NBA Discussion Thread - Page 2863

fenikz · 07-17-2012, 08:27 PM

I compared him to Michael Redd prior to the knee surgeries, well I said that was his absolute peak

Ravens1991 · 07-17-2012, 08:31 PM

yeah still those are ****** numbers for the next Michael Redd.

I didnt see a game but reports are he showed great defensive hustle, great passing for a sg and BBALL IQ so hopefully his shots start falling we will have a great young G combo.

iowatreat54 · 07-17-2012, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

CAN'T LOSE EITHER WAY

Have fun watching us in the playoffs.

Actually, you can.

On one hand, you go into the season with either old man Kidd running the point, and a complete waste of player in Felton backing him up. Or vice versa.

On the other hand, you start Jeremy Lin, who isn't at best average, and have fun paying him money he isn't worth for 3 years when no one will want him as he averages 10 and 4 with 5-6 turnovers a game.

Either way, maybe this year you guys will finally win a playoff series and not be the joke of the league. I guess that's something to be proud of...

LonghornsLegend · 07-17-2012, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fenikz

where'd you hear this? I've heard 3/24 so far as the starting price for him

https://twitter.com/ESPN_Caplan/stat...86779345219587

Quote:

Mayo deal is 2 years with second being a player option.

I'd personally have much preferred a 3/24. I want at least 1 young option to grow with going into 2013, and with him being a starter this year he's going to command way more money next year.

Brent · 07-17-2012, 09:35 PM

http://www.theonion.com/articles/jer...mportan,28810/ "Jeremy Lin's Departure Teaches Knicks Fans Important Lesson About Getting Excited By The Knicks"

LTgiants · 07-17-2012, 09:37 PM

Don't kick us while we are down Brent. That is not cool.

diabsoule · 07-17-2012, 09:44 PM

It's official. The Knicks won't match Houston's offer. Jeremy Lin is officially a Rocket.

Also, the Nuggets amnestied Birdman at the last second and signed Anthony Randolph.
http://www.denverpost.com/nuggets/ci...rdman-anderson

LTgiants · 07-17-2012, 09:51 PM

Yep Jim Dolan is a stupid stupid stupid man.

Brodeur · 07-17-2012, 09:53 PM

Fran Vazquez signing two year deal with random Euro team.......best pick ever or best pick ever?

MetSox17 · 07-17-2012, 10:06 PM

Best pick. Best pick ever status belongs to Darko.

Rob S · 07-17-2012, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTgiants

Yep Jim Dolan is a stupid stupid stupid man.

He's actually pretty damn smart. Saves him from spending around $39 million on a mediocre player in 2014 alone. Don't give me the marketing value BS argument either.

Hurricanes25 · 07-17-2012, 10:14 PM

I agree Rob. This is one of the few things Dolan has done right.

And apparently they still have plans on getting Chris Paul next year.

Babylon · 07-17-2012, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob S

He's actually pretty damn smart. Saves him from spending around $39 million on a mediocre player in 2014 alone. Don't give me the marketing value BS argument either.

I'd only add that nobody knows what kind of player he'll be in 2014.

LTgiants · 07-17-2012, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob S

He's actually pretty damn smart. Saves him from spending around $39 million on a mediocre player in 2014 alone. Don't give me the marketing value BS argument either.

Jeremy Lin is better then Raymond Felton on a 4 year contract for 18 million dollars. You have a better shot winning with Lin then Felton.

LTgiants · 07-17-2012, 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hurricanes25

I agree Rob. This is one of the few things Dolan has done right.

And apparently they still have plans on getting Chris Paul next year.

They have no money to give Paul or pieces to trade for him so put down the pipe.

Rob S · 07-17-2012, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babylon

I'd only add that nobody knows what kind of player he'll be in 2014.

I am a pessimist regarding Lin. That said, even an optimist would have to concede that $39 million is a ludicrous price to pay for Lin during one season.

Rob S · 07-17-2012, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTgiants

Jeremy Lin is better then Raymond Felton on a 4 year contract for 18 million dollars. You have a better shot winning with Lin then Felton.

Yeah, as a Knicks fan with no regard for Dolan's money this is true. I'm not going to blame the guy for saving himself a cool $50 million bucks over the next 3 years though. Even if his past decisions have been frivolous, it would be highly hypocritical of me to criticize him here.

MetSox17 · 07-17-2012, 10:21 PM

Eh, i'm not one way or the other on this whole Lin deal, but it's not $39M for Lin, it's $14.8M for Lin, with the luxury tax penalty being distributed evenly between all the dogshit contracts the Knicks have. Mainly Amar'e's.

gpngc · 07-17-2012, 10:23 PM

I don't mind losing Lin.

He's an OK player. His weaknesses were very evident amid the insanity. He turns the ball over way too much and he doesn't have a great jump shot.

He's not the best defender in the world and he doesn't control a game or the pace of a game if he's not penetrating at ease and dominating the ball. He also struggled mightily against good defensive teams and actually struggled bringing the freaking ball up when Chalmers pressured him full court.

I understand why people are down on Felton, but I really believe that if he loses a little weight he can be a decent starting PG. I think he'll be motivated coming back to the city where he played the best ball of his career, even if it's not in the SSOL offense.

Unlike Lin, Felton and Kidd have both proven to be PGs capable of controlling the pace of the game, which is the most important attribute of a PG.

Yes both players have limitations as well, but there are much less pronounced than Lin's. Lin also hasn't proven himself with that small sample size. In fact, he needs to IMPROVE by A LOT in order to be anywhere near that contract.

To conclude my argument against Lin I'll lazily point to his draft position and inability to crack the lineup for two other NBA teams, and not getting a scholarship from Stanford. I truly think it was a nice story, and it wasn't completely smoke and mirrors, but the reality of the situation was hyped up to be way more positive than it actually was, clutch shots, shiny NY lights, and perfect timing all contributing to the overblown hysteria. For Houston's sake, I hope he improves and has a nice career. Based on what I saw and NBA history for players like him, I highly doubt he lives up to that contract. He's also going to have a hard time staying healthy if he keeps going into the paint so wildly.

Anyway, back to the two PGs they have now, the Knicks started last year with TONEY BEER PONG DOUGLAS as their PG. And Shumpert got looks as well, and quickly made it obvious that he simply is not a PG. They were STARVED for a PG all season until Lin came along and did his homeless man's Russell Westbrook impression. They didn't have anyone who could handle the ball, let alone control the game. Carmelo had to handle the ball so much, people confused that with being a ball hog. The fact was he was their best ball handler, best scorer, and best shooter -- something you NEVER want ONE player to be on your squad. Now, I believe they have two guys who can handle the ball and actually play PG at an NBA-veteran level, something they haven't had since... ...Felton the first time.

Kidd's not quick but he's a good team defender and Felton should be fine as a starter.

The team's ball movement WILL improve, and Melo won't have to handle so much.

I believe the Knicks got better this offseason. No more shaky-ass, inconsistent, can't-really-shoot Landry Fields, and they added Camby as quality big-man depth.

Amare is the weak link in my opinion. Still, this team is good enough to win a playoff series or two in my estimation. And if Felton somehow is close to the player he was in his first stint, they could actually be a surprise ECF contender.

Rob S · 07-17-2012, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MetSox17

Eh, i'm not one way or the other on this whole Lin deal, but it's not $39M for Lin, it's $14.8M for Lin, with the luxury tax penalty being distributed evenly between all the dogshit contracts the Knicks have. Mainly Amar'e's.

Not really. Knicks are at the cap without factoring in the Lin deal. Sign Lin and we go over the cap by his salary and therefore he accounts for the luxury tax penalty all by himself.

LTgiants · 07-17-2012, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob S

Yeah, as a Knicks fan with no regard for Dolan's money this is true. I'm not going to blame the guy for saving himself a cool $50 million bucks over the next 3 years though. Even if his past decisions have been frivolous, it would be highly hypocritical of me to criticize him here.

Why the hell should I have any regard for his money. When is the last time he had regard for anyone else's money?

He was the same guy going around saying money is not a option for years. Now when he is remotely close to having a shot at winning he wants to save money.

He had no problem paying for Isiah's teams and when Isiah's action cost him a 11 million dollars in the anucha brown lawsuit. To turn around and not spend money when you have a shot to win is stupid.

gpngc · 07-17-2012, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTgiants

Why the hell should I have any regard for his money. When is the last time he had regard for anyone else's money?

He was the same guy going around saying money is not a option for years. Now when he is remotely close to having a shot at winning he wants to save money.

He had no problem paying for Isiah's teams and when Isiah's action cost him a 11 million dollars in the anucha brown lawsuit. To turn around and not spend money when you have a shot to win is stupid.

I think you have to look into the possibility that this was also a basketball decision and that being locked into Lin for two more years might actually be a mistake.

LTgiants · 07-17-2012, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gpngc

I think you have to look into the possibility that this was also a basketball decision and that being locked into Lin for two more years might actually be a mistake.

Their is no way you can spin Raymond Felton over Jeremy Lin as a good basketball decision. This was not a basketball decision. This was Dolan ego getting hurt that Lin didn't take a hometown discount.

Rob S · 07-17-2012, 10:32 PM

We aren't winning **** until Amare's contract is off the books, Lin or no Lin. That's just the truth. Just because he did dumb **** in the past doesn't mean we can get a pissy now when he exercises some financial responsibility. It's his money. I hate Dolan as much as the next guy, but it's his damn money.

If the coaches/front office really thought the Knicks needed to bring Lin back, Dolan would have stepped up and paid. You know it and I know it. Dolan wants to win, probably more than any of us. Lin just isn't that good and damn sure isn't worth that contract....he would still be a Knick if it was even close.

gpngc · 07-17-2012, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTgiants

Their is no way you can spin Raymond Felton over Jeremy Lin as a good basketball decision. This was not a basketball decision. This was Dolan ego getting hurt that Lin didn't take a hometown discount.

I completely disagree but OK.

My argument against Lin -- all basketball, didn't touch on the contract at all -- is in one of the above posts.