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Old 05-02-2012, 06:47 AM    (permalink
cmarq83
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Originally Posted by ElectricEye View Post
Oh, and in discussion unrelated to draft picks, the Redskins released Jabar Gaffney today. Happened earlier in the day, thought I had already posted it but I guess I forgot. We have a million receivers competing for spots right now, but I really wouldn't mind telling Chad to hit the high road and guaranteeing Gaffney a spot. He's still young enough to contribute meaningfully and he has a ton of experience and production in McDaniel's offense. He could be just what the doctor ordered as a complimentary receiver.
I'm more interested in Jacoby Jones being released. He offers size, speed, and return ability. All 3 things we're missing as of right now. He has inconsistency issues and concentration issues, but I'd rather have him on the roster to return kicks and run flys down the field than what Gaffney brings to the table.
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Old 05-02-2012, 06:51 AM    (permalink
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I'm more interested in Jacoby Jones being released. He offers size, speed, and return ability. All 3 things we're missing as of right now. He has inconsistency issues and concentration issues, but I'd rather have him on the roster to return kicks and run flys down the field than what Gaffney brings to the table.
Jacoby Jones would never learn the offense. The only thing he would bring is a good return game. I couldn't see him being an effective force on offense this year at all while i can see Jabar do work. I think Ocho will get the hang of the offense though, so i don't think we should go for Jabar.
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Old 05-02-2012, 06:56 AM    (permalink
cmarq83
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Jacoby Jones would never learn the offense. The only thing he would bring is a good return game. I couldn't see him being an effective force on offense this year at all while i can see Jabar do work. I think Ocho will get the hang of the offense though, so i don't think we should go for Jabar.
Neither did Brandon Tate, but we clearly missed him last season when all of our deep passes went to Matthew Slater and had Woodhead returning kicks. Jacoby Jones doesn't need to learn the entire offense. Hell we'll have 6 guys at least who can run the choice routes. However, for that 1-2 times a game we bomb it deep, it would be nice to have someone who could actually catch it. In the AFC Championship game and Super Bowl the fact that we called deep passes to Slater and a hobbled Gronk basically sapped the momentum out of us, instead of getting us the killshot we were looking for.
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Old 05-02-2012, 07:11 AM    (permalink
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Neither did Brandon Tate, but we clearly missed him last season when all of our deep passes went to Matthew Slater and had Woodhead returning kicks. Jacoby Jones doesn't need to learn the entire offense. Hell we'll have 6 guys at least who can run the choice routes. However, for that 1-2 times a game we bomb it deep, it would be nice to have someone who could actually catch it. In the AFC Championship game and Super Bowl the fact that we called deep passes to Slater and a hobbled Gronk basically sapped the momentum out of us, instead of getting us the killshot we were looking for.
Call me crazy, but i don't think our return game is that bad. Edelman and Welker do a pretty good job returning punts, and our kick return game is mediocre. I know what you mean though by having someone who could catch a clutch deep ball. It would be nice to see, but i don't see Jacoby Jones being signed.
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Old 05-02-2012, 07:48 AM    (permalink
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Call me crazy, but i don't think our return game is that bad. Edelman and Welker do a pretty good job returning punts, and our kick return game is mediocre. I know what you mean though by having someone who could catch a clutch deep ball. It would be nice to see, but i don't see Jacoby Jones being signed.
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Old 05-02-2012, 07:49 AM    (permalink
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I envision Hightower playing linebacker on first and second down and acting as a rush specialist on passing downs. At Alabama he was used in the "robber" role in coverage which basically means he dropped a couple of steps and tried to jump passing lanes.
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Old 05-02-2012, 07:50 AM    (permalink
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Call me crazy, but i don't think our return game is that bad. Edelman and Welker do a pretty good job returning punts, and our kick return game is mediocre. I know what you mean though by having someone who could catch a clutch deep ball. It would be nice to see, but i don't see Jacoby Jones being signed.
The Patriots ranked 29th in kick return average last year, that's a little bit worse than just mediocre, although I agree with you that New England probably won't sign Jacoby Jones.
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Old 05-02-2012, 07:55 AM    (permalink
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I don't really want Jones or Gaffney for that matter. Since changes were made to the kick off it's basically been irrelevant for the game with very few fluke return TDs happening. Returning punts is much more important in today's NFL IMO and we have Welker and Edelman to do that. I don't think we need to address returner at this point. Ideally I'd like to add another safety before TC, but overall I'm quite content with going into camp with the current roster.
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:09 AM    (permalink
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Neither did Brandon Tate, but we clearly missed him last season when all of our deep passes went to Matthew Slater and had Woodhead returning kicks. Jacoby Jones doesn't need to learn the entire offense. Hell we'll have 6 guys at least who can run the choice routes. However, for that 1-2 times a game we bomb it deep, it would be nice to have someone who could actually catch it. In the AFC Championship game and Super Bowl the fact that we called deep passes to Slater and a hobbled Gronk basically sapped the momentum out of us, instead of getting us the killshot we were looking for.
Oh for christ sake we certainly did not miss Tate last season. He never ******* got open either unless it was on a broken play. Tate was a worse Bethel Johnson failed experiment
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:56 AM    (permalink
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Who's really a lock to take it away from Hightower? Rob Ninkovich?
As far as pass rush goes, I would say we're better off with Ninkovich for sure. If we're planning on Hightower producing big as a dedicated pass rusher, I really don't think we're going to be all that pleased with the results. There's no way he can replace to production we got from the guys we used in that role last year.

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Oh for christ sake we certainly did not miss Tate last season. He never ******* got open either unless it was on a broken play. Tate was a worse Bethel Johnson failed experiment
I agree Tate was never going to develop into a real NFL receiver, but I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss what he was able to do as a role player. We swung for the fences with Taylor Price and I'm absolutely alright with us making that sort of move, but Tate wouldn't have had a hard time repeating or exceeding his 2010 production last year. He was disappointing in that he was never going to be anything more than that, but we didn't have ANYONE who could exploit the inattention of defensive backs down the field last season.
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:46 AM    (permalink
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Oh for christ sake we certainly did not miss Tate last season. He never ******* got open either unless it was on a broken play. Tate was a worse Bethel Johnson failed experiment
Not for nothing, but he did have 8 catches for 20+ yards in 2010, and not all of them were on broken plays like that Vikings play. Underwood, Edelman, Slater, and Price combined for 4 in 2011. Now that's not a fair comparison across the board because not all of the above guys are vertical threats , but I think the Patriots certainly missed him a bit in 2011. Even when we talk about Johnson the guy did contribute something to winning the 2004 SB with a great return and diving catch against the Titans. That is more than any of the aforementioned guys did this year. I don't think Tate was destined for much, but he could have done a few things last year that nobody else brought to the table. I liked the decision at the time with Ocho and Price looking like they could contribute, and kickoffs were predicted to have less of an impact than they ended up having, but in the end I suspect that is a decision that they would have liked to have had back.

Not to mention that Woodhead was a disaster returning kicks, and that is still an unresolved issue on this team for 2012. If a guy like Jacoby Jones could come in, make the team, and replicate Tate's 2010 exact role and production then I think the team would improve slightly.
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:50 AM    (permalink
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I don't really want Jones or Gaffney for that matter. Since changes were made to the kick off it's basically been irrelevant for the game with very few fluke return TDs happening. Returning punts is much more important in today's NFL IMO and we have Welker and Edelman to do that. I don't think we need to address returner at this point. Ideally I'd like to add another safety before TC, but overall I'm quite content with going into camp with the current roster.
I'd like to see a veteran back and a WR with some speed and return ability, even if it's just for camp competition. I know he was bad last season, but Ronnie Brown has always been a guy who intrigues me. I think he'd be a great veteran to mix in since he has a well rounded set of overall skills and decent size.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:15 PM    (permalink
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I'd like to see a veteran back and a WR with some speed and return ability, even if it's just for camp competition. I know he was bad last season, but Ronnie Brown has always been a guy who intrigues me. I think he'd be a great veteran to mix in since he has a well rounded set of overall skills and decent size.
Yeah, I completely forgot about RB. Ryan Grant is a player that I'd like to see in NE if he can accept a limited role. He didn't do that last year in GB but he might here. I'm afraid that Brown is done. The injuries have robbed him of his explosiveness so he's probably done.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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The Patriots ranked 29th in kick return average last year, that's a little bit worse than just mediocre, although I agree with you that New England probably won't sign Jacoby Jones.
I never really looked at the stats for KR, but the fact is i do think their punt return is still good.
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Old 05-02-2012, 01:38 PM    (permalink
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I'd like to see a veteran back and a WR with some speed and return ability, even if it's just for camp competition. I know he was bad last season, but Ronnie Brown has always been a guy who intrigues me. I think he'd be a great veteran to mix in since he has a well rounded set of overall skills and decent size.
I could only see Brown coming in for a leadership role. I don't think he can play at the caliber he needs to.
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Old 05-02-2012, 04:46 PM    (permalink
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Razor already posted this in the free agent thread, but ultimately it always comes back here. We've signed Jabar Gaffney. Honestly, I'm not surprised whatsoever. He has a long track record of being a useful player in Josh McDaniel's offense. At 6'2, he brings an element of size that we don't presently have on the roster. He was still able to produce plays down the field at a decent rate last season as well. Even with the stiff competition, I think he's a pretty decent bet to make the team. Brady was very complimentary of him as a player when we played Washington last year, so it seems he's got that going for him.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:32 PM    (permalink
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Could everyone please join me in adding a Junior Seau tribute signature? Feel free to copy the one I'm using, otherwise I would be glad to make another one for you. I have requested that BoneKrusher put together a tribute so hopefully he can whip up something as well.
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:45 PM    (permalink
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BoneKrusher came up with a sig, check it out below:
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:53 PM    (permalink
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53-man roster projection:

1. QB Tom Brady
2. QB Brian Hoyer
3. QB Ryan Mallett
4. RB Stevan Ridley
5. RB Shane Vereen
6. RB Danny Woodhead
7. FB Spencer Larsen
8. WR Wes Welker
9. WR Brandon Lloyd
10. WR Deion Branch
11. WR Jabar Gaffney
12. WR Julian Edelman
13. WR Matthew Slater
14. TE Rob Gronkowski
15. TE Aaron Hernandez
16. TE Daniel Fells
17. OT Nate Solder
18. OT Sebastian Vollmer
19. OT Robert Gallery
20. OT Marcus Cannon
21. OG Logan Mankins
22. OG Brian Waters
23. OG Ryan Wendell
24. C Dan Connolly
25. C Dan Koppen
26. DT Vince Wilfork
27. DT Kyle Love
28. DT Gerard Warren
29. DT Marcus Forston
30. DE Chandler Jones
31. DE Jonathan Fanene
32. DE Brandon Deaderick
33. DE Jake Bequette
34. DE Jermaine Cunningham
35. LB Jerod Mayo
36. LB Brandon Spikes
37. LB Dont'a Hightower
38. LB Rob Ninkovich
39. LB Dane Fletcher
40. LB Bobby Carpenter
41. LB Tracy White
42. CB Devin McCourty
43. CB Ras-I Dowling
44. CB Kyle Arrington
45. CB Sterling Moore
46. CB Will Allen
47. CB Alfonzo Dennard
48. S Patrick Chung
49. S Steve Gregory
50. S Tavon Wilson
51. K Stephen Gostkowski
52. P Zoltan Mesko
53. LS Danny Aiken

Notable players missing the cut:

WR Anthony Gonzalez
WR Chad Ochocinco
WR Donte' Stallworth
OL Nick McDonald
DT Ron Brace
DT Myron Pryor
DE Markell Carter
DE Trevor Scott
LB Jeff Tarpinian
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Old 05-03-2012, 07:04 AM    (permalink
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Thoughtful use of the signature Matt. Just stunning and tragic news on Seau.

On Gaffney, can't argue any with the signing especially considering that Brady really likes him. WR group this year looks really solid, next year is a different story.

On the roster projection, we look so thin at DT. If Vince goes down to injury this team is in a whole lot of trouble.
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Old 05-03-2012, 07:10 AM    (permalink
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Edit:
I wonder if any players we have are on the trading block, specifically Hoyer, Mallet or maybe Spikes. Can't imagine we'd get much there. Maybe if Mallet gets a lot of reps in pre-season and looks good doing it.

Oops. This wasn't suppose to be a new post.
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Old 05-03-2012, 07:47 AM    (permalink
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I'm particular to keeping Mallet and Hoyer's trade value isn't quite where it needs to be for them to go ahead and make a move.
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Old 05-03-2012, 09:29 AM    (permalink
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Does anyone else still believe in Ocho?
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:40 PM    (permalink
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GallopingGhost, I think Ochocinco is likely out with the signing of Jabar Gaffney. The Patriots should probably preemptively release him so that he can find a new team in 2012. I project the six wide receivers to be Wes Welker, Brandon Lloyd, Deion Branch, Jabar Gaffney, Julian Edelman, and Matthew Slater. At this point the only player I think Ochocinco could realistically beat out is Deion Branch (if Branch looks significantly slower in camp.)

In the forum mock, I selected Mississippi St. CB Johnthan Banks with our first-round pick. The Patriots would have McCourty, Dowling, and Banks at cornerback with Dre Kirkpatrick and Patrick Chung as the safeties.
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Old 05-03-2012, 02:06 PM    (permalink
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Ocho made it passed singing Jabar Gaffney. Tiquan Underwood was just cut, again.
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