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Old 03-27-2012, 02:50 PM    (permalink
PoopSandwich
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Trent ******* Dilfer.
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Old 03-27-2012, 03:09 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Razor View Post
I don't want to be a complete homer, but the 2007 (or 2004) Patriots need to be at least in the conversation. Also, unless I've been told wrong the '86 Bears were even better than the '85 Bears. They just didn't win the Super Bowl.
They were, but the well-balanced 98' Broncos beat them.
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Old 03-27-2012, 03:52 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Brent View Post
How is it the '84 Niners and not '89?
Why is this surprising to you? The 1984 49ers beat the 1989 49ers head on in the voting. The 1984 49ers only lost one game that year and pretty much dominated most of the their opponents. I'm not sure what the 1989 team had over the 1984 team being head and shoulders better. The run game was better on that 1984 team with Tyler...and the entire defensive secondary made the Pro Bowl. I don't think that has happened in the NFL since. Montana was also a lot younger and had more mobility. Guys like Jerry Rice, John Taylor, and Brent Jones were certainly more flashy for 89', but the 1984 team was just as dominant on offense.
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Old 03-27-2012, 04:10 PM    (permalink
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I can see why the Ravens did well, even though I don't think they deserves it.

The casual fan, especially younger ones, have a somewhat glorified view of that defense was. They were one of the best of all time, but not far and away better than every other defense.

People, including himself, joke about Dilfer being a SB winning QB, but some people forgot how historically awful that offense was. They had a decent running game, but I think it took at least half of the season for a TD throw to a receiver. I just think there are teams with comparable defenses whose offenses were much much better than the Ravens.

Not hugely knowledgeable, but I see these teams as the frontrunners:
Early Packers
One of the 70's Steelers teams
85 Bears
Late 80's early 90's Cowboys and 49ers teams
Homer pick - 2003 or 2004 Pat teams.
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Old 03-27-2012, 05:22 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Ness View Post
Why is this surprising to you? The 1984 49ers beat the 1989 49ers head on in the voting. The 1984 49ers only lost one game that year and pretty much dominated most of the their opponents. I'm not sure what the 1989 team had over the 1984 team being head and shoulders better. The run game was better on that 1984 team with Tyler...and the entire defensive secondary made the Pro Bowl. I don't think that has happened in the NFL since. Montana was also a lot younger and had more mobility. Guys like Jerry Rice, John Taylor, and Brent Jones were certainly more flashy for 89', but the 1984 team was just as dominant on offense.
That '89 team dominated the playoffs like no other, though. They finished 17-2 with both losses by a combined 5 pts.

The playoffs that seasons...

Defeated Vikings 41-13
Defeated Rams 30-3
Defeated Broncos 55-10.
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Old 03-27-2012, 05:27 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by phlysac View Post
That '89 team dominated the playoffs like no other, though. They finished 17-2 with both losses by a combined 5 pts.

The playoffs that seasons...

Defeated Vikings 41-13
Defeated Rams 30-3
Defeated Broncos 55-10.
Not by any means attempting to compare, but this post just reminded me of the dominance that was the '85 Bears playoff run:

21-0 over the New York football Giants
24-0 over Los Angeles Rams
46-10 over the New England Patriots

No points allowed until the Super Bowl, then the first TD allowed after up 44-3 early in the 4th quarter. That is what we call raping.

The '85 Bears were really an all universe defense that did anything they want, and Walter Payton. The offensive gameplan was basically give the ball to Walter, or otherwise don't **** up. Sooooo good.
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Old 03-27-2012, 05:42 PM    (permalink
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Even if I was a much older person I'd still say it's the 2007 Pats. They fckin HUMILIATED their opponents, especially once people decided to call them cheaters.

Lawlz @ them for not closing the deal. It wouldn't even be a contest if they won the Super Bowl. That offense could give any D at any point in league history fits, especially if given today's refs.
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:14 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by phlysac View Post
That '89 team dominated the playoffs like no other, though. They finished 17-2 with both losses by a combined 5 pts.

The playoffs that seasons...

Defeated Vikings 41-13
Defeated Rams 30-3
Defeated Broncos 55-10.
Right, but I'd say the 49ers faced tougher opponents in the 1984 playoffs. Both the Giants and Bears in the middle of the decade and Dan Marino's greatest season as a pro.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:16 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Ness View Post
Right, but I'd say the 49ers faced tougher opponents in the 1984 playoffs. Both the Giants and Bears in the middle of the decade and Dan Marino's greatest season as a pro.
Fair enough, it's pretty much a toss up.
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:21 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by iowatreat54 View Post
Not by any means attempting to compare, but this post just reminded me of the dominance that was the '85 Bears playoff run:

21-0 over the New York football Giants
24-0 over Los Angeles Rams
46-10 over the New England Patriots

No points allowed until the Super Bowl, then the first TD allowed after up 44-3 early in the 4th quarter. That is what we call raping.

The '85 Bears were really an all universe defense that did anything they want, and Walter Payton. The offensive gameplan was basically give the ball to Walter, or otherwise don't **** up. Sooooo good.
Agree. '85 Bears are in the game, in my opinion. I'm just stuck whether I'd want the '84 or '89 49ers to face them.
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:23 PM    (permalink
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Agree. '85 Bears are in the game, in my opinion. I'm just stuck whether I'd want the '84 or '89 49ers to face them.
The 1984 49ers could have easily had a perfect season if not for a bogus call on Eric Wright in the endzone over John Stallworth by a line judge, according to Dwight Hicks. Plus, Montana pre-back surgery? I think the choice is easy for me.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:37 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
The 86 Bears were better than the 85 Bears but they blew it vs Washington in the playoffs. They also had some issues at qb that year.

They would have lost to the 86 Giants that year anyway though. That 86 Giant team was more stable at qb and had just as dominant of a defense. LT had something like 22.5 sacks that year or something.

And Parcells had his own version of the 46 that he used as a subpackage, a 3-5-3 defense used the same concepts as the 46.
Similar with the 70s Steelers. The 76 squad was the best one, but were so crippled by injuries come playoff time that Oakland finally got past them.

The Steelers defenses of the 1970s are legendary, but the 1976 unit was the best (slightly better than the '75 squad). Here's why: 28. That's how many points the Steel Curtain surrendered in the last nine games of the season. That's a total. As a result, Pittsburgh, which started the season 1-4, made it all the way to the AFC Championship Game, which they lost to the Raiders 24-7. (It's worth noting that Pittsburgh running backs Franco Harris and Rocky Bleier were both injured in that contest.)

The '76 Steelers didn't have it easy -- their opponents had a .528 winning percentage.


http://espn.go.com/page2/s/list/bestNFLdefense.html

They also had 5 shutouts over the course of the season.

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Old 03-27-2012, 10:55 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Shane P. Hallam View Post
I feel like about 10-12 years ago, ESPN or someone did something like this where they took the tape of games and put other teams into it and had the greatest teams of all-time match-up. IIRC, the end was one of the Steeler teams against one of the 49er teams. I wish I could find links to that again.
Green Bay under Lombardi should be there and it should be against the Steelers or 49's. Nobody else belongs in the conversation but of course, NFL Network has become nothing more than a shill for promoting the NFL without any regard for the truth.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:46 PM    (permalink
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The 1984 49ers could have easily had a perfect season if not for a bogus call on Eric Wright in the endzone over John Stallworth by a line judge, according to Dwight Hicks. Plus, Montana pre-back surgery? I think the choice is easy for me.
And Wersching missed a FG to tie it. I watched both teams, and I can't put my finger on it, but that '89 team just seemed dominant. Could also be that I was still really young in '84.

That and adding arguably the greatest player of all-time, can't be minimized.


Side-by-Side

QB - Joe Montana | Joe Montana
RB - Wendell Tyler | Roger Craig
FB - Roger Craig | Tom Rathman
WR - Dwight Clark | Jerry Rice
WR - Freddie Solomon | John Taylor
TE - Earl Cooper | Brent Jones
LT - Bubba Paris | Bubba Paris
LG - John Ayers | Guy McIntyre
C - Fred Quillan | Jesse Sapolu
RG - Randy Cross | Bruce Collie
RT - Keith Fahnhorst | Harris Barton

DE - Jim Stuckey | Pierce Holt
NT - Manu Tuiasosopo | Michael Carter
DE - Dwaine Board | Kevin Fagan
OLB - Dan Bunz | Charles Haley
ILB - Riki Ellison | Matt Millen
ILB - Jack Reynolds | Mike Walter
OLB - Keena Turner | Keena Turner
CB - Ronnie Lott | Tim McKyer
CB - Eric Wright | Don Griffin
S - Carlton Williamson | Chet Brooks
S - Dwight Hicks | Ronnie Lott
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:35 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by SenorGato View Post
Even if I was a much older person I'd still say it's the 2007 Pats. They fckin HUMILIATED their opponents, especially once people decided to call them cheaters.

Lawlz @ them for not closing the deal. It wouldn't even be a contest if they won the Super Bowl. That offense could give any D at any point in league history fits, especially if given today's refs.
I used to get so mad at Forenci for trying to tell me the Giants were just the better team.
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:53 AM    (permalink
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And Wersching missed a FG to tie it. I watched both teams, and I can't put my finger on it, but that '89 team just seemed dominant. Could also be that I was still really young in '84.

That and adding arguably the greatest player of all-time, can't be minimized.


Side-by-Side

QB - Joe Montana | Joe Montana
RB - Wendell Tyler | Roger Craig
FB - Roger Craig | Tom Rathman
WR - Dwight Clark | Jerry Rice
WR - Freddie Solomon | John Taylor
TE - Earl Cooper | Brent Jones
LT - Bubba Paris | Bubba Paris
LG - John Ayers | Guy McIntyre
C - Fred Quillan | Jesse Sapolu
RG - Randy Cross | Bruce Collie
RT - Keith Fahnhorst | Harris Barton

DE - Jim Stuckey | Pierce Holt
NT - Manu Tuiasosopo | Michael Carter
DE - Dwaine Board | Kevin Fagan
OLB - Dan Bunz | Charles Haley
ILB - Riki Ellison | Matt Millen
ILB - Jack Reynolds | Mike Walter
OLB - Keena Turner | Keena Turner
CB - Ronnie Lott | Tim McKyer
CB - Eric Wright | Don Griffin
S - Carlton Williamson | Chet Brooks
S - Dwight Hicks | Ronnie Lott
Still, it was only one loss, and a close one. And one that probably should have been a victory if not for that bad call. And having Jerry Rice was a novelty sure, but that is really more for style points in my opinion. Like I said, the offense was just as good in 1984. They even averaged more points per game. The defense also allowed less points per game. The 1984 team had great players, they just weren't household names.
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:43 AM    (permalink
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Yea I saw this and stopped following it after the 02 Bucs won over the 78 Cowboys in the 1st Round, too many fans that don't do their HW and just voted for the more recent teams that they recognized. Sure that Bucs team had a really good D, but so did that Cowboys team which was led by arguably the best defensive player of the era and probably the best player in franchise history.



And there's no way I'd take a Brad Johnson led offense over a backfield that featured Staubach and Dorsett.

This would have been more interesting if they let former coaches/players vote instead of fans.

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Old 03-28-2012, 08:46 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Leo View Post
They were, but the well-balanced 98' Broncos beat them.
That accounts for the 2007 team not being there, but many Patriot fans feel that the 2004 were even better. Corey Dillon was raping that year, the defense was as nasty as ever and Tom Brady, well... He's Tom Brady. That was a good team all around. I didn't start watching NFL until '99 so I didn't see the '98 Broncos. But the '04 Pats were special.
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I'm a whiny little kunt. Feel sorry for me as I go masturbate to a picture of my mom dressed as a teletubby.
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Old 03-28-2012, 08:50 AM    (permalink
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And having Jerry Rice was a novelty sure, but that is really more for style points in my opinion.
I can accept '84 over '89 but I have a hard time just dismissing Rice's impact like that.
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Old 03-28-2012, 10:13 PM    (permalink
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There's been an upset (or two) in the semi-finals.

http://www.nfl.com/features/bracketo...P11_hot_topics
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Old 03-28-2012, 10:32 PM    (permalink
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I think this is a good showing of how strong the Ravens fan base is despite being the 2nd youngest franchise in the NFL.
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Old 03-28-2012, 10:44 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Thunder&Lightning View Post
If the 2008 Patriots won the super bowl they would be the #1 team, no questions asked.. But they didnt so fml
Yeah, NFL wouldn't have anything to do if that had happened because it'd be such a ******* no-brainer. They killed everyone while playing the hardest schedule of any team that year (and it wasn't like other teams were having down years of any sort). Just absolute domination.
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Old 03-29-2012, 09:10 AM    (permalink
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And there's no way I'd take a Brad Johnson led offense over a backfield that featured Staubach and Dorsett.
Quoted for truth.

Also, I'm apparently the only person who doesn't think the 2004 Pats belong in the "Best Team Ever" discussion.

Last edited by WCH : 03-29-2012 at 09:15 AM.
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Old 03-29-2012, 11:05 AM    (permalink
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It shows how stupid fan voting is
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Old 03-29-2012, 11:43 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post

They would have lost to the 86 Giants that year anyway though. That 86 Giant team was more stable at qb and had just as dominant of a defense.
The Giants allowed 236 points vs the Bears 165 points. That's not "just as dominant." Seriously, now...the 86 Bears allowed 11.7 points per game. That's just a stupid number when you think about it.

The reason the Bears didn't repeat as champs? The dirtiest hit in NFL history, courtesy of the Packers' Charles Martin.



The backup completed 49% of his passes and had 2 TDs to 10 INTs...still getting a record of 7-0 in his 7 starts. Somehow (170 rushing yards per game), the Bears STILL ended the season with a better point differential than the Giants. So, yeah. The reason the 1986 Bears aren't the greatest team in history is Charles Martin cheating.
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