< NHL Discussion Thread >

[SuperMcGee]

Yeah, there's not a whole lot wrong with this, in my eyes. Carolina was 4 million under the floor before this and I'm sure they think they can take a playoff spot from Florida or Ottawa. They obviously came into this offseason willing to throw money around. As much as I hate them, I don't fault them for trying to make a splash.

[Xiomera]

Don't blame the GMs for overspending on short-term deals. It's not their fault there's more overall cap space than there are quality free agents to acquire.

The NHL's pay scale has been thrown completely out of whack by the ~$5 million leaps the salary cap has taken each year since the lockout.

[Scotty D]

Originally Posted by Xiomera

I don't think it's an overpayment. Teams still have more cap space collectively than there are worthy players to spend on. Semin was the last impact free agent aside from Doan, and if you can get any impact player signed for a 1-year, low risk contract, you do it.

I'm pretty pissed that Ken Holland is still sitting on his hands acting like that cap space is going to roll over to next offseason. It's the same damn thing he did last year.

Yeah but this is why Holland is a good GM. He doesn't spend just because he has it. A lesser GM would have panicked and thrown big money at Carle, Semin, Doan, etc once he missed out on Suter/Parise.

[Xiomera]

Originally Posted by Scotty D

Yeah but this is why Holland is a good GM. He doesn't spend just because he has it. A lesser GM would have panicked and thrown big money at Carle, Semin, Doan, etc once he missed out on Suter/Parise.

I completely disagree. Why should I praise Holland because he DIDN'T sign those players? For two years he looked forward to this offseason, knowing he'd have the most cap space he's ever had (24 million) and he swung and missed on everyone. There's no rollover for cap space. That's just money that's not being used. We left 5 million unused last season. And we'll leave more than that unused again this year.

Ken Holland is living off his supreme reputation from the pre-lockout days.

Wings fans have been spoiled over the last 15 years. Everyone knows it. But Holland is passively letting this era of dominance end by failing repeatedly to acquire impact players.

I don't blame him for missing on Suter and Parise. I blame him for failing to recognize earlier in the process that he was gambling big time to wait on them while everyone else got signed. In the new NHL, you have to "overpay" for free agents, though the definition of an overpayment is rapidly changing. The market for a player like Hudler has gone up, past what most people think he's worth, but they're going off his salary from the past.

The salary cap has nearly doubled since the lockout. That means salaries have gone up too and Ken Holland is still asking or expecting players to take discounts. There's parity in the NHL now. Half the NHL teams enter the season with a chance at a Stanley Cup, so free agents aren't compelled to take very much less money to play on one of the supposed best teams.

I think Holland has done a poor job of adapting to the new NHL. I'm not saying he should be replaced by any means, but I'm rattled by every one of the countless Red Wings fans that I see defending him based on his past accomplishments. This team gets farther away from a Stanley Cup every year despite having the cap space to stop the decline.

[mcdlaxbonz13]

In my opinion because of the huge improvement of parity in the league players are most likely looking at more things than just hockey, for example if I was a player being persued by multiple teams each who had a legitimate chance at making the playoffs or winning a stanley cup and they were all offering ballpark same length and dollar amount a teams history really doesn't matter anymore. Instead I would look at things such as the city, places to live, if I had a family the school district for them and things of that nature, and I hate to say it but Detroit isn't that desirable of a destination as a city, and thats something Holland really has no control over. Again this is just my opinion as I am not a red wings fan.

[Xiomera]

Originally Posted by mcdlaxbonz13

In my opinion because of the huge improvement of parity in the league players are most likely looking at more things than just hockey, for example if I was a player being persued by multiple teams each who had a legitimate chance at making the playoffs or winning a stanley cup and they were all offering ballpark same length and dollar amount a teams history really doesn't matter anymore. Instead I would look at things such as the city, places to live, if I had a family the school district for them and things of that nature, and I hate to say it but Detroit isn't that desirable of a destination as a city, and thats something Holland really has no control over. Again this is just my opinion as I am not a red wings fan.

I have no idea where you live, but I'm guessing it isn't Michigan. There is nothing undesirable about living in Metro Detroit. Yes, the actual city of Detroit has problems (and a reputation that gets blown out of proportion), but no Detroit athlete actually lives in the city. There are tons of surrounding communities that are more than satisfactory to raise a family and live.

Prior to the recession, Oakland County (which is next to the county Detroit is in) was the third-richest county in the entire country. And even now, I'm guessing it still ranks very high on the list. I think you'd be very hard pressed to find any athlete that's played in Detroit that would be deterred from re-signing due to locale.

[Brodeur]

Originally Posted by Scotty D

Yeah but this is why Holland is a good GM. He doesn't spend just because he has it. A lesser GM would have panicked and thrown big money at Carle, Semin, Doan, etc once he missed out on Suter/Parise.

A one year deal isn't panicking, it's a low risk move that doesn't hurt in in the future. There was no reason for Holland not to do it.

[mcdlaxbonz13]

Originally Posted by Xiomera

I have no idea where you live, but I'm guessing it isn't Michigan. There is nothing undesirable about living in Metro Detroit. Yes, the actual city of Detroit has problems (and a reputation that gets blown out of proportion), but no Detroit athlete actually lives in the city. There are tons of surrounding communities that are more than satisfactory to raise a family and live.

Prior to the recession, Oakland County (which is next to the county Detroit is in) was the third-richest county in the entire country. And even now, I'm guessing it still ranks very high on the list. I think you'd be very hard pressed to find any athlete that's played in Detroit that would be deterred from re-signing due to locale.

Sorry i was partly distracted while writing that, what i meant was the reputation of the city to a laymen isn't very good. Personally I know the area isn't that bad as I will potentially be looking for jobs in that area. More so what i was getting at was that anymore these decisions half the time don't anymore have to do with hockey because most teams can make a pitch saying with you we are a legitimate stanley cup contender and not be that far off. So now it more so comes down to there personal preferences of the city and Ken Holland really has no control over how some one feels about living in a certain area.

[Xiomera]

Originally Posted by mcdlaxbonz13

Sorry i was partly distracted while writing that, what i meant was the reputation of the city to a laymen isn't very good. Personally I know the area isn't that bad as I will potentially be looking for jobs in that area. More so what i was getting at was that anymore these decisions half the time don't anymore have to do with hockey because most teams can make a pitch saying with you we are a legitimate stanley cup contender and not be that far off. So now it more so comes down to there personal preferences of the city and Ken Holland really has no control over how some one feels about living in a certain area.

I agree with the gist of what you're saying. The new parity of the league has allowed players to give much more consideration to factors other than money and team competitiveness. Look no further than Parise and Suter and what they did.

But I'm not willing to let Ken Holland off the hook for that reason. General managers that aren't aggressive (in trades, salary commitment, taking an occasional gamble) are at the mercy of the growing free agent phenomenon I described in the last paragraph.

[SuperMcGee]

Originally Posted by Xiomera

I have no idea where you live, but I'm guessing it isn't Michigan. There is nothing undesirable about living in Metro Detroit. Yes, the actual city of Detroit has problems (and a reputation that gets blown out of proportion), but no Detroit athlete actually lives in the city. There are tons of surrounding communities that are more than satisfactory to raise a family and live.

Prior to the recession, Oakland County (which is next to the county Detroit is in) was the third-richest county in the entire country. And even now, I'm guessing it still ranks very high on the list. I think you'd be very hard pressed to find any athlete that's played in Detroit that would be deterred from re-signing due to locale.

I could say the same thing about Buffalo, though on a smaller scale. I'm sure plenty of players fall in love with the area once they've been there, but it's not an attractive pull.

[Borat]

Well, I think if Holland had signed some of the "other" guys, then the fans would have b!tched that those signings caused them to lose out on Parise/Suter.

[SuperMcGee]

Nice 5 year extension for Enstrom. He'll make a little more than Carle does if these figures are right. Hope he has a big year in him after a fractured one last season.

[Xiomera]

Originally Posted by SuperMcgee

I could say the same thing about Buffalo, though on a smaller scale. I'm sure plenty of players fall in love with the area once they've been there, but it's not an attractive pull.

True, but the Red Wings still can play the "Original Six" angle and the 4 recent Stanley Cups, etc. I just don't accept this failure to bring in an impact player despite having 24 million dollars this summer, especially now that I've seen a player like Alex Semin was willing to sign for one year.

[mcdlaxbonz13]

Maybe semin really wanted to stay in the southeast so he can play the caps 6 times a year, without Semin coming out and saying exactly why he signed in carolina its impossible to know the reason's he choose there.

[Xiomera]

Originally Posted by mcdlaxbonz13

Maybe semin really wanted to stay in the southeast so he can play the caps 6 times a year, without Semin coming out and saying exactly why he signed in carolina its impossible to know the reason's he choose there.

Not necessary. I know damn well Ken Holland didn't make an offer that high.

[Ron]

Kinda late, but I gotta say I love the Semin deal for the Canes. A no-risk move for a team who has positioned themselves as a solid playoff team in the East. With a goalie capable of getting hot like Cam Ward, I see the Canes being a legit darkhorse

[djp]

Originally Posted by Ron

Kinda late, but I gotta say I love the Semin deal for the Canes. A no-risk move for a team who has positioned themselves as a solid playoff team in the East. With a goalie capable of getting hot like Cam Ward, I see the Canes being a legit darkhorse

They're not a darkhorse at this point. A lot of people are hyping Carolina for next season

[SuperMcGee]

Alffy is officially coming back. Could be cool.

[Todd Bertuzzi]

I would post his GWG against Buffalo to send Ottawa to the Cup but I know you'd only counter with Pominville walking around him.

So instead I will post what is possibly the greatest video ever:

http://video.thescore.com/watch/alfie-rises-trailer-1

[SuperMcGee]

Alright, that was pretty cool.

Kaleta signs for 3 more years of turtling and reputation charging calls.

[TimD]

I agree with Xio. Holland has really messed up the past 2 summers. I just hope that some of the wings' prospects develop into impact players. (Nyquist, Tatar, Jurco, Frk, Almquist, etc.)

[SuperMcGee]

Andrej Meszaros tears his Achilles. Ouchtown, Philly defense.

[Rosebud]

Originally Posted by TimD

I agree with Xio. Holland has really messed up the past 2 summers. I just hope that some of the wings' prospects develop into impact players. (Nyquist, Tatar, Jurco, Frk, Almquist, etc.)

You guys need to stop getting my hopes up. I'd absolutely love to see Detroit struggle and spend a few years picking in the top 5-10.

[Xiomera]

Originally Posted by Rosebud

You guys need to stop getting my hopes up. I'd absolutely love to see Detroit struggle and spend a few years picking in the top 5-10.

When the Wings inevitably fall out of the playoffs, they'll be in that unenviable spot where they're not bad enough to get a Top 5 pick, but not good enough to contend.

[Rosebud]

Originally Posted by Xiomera

When the Wings inevitably fall out of the playoffs, they'll be in that unenviable spot where they're not bad enough to get a Top 5 pick, but not good enough to contend.

You're seriously giving me wood here, stop it.