San Francisco 49ers Discussion - Page 354

king2am · 04-20-2011, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

Our schedule looks pretty difficult. Combine that with a new coach and it could be another long season. Hopefully that long season is a promising one though.

I see 9 or 10 - call me an optimist.

5 in the NFC West
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Washington
Detroit

10 if we sweep the west. This seems far fetched but, I don't think there was any doubt who had the most talent on the field in our division. The debacle in SEA? Definitely not a refleciton of our talent.

Harbaugh will get them going, there's no film on us to start with...

mac25fan · 04-20-2011, 12:26 PM

I just hope they figure out this CBA sooner than later... with a new HC and new offense and chance of a new QB, we will need more time than others play at the highest level.

I would hope for 10 wins, but not sure we can do it if the lack of a CBA delays the start of mini camps/pre-season.

Borat · 04-20-2011, 09:24 PM

Dan, just wondering how you're coming up with these draft pick trade values. Why does it cost a 2012 1st rounder to move up from 10 to 7, but then it only costs a 4th rounder to move up from 10 to 8. It just seems so unlikely. If the Niners move down from 7 to 10 and pick up a future first, they surely will have to give that 1st up to move up from 10 to 8, which then makes that trade scenario practically worthless. Might as well just stay at 7 or 10.

dan77733 · 04-21-2011, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Borat

Dan, just wondering how you're coming up with these draft pick trade values. Why does it cost a 2012 1st rounder to move up from 10 to 7, but then it only costs a 4th rounder to move up from 10 to 8. It just seems so unlikely. If the Niners move down from 7 to 10 and pick up a future first, they surely will have to give that 1st up to move up from 10 to 8, which then makes that trade scenario practically worthless. Might as well just stay at 7 or 10.

I'm adding the Redskins 2012 first rounder because they always trade away draft picks to the point that the NFL should just eliminate them from the Draft completely. Also, Newton and his rolling out would be a perfect fit for the Shanahan twins offense. The third reason is that especially with the Redskins, they would be more willing to trade a future first in case there's no draft next year.

The last reason can also be added to HOU but also because HOU is rumored to be in love with Peterson and since their pass defense was horrible and they play Manning, they may want to go all out for Peterson.

As for us trading up from 10/11 to 8 for just a 4th rounder, it would be because both QB's are gone as well as Peterson and Green. Basically, the two QB's and the top two players in most rankings overall in the draft would be gone so there's no reason to go all out to move up to 8.

In short, I would use both QB's and Peterson/Green as trade bait with the hopes of getting WSH or HOU to give up their 2012 first rounder for a guy they covet more than anyone else. For me personally to give up Peterson or Green, a team would HAVE TO give me their 2012 first rounder in order for that team to get him guaranteed. If not, I draft Peterson or Green myself. Of course, if I was to somehow get that extra first rounder, I would probably give up my 3rd if needed to make sure im still able to get Prince.

Granted, giving up a 3rd to move up 2 or 3 spots may seem like much but im still getting a potential franchise CB in Prince and I still have that extra first rounder in 2012.

Quite simply, I dont see Harbaugh trading up period because there's no one worth trading up for. I do see Harbaugh trying to trade down if Peterson falls to 7 if he can get that first rounder because I believe that his sights are set on Luck next year and no one knows Luck better than Harbaugh and im pretty sure that if Harbaugh knows 100% that Luck will enter the NFL Draft in 2012, he's going to do whatever he can in order to get that extra first so he can move up next year.

With the lockout going on, new coaching staff, players coming and going (eventually), its going to be a transition year which is why Harbaugh tried to re-sign Alex Smith because he sees 2011 as a throwaway season if he knows 100% that Luck is coming out next year. Even if Luck plays bad in 2011, he'll still be a perfect fit for us and would still most likely be better than any QB that we would be drafting this year.

Excluding Luck, I think Harbaugh will eventually trade for a QB once the lockout ends, possibly two with Buccaneers QB Josh Johnson being almost a guarantee.

Oh well, im off from work Thursday and Friday and will be able to see who they draft for rounds 1-3. I'm just hoping that at 7, its not a QB or Quinn and I will most likely be a happy camper.

And Scott's new mock draft is up -

Our top three picks are -

CB Patrick Peterson
QB Ricky Stanzi
OLB Chris Carter

Love the Peterson pick but im 50/50 on the other two mainly because I dont know anything about either player since after first rounders, I dont bother.

mac25fan · 04-21-2011, 12:56 PM

Interesting mock by Peter King who does a "will pick" and "should pick". He has us trading down and still getting Prince. I like that. He is also in "love" with Andy Dalton. Guess the King likes red hair.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...html?eref=sihp

49erNation85 · 04-21-2011, 01:14 PM

Dan, we better not be wasting out time with a love fest on QB's and previous from JH.We need a fresh start in either this draft or FA.I still us either draft Dalton,Ponder or maybe we get and get Locker!

Quote:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...html?eref=sihp

Dude for get this guy.If PP is there at 7 and we trade I will just ******* shoot my self in the foot. That would be the dumbest move ever.That guy doing the mock is a moron Dalton has no business going in the top 20 picks.We have a bigger need at CB then Houston does by far.Plus I really hope the 9ers do that.Just a waste of a trade.Instead we can get Peterson.

phlysac · 04-21-2011, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by king2am

I see 9 or 10 - call me an optimist.

5 in the NFC West
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Washington
Detroit

10 if we sweep the west. This seems far fetched but, I don't think there was any doubt who had the most talent on the field in our division. The debacle in SEA? Definitely not a refleciton of our talent.

Harbaugh will get them going, there's no film on us to start with...

Look at this brutality they call the Rams' first-half schedule...

1 Philadelphia Eagles
2 @ New York Giants
3 Baltimore Ravens
4 Washington Redskins
5 Bye
6 @ Green Bay Packers
7 @ Dallas Cowboys
8 New Orleans Saints

I see 2 wins tops.

mac25fan · 04-21-2011, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49erNation85

Dude for get this guy.If PP is there at 7 and we trade I will just ******* shoot my self in the foot. That would be the dumbest move ever.That guy doing the mock is a moron Dalton has no business going in the top 20 picks.We have a bigger need at CB then Houston does by far.Plus I really hope the 9ers do that.Just a waste of a trade.Instead we can get Peterson.

I think Peterson would be a great pick... but it would be even better to get Prince and add another pick to allow us to trade back into the first round to get the QB JH wants.

The teams that are the best in the draft over time know that you will have more success with a quantity of pics. Bill Walsh pioneered that strategy and you now see the Patriots following that example. I would place an educated bet that JH would adopt that strategy as well.

49erNation85 · 04-21-2011, 10:02 PM

We all new this day was coming.Here is a good read on Peterson visit to SF today.It is a good read if I must say.here is a link.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slu...he_49ers_today

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo? · 04-21-2011, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phlysac

Look at this brutality they call the Rams' first-half schedule...

1 Philadelphia Eagles
2 @ New York Giants
3 Baltimore Ravens
4 Washington Redskins
5 Bye
6 @ Green Bay Packers
7 @ Dallas Cowboys
8 New Orleans Saints

I see 2 wins tops.

I was jokingly going to say that all the 49ers had to win was 7 games to win the division and after looking at the Rams schedule that maybe the case again this season.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo? · 04-22-2011, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49erNation85

We all new this day was coming.Here is a good read on Peterson visit to SF today.It is a good read if I must say.here is a link.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slu...he_49ers_today

Thanks for the link. I been pessimistic about Peterson falling to 7 and it keeps growing as the days go by.
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/blog/..._draft_pa.html

49erNation85 · 04-22-2011, 12:26 AM

Dam Browns are trying steal all the best CB wtf man.I didn't see that article crap we I guess we are gonna probably Prince or some one else.It won't be far for them to have Haden and Peterson on each for a defense.No one is gonna want to throw on them at all period.Then they go on to say they still need a QB,poor McCoy I thought he showed sings of a good starter his rookie year.They should just take Gabbert or Green maybe Miller would be their choice too.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo? · 04-22-2011, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49erNation85

Dam Browns are trying steal all the best CB wtf man.I didn't see that article crap we I guess we are gonna probably Prince or some one else.It won't be far for them to have Haden and Peterson on each for a defense.No one is gonna want to throw on them at all period.Then they go on to say they still need a QB,poor McCoy I thought he showed sings of a good starter his rookie year.They should just take Gabbert or Green maybe Miller would be their choice too.

The Walrus and Shurmur have been high on McCoy all off-season so don't see them taking a QB till the later rounds. I think the Cardinals are the ones who snag Peterson and Browns take Julio Jones. Think Jones is perfect fit in their offense and gives McCoy a weapon.

After that I think it will leave SF with Gabbert. Seen a few writers saying SF should move down but I do not see any teams moving up for Gabbert. I think Locker is higher on Tenn and Wash board. Minnesota could but with Quinn and Bowers falling possibly there I think they stand pat.

BandwagonPunditry · 04-22-2011, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49erNation85

Dam Browns are trying steal all the best CB wtf man.I didn't see that article crap we I guess we are gonna probably Prince or some one else.It won't be far for them to have Haden and Peterson on each for a defense.No one is gonna want to throw on them at all period.Then they go on to say they still need a QB,poor McCoy I thought he showed sings of a good starter his rookie year.They should just take Gabbert or Green maybe Miller would be their choice too.

Are you permanently drunk when you post?

49erNation85 · 04-22-2011, 12:34 PM

Another good video here on how we are drafting round one.It sounds like BPA to me at defense or offense.

http://www.49ers.com/media-gallery/v...4-64432a528eb3

MrMojoRisin · 04-22-2011, 01:11 PM

The Browns need a WR or pass rusher, not another CB.

binary · 04-22-2011, 04:47 PM

I'm totally down with trading down and getting Prince.

footballfan098 · 04-22-2011, 05:34 PM

PP falling to 7 is a very real possibility.

The top 4 picks all get good players at positions of need.
CAR- Cam
DEN- Dareus
BUF- Von
CIN- AJ

Arizona will be the key. If they take Quinn, I can see Cleveland moving out for someone like the Cowboys who may want PP or a team like TEN that wants Gabbert.

If Arizona takes Gabbert then CLE gets Quinn and we end up with PP.

The problem for us is that everyone in the world knows our needs so teams moving up in front of us should someone fall is going to be a problem.

Verloren · 04-22-2011, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by footballfan098

The problem for us is that everyone in the world knows our needs so teams moving up in front of us should someone fall is going to be a problem.

Everybody knows what each team needs. The question is which need/player they target first, and things rarely go to plan on draft day.

After all, no battle plans survive first contact with the enemy (the draft in this case).

stl9erfan · 04-22-2011, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by binary

I'm totally down with trading down and getting Prince.

I agree with this. The more I think about this draft, the more convinced I am that the place the Niners should be is the late first/early second. That's where the interesting QB prospects are, and that's where the second tier of 3-4 OLB are. Give me a mock that gets SF the chance to trade back, pick up a corner, QB, and OLB? Yeah I'll take that.

Menardo75 · 04-23-2011, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BandwagonPunditry

Are you permanently drunk when you post?

Lol no joke.

ViperVisor · 04-24-2011, 12:25 AM

dan77733 · 04-24-2011, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViperVisor

Off the top of my head, that list is missing Rattay (2000) and Brandon Doman (2002). There's probably others too.

Draft wise, im still hoping for Peterson but if he's gone before 7, I wouldnt mind trading down and still drafting Prince. Of course, have to be careful because I can definitely see the Texans drafting him at 11 or even jumping ahead of us and trading with TEN. The more I think about it, the more I realize that it will be highly unlikely to trade down and still get Prince. Oh well, a few more days to good. I'll be watching the first three rounds Thursday and Friday since im off from work. Yay me!!!

Rabscuttle · 04-24-2011, 08:57 AM

Houston needs an OLB for Phillips to run a 3-4 more than anything else that they are missing. Aldon Smith is their most likely target. I know fans have cornerback in their heads, but they are ignoring the fact that Wade is in town and can't run his defence without a pass rusher. Quinn could be their other guy, but I think Smith is their preference with Miller of course being out of reach.

dan77733 · 04-24-2011, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rabscuttle

Houston needs an OLB for Phillips to run a 3-4 more than anything else that they are missing. Aldon Smith is their most likely target. I know fans have cornerback in their heads, but they are ignoring the fact that Wade is in town and can't run his defence without a pass rusher. Quinn could be their other guy, but I think Smith is their preference with Miller of course being out of reach.

True but their biggest need is a CB because their secondary was horrible and they do have Mario Williams who I think Phillips will use as his pass rusher. He's most likely going to run a 3-4/4-3 hybrid until he gets enough players who fit his 3-4 scheme but I honestly think that CB will be their pick if Prince is there at 11. Both of their safeties are gone, their top CB was horrible and their secondary in general was one of the worst in pass defense in NFL history if I remember correctly. They need a shutdown corner and Prince is the second best player available at CB.

I would be shocked if they pass on Prince at 11 if he's available.