NBA Discussion Thread - Page 2883

scottyboy · 08-11-2012, 05:01 PM

Yes, but Olympic 3's aren't NBA 3's, they're shorter. Mid-range is perfectly fine for Pau. He's not a 3 point shooter, but his midrange game is quite good. Lebron at the 4 causes mismatches for almost anyone in the NBA, but Dwight would easily leave Bosh in a rotation if Lebron drives on Pau. Rotation to cover the Bosh jumper. Lebron causes mismatches for every team because he's Lebron, but Dwight's athleticism and length on D makes it a huge advantage. Plus, Bosh couldn't guard Dwight in the paint, and Lebron would have trouble with Pau. They'd have to keep Anthony or Udonis in to try and slow Dwight down. And for rebounds, my goodness for rebounds

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 05:04 PM

I can't wait to root for and bet on the Heat against these Lakers.

Brodeur · 08-11-2012, 05:06 PM

OKC is still built to beat LA. Perkins can slow Dwight down (that's the ONLY thing he can do), Durant and Westbrook are still impossible to guard with their lineup, and they're quicker. Hell, the Nugs could give the Lakers some trouble too with their insane speed and youth.

The Alex · 08-11-2012, 05:13 PM

The Lakers aren't even the best basketball team in their own city.

Jordan < Dwight
Griffin > Gasol
Butler > Artest
Billups < Kobe
Paul > Nash

Hill, Crawford > Jamison, Blake

CLIPPERS DYNASTY BITCHES

diabsoule · 08-11-2012, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brodeur

OKC is still built to beat LA. Perkins can slow Dwight down (that's the ONLY thing he can do), Durant and Westbrook are still impossible to guard with their lineup, and they're quicker. Hell, the Nugs could give the Lakers some trouble too with their insane speed and youth.

Nash vs Lawson (or Miller)
Kobe vs Iggy
Artest vs Gallo
Pau vs Faried
Howard vs McGee

It'd be a battle for sure but Denver is deeper and younger at every position on the floor than that Lakers.

Bixby (Thumper) · 08-11-2012, 05:17 PM

LOL @ Blake Griffin being better than Pau. Blake is an overrated, overly dramatic player who is only good for dunks.

Docta · 08-11-2012, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottyboy

Yes, but Olympic 3's aren't NBA 3's, they're shorter. Mid-range is perfectly fine for Pau. He's not a 3 point shooter, but his midrange game is quite good. Lebron at the 4 causes mismatches for almost anyone in the NBA, but Dwight would easily leave Bosh in a rotation if Lebron drives on Pau. Rotation to cover the Bosh jumper. Lebron causes mismatches for every team because he's Lebron, but Dwight's athleticism and length on D makes it a huge advantage. Plus, Bosh couldn't guard Dwight in the paint, and Lebron would have trouble with Pau. They'd have to keep Anthony or Udonis in to try and slow Dwight down. And for rebounds, my goodness for rebounds

LeBron's not going to have trouble with Pau. He did fine with Durant in the Finals. And I don't know how much they're going to rotate if Mike Miller is also in at the 3, and if he's back to his regular form.

Dwight's injury is being overlooked though. It took the Heat 2 years to get their chemistry down, and Dwight's probably gonna be out for half the season.

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 05:20 PM

Dwight doesn't even need to be slowed down. I still think they need Gasol to come up big offensively and I'm not sure adding Dwight is going to help Gasol on the low block.

Might be more of Gasol standing near the perimeter and watching Kobe do whatever he wants.

Their offense might take a while. Kinda reminds me of Malone-GP-Shaq.

And I'm still not even huge on OKC. They rely on the jump shot too much to consistently win series. And Westbrook's all over the place, and none of their big three is a plus defender. Just something that irks me about them. Usually at least one of your big-time stars is a good defender too.

I do like the Nuggets but they have to rely on JAVALE MCGEE so that negates them.

Can't trust the Spurs after the past two years.

Memphis is still bleh but I guess they could creep (so funny that once the National media started giving them hype it was so obvious they weren't going to creep again this year).

I love GS this year but they aren't near that level.

Dallas lost two of their best three players from their title team and replaced them with Juice Mayo and Kaman-til-he-gets-hurt/Brand. Not good.

I would love the Clips as a darkhorse if Blake Griffin actually ascended into the stardom that the media pretends he's earned. Maybe he'll make the leap this year but I'm not holding my breath. They have a sneaky good team in that Billups returning is like a huge addition no one is talking about. But they need too much to go right - CP3 staying healthy for 82, Odom's mood to stay even, and Jordan to learn how to play basketball just a little.

I guess I'll go with Phoenix. Beasley wins the first of many Finals MVPs.

So it's Lakers by default but the Heat will smack them. Artest will need to check into an institution after LeBron gets done with him. Howard and Gasol will shrink, and Heat rises again.

LTgiants · 08-11-2012, 05:22 PM

Durant is a 3 and Pau is a 4 they have completely different games. Pau can post up Lebron and Durant cant.

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTgiants

Durant is a 3 and Pau is a 4 they have completely different games. Pau can post up Lebron and Durant cant.

But in what scenario is a team with Nash, Kobe, and Howard going to consistently feed the ball to Pau on the low block to attack LeBron freaking James - probably the best defender in the NBA - so that he can take 'advantage' of him down low? Not to mention Bron is a brilliant post defender and is stronger, more athletic, quicker, and the only thing he needs to do is make up about four inches with his physical advantages on a given possession.

The Alex · 08-11-2012, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bixby

LOL @ Blake Griffin being better than Pau. Blake is an overrated, overly dramatic player who is only good for dunks.

Player A: 55% FG%, 20.7 PPG, 10.9 RPG, 0.7 BPG, 23.4 PER
Player B: 50% FG%, 17.4 PPG, 10.4 RPG, 1.4 BPG, 20.5 PER

A is Griffin, B is Gasol.

LTgiants · 08-11-2012, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gpngc

But in what scenario is a team with Nash, Kobe, and Howard going to consistently feed the ball to Pau on the low block to attack LeBron freaking James - probably the best defender in the NBA - so that he can take 'advantage' of him down low? Not to mention Bron is a brilliant post defender and is stronger, more athletic, quicker, and the only thing he needs to do is make up about four inches with his physical advantages on a given possession.

I was merely trying to point out that using Durant as an example of Lebron being able to stop Pau makes no sense.

You don't have to feed Pau in the post. You can feed Dwight in the post and nobody on the Heat can really stop him. The more effort they have to put on defending Dwight. The more things open up for Nash, Kobe, & Pau.

Lebron is probably the best defender in the NBA on the wings. I would not call him a brilliant post defender. Not that he is incapable of doing it just I think it would wear him down if he had to do it for the majority of a game.

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTgiants

I was merely trying to point out that using Durant as an example of Lebron being able to stop Pau makes no sense.

You don't have to feed Pau in the post. You can feed Dwight in the post and nobody on the Heat can really stop him. The more effort they have to put on defending Dwight. The more things open up for Nash, Kobe, & Pau.

Lebron is probably the best defender in the NBA on the wings. I would not call him a brilliant post defender. Not that he is incapable of doing it just I think it would wear him down if he had to do it for the majority of a game.

Oh.

I definitely disagree with the last part but there's no way of knowing because he'd never play the post for an entire game.

As for Dwight, I'm not worried. Just don't let him dunk and foul him. If he really develops a consistent inside game other than dunking then he'll be Shaq and everyone can bow down to his greatness. Until then, limit dunks, use your fouls.

YAYareaRB · 08-11-2012, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Alex

The Lakers aren't even the best basketball team in their own city.

Jordan < Dwight
Griffin > Gasol
Butler > Artest
Billups < Kobe
Paul > Nash

Hill, Crawford > Jamison, Blake

CLIPPERS DYNASTY BITCHES

dynasty? try winning something (no, dunk contests do not count) first

LTgiants · 08-11-2012, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gpngc

Oh.

I definitely disagree with the last part but there's no way of knowing because he'd never play the post for an entire game.

As for Dwight, I'm not worried. Just don't let him dunk and foul him. If he really develops a consistent inside game other than dunking then he'll be Shaq and everyone can bow down to his greatness. Until then, limit dunks, use your fouls.

Actually Power forwards and Centers get worn down later in games defending the post. Lebron despite being a athletic freak he is still human. It would not be any different it would wear him down as well.

Just fouling him even if Dwight misses half his ft's still will put your team in foul trouble and the Lakers will just live at the line. Where they have one of the best ft shooters in league history in Nash. Kobe who is a career 80% ft shooter, Pau who is a career 75%. Hell even Metta is a 70% for his career.

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTgiants

Actually Power forwards and Centers get worn down later in games defending the post. Lebron despite being a athletic freak he is still human. It would not be any different it would wear him down as well.

Just fouling him even if Dwight misses half his ft's still will put your team in foul trouble and the Lakers will just live at the line. Where they have one of the best ft shooters in league history in Nash. Kobe who is a career 80% ft shooter, Pau who is a career 75%. Hell even Metta is a 70% for his career.

Eh. There really aren't that many non-shooting defensive fouls in the playoffs anyway. Especially when the refs know a team is in the bonus. And if it's Dwight - good. He'll never go 2/2.

And it's not like Joel Anthony matters as anything more than 6 fouls.

scottyboy · 08-11-2012, 06:05 PM

I understand the chemistry issue, and Dwight's injury (seriously, what's up with that? Anyone heard anything recently?) But the Heat were similar players. Lebron and Wade have similar attacking styles and had trouble complimenting each other early. The Lakers, however, have a PF who can shoot, a pure center who is a monster in the paint on both sides, a PG who doesn't care about shooting and will drive and dish, and Kobe, the pure scorer who can take over a game if needed. They compliment each others style of play so well, which makes them so scary

LTgiants · 08-11-2012, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gpngc

Eh. There really aren't that many non-shooting defensive fouls in the playoffs anyway. Especially when the refs know a team is in the bonus. And if it's Dwight - good. He'll never go 2/2.

And it's not like Joel Anthony matters as anything more than 6 fouls.

Stars get calls. Lakers starting lineup now except for Metta are guys that generally get a lot of FT attempts.

I am not going to bother coming up with a response for Joel Anthony cause like you said he does not matter

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottyboy

I understand the chemistry issue, and Dwight's injury (seriously, what's up with that? Anyone heard anything recently?) But the Heat were similar players. Lebron and Wade have similar attacking styles and had trouble complimenting each other early. The Lakers, however, have a PF who can shoot, a pure center who is a monster in the paint on both sides, a PG who doesn't care about shooting and will drive and dish, and Kobe, the pure scorer who can take over a game if needed. They compliment each others style of play so well, which makes them so scary

Ah but it's much different with wing players (especially one like LeBron who can play literally anywhere on the floor) and big men.

Down low is a much more confined space. Wings operate completely away from each other - you can have two wings with similar abilities and be successful. Big men like Gasol and Howard? I don't know. I see Gasol floating more and when he's settling for Jimmies that's not when he's at his best. Maybe I'm wrong I'm no offensive guru.

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 06:09 PM

Would be an interesting poll to see how many think the Lakers are now better than the Heat.

TheBoyWonder22 · 08-11-2012, 06:11 PM

None of the Thunder big three are a plus defender? Westbrook certainly is. Harden and Durant aren't bad either.

scottyboy · 08-11-2012, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gpngc

Ah but it's much different with wing players (especially one like LeBron who can play literally anywhere on the floor) and big men.

Down low is a much more confined space. Wings operate completely away from each other - you can have two wings with similar abilities and be successful. Big men like Gasol and Howard? I don't know. I see Gasol floating more and when he's settling for Jimmies that's not when he's at his best. Maybe I'm wrong I'm no offensive guru.

I think the set up is going to be Nash at top with Kobe running around the perimeter with him. Setting up drive and dishes. Keep Metta out in the corner where he can't **** up, and hit the wide open 3. Gasol should be running the high post, where I believe he can be tremendously effective. He can knock down that 15-20 foot jumper with consistency. Set screens up top for Nash to run the pick and pop. Nash drives, can kick to Kobe who can mamba, drive and dish to Dwight, or kick out to Pau for the jumper. They can certainly make it work and make it deadly. Pau has the feet and enough agility to be a pretty dangerous asset playing the high post.

TheBoyWonder22 · 08-11-2012, 06:15 PM

Just trade Pau and Metta for Kevin Love. That would be fun to watch.

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBoyWonder22

None of the Thunder big three are a plus defender? Westbrook certainly is. Harden and Durant aren't bad either.

Westbrook is quick, he gets his steals, but he's not a good team defender and for someone with his athleticism he gets beat way, way too much. He gambles a lot and always does weird things that leave me scratching my head. His focus is always offense and that's where you see his intensity. If he was that intense and energetic and enthusiastic on the defensive end, he'd be a monster but he just isn't.

gpngc · 08-11-2012, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottyboy

I think the set up is going to be Nash at top with Kobe running around the perimeter with him. Setting up drive and dishes. Keep Metta out in the corner where he can't **** up, and hit the wide open 3. Gasol should be running the high post, where I believe he can be tremendously effective. He can knock down that 15-20 foot jumper with consistency. Set screens up top for Nash to run the pick and pop. Nash drives, can kick to Kobe who can mamba, drive and dish to Dwight, or kick out to Pau for the jumper. They can certainly make it work and make it deadly. Pau has the feet and enough agility to be a pretty dangerous asset playing the high post.

I mean I don't disagree with any of these visions, I just think it's overly optimistic to expect it to work that well considering the histories of these particular players. I expect it to be a lot of work for them to mesh but we'll see.

Bold: I don't love a 7-footer who is a good FT shooter limiting himself to a jump shooter. Not that he'll be exclusively high post, but I feel he's at his best when he's down low drawing contact and passing out of the post, getting to the line.

We'll see. And it's different because of playing styles but I think the chemistry issues will remind us of Kobe/Shaq/Payton/Malone. Just my prediction.