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  • #16
    Originally posted by richdg View Post
    Woodley has good timed speed. he does not change directions well at all. He doesn't have much in the way of moves. Woodley doesn't need to agin weight to play OLB. He should lose weight. But he simply is not quick enough. But at 6-1 gaining weight to play DE does work well either.
    One of the mistakes we have made is getting rid of the OLB that is better at coverage. haggans is our rush LB. He isn't very good in coverage either. If we are sticking with the 3-4 Woodley will not have time to develop. He will ahve to play right away. This just isn't a good option.
    Well of course your entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with you whole heartedly.

    Comment


    • #17
      deleted. Not my teams forum, not my place to say anything. Sorry for taking up the space.
      Last edited by ironman4579; 03-23-2007, 11:32 AM.



      Originally posted by Jakey
      WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

      i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by ironman4579 View Post
        deleted. Not my teams forum, not my place to say anything. Sorry for taking up the space.
        well if you know a lot about him go ahead and tell us what you think, judging by your sig you are obviusly a michigan fan so you probably have seen a lot more of him then us

        as long as what you say isnt "omg omg woodley is the bestest ever"

        thanks to steel man for the fresh sig

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by richdg View Post
          Woodley has good timed speed. he does not change directions well at all. He doesn't have much in the way of moves. Woodley doesn't need to agin weight to play OLB. He should lose weight. But he simply is not quick enough. But at 6-1 gaining weight to play DE does work well either.
          One of the mistakes we have made is getting rid of the OLB that is better at coverage. haggans is our rush LB. He isn't very good in coverage either. If we are sticking with the 3-4 Woodley will not have time to develop. He will ahve to play right away. This just isn't a good option.
          I agree. I'd like to see us hold off until day 2 to pick up OLB prospects.

          I'd like to see Tim Shaw, and a guy like Brian Robison/Brian Smith/Jason Trusnik/Marques Murrell/Jacob Ford/Mike McFadden.

          Shaw can do coverage, play ILB/OLB in either 3-4/4-3 alignments.

          Robison (Or other guys) can learn behind someone and come in on pass rushing situations and ST's.

          I like Trusnik/Murrell and McFadden as UDFA's or 7th rounders.


          I think Shaw, Robison as drafted, then sign Trusnik and McFadden... I think we'll work through camp and have an excellent young lb core in waiting.


          Although I do want to sign almost all the guys from GVSU that are eligible..

          Cullen Finnerty, QB
          Ryan Fowler, WR
          Mike McFadden, OLB
          Derrick Jones, DE/OLB (6'4 272lbs 4.71 40')

          Yeah, I play WoW too.[/CENTER]

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by mikehop05 View Post
            well if you know a lot about him go ahead and tell us what you think, judging by your sig you are obviusly a michigan fan so you probably have seen a lot more of him then us

            as long as what you say isnt "omg omg woodley is the bestest ever"
            OMG, WOODLEY IS TEH ROXXORZ!!! No just kidding. Seriously though, I'll give you my impression of Woodley, and I'll try to reference it to the post that said please don't take Woodley.

            First off, Michigan really only went back to a 4-3 defense this year, so of course Woodley would be moved back to DE. Clearly he's not a 4-3 OLB, but the move back to DE had almost nothing to do with his inability at the position, and almost everything to do with the change in defensive philosophy brought in by Ron English IMO.

            As far as disappearing in the OSU and USC games, he did have 4 tackles in the OSU game, and he was getting pressure, Smith was just getting the ball out of his hand because the secondary was having problems with OSU's speed. But I'll admit that he really had no impact in that game. As far as USC, he had 3 tackles and a sack. Not great, but not terrible either. And considering that was Michigan's ONLY sack in that game, I don't think it's completely awful.

            And really, if you're looking at him as an 3-4 OLB, you have to look at him in that situation. He played OLB in '04 and '05.

            '04 numbers at OLB
            11 games played, 70 tackles, 16 TFL, 4 sacks, 4 pass break ups, 3 forced fumbles.

            And let's not forget the '04 Rose Bowl against Texas when he had 11 tackles and 4 tackles for loss.

            '05 numbers at OLB
            9 games played(slight injury), 48 tackles, 12 TFL, 5 sacks, 1 pass break up, 1 fumble recovery and 3 more forced fumbles.

            So in 2 season as an 3-4 OLB, he averaged 59 tackles, 14 TFL, 4.5 sacks, 2.5 PBU's, and 3 forced fumbles. I don't think that's too terrible honestly. In fact I always thought he was a better OLB than DE.

            And let's not forget, Woodley has basically played a different position all 4 years at Michigan(he actually played the rush backer position in '05) so he hasn't really had the chance to learn the ins and outs of any position. He just makes plays on instinct right now. If he actually got a set position and was able to get some coaching on that position, I think he could be an absolute monster. And I would also think his willingness to play a different position evey year shows what type of player and teammate he is.

            That's obviously my personal opinion on him, and I am certainly not trying to say he has no flaws. He is pretty weak in coverage at this point. Sometimes he struggles to read the play. He has decent speed for his size, but he's not going to blow you away. I think his change of direction is better than he's been given credit for, but I agree that it's not exactly "elite"

            So anyway, take all of that for what it's worth. Just my opinion.



            Originally posted by Jakey
            WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

            i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by ironman4579 View Post
              OMG, WOODLEY IS TEH ROXXORZ!!! No just kidding. Seriously though, I'll give you my impression of Woodley, and I'll try to reference it to the post that said please don't take Woodley.

              First off, Michigan really only went back to a 4-3 defense this year, so of course Woodley would be moved back to DE. Clearly he's not a 4-3 OLB, but the move back to DE had almost nothing to do with his inability at the position, and almost everything to do with the change in defensive philosophy brought in by Ron English IMO.

              As far as disappearing in the OSU and USC games, he did have 4 tackles in the OSU game, and he was getting pressure, Smith was just getting the ball out of his hand because the secondary was having problems with OSU's speed. But I'll admit that he really had no impact in that game. As far as USC, he had 3 tackles and a sack. Not great, but not terrible either. And considering that was Michigan's ONLY sack in that game, I don't think it's completely awful.

              And really, if you're looking at him as an 3-4 OLB, you have to look at him in that situation. He played OLB in '04 and '05.

              '04 numbers at OLB
              11 games played, 70 tackles, 16 TFL, 4 sacks, 4 pass break ups, 3 forced fumbles.

              And let's not forget the '04 Rose Bowl against Texas when he had 11 tackles and 4 tackles for loss.

              '05 numbers at OLB
              9 games played(slight injury), 48 tackles, 12 TFL, 5 sacks, 1 pass break up, 1 fumble recovery and 3 more forced fumbles.

              So in 2 season as an 3-4 OLB, he averaged 59 tackles, 14 TFL, 4.5 sacks, 2.5 PBU's, and 3 forced fumbles. I don't think that's too terrible honestly. In fact I always thought he was a better OLB than DE.

              And let's not forget, Woodley has basically played a different position all 4 years at Michigan(he actually played the rush backer position in '05) so he hasn't really had the chance to learn the ins and outs of any position. He just makes plays on instinct right now. If he actually got a set position and was able to get some coaching on that position, I think he could be an absolute monster. And I would also think his willingness to play a different position evey year shows what type of player and teammate he is.

              That's obviously my personal opinion on him, and I am certainly not trying to say he has no flaws. He is pretty weak in coverage at this point. Sometimes he struggles to read the play. He has decent speed for his size, but he's not going to blow you away. I think his change of direction is better than he's been given credit for, but I agree that it's not exactly "elite"

              So anyway, take all of that for what it's worth. Just my opinion.
              thats some good stuff and i appreciate the insight,

              it seems like we are decently interested in woodley, and all in all i think his motor makes up for his less than ideal size, though what concerns me is his coverage abilities

              if we grab him in the 3rd i would be happy with that

              thanks to steel man for the fresh sig

              Comment


              • #22
                I have heard scouts say he is actually a better pass rush in a stand up role in the 3-4. I also understand that he is not the best in coverage, neither is Shawn Merriman or many pure rush backers.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Woodley played with his hand on the ground since his freshman year. Weither you call that a DE or OLB doesn't matter. He does not cover well. To compare him to a 3-4 LB, he is a less talented version of Haggans. He isn't as tall, nor is he as fast. I like the guy, but he is a classic example of a good college player that may not make it as a pro.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Woodley is one of those classic great college players who doesn' do anything in the NFL. Hate to say it, but its true.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by richdg View Post
                      Woodley played with his hand on the ground since his freshman year. Weither you call that a DE or OLB doesn't matter. He does not cover well. To compare him to a 3-4 LB, he is a less talented version of Haggans. He isn't as tall, nor is he as fast. I like the guy, but he is a classic example of a good college player that may not make it as a pro.
                      No, he was a true OLB in the 3-4 in '04 and a rush backer in the 3-4 in '05. He might have had his hand on the ground once in a while, moreso in '05(actually I would say most of the time in the '05 season) but he was a stand up LB. I'm not saying he'll be a superstar, I'm simply saying he has experience as a true OLB in the 3-4. Would he be better as a rush backer, like a Merriman Role, just let him get after the QB? Absolutely.
                      Last edited by ironman4579; 03-29-2007, 03:27 PM.



                      Originally posted by Jakey
                      WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

                      i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Sorry, but you are wrong. I watch every Michigan game, and have been to several over the past few years. Woodley played almost every down with his hand on the ground.
                        The best player to compare Woodley to is James Hall. The former Lions DE. He isn't as tall as Hall is however. But they play the same type of game.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Seriously, go back to '04. I'll give you that most of the time in '05 he had his hand on the ground, but not '04. However. my memory always has a chance of being faulty. Perhaps I can dig up some tape from '04. I'f I am wrong, I'll let you know.



                          Originally posted by Jakey
                          WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

                          i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            In trueth, it doesn't matter. The fact is Woodley plays DE, because he is not comforatble dropping back into covarge. He has been playing with his hand down, because he is better in the DE position. Be it for 2 years, 3 years, or 4 years. Woodley is not a good fit with the Steelers. There are much better options out there.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by richdg View Post
                              In trueth, it doesn't matter. The fact is Woodley plays DE, because he is not comforatble dropping back into covarge. He has been playing with his hand down, because he is better in the DE position. Be it for 2 years, 3 years, or 4 years. Woodley is not a good fit with the Steelers. There are much better options out there.
                              Honestly, I would give you that one, simply because in a 3-4, Woodley would be better as a rush backer in a Merriman type role and, despite not knowing a ton about the Steelers, that really doesn't seem to be your biggest need right now.



                              Originally posted by Jakey
                              WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

                              i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                He Was An Outside Linebacker

                                Originally posted by richdg View Post
                                In trueth, it doesn't matter. The fact is Woodley plays DE, because he is not comforatble dropping back into covarge. He has been playing with his hand down, because he is better in the DE position. Be it for 2 years, 3 years, or 4 years. Woodley is not a good fit with the Steelers. There are much better options out there.
                                Dude, Get a pharking clue. At least do a little research before you think you know what you are talking about.

                                Everyone seems to think that Woodley is a second round pick. I don't see it. He will go first round like Kiwanuka did last year after his stock dropped. The Patriots have supposedly worked him out in private and are considering using one of their two first round picks on him.

                                I love how versatile the kid is despite how many feel about him. Some interesting tidbits about him:

                                http://patriots.bostonherald.com/pat...format=&page=1

                                "The buy-in was what got the corner turned. And no one profited like Woodley. TWICE AND ALL-BIG EN PICK AT LINEBACKER, he became a consensus first-team All-American up front while winning the Lombardi Award (nation’s top lineman), the Ted Hendricks Award (top defensive end) and national defensive player of the year honors from Rivals.com.

                                Along the way, he further developed the on-field versatility that the Patriots crave.

                                In a 3-4 as a sophomore, HE PLAYED AS AN ON-THE-LINE 'BACKER. In a 4-3 as a junior, HE WAS AN OUTSIDE LINEBACKER and end in the Wolverines’ over and under fronts. As a senior, when new defensive coordinator Ron English installed a Tampa-2 hybrid, he played a more traditional 4-3 end.

                                Better yet, Woodley never complained. Winning was his concern and had been since Day 1, when he was converted from high school linebacker to college end and put on the field as a true freshman."

                                All Big-Ten twice as a 'Backer and he can't play OLB in our 3-4?

                                Get a clue man. When you have two very respected franchises that really like a player, you might need to start re-evaluating what you know. Which is apparently not very much. This kid has suceeded in every scheme he has played and that includes a Tampa-2 type system.

                                I am not saying he's going to be the pick at 15, but you know that Tomlin has to like his versatility.

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