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-   -   Nate Clements (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1647)

TitanAddict 02-21-2007 01:27 PM

Nate Clements
 
It seems like everyone is rumored to be going after Nate Clements once FA starts. A lot of teams have money to spend (like my Titans) and I'm trying to figure out where he'll go. My money right now is on either the Titans or 49ers.

I watched him play against Tennessee in week 15 this year, and he seems worth the hype. I'm curious as to why Buffalo won't re-sign him since they obviously have the cap room.

Does anybody have any insight on Nate Clements?

Jughead10 02-21-2007 01:35 PM

My problem with Buffalo attempting to resign Clements has to do with their scheme. In the Cover 2, CBs just shouldn't make close to Champ Bailey money. Namely because they aren't nearly as important. Champ Bailey, and the other top corners in the game, make big money mostly because of their ability in man to man and deep zone coverage. Where in a Cover 2, man to man coverage is masked. Just look at Chicago's corners for example. None of them are even considered good man to man defenders but they are good in their scheme, however most could be easily replaced.

TitanAddict 02-21-2007 01:37 PM

Oh ... I wasn't aware that Buffalo ran a cover 2. I thought they were straight-up man. Maybe they'll make a run at Nick Harper? He'll be a lot cheaper than Nate.

Jughead10 02-21-2007 01:39 PM

Nope they are running mostly Cover 2 out there. At least that what I am under the assumption of. Which is another reason why they had Donte Whitner so high on their draft board last year. As safeties are arguably more important in that scheme.

dlions20 02-21-2007 01:47 PM

Browns | Team will be aggressive in free agency
Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:53:30 -0800

Mary Kay Cabot, of the Cleveland Plain Dealer, reports the Cleveland Browns have $30 million in cap room and are planning to be aggressive in free agency.

Browns | Team might go after Clements in free agency
Tue, 20 Feb 2007 19:13:10 -0800

Mary Kay Cabot, of the Cleveland Plain Dealer, reports the Cleveland Browns might go after Buffalo Bills CB Nate Clements in free agency.



Clements is from Ohio and has said he would like to play here before, much like other OSU players. i think we have the upper hand over everyone right now, because we will pay him what he wants most likely.[/quote]


i have a quetion. Does a 3-4 CB have to be anything different or can a 4-3 CB basically step into the 3-4 with no problem? I dont know if they need to be different in any way?

SFbear 02-21-2007 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10
My problem with Buffalo attempting to resign Clements has to do with their scheme. In the Cover 2, CBs just shouldn't make close to Champ Bailey money. Namely because they aren't nearly as important. Champ Bailey, and the other top corners in the game, make big money mostly because of their ability in man to man and deep zone coverage. Where in a Cover 2, man to man coverage is masked. Just look at Chicago's corners for example. None of them are even considered good man to man defenders but they are good in their scheme, however most could be easily replaced.

We play less Cover 2 and more man coverage than people think. Our corners are slightly underated for their man coverage skills. Slightly.

Splat 02-21-2007 01:59 PM

This guy is going to get so much money it is stupid he is a great player don't get me wrong he picked the right year to be a FA CB that is for sure.

Jughead10 02-21-2007 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SFbear
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10
My problem with Buffalo attempting to resign Clements has to do with their scheme. In the Cover 2, CBs just shouldn't make close to Champ Bailey money. Namely because they aren't nearly as important. Champ Bailey, and the other top corners in the game, make big money mostly because of their ability in man to man and deep zone coverage. Where in a Cover 2, man to man coverage is masked. Just look at Chicago's corners for example. None of them are even considered good man to man defenders but they are good in their scheme, however most could be easily replaced.

We play less Cover 2 and more man coverage than people think. Our corners are slightly underated for their man coverage skills. Slightly.

Manning is a decent man corner. Vasher on the other hand, eh, not so much.

regoob2 02-21-2007 02:05 PM

I hope he goes to the niners

Brodeur 02-21-2007 02:17 PM

He really isn't that great of a CB. He's probably around the 20-30 best CB's in the NFL and is the best CB in this years free agent market, but it shouldn't make teams want to give him a bigger contract than that of Champ Bailey(which he wants).

Splat 02-21-2007 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brodeur
He really isn't that great of a CB. He's probably around the 20-30 best CB's in the NFL and is the best CB in this years free agent market, but it shouldn't make teams want to give him a bigger contract than that of Champ Bailey(which he wants).

He is top 15 IMO and has played like a top ten at times but is up and down at times.

bigbluedefense 02-21-2007 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10
Quote:

Originally Posted by SFbear
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10
My problem with Buffalo attempting to resign Clements has to do with their scheme. In the Cover 2, CBs just shouldn't make close to Champ Bailey money. Namely because they aren't nearly as important. Champ Bailey, and the other top corners in the game, make big money mostly because of their ability in man to man and deep zone coverage. Where in a Cover 2, man to man coverage is masked. Just look at Chicago's corners for example. None of them are even considered good man to man defenders but they are good in their scheme, however most could be easily replaced.

We play less Cover 2 and more man coverage than people think. Our corners are slightly underated for their man coverage skills. Slightly.

Manning is a decent man corner. Vasher on the other hand, eh, not so much.

From my observations, yes, Chicago did play a decent amount of man coverage, but only when there was a blitz coming. When you send 6 at the qb, man coverage becomes alot easier, and those are the times I see Chicago run man. Usually when they rush 4, I see a zone. I could be wrong though. The scheme is rather simple, they run a very basic scheme thats heavily dependent on player performances.

keylime_5 02-21-2007 02:39 PM

Cleveland's top 2 targets are probably gonna be Clements and Dielman. I would be suprised to see a team like Tennessee or San Francisco outbid for Nate who would choose the Browns over the Titans or '9ers if they all offered the exact same deal.

Favre4 02-21-2007 03:06 PM

due to the cover 2 defense, he has had the ability to play wrecklessly because he has help over the top. this may be different if he is asked to play man to man against a prototypical 6'3 220lbs receiver such as roy williams/ andre johnson/ reggie wayne.

Jughead10 02-21-2007 03:09 PM

This was the first year in the Cover 2. He was still great before that.

SFbear 02-21-2007 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10
Quote:

Originally Posted by SFbear
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jughead10
My problem with Buffalo attempting to resign Clements has to do with their scheme. In the Cover 2, CBs just shouldn't make close to Champ Bailey money. Namely because they aren't nearly as important. Champ Bailey, and the other top corners in the game, make big money mostly because of their ability in man to man and deep zone coverage. Where in a Cover 2, man to man coverage is masked. Just look at Chicago's corners for example. None of them are even considered good man to man defenders but they are good in their scheme, however most could be easily replaced.

We play less Cover 2 and more man coverage than people think. Our corners are slightly underated for their man coverage skills. Slightly.

Manning is a decent man corner. Vasher on the other hand, eh, not so much.

Actually Manning was our nickelback and when he started in place of an injured Tillman and later injured Vasher, he was exposed for huge plays in man coverage.

Both Tillman and Vasher are superior to Ricky Manning. He makes a great nickelback though. If you recall Tillman had a pretty good game against Plexico when we pretty much declared we were going to play more man to man.

But as I said before, only slightly underated.

keylime_5 02-21-2007 04:02 PM

I think you guys are making a really big deal over the cover 2 thing. I'm suprised to hear people nagging about cover 2 or no cover 2 for Clements because he's played in both systems and has the skill set to really play in any defense whatsoever....he's big, physical, excellent cover skills, gets INTs, gets big play TDs on turnovers, can return punts, can tackle, play the run - he's a complete player and one of the top 15 corners in the league.

yourfavestoner 02-21-2007 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5
I think you guys are making a really big deal over the cover 2 thing. I'm suprised to hear people nagging about cover 2 or no cover 2 for Clements because he's played in both systems and has the skill set to really play in any defense whatsoever....he's big, physical, excellent cover skills, gets INTs, gets big play TDs on turnovers, can return punts, can tackle, play the run - he's a complete player and one of the top 15 corners in the league.

The problem is that he's a top 15 player who wants top 5 money. He's just not worth it.

Like I've said before, Buffalo has been drafting to replace Clements for a couple of years now. They won't shell out the big bucks for him, and they'll be smart for doing it. Professional football is a game of replacement, not a game of maintenance.

Addict 02-21-2007 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yourfavestoner
Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5
I think you guys are making a really big deal over the cover 2 thing. I'm suprised to hear people nagging about cover 2 or no cover 2 for Clements because he's played in both systems and has the skill set to really play in any defense whatsoever....he's big, physical, excellent cover skills, gets INTs, gets big play TDs on turnovers, can return punts, can tackle, play the run - he's a complete player and one of the top 15 corners in the league.

The problem is that he's a top 15 player who wants top 5 money. He's just not worth it.

Like I've said before, Buffalo has been drafting to replace Clements for a couple of years now. They won't shell out the big bucks for him, and they'll be smart for doing it. Professional football is a game of replacement, not a game of maintenance.

What's more interesting is, will he manage to find a team that is willing to pay him a top 5 salary.
If the guy is top 15, I doubt they're going to overpay him that badly, even if they've got ****loads of cap space.

yourfavestoner 02-21-2007 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Addict
Quote:

Originally Posted by yourfavestoner
Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5
I think you guys are making a really big deal over the cover 2 thing. I'm suprised to hear people nagging about cover 2 or no cover 2 for Clements because he's played in both systems and has the skill set to really play in any defense whatsoever....he's big, physical, excellent cover skills, gets INTs, gets big play TDs on turnovers, can return punts, can tackle, play the run - he's a complete player and one of the top 15 corners in the league.

The problem is that he's a top 15 player who wants top 5 money. He's just not worth it.

Like I've said before, Buffalo has been drafting to replace Clements for a couple of years now. They won't shell out the big bucks for him, and they'll be smart for doing it. Professional football is a game of replacement, not a game of maintenance.

What's more interesting is, will he manage to find a team that is willing to pay him a top 5 salary.
If the guy is top 15, I doubt they're going to overpay him that badly, even if they've got ****loads of cap space.

Look at the contract Brian Williams got from Jacksonville last year. With all of the cap space teams have, players' salaries are going way, way up - far beyond what used to be the established market price.

Pit Bull #53 02-21-2007 04:19 PM

I guess that the only problem I have with Clements is that his play has been up and down. Previous couple of years, his played hasn't mirrored his reputation, but this year, he was pretty damn good....in a contract year. How is he gonna play after he cashes in?

Jughead10 02-21-2007 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keylime_5
I think you guys are making a really big deal over the cover 2 thing. I'm suprised to hear people nagging about cover 2 or no cover 2 for Clements because he's played in both systems and has the skill set to really play in any defense whatsoever....he's big, physical, excellent cover skills, gets INTs, gets big play TDs on turnovers, can return punts, can tackle, play the run - he's a complete player and one of the top 15 corners in the league.

Of course he can play both. All the great corners could play in pretty much any scheme. My problem would be if the Bills gave him a 7 years 60 million dollar contract. Because you find guys for a WHOLE lot cheaper who can excel at Cover 2 but are more liabilities in man to man. They got a guy like that in the draft last year. Youbouty. He is perfect for the Cover 2 and I thought he was a steal for them where they got him in the draft. Bottom line is you don't spend that much money on a CB unless you are paying him for his amazing man lockdown potential.

dlions20 02-21-2007 06:23 PM

Quote:

He really isn't that great of a CB. He's probably around the 20-30 best CB's in the NFL
Ya ok, your wrong.

Name me 20 CB's that are better than him. Much less 30, thats just pothetic.

If he wasnt that great Buffalo wouldnt have franchised him 2 years in a row, and want him back currently, but wont get him.

princefielder28 02-21-2007 06:35 PM

He'll be one of the few good/great ones out there

keylime_5 02-21-2007 07:06 PM

I agree with the point that a good cover 2 corner is a lot easier to find than a good man-to-man cover corner in a non-zone scheme. If there was one corner I'd want my team to overpay for Clements might very well be that guy, but that's mostly because I'm a monster OSU fan :)


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