Official 2012 Draft Discussion Thread

[kBuc5]

I don't think you can go wrong with Blackmon or Claiborne. Hesitant to spend a high number one on a RB, but I wouldn't mind Richardson if Blackmon or Claiborne are gone. Blount/Richardson would be a crazy good duo to have.

One of our biggest priorties has got to be to find a replacement for Sean Jones, if we don't get one in FA how do you guys rank them and if you were to guess what round do you see us picking one?

[ChiFan24]

Anyone want to give me a quick rundown of which young players are good and which ones aren't? I know less about the Bucs than pretty much any other team - how's Rejus/McCoy/Price/Bowers/Claiborne/Foster been?

[bucfan12]

Originally Posted by ChiFan24

Anyone want to give me a quick rundown of which young players are good and which ones aren't? I know less about the Bucs than pretty much any other team - how's Rejus/McCoy/Price/Bowers/Claiborne/Foster been?

Honestly, guys we can build around:

Offense:
- QB Josh Freeman. Had an elite 2010 and regressed in 2011. A lot of it was coaching scheme, offensive predictablitly, and WRs lack of getting open. However, he also had made terrible reads and stared down Winslow a bit too much.

- Davin Joseph G: He's a pro bowler who shined and is still young.

- LT Donald Penn: Still a top 10 LT in this league.

- WR Mike Williams: He had a down year but I think with more speed on the offense, he can be a productive WR again.


Defense:
- Clayborn DE: Beast.
- Gerald MCCoy DT: there's a reason he was a top 3 pick. Once he went down with an injury early, the run defense, who gave up 75 yds per game, went to the crapper. Needs to stay healthy. If so, we have an anchor on d-line.
- Brian Price DT: When McCoy was on the field, these two formed one heck of a duo.
- Dequan Bowers DE: Played very well in his limited time. Saw more action towards the end of the year. Knee really didn't seem to be a problem.
- MLB Mason Foster: Like his aggressiveness and instincts. Really had too much responsibility being the MIKE with no offseason. Lacked help at both OLBs. Might fit better at WLB.
-FS Tanard Jackson: played well for being out of football for 59 weeks. But I think the lack of football shape hurt him as the year progressed. He'll get back to form. Too much talent.

Overall, there is talent. They are just inexperienced and did not have the right staff in place to develop this team. When you're the youngest team in the NFL being coached by an inexperienced staff, that's probably the perfect formula for failure.

[Caddy]

On the not of the post above, I really want to see more of Bowers. When he got playing time he looked pretty awesome. Whether it was chasing down RB's, knocking down passes or just not getting bullied around he showed a lot of promise. I hope he switches roles with Bennett next season.

[Bucs147]

Originally Posted by kBuc5

One of our biggest priorties has got to be to find a replacement for Sean Jones, if we don't get one in FA how do you guys rank them and if you were to guess what round do you see us picking one?

Once Cody Grimm gets healthy, he gets that job. He's better suited for the SS job anyway.

[kBuc5]

Originally Posted by Bucs147

Once Cody Grimm gets healthy, he gets that job. He's better suited for the SS job anyway.

Grimm is a heady player, he is coming off back to back injuries - leg and knee, and he is not the most gifted athlete to begin with. At this point I pray that we are not counting on him to replace Jones.
Outside of Mark Barron from Alabama I'm not sure of where the Safties rank coming out this year. Anyone scouting the 2012 Safties?

[Bucs147]

Originally Posted by kBuc5

Grimm is a heady player, he is coming off back to back injuries - leg and knee, and he is not the most gifted athlete to begin with. At this point I pray that we are not counting on him to replace Jones.
Outside of Mark Barron from Alabama I'm not sure of where the Safties rank coming out this year. Anyone scouting the 2012 Safties?

I feel we have too many needs to spend a high pick on Safety. We'll have to roll the dice with Tanard and Grimm being backed by Asante and Black (and probrably a FA).

[brasho]

Originally Posted by bigbuc

If we pick 4th or 5th and Luck, Kaill and Claiborne go 1,2,3 what do we do?

I say draft Trent Richardson. Always take the BPA

Get a RB? Welcome to today's NFL... good RBs can be had in rounds 2 and 3. You don't take BPA if that BPA is a RB in the top half of round 1 or if that BPA is an OG anywhere in round 1.

[bigbuc]

Originally Posted by brasho

Get a RB? Welcome to today's NFL... good RBs can be had in rounds 2 and 3. You don't take BPA if that BPA is a RB in the top half of round 1 or if that BPA is an OG anywhere in round 1.

I posted this later " I want Trent Richardson. We did this years ago... We had Caddy and passed on AP for Adams.

Basketball team the Blazers once passed on Jordan for Bowie, years later had another shot at it and passed on Durant for Oden.

Lets not be the Blazers of the NFL. "


If he's anything close to AP or LT I'll take him at 5 and sleep well at night

[bigbuc]

What do you guys think about a DT in the second round? I know we've put a lot of picks in the D line the last two drafts, but we needed too. We had the worst D line in football. But with McCoy and Price being hurt and Miller/Okam not getting it done it leaves us very thin at DT.

And like the NY Gmen show you can never have too many D line in the NFL.

[brasho]

Originally Posted by bigbuc

I posted this later " I want Trent Richardson. We did this years ago... We had Caddy and passed on AP for Adams.

Basketball team the Blazers once passed on Jordan for Bowie, years later had another shot at it and passed on Durant for Oden.

Lets not be the Blazers of the NFL. "


If he's anything close to AP or LT I'll take him at 5 and sleep well at night

Richardson is no AP. I agree on passing on AP from that year, I wanted Patrick Willis. AP was elite and should have been top 10, but he was injury prone in college and had red flags because of it.

[brasho]

Originally Posted by bigbuc

What do you guys think about a DT in the second round? I know we've put a lot of picks in the D line the last two drafts, but we needed too. We had the worst D line in football. But with McCoy and Price being hurt and Miller/Okam not getting it done it leaves us very thin at DT.

And like the NY Gmen show you can never have too many D line in the NFL.

Definitely not in the 2nd round. We have glaring needs at WR, RB, LB, and DB. There were 4 players on Alabama's D that would be a serious upgrade over what we have now (CB, the two LBs, and S). We need another DT for depth, but we can address that in free agency (Jason Jones anybody?) or later in the draft (Mike Daniels).

[brasho]

Honestly, I would be a fan of us moving down in the draft and acquiring more picks. If we dropped into the lower half of round 1 we could take Kuechly or another beast LB or speedy WR like Wright and acquire more picks to address our numerous needs.

There are a lot of 2nd and 3rd round guys that could help us immediately (RB Doug Martin, David Wilson, etc) (speedy WRs galore)

[bigbuc]

Could we go CB/CB back to back like the last two years? I think Talib is a goner and Barber is going to be 36.

[brasho]

I don't think the talent at CB is nearly as bare as it was with DT and DE the past two years. Besides that, we have soooo many other glaring needs and the CBs we currently have could be more than serviceable for another year if the other positions are addressed.

[brasho]

It is imperative the team gets a WR that can stretchthe field and escape man coverage, a 3rd down RB, a safety that can make the routine plays, one, possibly two LBs, and depth at DT. All of these may be seen as or more important than CB. A lot depends on what really happens with Talib, Barber, and what the team thinks of Lewis and Gaitor. Biggers is an average CB right now and that's better than many of our players.

[bucfan12]

Originally Posted by brasho

It is imperative the team gets a WR that can stretchthe field and escape man coverage, a 3rd down RB, a safety that can make the routine plays, one, possibly two LBs, and depth at DT. All of these may be seen as or more important than CB. A lot depends on what really happens with Talib, Barber, and what the team thinks of Lewis and Gaitor. Biggers is an average CB right now and that's better than many of our players.

So average means getting beat 99.9% of the time and pretty much almost every QB in the league picked on him and succeeded?

Biggers is terrible.

[bucfan12]

Originally Posted by brasho

I don't think the talent at CB is nearly as bare as it was with DT and DE the past two years. Besides that, we have soooo many other glaring needs and the CBs we currently have could be more than serviceable for another year if the other positions are addressed.

Honestly, I don't think our needs are that bad. We need help at OLB/MLB , depending on if we want to move Mason Foster.

CB is definately a top need, and probably need 2 starters, depending on Talib.

We do need a WR to stretch the field as well, but we can hit that in Free Agency (Pierre Garcon, Robert Meachum.)

My guess:

FA: Address LB, CB, WR, and OG.

Players available:
-WR: RObert Meachum or Pierre Garcon
-CB: Brandon Carr
-LB: Dqwell Jackson
-OG: Chilo Rachell

Draft:
1st: Morris Claiborne CB LSU
2nd: Chris Polk RB Washington
3rd: Nate Potter T Boise State
5th: Jarius Wright WR Arkansas
6th: Lance Kendricks OLB California
7th: GPA/Depth.

I know we need a SS as well, but the FA pool and Draft is weak, so I think it's smart not to reach. We can't fill every need successfully, but Cody Grimm would be an average solution and upgrade over Sean Jones.

[bigbuc]

Originally Posted by brasho

It is imperative the team gets a WR that can stretchthe field and escape man coverage, a 3rd down RB, a safety that can make the routine plays, one, possibly two LBs, and depth at DT. All of these may be seen as or more important than CB. A lot depends on what really happens with Talib, Barber, and what the team thinks of Lewis and Gaitor. Biggers is an average CB right now and that's better than many of our players.

If Talib gets let go ( which I think will happen ) or goes to jail ( which I think will happen ) we are left with Barber, Biggers and Lewis as our top three CB's. That to me is the worst unit in the NFL if you ask me.

Barber is great, but can not run man to man with very many WR's anymore. Biggers who I liked before this season gets dragged into the end zone more than I've seen any other player and if he's not getting dragged he's getting burnt for over 100 yards by a WR. Lewis as of right now is a bust as a 3rd round pick.

[dannyz]

What if you guys Drafted Morris Claiborne and then took a CB in FA while also moving Barber to SS? Fill two needs, Younger better CB's and Barber would be alot better playing the middle of the Field and getting big hits and picks.

[bucfan12]

Here
's a quick mock off-season:

Resignings:
- DE Michael Bennett
- OG/OC Jeremy Zuttah
- K Connor Barth
- QB Rudy Carpenter
- CB Elbert Mack
- RB Lagarette Blount (RFA)
- OLB Geno Hayes Back up
- QB Josh Johnson

Let Walk:
- DT Roy Miller
- WR Michael Spurlock
- RB/FB Ernest Graham
- RB Kregg Lumpkin
- SS Sean Jones
- FS/SS Corey Lynch
- WR Preston Parker

Possible trade bait/cap casulties:
- WR Arrellious Benn
- TE Kellen Winslow (probably not, depending on the coach)


Cut:
- C Jeff Faine
- CB Myron Lewis or EJ Biggers (Who ever sucks the least)

Trade:

Retired:
- CB Ronde Barber

Questionable:
- CB Aqib Talib (suspension pending)



FA Signings (Realistic):

- MLB Deqwell Jackson: Need help at LB and bringing in Jackson would allow us to move Foster to WLB. Plus, Jackson is also a Tampa native.
- CB Brandon Carr: Solid number 2 guy
- WR Robert Meachum: Get us that deep threat.
- OG Chilo Rachel: Solid player that can fill in at LG.
- Rest: Depth at DLINE and LB
DRAFT:

1st Round: Justin Blackmon WR Oklahoma State: True number 1 WR and give Freeman the weapon he needs. I wasn’t a fan at first, but he can dominate with Mike Williams opposite and a speedster in the slot.

2nd Round: Chris Polk RB Washington: Very underrated back that should be here early in round 2. Overall best compliment to Blount. Matt Forte 2.0.

3rd Round: Leonard Johnson CB Iowa State: Tough physical CB who really is underrated. His performance against Blackmon really caught my eye.

5th Round: Jarius Wright WR Arkansas : Deep threat that can develop as a KR/PR immediately and groom to be our #3 guy.

6th Round: Christian Thompson SS South Carolina State: Small school prospect with great physical tools. Has what it takes to develop into a solid SS in this league.

7th Round: Josh Ogelsby T Wisconsin Depth along the oline.



If Talib comes back, our secondary could be a lot better. CB depth of Carr/Talib/Johnson/Mack/Gaitor/BIGGErs or Lewis would be solid, in my opinion, with better coaching.

[brasho]

Originally Posted by bucfan12

So average means getting beat 99.9% of the time and pretty much almost every QB in the league picked on him and succeeded?

Biggers is terrible.

Ok, see the first Atlanta game. Biggers did a great job on his receivers. We played man to man most of the time and when Ryan threw his way his QB rating was under 70. Biggers is not a bad player at all. Considering the assignments he got on a weekly basis and the lack of pass rush or decent safety play, Biggers is at least average. His tackling is not great, but he is entering his 3rd year and if he sticks around could really blossom.

Myron Lewis can't stay healthy... people want to point out that when he was healthy he couldn't cover Calvin Johnson... right, that's an easy task for a rookie, few CBs in the history of the NFL can cover Calvin Johnson.

[brasho]

Originally Posted by bucfan12

Here
's a quick mock off-season:

Resignings:
- DE Michael Bennett
- OG/OC Jeremy Zuttah
- K Connor Barth
- QB Rudy Carpenter
- CB Elbert Mack
- RB Lagarette Blount (RFA)
- OLB Geno Hayes Back up
- QB Josh Johnson

Let Walk:
- DT Roy Miller
- WR Michael Spurlock
- RB/FB Ernest Graham
- RB Kregg Lumpkin
- SS Sean Jones
- FS/SS Corey Lynch
- WR Preston Parker

Possible trade bait/cap casulties:
- WR Arrellious Benn
- TE Kellen Winslow (probably not, depending on the coach)


Cut:
- C Jeff Faine
- CB Myron Lewis or EJ Biggers (Who ever sucks the least)

Trade:

Retired:
- CB Ronde Barber

Questionable:
- CB Aqib Talib (suspension pending)



FA Signings (Realistic):

- MLB Deqwell Jackson: Need help at LB and bringing in Jackson would allow us to move Foster to WLB. Plus, Jackson is also a Tampa native.
- CB Brandon Carr: Solid number 2 guy
- WR Robert Meachum: Get us that deep threat.
- OG Chilo Rachel: Solid player that can fill in at LG.
- Rest: Depth at DLINE and LB
DRAFT:

1st Round: Justin Blackmon WR Oklahoma State: True number 1 WR and give Freeman the weapon he needs. I wasn’t a fan at first, but he can dominate with Mike Williams opposite and a speedster in the slot.

2nd Round: Chris Polk RB Washington: Very underrated back that should be here early in round 2. Overall best compliment to Blount. Matt Forte 2.0.

3rd Round: Leonard Johnson CB Iowa State: Tough physical CB who really is underrated. His performance against Blackmon really caught my eye.

5th Round: Jarius Wright WR Arkansas : Deep threat that can develop as a KR/PR immediately and groom to be our #3 guy.

6th Round: Christian Thompson SS South Carolina State: Small school prospect with great physical tools. Has what it takes to develop into a solid SS in this league.

7th Round: Josh Ogelsby T Wisconsin Depth along the oline.



If Talib comes back, our secondary could be a lot better. CB depth of Carr/Talib/Johnson/Mack/Gaitor/BIGGErs or Lewis would be solid, in my opinion, with better coaching.

Bennett is a restricted free agent so he's almost a lock to come back. Roy Miller and Parker are restricted too, so they at least make it as camp bodies. I'm not sure what your fascination with moving Foster to WIll is... he doesn't run very well and moving a guy to Will where being able to run is extremely important, doesn't make sense.

[bucfan12]

Originally Posted by brasho

Ok, see the first Atlanta game. Biggers did a great job on his receivers. We played man to man most of the time and when Ryan threw his way his QB rating was under 70. Biggers is not a bad player at all. Considering the assignments he got on a weekly basis and the lack of pass rush or decent safety play, Biggers is at least average. His tackling is not great, but he is entering his 3rd year and if he sticks around could really blossom.

Myron Lewis can't stay healthy... people want to point out that when he was healthy he couldn't cover Calvin Johnson... right, that's an easy task for a rookie, few CBs in the history of the NFL can cover Calvin Johnson.

The first Atlanta Game: Both Julio Jones and Roddy White went for over 100 yards each.

Ryan's rating was due to the fact of the D-Line (McCoy, Price, Clayborn} constantly harrassing him into poor decisions.

[Caddy]

The problem with Biggers is that he just is not good enough to cover a #1 receiver, or a #2 on a team with a great second receiver. He is a nickel back at best unfortunately.