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Old 01-23-2011, 10:07 PM    (permalink
Hurricanes25
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Well that was a tough one to swallow. You just can't go down 24 and expect to win but we made it really close. We'll get there eventually.

Sanchez grew up in front of our eyes tonight. I have a lot of confidence in him going into next season.
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Old 01-23-2011, 10:12 PM    (permalink
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Great game, ya'll. It was a great game to watch. Best of luck this offseason and the next season. Oh, and I still hate you guys for taking Revis from Pittsburgh. :p
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Old 01-23-2011, 10:15 PM    (permalink
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I honestly couldnt think of a worse way to lose. There is really no doubt in my mind that these jets were a better team than the steelers. They just didnt come to play today. It really just seemed like everything went against us this game. I really thought this was our year, easily the most painful loss I've witnessed in my life

Only positive i can take from this is that Sanchez will be an elite QB. I am 100% positive of that.
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Old 01-23-2011, 10:18 PM    (permalink
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Schotty NEEDS to go. 3rd and 17 with a minute left, deep drop. WTF.

I'm too heartbroken to analyze further right now.
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Old 01-23-2011, 10:47 PM    (permalink
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At this point, I don't even care. This was a team that was built to win this year and not after this year IMO. The Jets don't have enough money to retain all of the people the Jets added last offseason.

In some cases, that might not be a bad thing. I still think the Jets receivers need to go. Yes they make big plays, but the do it incredibly inconsistently. Far too inconsistent given what they will likely be asking for.

People love to talk about how inaccurate Sanchez is, but how many of those incompletions this year were off the hands, jerseys and helmets of Jets players?

How many first downs or touchdowns do the Jets have to drop before people realize that the fault is not just with one player?

As for Schotty, the unwillingness to take even the smallest chances before there are no alternatives got old long ago. I'd love if the Jets got rid of him, but I already know they're not going to. I don't know why the Jets even bothered to get rid of Chad Pennington. He's the perfect quarterback for Schotty.

I certainly hope the Steelers running all over the Jets and Ben Roethlisberger escaping so much pressure in the first half made it perfectly crystal clear just how much the Jets need to address the front seven. The scheme allowed the Jets to get to Roethlisberger, but the lack of even an above average pass rusher also allowed him to escape regularly. This was a major need LAST year that was barely and completely inadequately addressed.

If it wasn't for that, the game wouldn't have gotten completely out of hand in the first half and the Jets could be going to the Superbowl now.

Instead, I see a team that's ready to take three steps back this off-season and will barely make the playoffs next year. :( :( :(
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Old 01-24-2011, 01:08 AM    (permalink
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At this point, I don't even care. This was a team that was built to win this year and not after this year IMO. The Jets don't have enough money to retain all of the people the Jets added last offseason.

In some cases, that might not be a bad thing. I still think the Jets receivers need to go. Yes they make big plays, but the do it incredibly inconsistently. Far too inconsistent given what they will likely be asking for.

People love to talk about how inaccurate Sanchez is, but how many of those incompletions this year were off the hands, jerseys and helmets of Jets players?

How many first downs or touchdowns do the Jets have to drop before people realize that the fault is not just with one player?

As for Schotty, the unwillingness to take even the smallest chances before there are no alternatives got old long ago. I'd love if the Jets got rid of him, but I already know they're not going to. I don't know why the Jets even bothered to get rid of Chad Pennington. He's the perfect quarterback for Schotty.

I certainly hope the Steelers running all over the Jets and Ben Roethlisberger escaping so much pressure in the first half made it perfectly crystal clear just how much the Jets need to address the front seven. The scheme allowed the Jets to get to Roethlisberger, but the lack of even an above average pass rusher also allowed him to escape regularly. This was a major need LAST year that was barely and completely inadequately addressed.

If it wasn't for that, the game wouldn't have gotten completely out of hand in the first half and the Jets could be going to the Superbowl now.

Instead, I see a team that's ready to take three steps back this off-season and will barely make the playoffs next year. :( :( :(
Receivers played well today other than Cotch.

Front 7 is our weakness. I dunno how to feel about Jenks coming back. Could be a boon on the 10% chance he's healthy, otherwise, ugh. Pace is a great second option, but should not be our best pass rusher. I have a feeling Ellis is gone. We need a DE, DT, and go to pass rush OLB.

I completely disagree about the Jets going backwards. As long as Sanchez continues to improve, Jets are going forwards. The OL is locked down, and will be just as good if not better next year, with Slauson having a year to gel.
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Old 01-24-2011, 01:51 AM    (permalink
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Front 7 is our weakness. I dunno how to feel about Jenks coming back. Could be a boon on the 10% chance he's healthy, otherwise, ugh. Pace is a great second option, but should not be our best pass rusher. I have a feeling Ellis is gone. We need a DE, DT, and go to pass rush OLB.

I completely disagree about the Jets going backwards. As long as Sanchez continues to improve, Jets are going forwards. The OL is locked down, and will be just as good if not better next year, with Slauson having a year to gel.
I don't think the Jets should rely on Jenkins. I was a fan of drafting Terrence Cody last year because I thought he could be a replacement of Jenkins in the long term and someone who would provide a breather or extra boost in the run defense should the Jets need it.

I don't think we're going to see what we saw today out of Sanchez on a regular basis. Not while Brian Schottenheimer is the offensive coordinator. Sanchez showed that he can be a playmaker. And Schottenheimer showed he's not going to let Sanchez do that unless the Jets are down by three touchdowns and its the start of the second half.

I don't know if Shaun Ellis will be gone if there is a 2011 season. Mike Devito, Sione Pouha and 36 year old Trevor Pryce/Jarron Gilbert as a starting defensive line does not inspire me with confidence. If there isn't, no way Ellis will be back in 2012. Not at age 35 with his contract.
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Old 01-24-2011, 04:29 AM    (permalink
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I honestly couldnt think of a worse way to lose. There is really no doubt in my mind that these patriots were a better team than the jets. They just didnt come to play today. It really just seemed like everything went against us this game. I really thought this was our year, easily the most painful loss I've witnessed in my life
I said this last week.

It's the playoffs. You always feel you should get another chance or that you should have done better.
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Old 01-24-2011, 12:19 PM    (permalink
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I've really come around on Jason Taylor. The man is pretty much done, but he put his heart and soul into it this year. Watching his postgame interview, I felt horrible for the guy. If he redoes his contract and stays for CHEAP, I want him back, in the role we actually wanted him in, a very situational pass rusher.

God, this still hurts so bad.
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Old 01-28-2011, 12:49 AM    (permalink
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No thank you to Justin Taylor

Im still hurt from the loss.
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Old 01-28-2011, 01:54 AM    (permalink
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No thank you to Justin Taylor

Im still hurt from the loss.
Justin Taylor? Que?

I just think having him and LT in the locker room is far more valuable than their on the field contributions. They're inspiring, calming, and both have ridiculously high football IQ's. I don't necessarily want them on the field too often, but I want them on the team.
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Old 02-02-2011, 12:32 PM    (permalink
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So there are a ton of free agents obviously, thought it would be interesting to discuss how we think each would be replaced if they end up leaving. What are your guys thoughts on some of our FA's?
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Old 02-02-2011, 01:55 PM    (permalink
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1. David Harris
2a. Santonio Holmes
2b. Braylon Edwards
3. Cro
4. Brad Smith
5. Ellis

IMO that should be our priority list. Ellis will have to take a massive pay-cut to stay and Smith will have offers from other teams bigger than ours. If we can keep 1-3 then that will be a successful off-season in my eyes and i could really give a **** what else happens
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Old 02-04-2011, 12:14 PM    (permalink
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I just checked out nyjetscap.com which supposedly keeps track of cap information for the Jets and seems to do a pretty good job of it. It appears that the Jets' current cap figure is somewhere in the ballpark of $118 million, which has to be way over whatever the cap next year would be I'd imagine, and that doesn't count any of the team's current FA's. Tannenbaum's going to have to do some serious restructuring if he wants to re-sign guys, last year with a cap came in at $128 million. The page also covers cap savings if cut which gives an idea of which players could be gone. Guys who offer the most savings and I think might get cut or at least restructured include Jenkins ($4.6 million), Bryan Thomas ($3.7), Damien Woody ($3.24), LT ($2.425), Jason Taylor ($2.275), Ben Hartsock ($1.65), and maybe even Brunell ($1.3). Should be an interesting offseason.
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Old 02-04-2011, 12:34 PM    (permalink
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The free agency period is going to be very interesting this offseason as there are a lot of teams with numerous free agents. With teams most likely trying to lock up their own free agents first, it could eventually lead to lowered contracts than initially thought.
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Old 02-04-2011, 01:13 PM    (permalink
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The free agency period is going to be very interesting this offseason as there are a lot of teams with numerous free agents. With teams most likely trying to lock up their own free agents first, it could eventually lead to lowered contracts than initially thought.
Interesting thought. I know that about $10 million give or take a couple million depending on what the cap ends up being isn't going to be nearly enough to bring back the guys that we'd like to though. I'd imagine there will be more than a few cuts. Definitely will be some interesting spots to watch.

At FS for example, do Smith or Pool get brought back? I kind of liked Lowery there towards the end of the year, does he get a shot to start with some minor competition brought in? Do they draft someone?

At corner do they maybe elect to re-sign Coleman to play nickel, give Wilson a shot to start, and promote Cole to play in dime situations? I'd guess they'll draft somebody there if Cro or Coleman leaves (barring signing a FA, which is just a lot more expensive) and one or the other seems likely.

Does Ellis come back at DE? Either way it seems like it needs to be addressed. How much faith do they have in Pitoitua, Dixon, Gilbert, etc to step up and command play time? I wouldn't be shocked if it's more than we'd like, but somebody has to get brought in here or at NT IMO. Just wonder if they'll continue to ignore that.

Woody seems like he might be a cap casualty, do they bring back Wayne Hunter to start, move Ducasse to RT and give him a shot (maybe have those two compete), draft someone, or sign someone if that does happen? Speaking of Ducasse, does he get a shot to win the LG job or do they try to upgrade Slauson in any way? Unlikely based on all of the other potential needs, but we'll see. I'd kind of like to see Vlad get moved to LT.

Same with Jenks, and either way it looks like a NT of the future would be nice to have. Do they address that in the draft or try to plug in UDFA's and players who have been cut on the DL like they have in the past?

WR kind of speaks for itself, but Brad Smith should be interesting. If he goes, which would be unfortunate, he might be replaced with a RB who also replaces LT to kill two birds with one stone, return kicks, take some carries, run some Wildcat. Even with the situation, if Edwards leaves I think you need to find another big wideout. Do they think Patrick Turner is that guy? I'd be a little surprised, but you never know. I do think that if Holmes is the one to leave Edwards and Cotchery are a decent starting duo and complement each other pretty well, but looking for a slot and a long-term replacement for J-Co could make sense.

RB isn't one we'd often think about, but if LT goes that's a lot of carries to fill and I don't think Joe McKnight takes them all. I'd guess somebody gets brought in if LT goes, which seems like a coinflip at this point.

Even QB is interesting depending on whether or not Brunell comes back, if he does then they have to figure out if Ainge or O'Connell profile as long-term backups and if not they may have to go after a backup QB. Much as we don't want Sanchez to get hurt if he does you've got to be ready for that, and Clemens is definitely long gone this offseason.

Then of course there's ILB, where losing David Harris would be really rough. On one hand you'd think that a major upgrade is needed there if he goes, but I wonder if it makes more sense to try to improve other spots first. The position has kind of become a priority in this defense because it's one of the two spots with the most talent, but it's not that key in a 3-4. I'd be intrigued by a potential move inside by Westerman actually and there are some younger talented backups as well.

OLB obviously we all know is a need in terms of adding pass rush, but I think additionally if you can't get either at a discount Taylor and Thomas should go with the cap situation. If that's the case, and unfortunately I'd guess it won't be, you need to find a starter and make that a major priority. Westerman may get a shot there as well and that would be interesting but I'd guess they at least bring in competition.


I'm just really interested in what happens this offseason because they can either have some upgrades and downgrades across the board by bringing in average players, or they can spend some significant cash on some of the team's FA's and try to let younger guys at certain spots step up. It's just a matter of which spots they have faith in the younger guys at. Either way it should be a really interesting offseason with some highs and some lows, and we'll definitely be looking at a different team next year.
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Old 02-04-2011, 01:28 PM    (permalink
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I just checked out nyjetscap.com which supposedly keeps track of cap information for the Jets and seems to do a pretty good job of it. It appears that the Jets' current cap figure is somewhere in the ballpark of $118 million, which has to be way over whatever the cap next year would be I'd imagine, and that doesn't count any of the team's current FA's. Tannenbaum's going to have to do some serious restructuring if he wants to re-sign guys, last year with a cap came in at $128 million. The page also covers cap savings if cut which gives an idea of which players could be gone. Guys who offer the most savings and I think might get cut or at least restructured include Jenkins ($4.6 million), Bryan Thomas ($3.7), Damien Woody ($3.24), LT ($2.425), Jason Taylor ($2.275), Ben Hartsock ($1.65), and maybe even Brunell ($1.3). Should be an interesting offseason.

Wow, I must say that that is much worse than even I thought it would be. I really figured that the Jets would struggle to bring anyone in, but I figured they would at least be able to bring Harris and Cromartie back.

Do you know if that 118 milion includes all of the money the Jets won't be paying Vernon Gholston? If so, well, that's not so bad then. Otherwise the Jets are even more SOL than I thought they would if there is a 2011 season.
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Old 02-04-2011, 02:00 PM    (permalink
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Wow, I must say that that is much worse than even I thought it would be. I really figured that the Jets would struggle to bring anyone in, but I figured they would at least be able to bring Harris and Cromartie back.

Do you know if that 118 milion includes all of the money the Jets won't be paying Vernon Gholston? If so, well, that's not so bad then. Otherwise the Jets are even more SOL than I thought they would if there is a 2011 season.
The site could be off on this, but apparently cutting Gholston would leave a lot of dead money and will only result in a little under half a million in savings. Trust me, if it was anything more I would've included him in there. There's also presumably some other savings in there given this includes the top 51 players currently on the roster, and a lot of them at the bottom probably won't make the team and will result in savings of around $300-500k. It's not an awful situation, but it's far from good. If they cut every guy I listed they'd have $29 million in cap space this year (presuming the cap is what it was in 2009, I'd guess they make it higher as that seems to be the trend) plus savings from not keeping some of the other guys who count against the cap right now but probably won't make the team. And they could always restructure some guys to save some money (Sanchez apparently counts like $17 million against the cap this year). Should be able at least to re-sign 2-3 of the bigger FA's and the draft picks.
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Old 02-04-2011, 02:44 PM    (permalink
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At FS for example, do Smith or Pool get brought back? I kind of liked Lowery there towards the end of the year, does he get a shot to start with some minor competition brought in? Do they draft someone?
I would let Smith walk, bring back Pool as the SS, let Lowery fight Leonhard for the other spot with the loser still getting significant playing time (Eric Smiths former role)

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At corner do they maybe elect to re-sign Coleman to play nickel, give Wilson a shot to start, and promote Cole to play in dime situations? I'd guess they'll draft somebody there if Cro or Coleman leaves (barring signing a FA, which is just a lot more expensive) and one or the other seems likely.
Coleman only comes back if Cro leaves IMO. Cole was already re-signed so he's the dime/nickel depending on Cro and Wilson is either starting or the nick.

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Does Ellis come back at DE? Either way it seems like it needs to be addressed. How much faith do they have in Pitoitua, Dixon, Gilbert, etc to step up and command play time? I wouldn't be shocked if it's more than we'd like, but somebody has to get brought in here or at NT IMO. Just wonder if they'll continue to ignore that.
I think Ellis is gonna have to take an embarrassing pay-cut to come back, but he seems like he might be willing to do that. To be honest I think they have an incredible amount of faith in Rex's ability to turn no names/UDFA's into starters. However, I would love to add premiere talent to the D-line, not sure how likely it is though.

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Woody seems like he might be a cap casualty, do they bring back Wayne Hunter to start, move Ducasse to RT and give him a shot (maybe have those two compete), draft someone, or sign someone if that does happen? Speaking of Ducasse, does he get a shot to win the LG job or do they try to upgrade Slauson in any way? Unlikely based on all of the other potential needs, but we'll see. I'd kind of like to see Vlad get moved to LT.
Woody is all but gone from what I've read. Bringing back Hunter and having a comp between him and Vlad for RT would be ideal, but im not sure how economically feasible it is. I think Slauson was pretty good for a first year starter and should only improve as time goes on so he should get the LG job.

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Same with Jenks, and either way it looks like a NT of the future would be nice to have. Do they address that in the draft or try to plug in UDFA's and players who have been cut on the DL like they have in the past?
Jenks is gonna have to re-structure to stay, but he really doesn't have much of a choice if he wants to play. He won't get much on the open market so it's either take a pay cut or retire (which he has talked about so it might be more of a possibility than we think)

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WR kind of speaks for itself, but Brad Smith should be interesting. If he goes, which would be unfortunate, he might be replaced with a RB who also replaces LT to kill two birds with one stone, return kicks, take some carries, run some Wildcat. Even with the situation, if Edwards leaves I think you need to find another big wideout. Do they think Patrick Turner is that guy? I'd be a little surprised, but you never know. I do think that if Holmes is the one to leave Edwards and Cotchery are a decent starting duo and complement each other pretty well, but looking for a slot and a long-term replacement for J-Co could make sense.
This is obviously the most fluid situation. We can either be set for the next 10 years or have to spend a 1st round pick on a WR. Hopefully we get both flight boys back so this becomes a non-issue. If not, who knows what can happen

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RB isn't one we'd often think about, but if LT goes that's a lot of carries to fill and I don't think Joe McKnight takes them all. I'd guess somebody gets brought in if LT goes, which seems like a coinflip at this point.
I think the only reason LT is a coin flip is his cap number, I'm sure he would be willing to take a cut


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Even QB is interesting depending on whether or not Brunell comes back, if he does then they have to figure out if Ainge or O'Connell profile as long-term backups and if not they may have to go after a backup QB. Much as we don't want Sanchez to get hurt if he does you've got to be ready for that, and Clemens is definitely long gone this offseason.
Cheah cheah


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Then of course there's ILB, where losing David Harris would be really rough. On one hand you'd think that a major upgrade is needed there if he goes, but I wonder if it makes more sense to try to improve other spots first. The position has kind of become a priority in this defense because it's one of the two spots with the most talent, but it's not that key in a 3-4. I'd be intrigued by a potential move inside by Westerman actually and there are some younger talented backups as well.
Agree here too, obviously I would love to have Harris back, but this seems like one position where we have people ready to step in and play, plus ILB isn't traditionally an impact position in the 3-4 so this is one situation where we could save alot of money without losing as much production. However, if Harris gets locked up long term he could be the leader of our D for the next 10 years. This is one of the most interesting sitations IMO.


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OLB obviously we all know is a need in terms of adding pass rush, but I think additionally if you can't get either at a discount Taylor and Thomas should go with the cap situation. If that's the case, and unfortunately I'd guess it won't be, you need to find a starter and make that a major priority. Westerman may get a shot there as well and that would be interesting but I'd guess they at least bring in competition.
Taylor is another guy who needs to take a pay-cut to stay, honestly he'll probably need to take the minimum. Thomas is a likely cut from what I've read or a re-structure. Regardless, we NEED more talent at this position, plain and simple. Either through the draft or FA (Kiwanuka?)


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I'm just really interested in what happens this offseason because they can either have some upgrades and downgrades across the board by bringing in average players, or they can spend some significant cash on some of the team's FA's and try to let younger guys at certain spots step up. It's just a matter of which spots they have faith in the younger guys at. Either way it should be a really interesting offseason with some highs and some lows, and we'll definitely be looking at a different team next year.
I completely agree. This team could look ALOT different next year but that might not necessarily be a bad thing. There is plenty of talent and depth on this team, its just up to Tanny and Rex to decide where to spend and where to save. Going off of history, I would say that Cro is re-signed. If Holmes and Bray truly want to (they really seemed like they were having a great time together) they will both be able to come back. T-Rich is basically gone from what I've read too. Overall, there is really anything that can happen so I'm pretty excited to see what we do
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Old 02-04-2011, 02:59 PM    (permalink
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I'm really nervous about this upcoming off-season. As you guys pointed out, it's going to be really tough to keep everybody that we want. I do however have a lot of confidence in Mr. T because he has done a good job of restructuring contracts and working around the cap.

Here are a list of guys I would let walk:
Tomlinson- lets face it, he's washed up.
T-Rich- age and I think Connor is ready to step in.
Holmes or Braylon- I keep going back and forth on who I'd rather keep.
Jenkins- The guy is fragile and we can't depend on hin.
Woody- age and he is declining.
Jason Taylor- A Rb can block him 1 on 1. No thanks.

We have to find a way to keep Harris (no need to explain), Ellis and either Holmes or Braylon. Hopefully Ellis takes a bit of a paycut because we are bare thin on the d-line and Ellis is still making an impact.

It would be nice to have Cro back but he's going to make a lot of money and I don't think we could pay him.

The QB situation is interesting. I think Brunell comes back. Just a feeling.

Bottomline, the team is going to look very different next year.
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Old 02-04-2011, 10:45 PM    (permalink
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I just checked out nyjetscap.com which supposedly keeps track of cap information for the Jets and seems to do a pretty good job of it. It appears that the Jets' current cap figure is somewhere in the ballpark of $118 million, which has to be way over whatever the cap next year would be I'd imagine, and that doesn't count any of the team's current FA's. .
No WAY the cap goes under 120 million. It raised 12 million from 08 to 09 (to 128 million), and would have raised another 10 million or so to 140 million this year, had there been a cap. Even if the owners negotiate a smaller amount of the profits to go to players, the cap wouldn't be lowered, as profits this year are almost definitely up again.

A safe estimate for a floor, would be around 130 million, where we were at two years ago (roughly a $20 million dollar decrease from what it regularly would be this year, or about a 14% decrease.

Which would have us 12 million under the cap. Cutting Gholston wouldn't net us much cap room, however, so hopefully we can trade him for a 7th, as extremely unlikely as that is. I wouldnt be surprised to see him play out the contract here.

Woody will be gone, which will get us to about 15 million.

15 million could sign two guys out of Braylon, Harris, Cro, and Holmes, assuming no one takes a pay cut to stay. However, we'll also have draft picks to sign. *shrug*
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Old 02-05-2011, 12:58 AM    (permalink
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No WAY the cap goes under 120 million. It raised 12 million from 08 to 09 (to 128 million), and would have raised another 10 million or so to 140 million this year, had there been a cap. Even if the owners negotiate a smaller amount of the profits to go to players, the cap wouldn't be lowered, as profits this year are almost definitely up again.

A safe estimate for a floor, would be around 130 million, where we were at two years ago (roughly a $20 million dollar decrease from what it regularly would be this year, or about a 14% decrease.

Which would have us 12 million under the cap. Cutting Gholston wouldn't net us much cap room, however, so hopefully we can trade him for a 7th, as extremely unlikely as that is. I wouldnt be surprised to see him play out the contract here.

Woody will be gone, which will get us to about 15 million.

15 million could sign two guys out of Braylon, Harris, Cro, and Holmes, assuming no one takes a pay cut to stay. However, we'll also have draft picks to sign. *shrug*
My bad, I definitely intended to delete that and just forgot it. A little lower in my post is the same cap figure you reference, and in a different post I'm pretty sure I said I'd imagine it'll go up a little. It's been two years. I think they'll get more space than the $15 million given more than just Woody should get cut, Jenks at the very least will take a pay cut and then some other guys I referenced in that post. But I definitely meant to get rid of it as soon as I looked up the most recent cap number and saw where it was, the statement you quoted was absolutely wrong.
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Old 02-05-2011, 02:07 PM    (permalink
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Does anybody know if the teams are allowed to use the franchise tag?
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Old 02-05-2011, 10:01 PM    (permalink
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Does anybody know if the teams are allowed to use the franchise tag?
They will be. In a couple days.
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Old 02-06-2011, 12:49 PM    (permalink
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Does anybody know if the teams are allowed to use the franchise tag?
Apparently it's somewhat up in the air since the players are fighting it, but it seems likely. And if they are, the Jets are tagging Harris:

Interesting move, makes sense if it happens. Cro's easier to replace than Harris with Wilson waiting in the wings, and you figure you can re-sign at least one of the wide receivers.
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