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Old 09-25-2012, 09:58 PM    (permalink
Rosebud
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Originally Posted by soybean View Post
I don't know why everyone is so high on Jake Locker. I get that he's very mobile, throws a pretty spiral and has a cannon for an arm but I still think he's wildly inaccurate. Granted, I haven't seen much of him but I remember 2 plays including the Nate Washington TD this past weekend where it was a horrible placement the receiver just made an amazing play.

the term 'circus catch' usually means inaccurate pass compensated by good play by the wr.

I think Locker will end up like Kyle Boller.

But meh, I could be wrong.
Locker's accuracy only wanders when he gets too into the "**** is hitting the fan" mindset the way it does with jay Cutler some games. Now Locker isn't playing behind that embarrassment to the sport, that is the chicago bear's OL, but he's also a first year QB. I think he's got the moxy to learn to focus a little bit more on his mechanics and a little less on needing to run for his life, he's not at Washington anymore. Now I'm not completely sold that he will make good on his abilities and continue to settle down, but I think there's a good chance he does with what he has to work with in Tennessee, which would lead to a very good QB.

BTW Ryan Tannenhill should be on this list. I am a believer in that kid. Kinda like the JPP of QBs he's just got remarkable natural talent and surprisingly good understanding of how to use them for someone so completely inexperienced and under-prepared.
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 09-25-2012, 11:14 PM    (permalink
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You make a good point. He wasn't the best prospect (which really hurts his image on a draft site), is in a offense that fits him perfectly, and has a stud young wr; but this guy has already won a lot of games and has the best resume of these guys so far. Granted its still way way too early, but Dalton has already made the playoffs.

Long term he isn't at the top of my list probably, but the guy deserves some praise. Dalton had a great rookie year & is playing well this year too. He is underrated for sure.
He still doesnt have the physical tools of Luck, Newton, or RG3 But he limits his mistakes and has shown a bit more improvement from last year to this year. I projected him to have a winning record last year despite his red hair and he delivered. He has that playoff game under his belt, although it was a loss, its still experience. Im not deeming him a HOF or anything but when making my list I think I would put him right below Newton. I honestly dont think theyre far apart.
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Old 09-26-2012, 03:46 AM    (permalink
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Funny, seems like the last thread like this taught everyone absolutely nothing. Our opinions on al of the QBs in that poll have flustered drastically in the last few years, yet everyone shows up here with guns blazing and ranking these guys like its anywhere set in stone.

If anything, five me tiers based on potential. That'd pretty much put Luck/RG3/Cam in tier 1 and the rest in tier two. It's nothing close to clear cut.

Easy to look at Ponder in a few games this year and call him better than both Locker and Gabbert. I'd agree. But next year, hell maybe later this season we may be talking about Locker and Gabbert progressing and getting into that top-15 echelon while Ponder remains an above average game manager.

Not saying we can't have opinions or long term outlooks on these guys, just thought it was ironic that everyone came flying into this thread with set rankings of these guys while the thread like this for the last group of QBs showed everyone knows nothing and everything changes on a year-to-year basis - sometimes week-to-week.

We may eventually talk about Mallett or Tannehill as the best QBs from this class, and they haven't even be mentioned. Lets discuss these classes of QBs in this thread, but the immediate rankings and reactions to them are all ridiculous.

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Old 09-26-2012, 04:10 AM    (permalink
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Mallett is eventually going to start, just wondering where??
Will it be in NE if/when Brady goes down with an unexpected injury?? Or will he be traded??

I'm still really high on Mallett and think he was the 2nd best QB prospect in the 2011 draft after Newton.

Agree these young guns threads shouldn't be ranking all prospects against each other and should focus more on discussing how these players are developing.
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Old 09-26-2012, 08:44 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by GaMeTiMe View Post
Funny, seems like the last thread like this taught everyone absolutely nothing. Our opinions on al of the QBs in that poll have flustered drastically in the last few years, yet everyone shows up here with guns blazing and ranking these guys like its anywhere set in stone.

If anything, five me tiers based on potential. That'd pretty much put Luck/RG3/Cam in tier 1 and the rest in tier two. It's nothing close to clear cut.

Easy to look at Ponder in a few games this year and call him better than both Locker and Gabbert. I'd agree. But next year, hell maybe later this season we may be talking about Locker and Gabbert progressing and getting into that top-15 echelon while Ponder remains an above average game manager.

Not saying we can't have opinions or long term outlooks on these guys, just thought it was ironic that everyone came flying into this thread with set rankings of these guys while the thread like this for the last group of QBs showed everyone knows nothing and everything changes on a year-to-year basis - sometimes week-to-week.

We may eventually talk about Mallett or Tannehill as the best QBs from this class, and they haven't even be mentioned. Lets discuss these classes of QBs in this thread, but the immediate rankings and reactions to them are all ridiculous.
I understand that reading can be difficult...but literally two posts before yours, brody...
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 09-26-2012, 10:08 AM    (permalink
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I understand that reading can be difficult...but literally two posts before yours, brody...
The essence of the post remains valid.
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Old 09-26-2012, 10:12 AM    (permalink
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The essence of the post remains valid.
The essence of the post contradicts the very idea of a message board. If we're not going to discuss our opinions of the future what's the point of this website? Why would we discuss anything other than post game recaps? Of course we don't know what'll happen, that's what makes it interesting to hear what others think will happen and why they think what they do. Especially in a thread about young QBs who haven't even started to get even close to their peaks.
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
Quote:
Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 09-26-2012, 12:29 PM    (permalink
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The essence of the post contradicts the very idea of a message board. If we're not going to discuss our opinions of the future what's the point of this website? Why would we discuss anything other than post game recaps? Of course we don't know what'll happen, that's what makes it interesting to hear what others think will happen and why they think what they do. Especially in a thread about young QBs who haven't even started to get even close to their peaks.
FACTS! Only FACTS! Any opinions, speculation or critical thinking will not be tolerated on this forum! You may copy and paste box scores, but you cannot interpret them in any thoughtful way.

Exceptions to this rule include:

1) Scottyboy discussing current and former Rutgers players.

2) J-mike complaining about packers injuries.

3) Vidae crying about the Chiefs.

Failure to comply will result in immediate whining by people who want FACTUAL based discussion.
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Old 09-26-2012, 12:33 PM    (permalink
Rosebud
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FACTS! Only FACTS! Any opinions, speculation or critical thinking will not be tolerated on this forum! You may copy and paste box scores, but you cannot interpret them in any thoughtful way.

Exceptions to this rule include:

1) Scottyboy discussing current and former Rutgers players.

2) J-mike complaining about packers injuries.

3) Vidae crying about the Chiefs.

Failure to comply will result in immediate whining by people who want FACTUAL based discussion.
So what do we do with Cudders then? Am I no longer allowed to use his post to more eloquently explain to people why I'm a Tannenhill fan? Cause he doesn't use very many stats and numbers at all.
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Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
Quote:
Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:01 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by GaMeTiMe View Post
Funny, seems like the last thread like this taught everyone absolutely nothing. Our opinions on al of the QBs in that poll have flustered drastically in the last few years, yet everyone shows up here with guns blazing and ranking these guys like its anywhere set in stone.

If anything, five me tiers based on potential. That'd pretty much put Luck/RG3/Cam in tier 1 and the rest in tier two. It's nothing close to clear cut.

Easy to look at Ponder in a few games this year and call him better than both Locker and Gabbert. I'd agree. But next year, hell maybe later this season we may be talking about Locker and Gabbert progressing and getting into that top-15 echelon while Ponder remains an above average game manager.

Not saying we can't have opinions or long term outlooks on these guys, just thought it was ironic that everyone came flying into this thread with set rankings of these guys while the thread like this for the last group of QBs showed everyone knows nothing and everything changes on a year-to-year basis - sometimes week-to-week.

We may eventually talk about Mallett or Tannehill as the best QBs from this class, and they haven't even be mentioned. Lets discuss these classes of QBs in this thread, but the immediate rankings and reactions to them are all ridiculous.
I agree it's a fluid situation. If it were just based on initial progress and results you'd just hand it to Newton or even Dalton, who made the playoffs.

Each QB is in a differant place as far as what he has around him and what is asked of him. Good group of QBs there and except for the one or two that will crash and burn they all should have nice careers.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:43 PM    (permalink
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I know I am going to get flamed a bit for this but this is how I would rank them if I were a GM.

1. Luck
2. RG3
3a. Dalton (Production)
3b. Locker (Potential)
4. Newton
5. Ponder
6. Gabbert

I am sure the fact the Cam is 4/5 on my list is going to rub 95% of people the wrong way. I understand his tools, his insane production... I just don't like the guy. I think last season was a bit of fluke. Sure I can see him being a solid to good NFL QB but I don't know if I see what everyone else sees.

Let the **** storm commence.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:47 PM    (permalink
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I like Locker a lot, but I don't think he'll be the 1st and 4th best QB.
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:49 PM    (permalink
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1. Locker
2. RG3
3a. Dalton (Production)
3b. Locker (Potential)
4. Newton
5. Ponder
6. Gabbert

no Luck... tsk tsk. I get the Locker love but to have him as both the best and 3b. I don't know if I can agree with you there.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:51 PM    (permalink
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Cain, you disappoint me with your lack of Tannehill. (Also, where's Luck and Weeden? I take it one of the Lockers is supposed to be luck...)
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:59 PM    (permalink
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Yeah I was eating while typing. Luck was number one.

As for Tannehill Grizz I would throw him after Cam ahead of Ponder and Weeden well I don't know if I even want to go there.
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Old 09-27-2012, 07:14 PM    (permalink
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Gabbert still sucks.

Ponder is improving.

Dalton is steady.

Locker is going to be better than Cam Newton when it's all said and done.

Newton won't ever have a season as good as his rookie season and he'll wear out his welcome.

Griffin I don't have a bead on yet, but I think durability will be his ultimate undoing.

Luck will be the face of the league for the next decade plus, and prove to be exactly what all the hype was about.
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Old 09-29-2012, 02:17 PM    (permalink
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Something tells me that the best qb in that 2011 class has yet to take a snap yet and it only does him better sitting behind Brady and gaining tutelage from Mr. Bellichik.
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Old 09-29-2012, 02:42 PM    (permalink
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It's sad how people are hating on Cam, because they were wrong on him when he was drafted. Seems like everyone wants him to fail.

1. Luck
2. RG3
3. Newton
4. Dalton
5. Ponder
6. Tannehill
7. Locker
8. Wilson
9. Weeden
10. Gabbert

1. Mallett
2. Kaepernick
3. Foles
4. Osweiler
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Old 09-29-2012, 02:54 PM    (permalink
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It's sad how people are hating on Cam, because they were wrong on him when he was drafted. Seems like everyone wants him to fail.

1. Luck
2. RG3
3. Newton
4. Dalton
5. Ponder
6. Tannehill
7. Locker
8. Wilson
9. Weeden
10. Gabbert

1. Mallett
2. Kaepernick
3. Foles
4. Osweiler
LULZWUT???

Even though you split em up, I would put Mallet and Kaep over Weeden too.
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Old 09-29-2012, 02:55 PM    (permalink
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LULZWUT???

Even though you split em up, I would put Mallet and Kaep over Weeden too.
Everyone saying "Cam is going to bust!!". They're upset that he hasn't yet and are hanging onto the fact that he still could.
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Old 09-29-2012, 03:16 PM    (permalink
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You know, watching Baylor this year, and seeing Nick Florence perform and basically not miss a beat on offense, makes me think how good Griffin actually was or the system?
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Old 09-29-2012, 03:18 PM    (permalink
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You can't really rank Mallet at this time ahead of anyone, but I think he can and will be the best out of the 2011 class and most of the 2012 guys. I think there were too many negatives with him in terms of off the field issues, but Bill Bellichik took him, and he's big on character.
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Old 09-29-2012, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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Thing about Newton and RG III is , they cannot succeed in the current offenses they run for very long. This is the NFL. None of this read/option crap offenses. You see it in Carolina right now with Newton. They're isolating his athleticism by putting a faster LB as a spy and getting to him in the pocket, making him read defenses and he's struggling. Him adjusting as a pocket passer and only using his athelticism when needed will have to be what he does to succeed in the nfl.

Same with RG III. ^.
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Old 09-29-2012, 03:22 PM    (permalink
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You can't really rank Mallet at this time ahead of anyone, but I think he can and will be the best out of the 2011 class and most of the 2012 guys. I think there were too many negatives with him in terms of off the field issues, but Bill Bellichik took him, and he's big on character.
This is why these threads aren't very good but provide tons of lols. They don't define what you're ranking them on. Production? Potential? A little bit of both? So everyone's rankings and opinions differ. Although some are just straight up fail.
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Old 09-29-2012, 03:39 PM    (permalink
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This is why these threads aren't very good but provide tons of lols. They don't define what you're ranking them on. Production? Potential? A little bit of both? So everyone's rankings and opinions differ. Although some are just straight up fail.
Oh yeah definately agree. I'll admit to get carried away, but my opinions and analysts towards a guy like Newton has stayed consistant. Same with RG III, where most on here are ready to put them in the HOF.
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