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Old 08-23-2012, 08:26 PM    (permalink
Brothgar
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Originally Posted by KCStud View Post
Belicheck is Mike Shannahan 2.0. Can't wait to see his fall to mediocrity after Tom Brady hangs 'em up.
Didn't he make the playoffs every year or nearly every year when he had Bledsoe?
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 08-23-2012, 08:28 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by KCStud View Post
Belicheck is Mike Shannahan 2.0. Can't wait to see his fall to mediocrity after Tom Brady hangs 'em up.
Well, he's had a winning season without Tom Brady. A couple of them. One with the Browns. He's a great defensive minded head coach. Really, you can't fault him for having a Hall of Fame quarterback.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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Old 08-23-2012, 08:30 PM    (permalink
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Didn't he make the playoffs every year or nearly every year when he had Bledsoe?
No. He only had one season with Bledsoe (as his full time starter) and the Patriots I. believe they went 5-11. In 2000, his first season as the head coach of the Patriots. Next season Bledsoe gets hurt two games in, and here we are today.
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Old 08-23-2012, 08:51 PM    (permalink
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Then Brady gets hurt first game of the year in 2008 and a seventh rounder comes in with no experience plays the whole year and we go 11-5. Having Brady doesn't hurt anything obviously, but Belichick has worked some damn miracles with this team. Can't fault him for getting Brady, that definitely helped and continues to help him but everyone could have had Brady a few times
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Old 08-23-2012, 09:08 PM    (permalink
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I just think of the defense first and foremost when it comes to Belichick. He had some of the best defenses in the early 2000's alongside the Ravens, Dolphins, Eagles, and Buccaneers. His staff is pretty good at just managing games as well. The only glaring decision I remember from him during a game in the last ten years is when his team went four it on fourth down against the Colts.
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Old 08-23-2012, 11:46 PM    (permalink
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Jim Harbaugh and Rex Ryan are over rated.

Honestly Harbaugh belongs at knocking on the door.

RAC and Chan Gailey will get more love by season's end.

Darth Hoodie belongs in a class by himself as does Tomlin.
A guy who takes his team to 2 AFC Title games in his 1st 2 years and has yet to have an under .500 season as a head coach while transforming a defense into being in the top 10 each season is not overrated.

I agree with Rex's placement on the list. He still has some work to do as a head coach but he's not quite in the upper echelon just yet. Still a borderline top 10 head coach in the game.
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Old 08-24-2012, 10:10 AM    (permalink
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True, but the kind of fortune that the Giants have had in their Superbowl runs isn't the kind that you can expect year in and year out. Look at the Patriots in the early part of the past decade they caught every break imaginable. It directly led to 3 SB titles. Over the last 6 years they've had teams every bit as good as those ones, but haven't had the same kind of breaks and haven't won a title.

I know SB titles are the ultimate goal, but I think wielding consistently good teams is another aspect that you need to look at when evaluating coaches, because in a single elimination format like the NFL has oftentimes the most talented/ best coached teams do not win because as we've said before chance plays such a large role.

However, IMO if you have a Hall of Fame QB and a Hall of Fame Coach it is inexcusable to miss the playoffs any year regardless of division, especially if there are no other great coaches or QB's in the division. The same consistency just hasn't been there with Coughlin coached teams, and I think there is more to that than just the fact that there are good teams in the NFC East.

I think Coughlin is a great coach, and he certainly outcoached BB in the 2007 SB, but he's not quite on the same level. BB has kept a team consistently around 12-4 for a decade while fundamentally changing its DNA multiple times. There is something to that, and I need to see Coughlin coached teams be able to be consistently great week in and week out for more than a couple 4 week stretches in January before I'm willing to move him into that top tier.
No consistency? Coughlin hasn't had a losing record with the Giants except for his first year when Eli was just breaking in. He's been plenty consistent.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:12 AM    (permalink
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Mike Tomlin is not a great HC. TomTom is a glorified cheerleader on the sidelines.
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:19 AM    (permalink
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No consistency? Coughlin hasn't had a losing record with the Giants except for his first year when Eli was just breaking in. He's been plenty consistent.
He's missed the playoffs twice in the past 3 years and squeaked in last season. I'm not saying that he's not a good coach, but we're comparing his consistency with a guy who has rolled off 10+ win seasons for a decade straight.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:23 AM    (permalink
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He has won two rings, and his team turns it on during the playoffs. He has something to do with that.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:24 AM    (permalink
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He's missed the playoffs twice in the past 3 years and squeaked in last season. I'm not saying that he's not a good coach, but we're comparing his consistency with a guy who has rolled off 10+ win seasons for a decade straight.
He missed one year going 10-6 so hardly a bad year. Listen he's not Belichick but he's the next guy after him. If the Giants were in the Pats division we would have made the playoffs every year also.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:26 AM    (permalink
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He has won two rings, and his team turns it on during the playoffs. He has something to do with that.
I know that is why he's #2 IMO.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:35 AM    (permalink
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He's missed the playoffs twice in the past 3 years and squeaked in last season. I'm not saying that he's not a good coach, but we're comparing his consistency with a guy who has rolled off 10+ win seasons for a decade straight.
Squeaked in? So winning your division to get in counts as squeaking in? It was a 1 game playoff basically between us and dallas for the right to get our ticket punched for the post season.

The funny thing is if Dallas won to get in, no one or no fan would use the term squeaked in or backed their way in, or whatever. But we do it, and now it's squeaked in. We won our division which is what every team aims for en route to the playoffs, where the then you focus on winning it all. No team says let's get the wild card and get in the playoffs that way.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:39 AM    (permalink
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Squeaked in? So winning your division to get in counts as squeaking in? It was a 1 game playoff basically between us and dallas for the right to get our ticket punched for the post season.

The funny thing is if Dallas won to get in, no one or no fan would use the term squeaked in or backed their way in, or whatever. But we do it, and now it's squeaked in. We won our division which is what every team aims for en route to the playoffs, where the then you focus on winning it all. No team says let's get the wild card and get in the playoffs that way.
no, i GUARANTEE wed all still be saying that. The world isnt out to get the giants, sorry.
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:40 AM    (permalink
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Squeaked in? So winning your division to get in counts as squeaking in? It was a 1 game playoff basically between us and dallas for the right to get our ticket punched for the post season.

The funny thing is if Dallas won to get in, no one or no fan would use the term squeaked in or backed their way in, or whatever. But we do it, and now it's squeaked in. We won our division which is what every team aims for en route to the playoffs, where the then you focus on winning it all. No team says let's get the wild card and get in the playoffs that way.
You went 9-7 and it came down to the last game. That is squeaking in any way you slice it. With a roster as talented as your's you should have had an easier time getting in. Again this isn't an indictment of Coughlin as a bad coach, he's had 2 very impressive runs, but his body of work isn't comparable to BB's at this time.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:45 AM    (permalink
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You went 9-7 and it came down to the last game. That is squeaking in any way you slice it. With a roster as talented as your's you should have had an easier time getting in. Again this isn't an indictment of Coughlin as a bad coach, he's had 2 very impressive runs, but his body of work isn't comparable to BB's at this time.
It's the NFL east, what do you expect? The Colts way of doing it back in the day where you clinch the division months in advance?

Not anywhere close to true. We won our division. That's the goal. It came down to the last day because Dallas and our team was going to toe to toe. Eagles and Skins bowed out, and it was a 2 team race. Not even close to squeaking in. Squeaking in refers to a WC in the form of needing help to get in. Meaning you need other teams to help you and then you get in via the WC. Winning your division doesn't qualify as squeaking in any form.

No, I understand your point on coughlin. However, like I said before, that's more of his thing on hiring stupid coordinators, specifically the defensive side of the ball.

If Perry Fewell can do well for a whole season, then we will be good to go. No more rush 3, and drop 8 in coverage! Dumbest thing I saw time after time all year long.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:46 AM    (permalink
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no, i GUARANTEE wed all still be saying that. The world isnt out to get the giants, sorry.
I bet no one in the media or other fans would be saying that. We'd be hearing about how Romo finally turned the corner and is on his way and so on and so forth. Maybe you're right, but it feels that way with the BS we deal with, and hence the respect card is always played.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:48 AM    (permalink
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"its the NFC east, what do you expect?"

give me a break, idk why they are continually anointed the class of the divisions. They were not a good division last year but are always talked about as the best division

if the cowboys won, i bet it would be called even more of a fluke than the giants (which i dont think it was a fluke at all, but i do agree they barely snuck in). The turn the corner omg they are the best team ever would have been vick and the eagles if they were anywhere close to being good enough last year, godddddd id still be nauseous from that
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Old 08-24-2012, 12:00 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by K Train View Post
"its the NFC east, what do you expect?"

give me a break, idk why they are continually anointed the class of the divisions. They were not a good division last year but are always talked about as the best division

if the cowboys won, i bet it would be called even more of a fluke than the giants (which i dont think it was a fluke at all, but i do agree they barely snuck in). The turn the corner omg they are the best team ever would have been vick and the eagles if they were anywhere close to being good enough last year, godddddd id still be nauseous from that


I don't know why they would call it a fluke. It was the dream team, cowboys, and then us as the team to win the division. So I have no idea where you're pulling that inaccurate stuff from.

As for always being talked about, I guess it's because the Cowboys are in it. America's team and all that jazz. As long as they are in our division they will always be talked about and so will our division. And the Eagles seem to be the team that the media backs as the team that will break out. Maybe it's the talent level or the fact they are the only team that doesn't have a SB in our division.

And if you are going to get sick from it, I'd suggest investing in barf bags, because it's going to get worse now that Bob Griffin is in the division.

But good conversation, thanks. I have to take a practice MCAT test, lol. But talk to you later man. Have a good day!
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Old 08-24-2012, 01:17 PM    (permalink
K Train
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Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG View Post
I don't know why they would call it a fluke. It was the dream team, cowboys, and then us as the team to win the division. So I have no idea where you're pulling that inaccurate stuff from.

As for always being talked about, I guess it's because the Cowboys are in it. America's team and all that jazz. As long as they are in our division they will always be talked about and so will our division. And the Eagles seem to be the team that the media backs as the team that will break out. Maybe it's the talent level or the fact they are the only team that doesn't have a SB in our division.

And if you are going to get sick from it, I'd suggest investing in barf bags, because it's going to get worse now that Bob Griffin is in the division.

But good conversation, thanks. I have to take a practice MCAT test, lol. But talk to you later man. Have a good day!
i was saying sick of the eagles, had they won a superbowl it would bring true my worst nightmare in all of sports aside from maybe the ravens but even that would be a toss up for me. I think the giants are a good team, and they turned it on in the playoffs twice now after 2 not so pretty seasons. I know what its like to have to defend your team winning a superbowl lol
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 08-25-2012, 04:42 PM    (permalink
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Jim Harbaugh is top shelf but Sean Payton isn't? Or Tom Coughlin for that matter?

...

Okay.
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