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-   -   Who Lost Money at the Combine? (http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51242)

StickSkills 02-26-2012 04:22 PM

Who Lost Money at the Combine?
 
I heard Kendall Wright had a bad 40 time.

Vaylor 02-26-2012 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StickSkills (Post 2875406)
I heard Kendall Wright had a bad 40 time.

I hope it means he falls to #27. God he would be a monster if used in the similar way Welker was this past year.

4U2NV 02-26-2012 04:44 PM

Alshon Jeffery. Didn't do a damn thing. No way this coward goes in the first.

vidae 02-26-2012 05:07 PM

I do think Alshon lost a bit of money. He really needed to answer some questions today and he didn't. I don't think he's a COWARD though..

GaMeTiMe 02-26-2012 05:10 PM

Dwight Jones apparently drew the ire of a lot of coaches for effort. Bad sign in this class of receivers.

SuperPacker 02-26-2012 05:26 PM

He'll have a chance to run well at his pro day. Anyway he'll probably be faster than Kendall Wright haha. Something went wrong there!

PossibleCabbage 02-26-2012 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StickSkills (Post 2875406)
I heard Kendall Wright had a bad 40 time.

Kendall Wright had a bad 40 time, but this may be a Joe Haden situation where there was some health or technique thing that really screwed him up and his pro day is going to be a better indication of his actual speed.

(If you don't recall, Haden ran a 4.57 at the combine and then a 4.43 at his pro day, the latter actually indicates how fast he plays, the former is an anomaly).

SuperPacker 02-26-2012 05:29 PM

We can definitely say that Kendall Wright is not 4.6 fast.

Larry 02-26-2012 05:32 PM

Sanu, his chances of going late first aren't looking good running a 4.67.

Sloopy 02-26-2012 05:38 PM

I've said it before but I will reiterate it here.

It seems as though Alshon lost the weight just for the weigh in

It suspect the weight wasn't lost in the weight room working out and losing it the right way for it to translate to a functional weight and doesn't provide functional strength, hence why he didn't participate.

If I had to guess, a lot of the weight may even be already coming back as it was probably mostly water weight that was lost through dehydration as well as a strict diet for the week leading up to the combine.

I said it in the other thread but I remember being able to drop an entire weight class in a week leading up to a wrestling match. As soon as the weigh in was done I was eating again and drinking fluids and thus my weight undoubtedly went up. Had I actually tried to wrestle at my weigh in weight I would have been too weak to do much of anything.

Could be wrong, but these are my assumptions.

The guy really needed to show that he could lose the weight the right way and have it still be a functional weight for him. He didn't do that and I think it might cost him the first round.

I would even go as far as to tag him with high bust potential.

PossibleCabbage 02-26-2012 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sloopy (Post 2875494)
I would even go as far as to tag him with high bust potential.

One of the Bob McGinn's scout sources said about Jeffrey something to the effect of "He plays the game really hard, but he doesn't do anything else hard"... which definitely has the ring of truth to it. I think if he blew the interview, he could end up falling out of the second round.

Sloopy 02-26-2012 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage (Post 2875497)
One of the Bob McGinn's scout sources said about Jeffrey something to the effect of "He plays the game really hard, but he doesn't do anything else hard"... which definitely has the ring of truth to it. I think if he blew the interview, he could end up falling out of the second round.

I just see a guy who shows up for games but doesn't put the work in outside of that 60 minutes of game time.

I see a guy who will struggle with his weight his entire career.

I'm not sure about his practice habits or time spent in the film room but if they are anything like his weight room/conditioning habits he isn't going to make it in this league.

Rashaan Salaam 02-26-2012 06:32 PM

If you think anyone won or loss the combine...then you guys need help.

Film > Workouts.

The only benefits from the combine are the player interviews & medical reports.

underscore 02-26-2012 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashaan Salaam (Post 2875553)
If you think anyone won or loss the combine...then you guys need help.

Film > Workouts.

The only benefits from the combine are the player interviews & medical reports.

Then why have the combine?

PossibleCabbage 02-26-2012 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashaan Salaam (Post 2875553)
If you think anyone won or loss the combine...then you guys need help.

Film > Workouts.

The only benefits from the combine are the player interviews & medical reports.

Film+Workouts>Film>Workouts.

Nobody is claiming any different. Everything you do in the pre-draft process matters, if nothing else it will help you break ties. I mean, if you're looking at your board and you have two guys with the same grade at the same position, you might as well know which guy is faster, stronger, quicker, more explosive, etc. in case you have to pick between those two guys in the actual draft.

So a guy doesn't win or lose at the combine based solely on tape, they win or lose relative to other players at the same position with the same grade based on tape. The difference between being the third guy taken at your position and the fifth guy taken at your position may well be millions of dollars.

Plus, it's not like Clay Matthews or Jason Pierre-Paul were first round picks on the basis of their stellar tape, but both of those guys have put in NFL performances that had a lot to do with why they have rings now.

Rashaan Salaam 02-26-2012 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by underscore (Post 2875557)
Then why have the combine?

For those last two reasons I listed. Interviews and having your medical team take a look at the players of interest.

Rashaan Salaam 02-26-2012 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage (Post 2875566)
Film+Workouts>Film>Workouts.

Nobody is claiming any difference. Everything you do in the pre-draft process matters, if nothing else it will help you break ties. I mean, if you're looking at your board and you have two guys with the same grade at the same position, you might as well know which guy is faster, stronger, quicker, more explosive, etc. in case you have to pick between those two guys in the actual draft.

So a guy doesn't win or lose at the combine based solely on tape, they win or lose relative to other players at the same position with the same grade based on tape. The difference between being the third guy taken at your position and the fifth guy taken at your position may well be millions of dollars.

Plus, it's not like Clay Matthews was a first round pick on the basis of his stellar tape at USC.

Yea you find out a guy can run fast or jump high..but if it doesn't translate onto tape, then its all for not.

Clay Mathews showed enough on tape for GB to pick him. Even though he had limited tape, he still showed explosiveness and athleticism that was tailor made for the Pack.

PossibleCabbage 02-26-2012 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashaan Salaam (Post 2875571)
Yea you find out a guy can run fast or jump high..but if it doesn't translate onto tape, then its all for not.

Clay Mathews showed enough on tape for GB to pick him. Even though he had limited tape, he still showed explosiveness and athleticism that was tailor made for the Pack.

Guys sometimes become better players in the NFL than they were in college. When this happens, it's due to taking advantage of physical attributes more effectively than they were able to do so in college. You have to know that those physical attributes are there in the first place.

There are a lot more "numbers" people in the actual NFL than I think you give credit for. Not everybody is the Raiders, who put numbers over everything, but you have to believe that Clay Matthews's 1.49 second 10-yard split turned a lot more heads than whatever "explosiveness" he may have left on tape.

Rashaan Salaam 02-26-2012 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage (Post 2875580)
Guys sometimes become better players in the NFL than they were in college. When this happens, it's due to taking advantage of physical attributes more effectively than they were able to do so in college. You have to know that those physical attributes are there in the first place.

There are a lot more "numbers" people in the actual NFL than I think you give credit for. Not everybody is the Raiders, who put numbers over everything, but you have to believe that Clay Matthews's 1.49 second 10-yard split turned a lot more heads than whatever "explosiveness" he may have left on tape.

I agree... the 10 yard split is way more important than the 40 yard dash. You will never run your 40 yard dash in your football career. Football is a game of spurts.

But if you looked at the tape, you'd see the same explosiveness that you would've saw at the combine (with no pads and in a non-football related events)

Clarkw267 02-26-2012 07:00 PM

Anyone remember Mario Manningham coming out of Michigan?

That's who Kendall Wright reminds me of, but with better hands.

Both are clearly explosive players, who for whatever reason, just can't get a good start in the 40.

STsACE 02-26-2012 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashaan Salaam (Post 2875553)
If you think anyone won or loss the combine...then you guys need help.

Film > Workouts.

The only benefits from the combine are the player interviews & medical reports.

I believe all players can benefit from the combine. Some need to prove they can lost weight to get quicker while others need to add weight and not lose quickness. Hands. Arm Strength. Speed. Is it better than what was asked of them in school? Some players have to prove what they did in college isn't all they have to offer and it starts with the drills and workouts.

Plus it gives a chance to see how these players respond to the media and interviews AFTER not performing how they were supposed to in the workouts. Notice I said after the workouts.

And biggest loser, has got to be Jeffrey. Healthy and not running the 40 when the biggest concern is speed. A good 40 time could have kept him in the 1st round and pushed him into talks of going top 20.

ChiFan24 02-26-2012 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashaan Salaam (Post 2875553)
If you think anyone won or loss the combine...then you guys need help.

Film > Workouts.

The only benefits from the combine are the player interviews & medical reports.

Ugh. There's always one person.

Joe Adams killed what I thought was a good chance to push the first round.

Rashaan Salaam 02-26-2012 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiFan24 (Post 2875595)
Ugh. There's always one person.

Joe Adams killed what I thought was a good chance to push the first round.

Yep. I'm the one that understands what's most important.

Joe Adams was a one-trick pony to begin with. Greg Childs is a better football player...just that he's still recovering from the injury.

ChiFan24 02-26-2012 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashaan Salaam (Post 2875599)
Yep. I'm the one that understands what's most important.

Joe Adams was a one-trick pony to begin with. Greg Childs is a better football player...just that he's still recovering from the injury.

Well no, Adams is still awesome.

And the reason you were quoted has nothing to with what's important, it has to do with reality. There's a combine for a reason. NFL teams care about these drills.

Rashaan Salaam 02-26-2012 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiFan24 (Post 2875605)
Well no, Adams is still awesome.

And the reason you were quoted has nothing to with what's important, it has to do with reality. There's a combine for a reason. NFL teams care about these drills.

Welcome to the combine, where the good teams ignore it and the bad teams set their draft boards


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