Draft Countdown Forums

Go Back   Draft Countdown Forums > Draft Countdown Forums > Pro Football

Pro Football Discuss professional football.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-05-2012, 08:55 PM    (permalink
bearsfan_51
The Professor (Hall of Famer)
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
Posts: 36,296
Reputation: 2341466
bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bearsfan_51 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

"I think that just as athletes you've got to be careful where you are and what you're doing," Manning said Thursday. "You try to be conscious of it. But also, if you want to have fun - you're still a person and you have a right to enjoy yourself."

-Eli Manning supports rape.
__________________


Nobody cares about your stupid fantasy team.
bearsfan_51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 08:59 PM    (permalink
brat316
bhaarat316
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: earth
Posts: 13,781
Reputation: 1048817
brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Accused rapes, lets get that straight. Innocent till proven guilty, they just want his money.
__________________
brat316 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 09:05 PM    (permalink
NY+Giants=NYG
All-Pro
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 9,356
Reputation: 295348
NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by y.f.s. View Post
How many yards a guy throws for or Superbowls won aren't really stats IMO. It's trivia.
Well the 2nd part, SBs won is the stat or trivia as you call it that gets you in the HOF. So personally, I consider that a stat, a big one, which helps in the HOF talk.
NY+Giants=NYG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 09:29 PM    (permalink
y.f.s.
Rookie
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 445
Reputation: 547290
y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.y.f.s. is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG View Post
Well the 2nd part, SBs won is the stat or trivia as you call it that gets you in the HOF. So personally, I consider that a stat, a big one, which helps in the HOF talk.
I understand the appeal to authority the HOF has, but the voting process pretty much shows that it's full of inherent human biases. IMO, the HOF is as much about sportswriter politics and preserving the historical narrative of Pro Football as it is a 100% meritocratic recognization of the best players in league history.

BTW, I'm not sure Superbowl success is as important to the voters as overall postseason impact. But again, this goes back to narrative and whether what's important for the HOF should be the definition of greatness, so to speak.
y.f.s. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 09:33 PM    (permalink
fenikz
Pillow Hat Pal
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: ain't know one ***** with tiny hippo. ain't no one
Posts: 28,820
Reputation: 4223157
fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.fenikz is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bhaarat316 View Post
Accused rapes, lets get that straight. Innocent till proven guilty, they just want his money.
and he paid them the money, an innocent man would want his name cleared

he is a rapist
__________________

fenikz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 09:58 PM    (permalink
brat316
bhaarat316
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: earth
Posts: 13,781
Reputation: 1048817
brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.brat316 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fenikz View Post
and he paid them the money, an innocent man would want his name cleared

he is a rapist
yeah its pretty obvious, with that mug. I"m sure he paid the girl that married him. I ain't sayin she a gold digger, but she ain't messing with no broke rapist.
__________________
brat316 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2012, 10:00 PM    (permalink
NY+Giants=NYG
All-Pro
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: NJ
Posts: 9,356
Reputation: 295348
NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.NY+Giants=NYG is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by y.f.s. View Post
I understand the appeal to authority the HOF has, but the voting process pretty much shows that it's full of inherent human biases. IMO, the HOF is as much about sportswriter politics and preserving the historical narrative of Pro Football as it is a 100% meritocratic recognization of the best players in league history.

BTW, I'm not sure Superbowl success is as important to the voters as overall postseason impact. But again, this goes back to narrative and whether what's important for the HOF should be the definition of greatness, so to speak.
The HOF voting process, right or wrong, isn't what I am saying. It's that stat, SB win, for a HC and QB means something. They say you play the game to win the coveted SB. Well, if you win, and win a bunch you go to the sport's immortal realm, which is the HOF.

I think it can be both, post season impact, as well as eventually winning a SB, or en route to a SB win. All that gets added to the player's resume, and the voters look at that. Again, whether it's good or bad, I am not saying, but the SB win is important stat. You can call it trivia, that's fine, it very well could be trivia. But that trivia or stat is important for this sport and can get you into football heaven in Canton.

Most QBs with more than 1 SB win get into the HOF except for Jim Plunkett. It can be used as trivia or a stat or what not. But winning a SB is pretty damn important either way for the HOF.
NY+Giants=NYG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 01:58 AM    (permalink
Rosebud
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Enjoying a succulent peach
Posts: 10,596
Reputation: 2578670
Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rosebud is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bearsfan_51 View Post
I never said I was. But it matters to me a lot more that something as obviously team-based as win-loss record.

Eli throws an interception every 33 times he throws the ball. That number hasn't improved one bit as he's matured in his career (it's actually slightly worse over the last 2 1/2 seasons). That's almost double the rate of Rodgers.

Some of those interceptions are situationally dependent, but those situations aren't any more likely to happen to Eli as they are to anyone else. The Giants don't push the ball down the field with any more frequency than most teams, and they typically have a stronger running game and defense to play with.

Eli just turns the ball over too much to be considered elite in my book. It's not complicated, no matter how much you want to make this something it isn't.
No offense brah, but the **** are you talking about? The giants running game has been **** for a while now and they do push the ball further down the field than most teams, all while having the most complex routes in the NFL. So literally the entire context you've mentioned is wrong for how often Eli throws picks.
__________________

BK

Quote:
Originally Posted by AcheTen View Post
JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
Quote:
Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
Rosebud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 02:04 AM    (permalink
scottyboy
Coolio Cat
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Stalking Brian Leonard and Raymell Rice
Posts: 24,421
Reputation: 4210181
scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Eli is the third best qb in the league, behind Brady and Rodgers. At me is the general direction in which you can come.
__________________
We ALL bleed scarlet
New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
Quote:
Originally Posted by PalmerToCJ View Post
BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
scottyboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 02:57 AM    (permalink
Matthew Jones
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: China
Posts: 13,940
Reputation: 1855213
Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyboy View Post
Eli is the third best qb in the league, behind Brady and Rodgers. At me is the general direction in which you can come.
Only because Mike Teel is retired.
__________________
Matthew Jones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 06:42 AM    (permalink
abaddon41_80
Pro Bowler
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Jacksonville, Fl
Posts: 4,013
Reputation: 323867
abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.abaddon41_80 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyboy View Post
Eli is the third best qb in the league, behind Brady and Rodgers. At me is the general direction in which you can come.
Mohamed Sanu > Eli. Perfect QB rating, never thrown an incomplete pass, etc.
abaddon41_80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 07:19 AM    (permalink
scottyboy
Coolio Cat
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Stalking Brian Leonard and Raymell Rice
Posts: 24,421
Reputation: 4210181
scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.scottyboy is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Teel and Sanu are obviously the top 2, I just assumed we were talking about after them.
__________________
We ALL bleed scarlet
New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
Quote:
Originally Posted by PalmerToCJ View Post
BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
scottyboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 09:20 AM    (permalink
Jvig43
Icon
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dropping Brady Passes
Posts: 16,898
Reputation: 4904671
Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Eh no Brees scotty? I feel like Brees is certainly above Eli, but I would have no problem putting Eli at foourth behind him. Obviously if Peyton were healthy that might bump him down another spot but since he hasn't completely returned to that form yet (maybe he will, havent seen any denver games this year yet to tell) I think its fair to put Eli 4th.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by WMD View Post
Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
Jvig43 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 10:09 AM    (permalink
Scotty D
Team Leader
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 14,675
Reputation: 1647819
Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Scotty D is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Well, are you talking about performance this season or resume? Because Matt Ryan is beast mode this year.
__________________

sig by BoneKrusher
Scotty D is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 10:18 AM    (permalink
Jvig43
Icon
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dropping Brady Passes
Posts: 16,898
Reputation: 4904671
Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

When I rank a QB i never rank them strictly on what they are currently doing and I think far too many people do that. If were ranking QBs (current), who is elite etc, we are taking into account more than one season, or two seasons. Were looking at their entire body of work, why people have such knee jerk reactions to the present is beyond me.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by WMD View Post
Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
Jvig43 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 10:24 AM    (permalink
SuperPacker
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: awkward
Posts: 11,063
Reputation: 2237213
SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.SuperPacker is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

You could say "Matt Ryan is playing at an elite level" but it would be extremely premature to say he's an elite QB, after 4 games.
__________________



RIP themaninblack
SuperPacker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 04:28 PM    (permalink
PACKmanN
All-Pro
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: toronto
Posts: 7,049
Reputation: 114301
PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PACKmanN is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jvig43 View Post
When I rank a QB i never rank them strictly on what they are currently doing and I think far too many people do that. If were ranking QBs (current), who is elite etc, we are taking into account more than one season, or two seasons. Were looking at their entire body of work, why people have such knee jerk reactions to the present is beyond me.
You cannot base elite talent off of in-season. It's the consistent elite play in that qb's history that makes him elite. If we base it off of only during each season then practically every qb can be or could have been elite. Which is outrageous.
__________________
PACKmanN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 04:44 PM    (permalink
Matthew Jones
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: China
Posts: 13,940
Reputation: 1855213
Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Matthew Jones is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

The only quarterbacks that should be called elite are the ones with the championships. That means Brady, the Mannings, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Ben Roethlisberger. Guys like Matt Ryan, Philip Rivers, Tony Romo, Matthew Stafford, Michael Vick, Joe Flacco, etc. belong in the next tier (franchise quarterback?)
__________________
Matthew Jones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 04:49 PM    (permalink
bigbluedefense
Team Leader
Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Jersey
Posts: 28,871
Reputation: 4076734
bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.bigbluedefense is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PACKmanN View Post
You cannot base elite talent off of in-season. It's the consistent elite play in that qb's history that makes him elite. If we base it off of only during each season then practically every qb can be or could have been elite. Which is outrageous.
So how long of a sample size do we need?

Because guys like Rodgers for example, has been elite for 3 years, but is 3 years enough to say for certain that he is elite? I say yes, because I have no concerns about him declining, I fully expect him to continue playing like he does for the next 7 years or so.

There's a fine line. It's why I have confidence in calling Eli elite. Does he have 6 years of elite play? No, he does not. But I fully expect him to continue to play at an elite level for the rest of his career as long as he can stay healthy.
__________________
bigbluedefense is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 05:20 PM    (permalink
Jvig43
Icon
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Dropping Brady Passes
Posts: 16,898
Reputation: 4904671
Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Jvig43 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PACKmanN View Post
You cannot base elite talent off of in-season. It's the consistent elite play in that qb's history that makes him elite. If we base it off of only during each season then practically every qb can be or could have been elite. Which is outrageous.
Yes, that was my point.
__________________


Quote:
Originally Posted by WMD View Post
Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
Jvig43 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 06:00 PM    (permalink
Raiderz4Life
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: R4L 3:16 says I just whipped your ass
Posts: 14,236
Reputation: 3009822
Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Raiderz4Life is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
The only quarterbacks that should be called elite are the ones with the championships. That means Brady, the Mannings, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Ben Roethlisberger. Guys like Matt Ryan, Philip Rivers, Tony Romo, Matthew Stafford, Michael Vick, Joe Flacco, etc. belong in the next tier (franchise quarterback?)
That's ridiculous. If that's your measuring stick Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer were elite too right?
__________________

Props to BK for the sig
"Impulsive thinker, compulsive drinker, addict, half animal half man"
Quote:
Originally Posted by njx9 View Post
that's because we're the only animal capable of getting it from other animals. the day a goat can milk cows, it will.
Raiderz4Life is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 06:16 PM    (permalink
prock
All-Pro
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 9,146
Reputation: 2098837
prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.prock is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by raiderz4life View Post
That's ridiculous. If that's your measuring stick Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer were elite too right?
No, you interpreted that poorly. He is saying you need to have a championship to be elite, but having a championship doesn't necessarily make you elite.
__________________

Bonekrusher.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanTaber View Post
Football...it's rocket surgery now, folks.
prock is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 07:39 PM    (permalink
Ness
Icon
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: California
Posts: 19,985
Reputation: 2134825
Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Ness is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
The only quarterbacks that should be called elite are the ones with the championships. That means Brady, the Mannings, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Ben Roethlisberger. Guys like Matt Ryan, Philip Rivers, Tony Romo, Matthew Stafford, Michael Vick, Joe Flacco, etc. belong in the next tier (franchise quarterback?)
But why? Football is a team sport and not everyone can be a champion due to a lot of variables that are out of one's control, no matter how good of a player at their individual position they are. Marino, Moon, and Fouts were elite guys in their hey-day.
__________________

"Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
-San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Borat View Post
Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
Ness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 07:51 PM    (permalink
Borat
All-NFLDC
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: The NFC West. Where people play defense.
Posts: 10,941
Reputation: 2450167
Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Borat is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Dan Marino. Obviously, not elite.
__________________


I'm sorry Brian Sabean. I was wrong. I think I might have been right, but you have Scoreboard.
Borat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 08:59 PM    (permalink
Rob S
Suck it Metsox
Legend
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: I'm a simple man. I like pretty, dark haired women and breakfast food
Posts: 24,211
Reputation: 4093934
Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Rob S is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I think it's fair to say that, in general, you need a championship to be considered an elite QB. There can be exceptions obviously (Marino, Kelly, Tarkenton), but in general it's true. Exceptions to the rule will be glaringly obvious in all cases.

I don't really understand why this discussion has gained so much steam. It's pretty cut and dry imo. meh.
__________________
When I eat, it is the food that is scared.
Rob S is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.