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Old 11-26-2012, 03:23 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by leroyisgod View Post
I'm not even that sold on Smith at this point. He's regressed some in my opinion. Yes he's at LT now and it's a bit harder, but maybe I'm the only one that hasn't been all that impressed with him this year.
I'm not terribly worried about Tyron he is still on of the youngest players in the league turning 22 in a couple weeks. Most of his issues have been false starts which can be attributed to thinking to much and not keying on the snap count. This is a big adjustment for him he hasn't played LT for the first time in 4-5 years?(Khalil played LT at USC).

Something that hasn't been brought up to my knowledge is both Smith and Free were at their best playing next to Kyle Kosier. Adding a plus player on the interior line could do wonders for the unit as a whole.
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Old 11-26-2012, 03:39 PM    (permalink
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I'm not terribly worried about Tyron he is still on of the youngest players in the league turning 22 in a couple weeks. Most of his issues have been false starts which can be attributed to thinking to much and not keying on the snap count. This is a big adjustment for him he hasn't played LT for the first time in 4-5 years?(Khalil played LT at USC).

Something that hasn't been brought up to my knowledge is both Smith and Free were at their best playing next to Kyle Kosier. Adding a plus player on the interior line could do wonders for the unit as a whole.
I think he can develop, but I'm just not as high on him as others are. I agree with having an experienced IL next to him.
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Old 11-26-2012, 04:04 PM    (permalink
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I don't think Smith has regressed, but asking him as a 21 year older to play at a pro bowl level, alongside 4 JAG's isn't what you should be doing at all. He's still younger then nearly every rookie LT coming out next year, and when you don't have a Guard you trust next to you, communication breakdowns occur all the time. He's a stud, you just can't expect him to play like one at that age, he may not be a hall of famer but you would be hard pressed to find many better LT's under 25 in the NFL right now.


He'll get beat by JPP in 1 on 1 and everybody starts piling on about him regressing(not you leroy, just that talk in general from btb and places), if you slapped him on Tampa Bay's offensive line with their All Pro guards all of a sudden people are talking about Tyron completely different.
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I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.
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Old 11-26-2012, 04:13 PM    (permalink
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So the Bucs lose Eric Wright at CB, and they were already ranked dead last in the league, up next they face Peyton and Brees. Seahawks lost both of their CB's for the final 4 games, the Vikes don't have a chance with Ponder, Saints have a few more losses with that schedule, there is so much room here to snag a playoff spot it's not even funny. 9-7 looks like it may do it.


Funny thing is I project 8-8. Miss a playoff spot by 1 game, and win just enough to keep JG and to miss out on a premium pick for a QB. That's pretty typical for us.
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Old 11-26-2012, 04:13 PM    (permalink
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I think expectations of OL by the Cowboys fans are a bit unrealistic. Guys are gonna get beat. It happens.

Those 90s OLs won't ever happen anymore. Those days are over. FA won't allow for it. Plus I think in general defensive linemen are just much more athletic than OLmen nowadays.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:06 PM    (permalink
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I think expectations of OL by the Cowboys fans are a bit unrealistic. Guys are gonna get beat. It happens.

Those 90s OLs won't ever happen anymore. Those days are over. FA won't allow for it. Plus I think in general defensive linemen are just much more athletic than OLmen nowadays.
I agree with you to an extent. We had virtually 5 pro bowlers on those teams. That's not gonna happen anymore. I'd say I'd be happy with 2 pro bowlers and 3 guys that can hold their own.

On a side note, I think Parnell has played his way into being our future RT.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:14 PM    (permalink
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On a side note, I think Parnell has played his way into being our future RT.
Yep. Sure he's not some diamond in the rough that is a future pro bowler, but he's a starter, and a solid one. Other then the small, quick pass rushers on that side he'll do fine. The athleticism is obvious, and he's a massive dude with really long arms, if you don't get a nice initial move on him your out of the play. Can't wait to make that official switch. Then we can go Guard and Center first, sign one guard, BAM 4 new starters next year.
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I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:32 PM    (permalink
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Lol, didn't I JUST say that Cowboys fans overrate their own talent?

Like seriously, we're all ready to crown Parnell....didn't we just do that with doug free 2 years ago?


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Old 11-26-2012, 05:32 PM    (permalink
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I haven't paid a lot of attention to Mackenzy, but what's the opinion on him at center?

Also, I'm liking what I've seen out of Harris and Beasley.
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Old 11-26-2012, 05:32 PM    (permalink
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Lol, didn't I JUST say that Cowboys fans overrate their own talent?

Like seriously, we're all ready to crown Parnell....didn't we just do that with doug free 2 years ago?


Nobody is crowning him, just saying he's showing some flashes that he could be a solid RT for us.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:01 PM    (permalink
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Lol, didn't I JUST say that Cowboys fans overrate their own talent?

Like seriously, we're all ready to crown Parnell....didn't we just do that with doug free 2 years ago?


Guys here have only called him a suitable replacement for Free, and specifically stated that he's not a Pro Bowl player, but still solid starter material.

When we did it with Free, it was true at the time. For whatever reason he is not that same player.

Seriously, we can't ever win. We bash Spencer and he's labeled underrated. We bash Felix, crucify our OL, want Romo replaced, can't stand Austin always getting hurt, complain about every single mistake Dez makes... and yet we are a bunch of fans that always overrate our guys?
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:01 PM    (permalink
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Is Jerry his own worst enemy?
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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Is Jerry his own worst enemy?
Top 3 reasons why folks hate Jerry.

I wanna hear them.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:25 PM    (permalink
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Lol, didn't I JUST say that Cowboys fans overrate their own talent?

Like seriously, we're all ready to crown Parnell....didn't we just do that with doug free 2 years ago?


Your right dude. I lol everytime somebody says that Miles Austin will be worth a damn, he's a fast kick returner at best and will never be a starter in this league. Jay Ratliff is just a JAG at NT who has shown flashes. Bruce Carter is obviously just good in shorts too, nothing to see there.


What is your point exactly? I hate points like this because it doesn't even say anything. Have you watched Parnell the last two games at LT or is it more fun to just do facepalm gifs and talk about typical Cowboy fans? Because if you had watched him you wouldn't have been making the same sarcastic post. Or maybe you did and you'd say why he wouldn't be any good...


Doug Free was one of the best RT's in the league that year, it's proven by watching him that year and all the stats used to account for offensive lineman. He's seriously declined in play since that year. That doesn't change the fact that he was a REALLY good RT for us. But according to you, nobody can be good for the Cowboys because we all overrate our players anyway.
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I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:48 PM    (permalink
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Your right dude. I lol everytime somebody says that Miles Austin will be worth a damn, he's a fast kick returner at best and will never be a starter in this league. Jay Ratliff is just a JAG at NT who has shown flashes. Bruce Carter is obviously just good in shorts too, nothing to see there.


What is your point exactly? I hate points like this because it doesn't even say anything. Have you watched Parnell the last two games at LT or is it more fun to just do facepalm gifs and talk about typical Cowboy fans? Because if you had watched him you wouldn't have been making the same sarcastic post. Or maybe you did and you'd say why he wouldn't be any good...


Doug Free was one of the best RT's in the league that year, it's proven by watching him that year and all the stats used to account for offensive lineman. He's seriously declined in play since that year. That doesn't change the fact that he was a REALLY good RT for us. But according to you, nobody can be good for the Cowboys because we all overrate our players anyway.
I'm saying that the boys shouldn't abandon looking for an upgrade over Free because Parnell has played ok in two games against two defenses that don't have the talent to really test him.

Just read that specific post. Nobody wants to even find the reason that Free is struggling..what's up with our player development? Or are we resigned to "Free sucks, cut him".

I'm not saying a late round or undrafted player can't come in and start, i'm just saying let's not pencil in starters based on two games.

I hope Parnell is a pro-bowler for the Cowboys eventually, but it just screams "Jerry says he's good, and he hasn't sucked...sooo...START HIM over the guy we just paid millions of dollars to"


I dunno...just ranting. At some point we'll realize that Linemen on both sides of the ball can be drafted in the early rounds, and we start filling these needs with top talent instead of building from the outside in.
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Old 11-27-2012, 09:40 AM    (permalink
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Top 3 reasons why folks hate Jerry.

I wanna hear them.
  1. He talks to much to the media. Why does he need a weekly press conference? How many other owner/gm's have a weekly press conference?
  2. I feel that he sometimes overvalues FA pick-ups
  3. He needs to leave the coaching to the coaches
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Old 11-27-2012, 09:50 AM    (permalink
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NFL fans really overrated how much Jerry is involved. His primary role for the team is A) $$$ and B) face of the franchise. If you don't want to root for a team with a egotistical owner you should definitely look elsewhere. That being said.
  • His son Stephen handles contracts.
  • Jason Garrett has final say on roster decisions including free agents (has been stated multiple times).
  • Draft decisions have been the same since Jerry started. Scouts have a MAJOR say. Coaching staff has a MAJOR say. It is there job to "sell" the room.

Jerry gets to hog the limelight and media attention. He gets to use the phone for all the transactions. In the end though he's nothing more than a wallet with a gigantic mouth.

Has he had problems previously? Of course. He forced TO on BP and his choices for head coach haven't always been my cup of tea.

Put it in perspective though. We could have the Glazers for owners. Sitting as close to the salary floor as possible while stating their primary interests lie elsewhere (Manchester United). How about the Bengals? Same issue isn't add inept and miserly to the previous statement.
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Old 11-27-2012, 10:21 AM    (permalink
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Doug Free is not the player that many of us though he was at his high point and he isn't as horrible as he looks at times. He has some lapses in technique and will always struggle with elite strength but he still has good feet and can slide with most speed rushers.

Schematically Callahan hasn't been able to use his athleticism to pull, trap or get up field in the run game becuase the C/RG positions have been compromised by injuries and sub par play by Bernadeu.
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Old 11-27-2012, 10:41 AM    (permalink
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NFL fans really overrated how much Jerry is involved. His primary role for the team is A) $$$ and B) face of the franchise. If you don't want to root for a team with a egotistical owner you should definitely look elsewhere. That being said.
  • His son Stephen handles contracts.
  • Jason Garrett has final say on roster decisions including free agents (has been stated multiple times).
  • Draft decisions have been the same since Jerry started. Scouts have a MAJOR say. Coaching staff has a MAJOR say. It is there job to "sell" the room.

Jerry gets to hog the limelight and media attention. He gets to use the phone for all the transactions. In the end though he's nothing more than a wallet with a gigantic mouth.

Has he had problems previously? Of course. He forced TO on BP and his choices for head coach haven't always been my cup of tea.

Put it in perspective though. We could have the Glazers for owners. Sitting as close to the salary floor as possible while stating their primary interests lie elsewhere (Manchester United). How about the Bengals? Same issue isn't add inept and miserly to the previous statement.
I agree with this 110%. Jerry's problem is the talking, everything else seems to be handled by someone else, from contract negotiations to scouting/selection of draft picks to FA acquisitions.

Jerry's just a mouthpiece.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:36 AM    (permalink
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I have a bad feeling we're gonna use the injuries this season as an excuse for Garrett. We have to remember as bad as we want him gone, Jerry loves him and will be searching for anything to justify keeping him. He'll try and use the injury angle to sell it to the fans, book it.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:31 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFinisher View Post
I have a bad feeling we're gonna use the injuries this season as an excuse for Garrett. We have to remember as bad as we want him gone, Jerry loves him and will be searching for anything to justify keeping him. He'll try and use the injury angle to sell it to the fans, book it.
His drafts have been excellent and has much fewer holes than when he started. I can easily see him getting another year to complete his roster turnaround. If he fixes the offensive line and runs his vertical passing scheme I could see him being successful.

The maddening part is that if he wasn't so stuck on making the team win in his scheme rather than applying the best scheme offensively for the team we would be sitting pretty for the playoffs THIS year.

Honestly the only way I see Garrett getting the boot is if Sean Payton is legitimately interested in the job here. Aside from that I think Garrett gets a Year 3 regardless of how we finish.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:32 PM    (permalink
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Here's a gem from the archives lol:

12-30-2010

Quote:
Originally Posted by CDCB View Post
If jerry doesn't hire garrett this franchise is going in the wrong direction, end of story.
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Originally Posted by TheFinisher View Post
You know how I feel about it, I think this is a huge mistake.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:22 PM    (permalink
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I really wouldn't mind JG here another year....If Payton isn't available though.


I just...I think he's done an excellent job at bringing talented(but injury prone) players onto the roster..I like his approach, and think with an OC he can be a great HC.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:38 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leroyisgod View Post
  1. He talks to much to the media. Why does he need a weekly press conference? How many other owner/gm's have a weekly press conference?
  2. I feel that he sometimes overvalues FA pick-ups
  3. He needs to leave the coaching to the coaches
I actually like his openness. I don't see it as an irritation as much as I like to hear where he's coming from.

I don't think he makes the decisions on FA pick ups alone. In fact, I think he's just the guy who cuts the check and believes in his staff when they say they want a particular guy. When they sell the idea to him, he's using those same words to the media on why we took 'em. When we signed Livings and Bernadeau, I don't think for a second that Jerry told Garrett/Callahan that's who the team needs. I think it was the other way around.

...and really, he does leave the coaching to the coaches. The media always likes to portray the image that Jerry is deciding who plays and who doesn't. We know better than to be disallutioned by that right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trogdor View Post
NFL fans really overrated how much Jerry is involved. His primary role for the team is A) $$$ and B) face of the franchise. If you don't want to root for a team with a egotistical owner you should definitely look elsewhere. That being said.
  • His son Stephen handles contracts.
  • Jason Garrett has final say on roster decisions including free agents (has been stated multiple times).
  • Draft decisions have been the same since Jerry started. Scouts have a MAJOR say. Coaching staff has a MAJOR say. It is there job to "sell" the room.

Jerry gets to hog the limelight and media attention. He gets to use the phone for all the transactions. In the end though he's nothing more than a wallet with a gigantic mouth.

Has he had problems previously? Of course. He forced TO on BP and his choices for head coach haven't always been my cup of tea.

Put it in perspective though. We could have the Glazers for owners. Sitting as close to the salary floor as possible while stating their primary interests lie elsewhere (Manchester United). How about the Bengals? Same issue isn't add inept and miserly to the previous statement.
This is how I feel too. Nicely said.
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Old 11-27-2012, 02:01 PM    (permalink
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I'm going on record saying that I want Garrett back for another year. When I look at our issues as a team, I do not point a finger in his direction as the main reason why we are where were at this year. The injuries have been an issue, but I'm not using that as an excuse. I feel that most of this lies on the shoulders of our OL. If our OL is an above average unit, we're probably looking at a 7-4 team and not 5-6.
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