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Old 02-26-2012, 09:34 PM    (permalink
J-Mike88
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Clues?
Am I the only one that knows MOST of what we hear from GMs and scouts at this time of the year is BS?

This is called "The Lying Season" for a reason.
80% of what we hear from these guys this time of year is false, or twisted in some way.

Why would a GM hint at what they desire to do?
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Old 02-26-2012, 10:02 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-Mike88 View Post
Clues?
Am I the only one that knows MOST of what we hear from GMs and scouts at this time of the year is BS?

This is called "The Lying Season" for a reason.
80% of what we hear from these guys this time of year is false, or twisted in some way.

Why would a GM hint at what they desire to do?
Schneider's quotes leave a lot of room for interpretation including the possibility that he could be after RG3 and/or Flynn. I chose to interpret them one way, others may think they mean something else. I do think my interpretation is in alignment with the way the team has been run since Carroll arrived though...which doesn't make me right either.
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Old 02-26-2012, 10:32 PM    (permalink
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You can't believe anything you hear in February or March.
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Old 02-26-2012, 10:55 PM    (permalink
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i remember this time in 2006 Matt Leinart was a stone cold LOCK to go #2 overall to New Orleans.
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Old 02-26-2012, 11:10 PM    (permalink
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Skins will pull this trade off, unless Cleveland offers both 1st rounds this year. All depends on how far the Rams want to trade down. I think they want to make sure they get Blackmon.
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Old 02-26-2012, 11:26 PM    (permalink
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Two firsts a 2nd a third and another 2nd > two firsts, pretty sure the Rams aren't idiots.
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Old 02-27-2012, 12:04 AM    (permalink
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I wonder if this gets done before FA starts ?
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Old 02-27-2012, 09:16 AM    (permalink
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Do you have any type of link?
The source of this was Howard Eskin of WIP radio in Philadelphia on Sunday. (citing Redskins sources).
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:36 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fear the elf View Post
Meh, I disagree with your evaluation of Colt. I'm not saying he's a franchise guy or anything, just that he's not as bad as you make him out to be.

Also, I think we are polar opposites in our preference of draft prospects. I do not like your "draft."
If I was a Browns fan.. that draft definitely isn't the "sexy" type of draft that is going to get fans super excited, but it's realistic, and would fill big needs.

Richardson is going to be the best player there at #4. Now they could go in a different direction, but I don't see a OT or a WR there that will be worth the pick. And the D prospects there all have question marks with the exception of Claiborne. So if they don't move back I think Trent is the guy.

Glenn is a heck of a fooball player, who showed great athleticism for his size. He can play all across the OL, and profiles well as a RT in the pros. Pashos was awful last year when he played.

I'm not a huge fan of Tannehill or Osweiler, but I just don't see how the Browns can go into this season without some competition at the QB position. Obviously if they sign a FA this would change, but there's no way of knowing that.
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:47 AM    (permalink
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There are three approaches if the Browns want a starting QB out of this draft.
1) Take Tannehill at #4
2) Take Weeden at #36, if available
3) Trade up to the late 1st round to be certain of Weeden.

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Old 02-27-2012, 04:07 PM    (permalink
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I'm sure it's been noted (too lazy to check), but the Browns can match a Redskins 1/2/3 package this year and a 1/2 next year (although the rumors I thought were being bandied around were more 1/2/3 this year and 1 + players) without giving up as much picks, as it pertains to generic perceptions on value (I still think people take the trade value chart too strictly, teams have always adjusted things, either on paper or in their minds, to rationalize deals) due to their 2nd first.

That said, if the price gets way too high, I think the best move is to go after a vet QB (if they don't believe in McCoy enough), and draft someone in the 2nd round. They are a step behind the Redskins in the rebuilding process, in terms of talent, so it might be more beneficial to keep the picks around.

Of course, if you truly believe in the QB to be elite, the cost would definitely be worth it.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:10 PM    (permalink
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good article in philly.com that said the Eagles might be the secret team in the RG3 sweepstakes

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/...140518133.html

makes sense on alot of levels.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:14 PM    (permalink
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That's the rumors on 97.5 in Philly when I passed by Philly the other day (although Schwartzman? made it sound like more of a fan rumor than a legitimate rumor). Not sure I buy it, though. They'd have to offer 2 arms and more to make that deal, and they would definitely need to send young talent. Just not sure they have the fuel to make the trade.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:15 PM    (permalink
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They just gave Michael Vick a $100m contract, so now they're going to trade up to #2 with less firepower than other teams to draft another QB when they have needs all over their team?

It doesn't make as much sense to me as it does to you.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:19 PM    (permalink
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well, I think they can get out of the Vick deal in a year. Too lazy to check right now, but someone can rotoworld that.

Bigger issue is still the lack of chips to legitimately make this move. The Rams are likely going to want a guy they view as an impact player out of this draft, so to get them budge so far down would mean a package that's just insane. I mean, we're talking about a Ricky Williams type deal and more, probably. Just don't see it (unless they, say, offer McCoy up in some fashion).
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:20 PM    (permalink
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I don't disagree, but at what point are you cutting off your nose to spite your face? A rookie QB is going to need pieces around him to succeed, and giving up a player like McCoy would be a big mistake. He'd be such a huge asset to a rookie in that situation.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:25 PM    (permalink
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well ... the cynical argument would be that Andy Reid wastes RB's anyways ...

That said, I think this is more wishful thinking by some Philly fans. I'm mildly surprised the Redskins seem all-in on Griffin III (although it's interesting to note that Shanahan is a fairly tight-lipped/tight ship guy when it comes to the draft, and the one QB name you don't hear associated with them as much is Tannehill ... ), and I think Cleveland giving a slightly decreased package may be more appealing to the Rams than some sort of mega-package from the Eagles (when comparing generic values) due to the Browns draft positioning. Beyond the, there's just too many teams with QB needs before Philly. If RG3 somehow fell (I doubt it), I think even Buffalo would investigate.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:33 PM    (permalink
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reasons why the eagles makes no sense for Griffin:

-they just handed out all these contracts to players in their prime (Babin, Nnamdi, DRC, Jenkins, etc.) because they CLEARLY are trying to make a super bowl run and win NOW.

-Andy Reid is the guy who picks the players...and he is on the hotseat after last year's colossal disappointment.....you really think he's gonna bring in a rookie QB when he has to win this year?

-Michael Vick, the $100M man......who btw is just a year removed from an amazing, MVP worthy season.

-the team picks 15th.........they would have to give up Ricky Williams type compensation to outbid the other contenders for RG3.

this is just stupid wishful thinking by some in the Philadelphia media.





I can see Buffalo, Arizona, Kansas City.....even Denver being the "mystery teams" but not Philly.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:39 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyboy View Post
if you guys move back a bit and come out with something like:
Decastro
Floyd
and Miller/Martin

that's a damn good haul, with a few extra picks scattered in there
This is what I'm thinking. If you're the Browns and that's the package you're having to compete with trying to trade for the pick, the value you're giving up seems to be greater than the difference between Colt McCoyand Robert Griffin. Griffin's waaaaaay sexier, but McCoy's a young QB still. He had a sophomore slump with Peyton Hillis failing to come close to replicating his success from the year before. This will be his make-or-break year. And remember, this is Mike Holmgren's project; he's got a good record of bringing in talent. If the Browns don't make a move for Griffin, they could still end up with something like Claiborne or a stud lineman, Malcolm Floyd and then another running back like you said, LaMar Miller or Doug Martin (...Turbin?) to compete with and/or spell Peyton Hillis. Then if Colt McCoy can't get it done with Greg Little and Malcolm Floyd on the outside and a couple of legit runners in the backfield (And who knows how good Montario Hardesty would be if he could stay healthy), THEN you go and draft a Matt Barkley or somebody, and your offense is already stacked and ready to go. Not to mention the possible Claiborne/Haden secondary you mentioned. Or maybe they even take Kuechly or something.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:54 PM    (permalink
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This is what I'm thinking. If you're the Browns and that's the package you're having to compete with trying to trade for the pick, the value you're giving up seems to be greater than the difference between Colt McCoyand Robert Griffin. Griffin's waaaaaay sexier, but McCoy's a young QB still. He had a sophomore slump with Peyton Hillis failing to come close to replicating his success from the year before. This will be his make-or-break year. And remember, this is Mike Holmgren's project; he's got a good record of bringing in talent. If the Browns don't make a move for Griffin, they could still end up with something like Claiborne or a stud lineman, Malcolm Floyd and then another running back like you said, LaMar Miller or Doug Martin (...Turbin?) to compete with and/or spell Peyton Hillis. Then if Colt McCoy can't get it done with Greg Little and Malcolm Floyd on the outside and a couple of legit runners in the backfield (And who knows how good Montario Hardesty would be if he could stay healthy), THEN you go and draft a Matt Barkley or somebody, and your offense is already stacked and ready to go. Not to mention the possible Claiborne/Haden secondary you mentioned. Or maybe they even take Kuechly or something.
There is just one problem with this argument.

Colt McCoy is beyond terrible and needs upgraded immediately.

(And it's Michael Floyd)
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Old 02-27-2012, 05:14 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by keylime_5 View Post
-the team picks 15th.........they would have to give up Ricky Williams type compensation to outbid the other contenders for RG3.

that assumes that all the Redskins mortgaging everything stories are real. I don't know if I believe Bruce Allen will bless Snyder trading away everything. Eagles have 2 second round picks, those plus the 1st rounder is a decent starting bid. maybe they throw in a defender like Trent Cole.

One reason I like this rumor is cause let's be real the Eagles aren't drafting an inside linebacker in rd1. it's just not gonna happen. Why? Cause they are the Eagles.
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Old 02-27-2012, 05:23 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by DeepThreat View Post
There is just one problem with this argument.

Colt McCoy is beyond terrible and needs upgraded immediately.

(And it's Michael Floyd)
He sure wasn't good last year, but Cleveland had problems throughout its offense. The running game fell apart and defenses didn't have to take it seriously, and his no. 1 wideout was a rookie, and a raw one at that. And you're talking about a second-year QB who doesn't have outstanding physical traits, but can make things happen with talent around him. I won't write off Colt yet, because I think he can have success in a team that's efficient and executes well. Kind of to the NFL what Kellen Moore was to college football. But I'll readily concede that if last year was what you're basing your opinion of Colt McCoy on, there's not a lot to be excited about.
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Old 02-27-2012, 05:28 PM    (permalink
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Robert Griffin would look too good in a Browns uniform to go to the Redskins!

GRIFFIN TO CLEVELAND!!!
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Old 02-27-2012, 05:53 PM    (permalink
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The Browns are in the driver's seat no matter what Washington, Miami or Seattle do. With the 4th pick, St. Louis can still get Blackmon after Minny takes Kalil. if they trade further back, Blackmon will likely be taken by Cleveland and St. Louis will be left empty handed.
If Cleveland wants to pay the price, there is no way Washington can outbid them.
I fully expect RG111 to be wearing a Cleveland uniform next season.
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Old 02-27-2012, 05:58 PM    (permalink
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You are a little more optomistic than me (which might be a first, haha), because I think the combination of Shannahan and Snyder is going to result in some crazy compensation that Holmgren/Heckert won't match. Blackmon might run a bad time and could drop down draft boards - but hoping that Blackmon lights it up is good for the Browns in any case, whether it be to make St.Louis fall in love with him or in the event that the Browns take him.
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