown or Griese.

                        To revise my hypithesis...it would be much more likely if the Jets dealt Pennington to a team and pulled a vilma deal....something around a 4th this year and a future pick depending on his productivity and playing time. I wouldnt say he garners a 2nd later but maybe another 4th and at the very best if he plays well a 3rd. Ive always believed that if Chad left the Jets, like so many others have, he would play better and succeed more than he did with the Jets and people would say look they traded that guy...those thoughts have died down in my mind but Im not counting out the fact that Chad could mean a lot to a team like the Falcons or Bears who lack a stand up team guy with a lot of veteran/playoff experience.

                        I guess Im just saying I wouldnt discount the possibility...bc of his cap number and desire to start and our investment in Clemens coming to the forefront. Gus Ferrotte, Daunte Culpepper, and Kelly Holcomb come to mind as backups not Chad, I think if we trade or cut him we should sign one of those 3 maybe 90 year old Jamie Martin (someone whos a true backup, but competetive and hardworking enough not someone waiting in the wings to get in)

                        Ive heard a lot of talk from people about the Jets making CP a draft day trade...ive also heard about carolina being somewhat interested in drob maybe we package CP and DROB as Delhomme is injury prone and CP would compete. Just a fleeting thought prob wouldnt work as Carolina should draft for the future not bring in a smarter delhome with better accuracy but less of an arm.

                        A lot of possibilities thats why we have to explain them all.
                        QB, OG, OLB, WR, CB, MLB, RB, FS

                        Exactly Why The Jets were the Coolest Team in the NFL under Rex, but Bowles is the man-see Arians speech:

                        http://kissingsuzykolber.uproxx.com/...x-in-town.html


                        http://kissingsuzykolber.uproxx.com/...e-for-you.html

                        Comment


                        • I'll be honest I don't see D-Rob going anywhere. Teams are interested, and it'd be nice if we could try to get a bidding war going but between his terrible knee and terrible contract nobody's willing to give up anything. To be quite frank, not restructuring with a team just really screws us over because he's not going to see the money on this contract anyway after he gets cut (if we don't cut him I'll be pissed) and he'll have to sign a FA contract anyway. I guess he assumes he'll get more on the open market, but I'm not sure, especially with 4ish teams that are interested but only for the right price (Denver, Cincy, Detroit, Carolina). He's getting cut by us and we're not getting anything back, assuming anything else is hopeful IMO. And besides, cutting him more than doubles our cap space and he's not doing anything for us anyway, if we can get a pick for him its a steal but even if we cut him it's a great move.

                          As far as Penny goes, I don't see us moving him. If we get an offer that blows us out of the water I think we do, but right now it doesn't make much sense. I don't think we particularly want Clemens out there if he's not our best option and we're in win now mode. Not that I want Penny to win a TC battle in any sense or think he will, but we're going to want to simply put ourselves in a position to win. Beyond that he's a solid (but expensive) backup and a good mentor for a young player. I don't see a team offering all that much for him because his arm is shot, only a team that has a weak QB situation or an injury just before the season starts that needs a smart, move the chains QB. Even then, the pick 6 risk with Penny is tremendous, so for being a smart QB he's not mistake free which really decreases his value. I don't see us getting much unless some team is desperate, and I don't think we're going to move him just for the sake of moving him. Because of that, I think he's there in TC and we'll see what happens from there. By the way, although he's expensive by the time we get to TC unless we need money for Rhodes (which cutting D-Rob will give us plenty of so I doubt it) I see no need to move him for the sake of moving him.

                          I guess my theory is, as of now, D-Rob is getting cut with us recieving no compensation and Penny will be in TC and we'll see what happens from there. Don't see us doing much more in FA, right now the FO needs to concentrate on keeping Rhodes long-term before he raises his value to ridiculous levels (we need to cut D-Rob first) and the draft. Hoping for anything more than that is just being very hopeful though IMO.

                          Comment


                          • Just a comment on the Pennington trade to Chicago scenario...albeit unlikely bc w the exception of someone who got called by their girlfirends uncles cousins baby daddy last year with inside info (when we traded up for revis) you really cant predict them....

                            BUT for those who say he cant play in a windy city then why would we keep him in the meadowlands where the wind is the most unpredictable and probably 2nd worst to Chicago...if not 2nd (bc thats so subjective its almost not worth posting but its a post) then at least top 5. i was at a night game where he threw a perfect spiral to mccareins down the sideline and it looked like it hit a wal and floated straight down.

                            DO I think Arizona would be a wonderful place for him where theres NO WIND. Absolutely for certain open up down the field plays BUT realistically any team that has pennington is going to ask him to make the quick slant and timing throws that he can make effectively....Again and it bears repeating, Pennington can be effective when hes not forced to PRESS (go 70 yards in 40 seconds or at least 40 to get in FG range) bc in those scenarios he needs to throw out routes instead of mixing plays up so the wr can get out of bounds and stop the clock. I think he can be effective I just hate going to CLemens and going back, bc essentially its an indictment of our 2nd rd pick in 2006 and kills some of the confidence I would have in the FO drafting ability...bc we could have gone in 2006...
                            1A) Jay Cutler QB
                            1B) Nick Mangold C
                            2) Trade down and take Marcus McNeill OT

                            i know monday morning QBing is unfair but still if Clemens isnt it now but might be in the future why did we set him up to fail last season with no OL and no deep or big WR threat.

                            I just want to make sure the team is protecting investments and really building for the future as well as trying to win now.
                            QB, OG, OLB, WR, CB, MLB, RB, FS

                            Exactly Why The Jets were the Coolest Team in the NFL under Rex, but Bowles is the man-see Arians speech:

                            http://kissingsuzykolber.uproxx.com/...x-in-town.html


                            http://kissingsuzykolber.uproxx.com/...e-for-you.html

                            Comment


                            • At this point our QB situation pretty much sucks. Pennington is a nice game manager but you have to wonder what happens when he starts throwing outs as you said hcbrad. I think he's a great guy to have if you're trying to spark a young team, maybe use as a stopgap for a young guy to mentor and try not to make mistakes. But his arm is a liability because it brings defenses up in the box and ESPECIALLY late in games trying to make a comeback when he's throwing outs (again as you said) because you just have to wait for a corner to jump a route and it's 6 the other way. If he gets traded anywhere I see it to a team with instability at the QB position that needs a stopgap starter for a year or so and then have the guy they draft this year take over (Atlanta?). But he's not a guy you want playing QB for you because he's just not a good late game quarterback, odds are you don't win the close ones with Chad under center. I'm pretty sure that happened in at least three games this past season, trying to come back and he threw a pick (Giants, Bengals, one of the Bills games). He's just not long-term starter material anywhere IMO, he's a mentor and a stopgap and you're not going to get much for that.

                              Clemens is just really inconsistant. He's either going to take a massive step forward this year or do absolutely nothing and force us to draft a guy. Depending on what we think of him we may draft a guy this year. Granted, he had a crap offensive line no running game and essentially only one starting caliber wideout part of the time. But next year to start the season we should have a much improved pass and run blocking OL and Coles will hopefully be healthy. That gives us a better run game and more time for him to throw alogn with better guys to throw to. Add in Franks in the RZ and any offensive players we draft (hopefully a big wideout that's a deep threat) and he has no excuses. If we get a deep threat in here he's got everything he needs to succeed, and if we don't hes got a nice supporting cast anyways. By the way, our getting a deep threat or not in the draft could be a major indicator of what direction we're going in with QB's. He needs to take a large step forward with a solid supporting cast and a year of starting under his belt. We need him to get us into the endzone, avoid mistakes, and really bring that completion percentage up. Ideally he can be like Roethlisberger was his rookie season for the Steelers, don't ask him to do much just not make mistakes and see how he progresses from there. That said he needs to take a big step forward for the future of this franchise and should have everything he needs to do it. If he doesn't we may need to draft a guy next year, and if we're not convinced he will we should probably go after a guy this year.

                              On a side note reports are we've agreed to something with Coles. They're conflicting, the Post says we extended him 2-3 years and ESPN says we just guaranteed the last two years of his deal. Rotoworld says they think the Post is right but I'm sure more info will be out soon. Regardless I think this is great news, LC has good hands and is a nice reliable target for a young QB if Clemens starts and has great chemistry with Chad if somehow he starts. Plus, it means we don't have to rush a young WR into a starting job (there are exceptions but it generally takes around 3 years, look at a guy like Roddy White who exploded last year with a terrible team around him). If we grab a guy that can run deep routes, play in the red zone, and create mismatches from the slot that doesn't have to start from day 1 I think it's great for the wideouts development and he can play a big role on the team and really help our QB's as well. Definitely hope it happens.

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                              • you guys are in a sticky situation with Clemens. You can't give up on him so quickly, but at the same time he has been pretty inconsistent. But hey, we just saw what patience can do for Eli, so its waaay too early to write him off just yet.

                                The one thing that would scare me, when i evaluated his game thus far is blitz recognition. Clemens does a terrible job at recognizing the blitz, really really poor job of it, and he looks terrible out there when you overload blitz him. Thats going to be key in his development, how well he recognizes that this year. From my limited study of him, he was very unimpressive in that regards, and that has to worry you a bit.

                                But again, give it time, its way too early to write him off. I haven't OD'ed on studying his game so I can't give a fair evaluation of him, but one thing that did stick out to me was his blitz recognition.

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