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2011 NBA Draft Thread

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  • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
    Yeah, because if the NBA was rigging the lottery they'd make it plainly obvious every year...lol. That's just simple minded thinking. If a conspiracy is going on, the conspirators won't want it to be obvious. I'm not saying the lottery is rigged for certain, but it's quite suspicious. There's a 98.3% chance Chicago didn't win a legitimate lottery for the #1 pick in 2008.
    Conspiracy theories have to have a pattern. The league hasnt favored small teams or big teams or made sure a player goes to his hometown. And as Derza points out there was a ton of speculation that Chicago would draft Beasley because they had a glut of guards and needed a low post scorer to get over the whole Tyrus Thomas debacle.

    Picking in the top 3 is also not a guarantee of success. The Hawks picked Marvin Williams at 2, Memphis picked Thabeet, Chicago picked Aldridge and traded him away. Kyrie Irving is a good prospect but he is not John Wall or Blake Griffin and he certainly isnt Lebron James and isnt going to rebuild Cleveland all on is own.

    Comment


    • fairly confident there's conspiracy going on. not this year but pretty sure years past.

      btw i hate everyone who just dismisses conspiracy saying that they're stupid and that conspiracies will never happen.

      why not?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
        There's a 98.3% chance Chicago didn't win a legitimate lottery for the #1 pick in 2008.

        I don't think you understand probability very well.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by soybean View Post
          fairly confident there's conspiracy going on. not this year but pretty sure years past.

          btw i hate everyone who just dismisses conspiracy saying that they're stupid and that conspiracies will never happen.

          why not?
          Just simply because there is not repeatable pattern. Some people are saying they gave No.1 to the Cavs just to slight the Clippers. Why would they then send Blake Griffin to the Clips just 2 years ago? The NBA lost a lot of TV viewership and ad dollars when both the Celtics and Lakers lost. The NBA doesnt play favorites at all. There may be individual people that may have vested interests(refs for example) but I dont see the league ganging up on a whole to favor certain teams.If it did somebody would definitely leak it out. You think when half the owners are suffering losses from the basketball operations would be ok with letting the league screw them out of the next superstar?

          This is an old Truehoop post which i agree with 100%. http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/pos...lottery-rigged
          Talks about why rigging doesnt make sense and what they should do to make it more transparent.

          Comment


          • Speculation about Chicago taking Beasley came from fans and media. That's meaningless.

            And if someone wants to break down how I was wrong on probability, instead of typing one sentence and running away, feel free.

            ESPN is in business with the NBA. If there's a conspiracy, I wouldn't look to them for the truth. To be fair, even ESPN acknowledges that the Pau Gasol to the Lakers trade was a sham.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
              Speculation about Chicago taking Beasley came from fans and media. That's meaningless.

              And if someone wants to break down how I was wrong on probability, instead of typing one sentence and running away, feel free.

              ESPN is in business with the NBA. If there's a conspiracy, I wouldn't look to them for the truth. To be fair, even ESPN acknowledges that the Pau Gasol to the Lakers trade was a sham.

              I'm not running away. There was a 98.3% chance that they wouldn't win the lottery. But they did win it, so the probability that they won it legitimately is an entirely different thing.

              If the Timberwolves would have won the lottery last night would you have said that there was a 75% chance they didn't win a legitimate lottery?

              Comment


              • Not at all. Beasley came of a season that was even better than Durant's and was national player of the year. Its sad that people see the current Goofball version but the guy was a dominant player whose only issue was his height and that he was a more casual guy rather than a serious stand up guy like Rose. Rose meanwhile put up 14 points and 5 assists that season. He didnt have a good season at all till the Tournament and had a lot of people questioning whether he was a pure point guard because of his low assist numbers. It was by no means a slam dunk atleast early in the draft process.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by yo123 View Post
                  I'm not running away. There was a 98.3% chance that they wouldn't win the lottery.
                  Which is the point I was making, and everyone who read it knew it. I'm not really interested in a dumb argument over whether I worded it 100% correct.

                  Comment


                  • Beasley was/is an undersized PF with serious maturity/characters issues. It hasn't been a shock that he's failed to live up to being the #2 pick. Rose was the clear #1 prospect in that draft.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                      Which is the point I was making, and everyone who read it knew it. I'm not really interested in a dumb argument over whether I worded it 100% correct.

                      I really doubt everyone knew it, but if you're going to get all pissy about a small correction then forget it.

                      Comment


                      • As a Timberwolves fan, I love to believe there is a conspiracy. But it is unlikely.

                        Bonekrusher.

                        Originally posted by JordanTaber
                        Football...it's rocket surgery now, folks.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                          Beasley was/is an undersized PF with serious maturity/characters issues. It hasn't been a shock that he's failed to live up to being the #2 pick. Rose was the clear #1 prospect in that draft.
                          In retrospect, Rose was obviously the #1 prospect, and Beasley was an undersized PF with character problems. And I'm not shocked that Beasley didn't live up to being the #2 pick either. But he was an absolute monster in college and I'm sure there were quite a few people who thought he was the #1 prospect in the draft, it wasn't nearly as clear as you're making it seem. Plus the Bulls did their due diligence on both players, and supposedly elected to choose Rose based on the interview process (among other things I'm sure). If they had decided before the draft that they were going to take Rose there would have been little to no reason to go through the process with both players, they could have just announced they were going to go with Rose and been done with it. But they didn't, and if it wasn't a lock that they were going to take him then it doesn't make sense that the NBA would have given the Bulls the #1 pick so they could draft a hometown kid.

                          Comment


                          • New Mock Draft

                            Trades:

                            Trade #1:

                            Philadelphia Receives:
                            #4 pick overall(Enes Kanter)
                            Antawn Jamison

                            Cleveland Receives:
                            Andre Iguodala

                            Reasoning: Philadelphia appears to be shopping Iguodala hard this offseason for several reasons. First is his contract. 4 years 14 mil a year for a guy who isn’t a #1. 2nd he’s given statements of wanting to leave the team. Lastly the fit isn’t great. The franchise is committed towards moving on with Evan Turner who is too similar of a player also Iguodala has been misused by Doug Collins who has been treating him like a #1 scorer instead of running the offense through Holiday and Brand. Doing this trade makes too much sense for both sides. For Philly the trade allows them to start their nice young trio for the future with Holiday at PG, Turner at SG, and Thaddeus Young at SF. Antawn Jamison gives them an immediate starting 4 beside Brand. Having followed the Wizards closely Collins will love Jamison’s veteran leadership and the fact that his contract only has half the years left that Iguodala’s has. The #4 overall pick also allows them to add a 5th piece to the young core if you include Lou Williams. This is a financial and youth move. As for the Cavs the value Iguodala brings them is beyond anything the #4 pick in this years draft would. I’ve always referred to Iguodala as a poor man’s LeBron and right now SF is the Cavs biggest weakness and no one at #4 is worth it. A lineup with Kyrie, Iguodala, Hickson, Varejao would at least be competitive on the on set.
                            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #2

                            Utah Receives:
                            #20 pick overall(Tyler Honeycutt)
                            Michael Beasley
                            Johnny Flynn

                            Minnesota Receives:
                            Devin Harris
                            Future First Round Pick(top 14 protected 2012, top 10 protected 2013, unprotected 2014)

                            Reasoning: Minnesota needs a PG immediately more than anyone else. Even if Rubio does come over this year he’s not ready to be a full time PG. Devin Harris is the perfect bridge as he’s a solid PG who is good enough to start for a couple years but you don’t have to hang on him as the PG of the future. For Utah Devin Harris becomes far too expensive of a backup with the drafting of Brandon Knight. They get back a young SF in training(Honeycutt) and get a big versatile scorer in Beasley. Flynn becomes the backup PG.
                            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #3

                            Portland Receives:
                            #6 pick overall(Kemba Walker)

                            Washington Receives:
                            Nicholas Batum

                            Reasoning: With the emergence of Wesley Matthews, the trade for Gerald Wallace and still having Rudy Fernandez under contract, Batum is no longer thought of as untouchable. His role has decreased and it’s hard to imagine the Blazers giving him a contract next summer with so much money tied down to Brandon Roy, Lamarcus Aldridge, and Gerald Wallace. I think at this point the Blazers need to turn their attention to keeping Oden next summer if he shows anything this coming season. This pick allows them to draft their PG of the future regardless of if they retain Andre Miller next year. Kemba would be great playing off of Roy. For Washington they would definitely be willing to move this pick for a veteran player. Batum is perfect for the Wizards. He’s young, plays defense, has a ton of potential and fit’s the teams #1 need which is a SF. They definitely wouldn’t find a SF with the #6 pick with the value of a Batum. If it’s down to Kawhi Leonard or Batum I’d take Batum.
                            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #4:

                            Chicago Receives:
                            #17 pick overall(Klay Thompson)

                            New York Receives:
                            #28 pick overall(Charles Jenkins)
                            #30 pick overall(JuJuan Johnson)
                            Cash Considerations

                            Reasoning: Chicago desperately needs a shooter to put beside Rose. Thompson is possibly the best pure shooter in the draft. Thompson could probably grab the starting SG spot day 1, his attitude and demeanor towards the game also fits in well with the Bulls. For the Knicks they need depth and youth infusion on that roster. They really like Jenkins but he’s a reach at #17. They get him at 28 and JuJuan Johnson a guy with his length and athleticism could play some center under D’Antoni.
                            ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #5:

                            New Jersey Receives:
                            #17 pick overall(Kenneth Farried)

                            Washington Receives:
                            #27 pick overall(Trey Thompkins)
                            Ability to swap picks in 2012 or 2013 if not becomes 2nd rounder in 2014

                            Reasoning: You have a supremely offensively talented big who also happens to be a horrendous rebounded. Makes sense to pair him with the best rebounded to come out since Paul Millsap. Farried’s rebounding, shot blocking and motor would be perfect for the Jazz. Also is great setting picks and rolling to the hoop with Deron Williams. Kris Humphries was a great story but no point in paying him 6+ mil a year when you can get more in a guy like Faried. For the Wizards the big key is the ability to swap picks in subsequent years which are projected to be stronger drafts. Trey Thompkins is also a big pickup and makes Andray Blatche expendable if anyone will take on his contract.
                            -------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #6

                            Cleveland Receives:
                            #23 pick overall(Marshon Brooks)

                            Houston Receives:
                            Cleveland First round pick(Top 16 protected 2012, top 14 protected 2013, top 10 protected 2014, No protection 2015)
                            Reasoning: Cleveland needs a young SG bad. Brooks is a guy who is rising up draft boards fast. He has a freakish 7-2” wingspan and is one of the best pure scorers in the draft. He would be perfect running along with Kyrie as he can run some point and have Kyrie play off ball to ease the load. Houston doesn’t need the pick as they have several in this draft and get a future pick in hopefully a stronger draft.
                            -----------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #7

                            LA Lakers Receive:
                            #36 pick overall(Iman Shumpert)

                            New Jersey Nets Receive:
                            #41 pick overall(Jereme Richmond)
                            #46 pick overall(Jon Leuer)

                            Reasoning: Lakers can’t make all 4 picks in the draft so any sort of move up would be smart. Shumpert is the perfect pick to possibly play PG in the triangle or SG. Great potential defensively and versatile on offense. The Nets get a promising enigmatic player in Richmond and a nice finesse four in Leuer to complement to interior strength of Faried.
                            -----------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #8

                            Minnesota Receive:
                            #50 overall(Malcolm Lee)

                            Philadelphia Receives:
                            2012 2nd round pick

                            Reasoning: Philly has their roster set and Minnesota could add a nice young SG. Malcolm Lee is a great value at this point in the draft. Nice defensive potential and has shown flashes of being a good scorer. Can also run a little point and in the long term could be a 6th man backup for both the PG and SG slots ala a Jamal Crawford type role.
                            -----------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Trade #9

                            Washington Receives:
                            #50 pick overall(Bojan Bogdanovic)

                            Portland Receives:
                            Cash Considerations

                            Reasoning: Portland doesn’t have a free roster space, Washington grabs a guy to stash in Europe who has potential to be an impact player in this league down the line.
                            -------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Trade #10

                            New York Receives:
                            #58 overall(Greg Smith)

                            LA Lakers Receive:
                            Cash Considerations

                            Reasoning: Lakers don’t need to make another pick the Knicks could add another young player. Greg Smith lacks great skill and is highly inconsistent but he has a man’s body and has potential to be a beast in the post if you can coach him up properly.
                            -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                            Round 1

                            1. Cleveland: Kyrie Irving: PG: Duke
                            2. Minnesota: Derrick Williams: PF/SF: Arizona
                            3. Utah: Brandon Knight: PG: Kentucky
                            4. Philadelphia(f/ Cleveland) Enes Kanter: PF/C: Turkey
                            5. Toronto: Jan Vesely: SF/PF: Czech Republic
                            6. Portland(f/Washington) Kemba Walker: PG: UCONN
                            7. Sacramento: Bismack Biyombo: PF/C: Congo
                            8. Detroit: Jonas Valanciunas: C: Lithuania
                            9. Charlotte: Tristan Thompson: PF/C: Texas
                            10. Milwaukee: Kawhi Leonard: SF: San Diego State
                            11. Golden State: Donatas Montiejunas: PF/SF: Lithuania
                            12. Utah: Alec Burks: SG: Colorado
                            13. Phoenix: Marcus Morris: SF/PF: Kansas
                            14. Houston: Chris Singleton: SF: Florida State
                            15. Indiana: Jimmer Fredette: PG/SG: BYU
                            16. Philadelphia: Jordan Hamilton: SF: Texas
                            17. Chicago(f/New York) Klay Thompson: SG: Washington State
                            18. New Jersey(f/Washington) Kenneth Faried: PF: Morehead State
                            19. Charlotte: Darius Morris: PG: Michigan
                            20. Utah(f/Minnesota) Tyler Honeycutt: SF: UCLA
                            21. Portland: Markief Morris: PF: Kansas
                            22. Denver: Tobias Harris: SF/PF: Tennessee
                            23. Cleveland(f/Houston): Marshon Brooks: SG: Providence
                            24. Oklahoma City: Justin Harper: SF/PF: Richmond
                            25. Boston: Jordan Williams: PF/C: Maryland
                            26. Dallas: Travis Leslie: SF: Georgia
                            27. Washington(f/New Jersey) Trey Thompkins: PF: Georgia
                            28. New York(f/Chicago) Charles Jenkins: PG/SG: Hofstra
                            29. San Antonio: Davis Bertans: SF: Latvia
                            30. New York(f/Chicago) JuJuan Johnson: PF/C: Purdue

                            Round 2

                            31. Miami: Josh Selby: PG/SG: Kansas
                            32. Cleveland: David Lighty: SG: Ohio State
                            33. Detroit: Reggie Jackson: PG: Boston College
                            34. Washington: Norris Cole: PG: Cleveland State
                            35. Sacramento: Nolan Smith: PG: Duke
                            36. LA Lakers(f/New Jersey) Iman Shumpert: PG/SG: Georgia Tech
                            37. LA Clippers: Scotty Hopson: SF: Tennessee
                            38. Houston: Jeremy Tyler: PF/C: USA
                            39. Charlotte: Jimmy Butler: SF: Marquette 4
                            40. Milwaukee: Shelvin Mack: PG: Butler
                            41. New Jersey(f/LA Lakers) Jereme Richmond: SF: Illinois
                            42. Indiana: Jamie Skeen: PF/SF: VCU
                            43. Golden State: Keith Benson: PF/C: Oakland
                            44. Chicago: Demetri McCamey: PG: Illinois
                            45. New Orleans: Cory Joseph: PG: Texas
                            46. New Jersey(f/LA Lakers) Jon Leuer: PF: Wisconsin
                            47. LA Clippers: Nikola Vucevic: PF/C: USC
                            48. Atlanta: Chandler Parsons: SF: Florida
                            49. Memphis: Vernon Macklin: PF: Florida
                            50. Minnesota(f/Philadelphia): Malcolm Lee: SG: UCLA
                            51. Washington(f/Portland) Bojan Bogdanovic: SG/SF: Croatia
                            52. Denver: Rick Jackson: C: Syracuse
                            53. Orlando: Kyle Singler: SF: Duke
                            54. Cleveland: Nikola Mirotic: SF: Montenegro
                            55. Boston: E’Twuan Moore: PG: Purdue
                            56. LA Lakers: Robin Benzing: SF: Germany
                            57. Dallas: Gary Mcghee: C: Pitt
                            58. New York(f/LA Lakers) Greg Smith: C: Fresno State
                            59. San Antonio: Willie Reed: PF: St. Louis
                            60. Sacramento: Malcolm Thomas: SF/PF: San Diego State

                            Below are some projected Depth Charts for some teams that were heavily involved in this mock:
                            ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Projected Utah Depth Chart:

                            PG: Brandon Knight/Johnny Flynn
                            SG: Alec Burks/Gordon Heyward/Raja Bell
                            SF: Michael Beasley/CJ Miles/Tyler Honeycutt
                            PF: Paul Milsap/Derrick Favors
                            C: Al Jefferson/Mehmet Okur

                            Overall Assessment of Team: Wow if Brandon Knight could develop fairly quick this would be a team to watch in the league. The depth at every position is pretty ridiculous but more importantly with great young talent. This could easily be the next Grizzlies with Al Jefferson being the new Zach Randolph. A ton of pieces if you wanted to make a run at a star.
                            --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Projected Cleveland Depth Chart:

                            PG: Kyrie Irving/Ramon Sessions
                            SG: Manny Harris/David Lighty/Daniel Gibson
                            SF: Andre Iguodala/Joey Graham/Christian Eyenga
                            PF: J.J. Hickson/Samardo Samuels
                            C: Anderson Varejao/Ryan Hollins/Semih Erden

                            Overall Assessment of Team: Obviously still not a visually appealing team but with Irving running show the veteran leadership of Iggy and Verejao, and the development of Hickson it wouldn’t shock me if this roster was extremely competitive. Still need a SG and probably a 2012 lottery pick away from being good, but still there are some nice building blocks here and the addition of Irving and Iggy at least give the franchise marketable faces and more ticket sales.
                            -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Projected T’wolves Depth Chart:

                            PG: Devin Harris/Ricky Rubio?/Luke Ridnour
                            SG: Martell Webster/Wayne Elington/Malcolm Lee
                            SF: Wes Johnson /Anthony Randolph
                            PF: Derrick Williams/Darko Millicic
                            C: Kevin Love/Nikola Pecovic/Anthony Tolliver

                            Overall Assessment of Team: Things look much better in this picture. Still a SG away but at least you have a solid PG to bridge the gap between Rubio. And if you do get Rubio this year at least he isn’t thrusted into a starting spot which he isn’t ready for. I understand Williams and Love is a small front court but it gives you a ton of versatility. More than likely you’d have Williams at SF, Johnson at SG, Love and PF and Darko at center but regardless there is a ton you can do with this roster.
                            -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Projected 76ers Depth Chart:

                            PG: Jrue Holiday/Louis Williams
                            SG: Evan Turner/Jodie Meeks
                            SF: Thaddeus Young/Jordan Hamilton/Andres Nocioni
                            PF: Elton Brand/Antawn Jamison
                            C: Enes Kanter/Mareese Speights/Spencer Hawes

                            Overall Assessment of Team: Maybe a slight downgrade in the immediate losing Iguodala but this sets up the 76ers for a bright future especially when Brand and Jamison’s contract’s are up. Kanter is a legit franchise bigman and this gives the 76ers one of the better young talented teams. Brand and Jamison will keep them in the playoff hunt in the immediate time.
                            ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Projected Blazers Depth Chart:
                            PG: Andre Miller/Kemba Walker
                            SG: Wesley Matthews/Brandon Roy/Elliott Williams
                            SF: Gerald Wallace/Rudy Fernandez/Luke Babbitt
                            PF: LaMarcus Aldridge/Markief Morris
                            C: Marcus Camby/Greg Oden

                            Overall Assessment of Team: I like what I did here. Morris is a great backup for Aldridge. Getting Kemba is huge for the future with the uncertainty of Andre Miller and Brandon Roy. Overall this improves the Blazers in the post and at the PG position.
                            ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Projected Wizards Depth Chart:
                            PG: John Wall/Norris Cole
                            SG: Nick Young/Jordan Crawford/Othyus Jeffers
                            SF: Nicholas Batum/Rashard Lewis
                            PF: Andray Blatche/Trevor Booker/Trey Thompkins
                            C: Javale Mcgee/Kevin Seraphin

                            Overall Assessment of Team: More positive steps towards rebuilding. Batum provides the Wizards with a SF of the future that they wouldn’t get at the #6 overall pick. They bag a great backup to Wall as well as some nice moves for the future. Thompkins makes Blatche expendable if they can find a trade partner. Maybe a team like the Magic could take on Blatche for a future first and other compensation.
                            -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                            Projected Knicks Depth Chart:
                            PG: Chauncey Bilups/Charles Jenkins
                            SG: Landry Fields/Toney Douglass
                            SF: Carmelo Anthony/Shawne Williams/Bill Walker
                            PF: Ronny Turiaf/JuJuan Johnson/Renaldo Balkman
                            C: Amare Stoudemire/Greg Smith

                            Overall Assessment of Team: Adding depth and talent was a top priority. Jenkins and Johnson are great fits as is Smith down the line.

                            Sig By:The Dynasty

                            2 7 Round Mocks: April 20
                            http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/...50#post2577350
                            Full NBA Mock Draft: Updated May 18
                            http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/...=1#post2602966

                            Comment


                            • I didnt look at all of it yet...but that is an ugly Jazz/T'Wolves trade.

                              edit...plus, the Jazz really like Hayward. No need for Beasley at all with Hayward at the 3 and Favors the future at the 4.
                              Last edited by M.O.T.H.; 05-18-2011, 06:20 PM.

                              Thanks BoneKrusher^

                              http://youtube.com/watch?v=6_j52DziMy4 (the man)
                              http://youtube.com/watch?v=2g6S3Anto7c
                              KO KNOWS

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                                Beasley was/is an undersized PF with serious maturity/characters issues. It hasn't been a shock that he's failed to live up to being the #2 pick. Rose was the clear #1 prospect in that draft.
                                Yeah I was pissed cuz the Heat had the worst record that year. I wanted a top 2 pick to get Rose or Beasley. But I was really hoping for 1 to get Rose. But hey if we got Rose, there would be no need for the Big 3. It worked itself out. However, I like what D-Unit said tho. There are a lot of conspiraces going around. And they are kinda warranted as some1 pointed out with people going to home towns, redemption stories, etc. I am not saying they are true, but there is an easy way to fix it. Show the ping pong thing actually happen. That would make the conspiracies shut up.....

                                Comment

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