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Old 05-01-2008, 03:26 PM    (permalink
Burns336
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VY sucks.

People tried to downplay that pathetic Wonderlic Score, and sure maybe it doesn't mean a whole lot for everyone else on the field, but I like a smart QB.

People will always say "vince just wins games" but look at the offense he runs. They have like 2 sets of training wheels on the guy because he can't digest a playbook. run-run- bootleg, run-run-bootleg. The guy is an idiot who doesn't know how to run plays because he doesn't understand them.

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Old 05-01-2008, 08:02 PM    (permalink
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VY sucks.

People tried to downplay that pathetic Wonderlic Score, and sure maybe it doesn't mean a whole lot for everyone else on the field, but I like a smart QB.

People will always say "vince just wins games" but look at the offense he runs. They have like 2 sets of training wheels on the guy because he can't digest a playbook. run-run- bootleg, run-run-bootleg. The guy is an idiot who doesn't know how to run plays because he doesn't understand them.

Why all the VY hate? I wouldn't call it "2 sets of training wheels", hell thats just how Fisher runs his offense and always has, it was like that with McNair as well...Vince is still learning and a young QB, Eli was flat our crap majority of the time before the end of this past season, and look how many years he has been playing.


And Leinart of the other hand, who had a higher wonderlic score, can't even beat out Kurt Warner, the same Kurt Warner who fumbles as soon as you breathe on him and is over 40 years old...VY isn't a prototype QB, your not going to run the same offense as you would with Brees or Romo, how about lets wait until he gets a legitmate target in a #1 WR, or hell even a TE before we call him an idiot or that he cannot digest a playbook.


Marino had a lower Wonderlic score then Vince FYI.
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Old 05-01-2008, 08:08 PM    (permalink
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Marino had a lower Wonderlic score then Vince FYI.
Marino was coked up most of college too. What was Vince's excuse?
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Old 05-01-2008, 08:11 PM    (permalink
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Marino was coked up most of college too. What was Vince's excuse?
So Marino took the Wonderlic test on coke? Interesting.


That's also interesting you know he was coked up during college, most teams spend 1st rd picks on coke head qbs, that happens daily
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Old 05-01-2008, 08:17 PM    (permalink
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So Marino took the Wonderlic test on coke? Interesting.


That's also interesting you know he was coked up during college, most teams spend 1st rd picks on coke head qbs, that happens daily
Lol, i was thinking the same thing, but i thought his post was too inept to make a rational argument in defense.

We should black-ball Bob from this forum lol.
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Old 05-01-2008, 08:35 PM    (permalink
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Eli has always been able to run a complex offense though. He may have had poor decision making in the past, mostly due to confidence issues, which are now gone.

Leinart on the other hand tossed for 405 yards in a game as a rookie, something vince has never sniffed, but struggled transitioning into the new offense this year. Still, Leinart is the incumbent starter and will probably break out this year. It's not necessarily fair given Leinarts receivers, but I still think he can run an offense.

I just think VY is overhyped. I think people still think he is the college VY. I was a little hard on him on the post above, but I gotta hate on him to bring everyone down to earth haha.
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Old 05-01-2008, 08:47 PM    (permalink
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Eli has always been able to run a complex offense though. He may have had poor decision making in the past, mostly due to confidence issues, which are now gone.

Leinart on the other hand tossed for 405 yards in a game as a rookie, something vince has never sniffed, but struggled transitioning into the new offense this year. Still, Leinart is the incumbent starter and will probably break out this year. It's not necessarily fair given Leinarts receivers, but I still think he can run an offense.

I just think VY is overhyped. I think people still think he is the college VY. I was a little hard on him on the post above, but I gotta hate on him to bring everyone down to earth haha.
Lol i think it's a bit of a stretch to say that all of Eli's confidence issues are gone. Winning a superbowl will go a long ways for you, but he still needs to play well and win some games at home. Something he wasn't very good at this past year.

To knock on Vince because he has never thrown for 400 yards is like knocking Leinart for never rushing for 7 td's like Vince did his rook year.

I think the Titans knew they weren't gonna get Peyton Manning at Quarterback when they took Young, but if you could get him to be at least a solid to good passer, he'll be beastly. I wonder how many yards Leinart would throw for if he had Roydell Williams and Eric Moulds to throw to.
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Old 05-01-2008, 09:15 PM    (permalink
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Lol, i was thinking the same thing, but i thought his post was too inept to make a rational argument in defense.

We should black-ball Bob from this forum lol.
Would you believe it if I told you hes been banned numerous times and that he used to come on here as several different alias's and argue with himself. HaHa. Well he's back again as you can see. Wonder how long he'll last this time.
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Old 05-01-2008, 09:31 PM    (permalink
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Would you believe it if I told you hes been banned numerous times and that he used to come on here as several different alias's and argue with himself. HaHa. Well he's back again as you can see. Wonder how long he'll last this time.
Lol, well that would explain a lot. There's no talking sense into that man. I wouldn't doubt it if he's a 70 year old senile man who's afraid of going outside because "the police are out to get him".
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Old 05-02-2008, 03:09 AM    (permalink
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Lol i think it's a bit of a stretch to say that all of Eli's confidence issues are gone. Winning a superbowl will go a long ways for you, but he still needs to play well and win some games at home. Something he wasn't very good at this past year.

To knock on Vince because he has never thrown for 400 yards is like knocking Leinart for never rushing for 7 td's like Vince did his rook year.

I think the Titans knew they weren't gonna get Peyton Manning at Quarterback when they took Young, but if you could get him to be at least a solid to good passer, he'll be beastly. I wonder how many yards Leinart would throw for if he had Roydell Williams and Eric Moulds to throw to.
I think everyone is still underestimating Eli. He had ice running through his veins as he led his team down the field for a 4th quarter comeback win in the superbowl. I don't like the guy, and I've always thought he was a baby after what he did at the draft, but he's got a ring and he made some huge plays along the way. He's made big strides as a player IMO.
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Old 05-02-2008, 03:11 AM    (permalink
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He made strides in the playoffs...he still had one of the lowest completion percentages in the league and lead the league in interceptions. He has to prove he can play like he did in the playoffs for a full year. Everyone is fast to forget the terrible year he had. Who knows what guy shows up when the season begins? I'm still not sold on Eli.
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Old 05-02-2008, 03:24 AM    (permalink
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I think everyone is still underestimating Eli. He had ice running through his veins as he led his team down the field for a 4th quarter comeback win in the superbowl. I don't like the guy, and I've always thought he was a baby after what he did at the draft, but he's got a ring and he made some huge plays along the way. He's made big strides as a player IMO.
But this didn't all happen until his 4th season, and well into the 4th year at that, he was fresh off a TERRIBLE game vs the Vikings where he looked like a pansy, nowhere near the level that a guy in his 4th yr should be...Granted it all clicked for him at the right time, but my point is it took him a long time to grasp the game, and he isn't even a running QB, he's a passing QB that struggled mightly reading defenses, playing with composure, and being the leader of his team...With Vince, he became the leader of that team his rookie season, and commanded the veterans respect like Kevin Mawae, and they knew that team was his and believed in him...With Eli, he didn't have control of that team, or the huddle until this year, and especially once Shockey went out late into the year, thats a late development on his part as well.


Vince has only played 2 years, your judging him pretty harshly because frankly he is still learning like most QB's go through with the learning curve, and as Eli showed not everybody gets it immediately.


And with Leinart, they plan on using a platoon again, thats the reason Warner came back, because he wants to play, he doesn't want to sit on the bench, and Whisenhunt told him he would be utilized, Leinart hasn't won over the locker room, team, coaches, nor has his play earned the right to beat out Warner at his age...That''s something you may be undervalueing, is leadership, some QB's can naturally lead teams, other guys that don't get the players respect won't have guys playing for them the same...I don't know how many negatives that is, but the only thing he has going for him is that he was a high draft pick, he is cruising right down the street towards mediocrity in the same neighborhood as bust...And all this is without even mentioning the caliber of weapons Leinart has opposed to Young...Boldin + Fitzgerald or Williams + Jones, if you were a QB which one would make your job easier, and increase stats?


Young has never had a #1 WR, Leinart has two, and arguably two of the best in the NFL at that, yet he still isn't the clear cut starter...So to be clear I don't think Vince is elite, or a gamebreaker or any of that, but I won't judge guys like him, or hell even Alex Smith who is young and has changed coordinators every season, I will let thoes guys get settled, get some weapons around them, and if they show constant improvement it's hard for me to knock them.
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Old 05-02-2008, 09:44 AM    (permalink
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So Marino took the Wonderlic test on coke? Interesting.


That's also interesting you know he was coked up during college, most teams spend 1st rd picks on coke head qbs, that happens daily
Unlike you, I was an adult when the 1983 draft occured and that is EXACTLY why he fell to 26.

History was not invented the day you decided to follow it and yes coke was a big problem back in the early 80s.

As prevalent as weed is today to ball players.

Why his wonderlic was low? Maybe b/c he did not give a crap and was a party animal. He ain't the brightest guy in the world either but not much better throwers in NFL history and certainly 10X the pocket passer VY is.

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Old 05-02-2008, 03:31 PM    (permalink
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From the DMN:

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Here's five observations I came away with ...

1) Bennett's a beast: Second-round Martellus Bennett is a load and flashed some athleticism in the passing skeleton and one-on-ones. Seems to do a good job, in most cases, of catching the ball away from his body and looks like he could develop into a matchup nightmare.

2) Jenkins rough around the edges: No one got more individual attention than first-rounder Mike Jenkins, and part of it was that he was getting beat on a fairly regular basis. You can see the athleticism, the ability to turn and run, the ability to sink his hips and explode ... but it needs to be more consistently. He'd look great one play, and very, very average the next. He had real trouble catching the ball.

3) Amendola shines: I know Timmy already addressed this, but there was a whole lot to like about Danny Amendola (and not just because I wrote about him this morning). He runs sharp, precise routes, gets in and out of his breaks quickly, and knows how to set up a DB. Plus, he didn't drop a ball. It's worth noting that Jenkins couldn't stop him once in one-on-ones, at least in the three instances I say the two match up.

4) Jones' wheels: Jerry called Felix Jones' style "smooth" and there might not be a better way to describe it. He almost looks like he's gliding, and not running out there, and you can see his change-of-direction skills. Felix looked fairly natural catching the ball for the most part, save for a couple drops. Tashard Choice had a couple early drops, but rebounded late and showed the skills in the passing game he flashed as a collegian.

5) Garrett's involvement: One thing's pretty clear here -- Jason Garrett is not simply the overseer of the offense. He has his hands in everything. And it seems like he can coach every position, which is something that I remember being impressive about Bill Belichick when I covered the Patriots. Garrett sets a pace for practice -- a quick one -- and his guys seem to respond.
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Old 05-02-2008, 05:10 PM    (permalink
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Just to add on to that, here are a few more...


Quote:
Here are a couple things from the afternoon session ...

1) Bradford makes play: Stanford product Mark Bradford, the hero of the Cardinal's shocker over USC last week, got Orlando Scandrick crossed up on a double move and hauled in a ball 60 yards downfield on a skinny post. That passed for the play of the day in a short practice.

2) Scandrick looks solid: To me, the Boise State CB was the best defensive back on the field today, when you put both the sessions together. He sticks with receivers, and has the athleticism and explosiveness to drive on the ball. Outside the Bradford catch -- which came with Scandrick right there with him, even after he got beat -- the former Bronco had a big day.

3) Jenkins bounces back: After a rough start this morning, first-round pick Mike Jenkins was solid this afternoon. It's not likely he was suddenly Champ Bailey out there and, a lot of the time, he was playing 8-10 yards off the receiver, which made it tough to defend the slants and shorter out-cuts. But he was close on everything. He still is a step late quite a bit, though.

4) Amendola slides back: By the time Danny Amendola finally dropped a ball, it was actually surprising to see. He shouted, "Son of a gun!" (And that's not even cleaned up) into the air, and that set off a little bit of a bad streak for the Tech-ex. He dropped a couple more, and fell down on a route after that, so this afternoon wasn't quite as strong as this morning.

5) Bartel's big day: OK, I wasn't watching him that closely -- I tend to discount what QBs do with no pass rush in their face -- but from what I did see, and what people around, like Archer, were saying, Richard Bartel played well today.
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Old 05-02-2008, 05:14 PM    (permalink
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Unlike you, I was an adult when the 1983 draft occured and that is EXACTLY why he fell to 26.

History was not invented the day you decided to follow it and yes coke was a big problem back in the early 80s.

As prevalent as weed is today to ball players.

Why his wonderlic was low? Maybe b/c he did not give a crap and was a party animal. He ain't the brightest guy in the world either but not much better throwers in NFL history and certainly 10X the pocket passer VY is.

Have you ever tried contributing anything useful to this forum other then constant bitching, moaning and complaing about ****? Seriously, you would rather talk about Roy Williams, and Jerry Jones being incompetent as a GM, and rehash the same points OVER AND OVER, instead of actually talking about something meaninful, current or up to date...Why don't you tell us more old ass stories about the good ol days when you used to watch the draft back in 1972, or how Parcells is God or Jerry is a bum...Really, we all love when you talk about it, and it has nothing to do with the fact that we have heard EVERYTHING you have to say already, there aren't many new members, we know how you feel about everything because you can only talk about 2 subjects.
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Old 05-02-2008, 05:20 PM    (permalink
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Have you ever tried contributing anything useful to this forum other then constant bitching, moaning and complaing about ****? Seriously, you would rather talk about Roy Williams, and Jerry Jones being incompetent as a GM, and rehash the same points OVER AND OVER, instead of actually talking about something meaninful, current or up to date...Why don't you tell us more old ass stories about the good ol days when you used to watch the draft back in 1972, or how Parcells is God or Jerry is a bum...Really, we all love when you talk about it, and it has nothing to do with the fact that we have heard EVERYTHING you have to say already, there aren't many new members, we know how you feel about everything because you can only talk about 2 subjects.
LMAO, nice job LL. Looks like that was the last straw huh?
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Old 05-02-2008, 08:32 PM    (permalink
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More news from training camp, Felix Jones is getting rave reviews already and I'm certainly not complaining about that:D

http://www.dallascowboys.com/news.cf...1E9E010C0FCDE5




Sounds promising thus far, hope he keeps up the good work.
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I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

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Old 05-03-2008, 06:12 PM    (permalink
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Most of you guys have read this, just posting it for those who didn't, yes its just mini camp, but these were the standouts...

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We'll borrow a page out of the hockey playbook, since folks have Stars fever around these parts, and go with three stars. As Wade Phillips wisely noted, you can't tell too much from watching a bunch of guys run around in helmets and shorts, but here are a few that looked good during rookie minicamp.

Felix Jones: Jones didn't play in a sophisticated passing attack at Arkansas, but he impressed Cowboys coaches with his route-running ability and hands all weekend. Heck, Wade Phillips is comparing the kid to Thurman Thomas. Jones made a spectacular, leaping grab on the sideline after running a wheel route during this afternoon's practice. It'll be tough to beat the Curse of 22, but Jones got off to a good start.

Orlando Scandrick: The fifth-round cornerback from Boise State had a better minicamp than first-round pick He has 4.36 40 speed, but his ability to break on the ball is just as impressive. It's not hard to see why a lot of folks considered Scandrick the steal of the fifth round.

Danny Amendola: We could go with second-round TE Martellus Bennett or fourth-round RB Tashard Choice, who both had solid minicamps. But I'm thinking folks want to read about an undrafted dude with a chance to make the cut. Amendola, a proud Wes Welker wannabe from Texas Tech, has the best shot. Just ask Jenkins, who got beat a bunch by Amendola during the four practices. "He's real quick -- a great receiver," Jenkins said. "He's got great speed breaks and is real decisive. He's tough to cover."

Also a little bit about the coaching, Garrett has been getting rave reviews like one of the players, I think its pretty obvious he is the heir apparent, he just screams HC, the players love him, and he's incredibly smart...I keep hearing about how he knows all the positions very well and he's out there teaching everyone how to do their job and being vocal...And gotta love Campo getting some love, he is a great DB coach and probably glad to be back here.

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The way Dave Campo coaches. I wasn't here for his first go-round with the Cowboys, but he looks like he's a teacher. He does it by showing, without yelling, and the players responded to it.

The way John Garrett coaches. He was on Martellus Bennett from the first practice. Garrett is a stickler for the little things, like finishing plays and holding the ball high and tight. Bennett would be wise to listen. We'll have more on Bennett's eagerness later in the week. I think it's there.
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I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

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Old 05-09-2008, 02:40 AM    (permalink
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Longhorn im a big Sooner fan but after that statement you've moved 1k places up in my book, "which doesn't matter much im sure, but oh well!" I am as well loving the review of a lot of our picks. I was always a big Felix Jones fan, but after hearing all the negativity on the forums and seeing his 40 time consistently not break the low 4.4 mark as well i was wondering if someone else might be a better fit (which they may have been but we will never know.... unless we get wild get one of those guys down the line!). It seems like he will be fine and Scandrick i heard nothing of and could end up growing into a great player im getting pumped for the preseason to begin. As much as i liked Roy in college i think he needs to go and im liking the idea of Hamlin sliding over and giving Henry a shot....... good posts everyone!
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Old 05-10-2008, 02:16 PM    (permalink
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Default Roy Williams

I really like R. Williams and while I hope he stays a Cowboy it seems apparent that this his is last year hear. I don't see why people want to cut him and put Henry back there. I think Williams plays this year and than we release him next year. When does his current deal expire?

I still think teams are afraid of what he can bring, but when you isolate him in coverage that is where teams are exposing him. I hope this year we can use CB to cover the WR and TE on 3 and 5+.

As long as he is here we need to just try to use him to the best that he can.
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