2013 Canes - Page 125

bearsfan_51 · 08-18-2011, 11:11 AM

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/18/sp...r=3&ref=sports

Death penalty doesn't seem to be in discussion. I disagree with their judgement, but nobody asked me.

The Great Jonathan Vilma · 08-18-2011, 04:37 PM

http://miami.247sports.com/Article/O...nd-Canes-36020

Posted in CFB Rumours, but I believe it applies here as well. Good read and justified.

For the record I don't disagree that the players broke the rules and that they did more than just accept money to get by, but I agree with the concept of the article. I don't blame kids for having meals and drinks purchased for them, or even parties. Having women, car rims, and other such items are over the top and qualify for brekaing the rules IMO. Hopefully they differentiate the two when it comes to what players accepted.

draftguru151 · 08-18-2011, 09:54 PM

I'm just gonna leave this here.

CashmoneyDrew · 08-18-2011, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by draftguru151

I'm just gonna leave this here.

Quote:

NCAA Bylaws are clear: The ‘death penalty’ is a phrase used by media to describe the most serious NCAA penalties possible. It is not a formal NCAA term. It applies only to repeat violators and can include eliminating the involved sport for at least one year, the elimination of athletics aid in that sport for two years and the school relinquishing its Association voting privileges for a four-year period. A school is a repeat violator if a second major violation occurs within five years of the start date of the penalty from the first case. The cases do not have to be in the same sport. I added the bolding because it is important to note that given the death penalty ONLY applies to repeat violators and that for Miami to be classified as a repeat violator, the NCAA would have to prove allegations occurred in 2001 and before, something Yahoo! doesn’t allege and a timeframe in which Nevin Shapiro wasn’t even a UM booster. Therefore, this case isn’t even death penalty eligible because of the football program, which is kind of an important point that no one seems to want to make.

Isn't Miami on some kind of probation for a sport other than football? If so, he's missing that key point I bolded.

draftguru151 · 08-18-2011, 10:20 PM

He mentions the baseball stuff in the next paragraph. There are some issues in there, and I'm not sure the exact stuff on the death penalty and whether he is right about it or not, but a lot of his stuff is right.

It's just kind of sad everyone is taking this guy's word as gospel when there are already tons of facts proving things in this report are complete lies, and multiple players have already come out and denied what he was accusing. The NCAA has already cleared 7 players in the report, but no one wants to talk about that, just that Shapiro said he paid for a hooker's abortion.

CashmoneyDrew · 08-18-2011, 10:29 PM

I'm still trying to get my head wrapped around all of this.

Hurricanes25 · 08-18-2011, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by draftguru151

I'm just gonna leave this here.

Great piece. The writer is absolutely right. There really isn't as much evidence as Y! leads us to believe.

The Great Jonathan Vilma · 08-19-2011, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by draftguru151

I'm just gonna leave this here.

A great read. Thanks for sharing.

Saints-Tigers · 08-19-2011, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by draftguru151

He mentions the baseball stuff in the next paragraph. There are some issues in there, and I'm not sure the exact stuff on the death penalty and whether he is right about it or not, but a lot of his stuff is right.

It's just kind of sad everyone is taking this guy's word as gospel when there are already tons of facts proving things in this report are complete lies, and multiple players have already come out and denied what he was accusing. The NCAA has already cleared 7 players in the report, but no one wants to talk about that, just that Shapiro said he paid for a hooker's abortion.

Do you expect anything less? People love siding with whoever comes up with the next great scandal. EVERYONE just follows Tim Donaghy and believes anything he says, despite the fact that his claims about the NBA being staged are very dubious, and all of his future predictions pretty much fall flat(then claiming the NBA reversed their choice of finals winner, to spite him).

It's probably not as small as the writer makes it to be, but it's not nearly as grandiose and Shapiro and the media outlets want us to believe I would say.

FUNBUNCHER · 08-20-2011, 02:32 AM

NCAA President says he's willing to use the 'death penalty'.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-...,1208175.story

JHL6719 · 08-22-2011, 02:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeJoeBrown

WRT SMU, their Board of Trustees, President, and a bunch of other execs (including the Governor of Texas) were involved in operating a slush fund that bought players. When the NCAA said to cut it out, they all ignored the NCAA and continued to pay players. This is why they got the death penalty.

Miami is very bad (assuming this stuff is remotely true). The second worse that we've likely seen exposed in college football. But it's not SMU level of administrative corruption (yet).

I think it's a difficult distinction to make at this point whether or not this reaches SMU level of administrative corruption. But it certainly doesn't look good.

A lot of coaches are named in this. Not to mention, Paul Dee stood up there and shook his finger at USC when he was on the infraction committee, and now it appears the most renegade program in the country may very well have happened on his watch when he was AD at Miami.

This Shapiro guy wasn't even an alumnus, and he was allowed to donate and gain keys to the program through his donations. He owned a sports agency and they still let this guy have constant access to players and coaches...meanwhile, the university president, AD, etc.. all continued to take this guy's money, run him out onto the field, and name buildings on campus after him.

Something just doesn't add up here. It's their JOB to protect the university from these type things.

If even 1/3 of all this is true, you almost have to punish the program severly based purely off stupidity if they didn't know, followed by some people losing their jobs.

I believe the UM compliance department self reported some of this to the NCAA a while back, which is why the investigation into some of this was already underway. But the question(s) seems to be:

How much evidence did UM's compliance department provide? Was it anywhere near what Shapiro is claiming? Did UM's compliance department withhold any evidence knowingly?

What a mess.

draftguru151 · 08-25-2011, 07:29 PM

Jacory and 7 others declared ineligible. Could play in the opener though.

YAYareaRB · 08-25-2011, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by draftguru151

Jacory and 7 others declared ineligible. Could play in the opener though.

waiiiiiit, whatzzz?

draftguru151 · 08-25-2011, 07:40 PM

The school ruled them ineligible, the NCAA has to clear them or pick the amount of games that they're suspended player by player, which could happen before the season starts. Saw something about Tuesday but not sure about that.

Hurricanes25 · 08-25-2011, 07:41 PM

Do you know the 7 other players or have their names not yet been released?

draftguru151 · 08-25-2011, 07:51 PM

I've seen Spence's name but no others. And apparently it might be 13 now?

draftguru151 · 08-25-2011, 08:24 PM

Also haven't posted any of the stuff I've read recently cause I've been kind of sick of it, but here are some random tidbits.

A group (5 or 6) of boosters was interviewed, all saying how strict UM was the past few years (during Shannon/Hocutt). One couldn't bring his daughter to a game in the Hocutt's box because she was in high school and it might be a violation. One guy couldn't say hi to players when he traveled on the team plane. Another couldn't give his sponsored player (Booster pays for an athlete's scholarship) a gift when the player had a baby. UMs compliant offense constantly met with boosters, sent them paperwork on what they could and couldn't do, had them watch videos, etc. Were extremely strict.

Randy knew what kind of scum bag this guy was, and told all his players to stay away from him. If any of the coaches interacted with him they'd be fired on the spot. He berated them about what they could and couldn't do. He had people that would let him know where players were and what they were doing.

A few years ago Miami had Shapiro investigated, including hiring a private investigator, which turned up nothing. After the Director of Compliance David Reed had an altercation with Shapiro he warned people about him.

The owner of the bowling alley that Shapiro said he paid players at said he never recalls seeing Shapiro with the athletes or even talking about it (which shocked him because he bragged about EVERYTHING). Here is the interview.

And a bunch of other stuff showing Shapiro is full of ****. Dates with Dequan Jones don't match up at all. Said Shapiro paid him 9 months after he signed with Miami.

JoeJoeBrown · 08-25-2011, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by draftguru151

Also haven't posted any of the stuff I've read recently cause I've been kind of sick of it, but here are some random tidbits.

A group (5 or 6) of boosters was interviewed, all saying how strict UM was the past few years (during Shannon/Hocutt). One couldn't bring his daughter to a game in the Hocutt's box because she was in high school and it might be a violation. One guy couldn't say hi to players when he traveled on the team plane. Another couldn't give his sponsored player (Booster pays for an athlete's scholarship) a gift when the player had a baby. UMs compliant offense constantly met with boosters, sent them paperwork on what they could and couldn't do, had them watch videos, etc. Were extremely strict.

Randy knew what kind of scum bag this guy was, and told all his players to stay away from him. If any of the coaches interacted with him they'd be fired on the spot. He berated them about what they could and couldn't do. He had people that would let him know where players were and what they were doing.

A few years ago Miami had Shapiro investigated, including hiring a private investigator, which turned up nothing. After the Director of Compliance David Reed had an altercation with Shapiro he warned people about him.

The owner of the bowling alley that Shapiro said he paid players at said he never recalls seeing Shapiro with the athletes or even talking about it (which shocked him because he bragged about EVERYTHING). Here is the interview.

And a bunch of other stuff showing Shapiro is full of ****. Dates with Dequan Jones don't match up at all. Said Shapiro paid him 9 months after he signed with Miami.

Yep, totally squeaky clean.

YAYareaRB · 08-25-2011, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeJoeBrown

Yep, totally squeaky clean.

lol well to his merit, it seemed like randy shannon TRIED to run a clean ship. but like i said, if someone came around flashing cash and nice cars, i wouldn't think twice but to take it

JoeJoeBrown · 08-26-2011, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YAYareaRB

lol well to his merit, it seemed like randy shannon TRIED to run a clean ship. but like i said, if someone came around flashing cash and nice cars, i wouldn't think twice but to take it

Yeah, kids that are getting offerred stuff are going to be very hard pressed to turn down the stuff. Especially the poor ones.

What a dumb system.

And I agree, it does seem like Randy was on the up and up. Being a former player, he would know what a corrupt booster with illegal handouts would look like.

But I'm sorry, Robinson has way too much damning data (supported) for these word of mouth denials to have much effect on anyone.

FUNBUNCHER · 08-26-2011, 11:20 AM

What really hurts the 'Canes football program IMO is that Shapiro donated hundreds of thousands of dollars to the school and for the most part they took it no questions asked.

You can't say you had this creep at arm's length and told every relevant party not to associate with him, yet he's still one of the school's biggest donors.

Something doesn't match up.

This case will make or break on receipts of expenditures SHapiro claims he spent on players. If there is a confirmed electronic paper trail, UM is in deep doo doo.

Think about it, how could the football program preemptively suspend players without being told to do so by the NCAA, unless there was some dirt already on those guys??

JoeJoeBrown · 08-26-2011, 11:28 AM

I also like how the story is now pretty quiet on the national media outlets. Probably because no one outside of Miami's tiny fan base gives a crap and expects this of Da U.

The small fan base is one of the reasons that I think the NCAA can come down really hard Miami.

draftguru151 · 08-26-2011, 07:58 PM

Vaughn Telemaque is cleared.

The Great Jonathan Vilma · 08-27-2011, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by draftguru151

Vaughn Telemaque is cleared.

great news. Thanks for the update.

Appreciate it if you provide any further updates as we move forward.

draftguru151 · 08-30-2011, 05:16 PM