Do the Rams regret trading RG3?

[SolidGold]

Originally Posted by jrdrylie

Wait, you're telling me Mark Sanchez ISN'T a steallar QB? Mind blown. But seriously, stellar was the wrong word for Vince Young. But people were talking about how great Young was after his rookie season (deserved or not) and we all know how he turned out.

My thing with RGIII is a lot of his numbers are inflated by the system he is in. In the games I've watched of his, so many of his passes are behind the line of scrimmage or just beyond. Not that hard to complete those. He doesn't throw many picks because 90% of what he does is so low risk. Defenses will adjust next year so that the Redskins will have to do more things down field, over the middle, and higher risk. How RGIII adjusts to that different style will go a long way in answering this question.

Quoted for truth. People are all over his nuts just like they were for Newton last year. Defenses adjusted to the Panthers offense just like they will for the Redskins in year two.

Luck pwns all

[TACKLE]

Originally Posted by jrdrylie

My thing with RGIII is a lot of his numbers are inflated by the system he is in. In the games I've watched of his, so many of his passes are behind the line of scrimmage or just beyond. Not that hard to complete those. He doesn't throw many picks because 90% of what he does is so low risk. Defenses will adjust next year so that the Redskins will have to do more things down field, over the middle, and higher risk. How RGIII adjusts to that different style will go a long way in answering this question.

It's a strange thing that in college, we take all stats with a grain of salt with system, style of play, level of competition, etc. where as in NFL, it feels like a lot of people act like all stats are created equal. Those variables are smaller factors when you get the pros but it's silly to think that numbers can't be inflated due to system too.

[Ness]

I don't think the system is a big deal. Players are put in the best situations so they can win games. I don't think just anyone with Griffin's skillset can do what he is doing. He still has to read defenses and make the right decisions at the right time in that system to be successful.

[gpngc]

Ugh. Cam Newton's rookie year was fantastic but it's not even comparable to what RGIII is doing.

Statistically, RGIII is having EASILY the greatest rookie season in the history of the NFL. Easily.

What Newton did last year was show many, many glimpses of something special, while keeping his team competitive for the most part.

What RGIII is doing is leading his teams to win BECAUSE of him.

When you're evaluating a college player in System X, stats can be misleading and it's fair to question how his transition will go.

RGIII is transitioning no where. The stats here matter. There is no reason to 'take them with a grain of salt' at all. YPA, TD/TO, and most importantly PPG and Ws. And he's made plenty of plays within the pocket as a straight drop-back passer this year.

To me it's just so obvious that I'd rather have RGIII than Sam Bradford and that's all that needs to be said in this discussion. There is almost no chance those picks can make up in the disparity of the two player's talents and upside.

RGIII has almost no help in Washington and already has 6 wins. Because of this, it is reasonable to assume he would have had success early with St. Louis, which has a better skeleton. And don't say Morris because it's obvious that Morris has huge holes because of the presence of RGIII. He's a good runner but there are a bunch of backs that would excel in that situation.

[WCH]

I basically agree with gpngc. There was never a point, in college or in the NFL, when I watched Bradford and thought "Wow, I wouldn't mind him Quarterbacking my team!"

It's not that Bradford is bad (and I actually think he can be pretty darned good). I'd just simply rather have RGIII than "Bradford + Other Guys."

[J-Mike88]

They should regret it. Let's be honest here... RG3 is a special QB.
Bradford is not.
I like him, good person like RG3 is, and he has a fine arm.
But he's not a star.

[armageddon]

Most people don't get to see Bradford very often because the Rams don't get nationally televised games. I also doubt people are watching the Rams on their game ticket either. I have seen every snap he has taken with the Rams and can testify he is damn good. Here are his throws last year over 15 yards. He is even better this year.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhLDkYravNA

[njx9]

i always regret taking a rookie qb based on a partial season over a less flashy veteran qb who also had an impressive rookie season. 'but zomg, it wasn't the samez!'. i mean, that's totally true. one won the roty award, the other hasn't yet. 'but statzzzz!' i know, right? those are totally transferrable across systems, and years and players. there's absolutely no difference, ever. and qb rating is literally the end-all, be-all of how good a player you are. that's why everyone on earth agrees that tony romo is a top 5 all-time qb, and how we all know that matt schaub is better than dan marino and joe montana. because stats.

[Bengalsrocket]

Originally Posted by njx9

i always regret taking a rookie qb based on a partial season over a less flashy veteran qb who also had an impressive rookie season. 'but zomg, it wasn't the samez!'. i mean, that's totally true. one won the roty award, the other hasn't yet. 'but statzzzz!' i know, right? those are totally transferrable across systems, and years and players. there's absolutely no difference, ever. and qb rating is literally the end-all, be-all of how good a player you are. that's why everyone on earth agrees that tony romo is a top 5 all-time qb, and how we all know that matt schaub is better than dan marino and joe montana. because stats.

This is so crucial to the argument at hand. I think the Rams should have a hard time regretting anything at this point. Sam Bradford could theoretically be the better QB 10 years from now.

[njx9]

Originally Posted by Bengalsrocket

This is so crucial to the argument at hand. I think the Rams should have a hard time regretting anything at this point. Sam Bradford could theoretically be the better QB 10 years from now.

exactly. there's no more merit to this discussion, than there is to one calling ryan tannehill a bust. have the discussion in two years when there's actually a body of work.

[TACKLE]

Originally Posted by njx9

i always regret taking a rookie qb based on a partial season over a less flashy veteran qb who also had an impressive rookie season. 'but zomg, it wasn't the samez!'. i mean, that's totally true. one won the roty award, the other hasn't yet. 'but statzzzz!' i know, right? those are totally transferrable across systems, and years and players. there's absolutely no difference, ever. and qb rating is literally the end-all, be-all of how good a player you are. that's why everyone on earth agrees that tony romo is a top 5 all-time qb, and how we all know that matt schaub is better than dan marino and joe montana. because stats.

classic elway apologist.

[njx9]

Originally Posted by TACKLE

classic elway apologist.

just because the original team from your favorite team's city traded him away, doesn't mean you have to be a hater for life.

[Iamcanadian]

I'd have to say they do, although trading Bradford with his huge contract, might have been impossible.
Holmgren's failure to get a trade with the Rams for RG111 will also leave a legacy in Cleveland for many years to come.

[holt_bruce81]

http://101sports.com/templates/audio...a=11448&type=s

[gpngc]

Originally Posted by njx9

i always regret taking a rookie qb based on a partial season over a less flashy veteran qb who also had an impressive rookie season. 'but zomg, it wasn't the samez!'. i mean, that's totally true. one won the roty award, the other hasn't yet. 'but statzzzz!' i know, right? those are totally transferrable across systems, and years and players. there's absolutely no difference, ever. and qb rating is literally the end-all, be-all of how good a player you are. that's why everyone on earth agrees that tony romo is a top 5 all-time qb, and how we all know that matt schaub is better than dan marino and joe montana. because stats.

RGIII is clearly a better player right now and projects to be better in the future. This is my argument based on college and pro perfocamce and the stats only support it.

I credit the Shanahans for how they've incorporated the read option into the offense but literally every oc in the lg would know to use rg3 out of the pocket and w play action. Because of this, the accross systems argument is weak.

Rg3 makes everyone better because of his mobility and deep ball ability. The rams ol would look better with him mainly because he'd single handedly improve the running game substaintially.

[gpngc]

And I also never mentioned qb rating. Ypa Td to turnovers. Ppg and wins. Those were the stats I mentioned.

[bucfan12]

Right now? Maybe. Down the road? I don't know. RG III is having a magnificent rookie year, it's his rookie year. A lot of these athletic rookie Qbs have great success in their 1st year (Vince Young, Mike Vick, Cam Newton, etc.). However, it's how you develop your game as a pocket QB and only rely on the athleticism when needed.

Right now, the Redskins are running the Pistol Offense. That isn't going to work next year like it did this season. Opposing defenses will catch on to all these read options (See Cam Newton). Eventually, most likely sooner, RG III will have to adapt to an NFL Offense and become a pocket passer who relies on his speed and athleticism to bail him out when nothing is there.

The Rams have done a nice job building their team and the next 2 drafts they have the opportunity to build around the QB. If Bradford isn't the answer, I still think they made a good move. At the time, you have 80 million invested in a QB with no weapons and a weak o-line. I personally am not a fan of Bradford, but like Jeff Fisher and the front office did, made the correct move.

[Rosebud]

The Skins don't run the option as much as Vince Young did, but so much of their efficiency passing the ball comes from play action and defenders cheating against the run. That's what'll change the most and why Bob will have to adjust, and once that happens we'll see whether he's the next Elway and Young or Cam and Vick.

[stlouisfan37]

I am a Rams fan, so my opinion is automatically going to be seen as biased. That being said, I don't think they regret their decision. And I don't think it has as much to do with the comparison of the two players as it does with the direction Fisher and Snead wanted to take this team when they got here.

Is RGIII the more dynamic of the two? Yes. Better athlete? Yes. As passers they are both very good, but with different styles, so I'm not sure that argument can be made either way. Sam has a lot of great qualities that have yet to be translated onto the field, but if you look at his play this season, he is clearly progressing.

The Rams simply took a look at what they had and decided that Bradford was their QB of the future, and they could turn the #2 pick into several meaningful players upon which to build. It has already netted them Brockers, Jenkins, and Pead. This year it will return them a pick in the teens, which could potentially grow into more picks if they continue their current trend of trading down to add pieces. And next year they will net another 1st rounder, which also has the potential to bring more picks. I believe they saw the trade as a sure thing. They would get the picks, which would mean more players. So you have to take into consideration that, while RGIII may be the better player, if the Rams as a whole have a solidly built team with talent and depth at all positions in 2014, then they have accomplished what they set out to do, regardless of how good the player they passed on has become.

[bucfan12]

Originally Posted by stlouisfan37

I am a Rams fan, so my opinion is automatically going to be seen as biased. That being said, I don't think they regret their decision. And I don't think it has as much to do with the comparison of the two players as it does with the direction Fisher and Snead wanted to take this team when they got here.

Is RGIII the more dynamic of the two? Yes. Better athlete? Yes. As passers they are both very good, but with different styles, so I'm not sure that argument can be made either way. Sam has a lot of great qualities that have yet to be translated onto the field, but if you look at his play this season, he is clearly progressing.

The Rams simply took a look at what they had and decided that Bradford was their QB of the future, and they could turn the #2 pick into several meaningful players upon which to build. It has already netted them Brockers, Jenkins, and Pead. This year it will return them a pick in the teens, which could potentially grow into more picks if they continue their current trend of trading down to add pieces. And next year they will net another 1st rounder, which also has the potential to bring more picks. I believe they saw the trade as a sure thing. They would get the picks, which would mean more players. So you have to take into consideration that, while RGIII may be the better player, if the Rams as a whole have a solidly built team with talent and depth at all positions in 2014, then they have accomplished what they set out to do, regardless of how good the player they passed on has become.

100% agree. One of those situations where both teams get what they wanted and win.

[armageddon]

Originally Posted by stlouisfan37

I am a Rams fan, so my opinion is automatically going to be seen as biased. That being said, I don't think they regret their decision. And I don't think it has as much to do with the comparison of the two players as it does with the direction Fisher and Snead wanted to take this team when they got here.

Is RGIII the more dynamic of the two? Yes. Better athlete? Yes. As passers they are both very good, but with different styles, so I'm not sure that argument can be made either way. Sam has a lot of great qualities that have yet to be translated onto the field, but if you look at his play this season, he is clearly progressing.

The Rams simply took a look at what they had and decided that Bradford was their QB of the future, and they could turn the #2 pick into several meaningful players upon which to build. It has already netted them Brockers, Jenkins, and Pead. This year it will return them a pick in the teens, which could potentially grow into more picks if they continue their current trend of trading down to add pieces. And next year they will net another 1st rounder, which also has the potential to bring more picks. I believe they saw the trade as a sure thing. They would get the picks, which would mean more players. So you have to take into consideration that, while RGIII may be the better player, if the Rams as a whole have a solidly built team with talent and depth at all positions in 2014, then they have accomplished what they set out to do, regardless of how good the player they passed on has become.

And promising OG Watkins. Big, strong road grader.

[J-Mike88]

Originally Posted by njx9

exactly. there's no more merit to this discussion, than there is to one calling ryan tannehill a bust. have the discussion in two years when there's actually a body of work.

So his 3rd year, fine.
What year is this for Bradford again? Body of work?

[armageddon]

Bradford took a 1-15 team to one game of winning the division his rookie season. Last season, the lockout and a new scheme, plus his high ankle sprain (from running for his life behind a terrible o-line) set him back. This year he has been very good. He's getting better each week too. Had a few bad/mediocre games, but many very good games. The o-line has been better too lately. Getting pro bowl OC Wells back has helped. Sam's main weapon Amendola has missed numerous games too. His only legitimate target has been 4th rounder Chris Givens. If Sam had a true #1 WR, his numbers would skyrocket. If the Rams can draft Allen or Williams, resign Amendola, and Givens keeps developing, and hopefully Quick too, the Rams offense should thrive. Sam could finally have some weapons. A big pass catching TE like the Notre Dame dude would be nice too.

[njx9]

Originally Posted by gpngc

And I also never mentioned qb rating. Ypa Td to turnovers. Ppg and wins. Those were the stats I mentioned.

wasn't specifically referring to anyone, just the general theme of nfldc when discussing qbs. it just shocks me, every year, when people think the second year can't be a drastic shift from the rookie year, when it happens every single year.

Originally Posted by J-Mike88

So his 3rd year, fine.
What year is this for Bradford again? Body of work?

??? i'm pretty sure both are evident. what do you, specifically, plan to compare them to?

[KCJ58]

the rams really had no choice, they had so much money committed to Sam Bradford to try to move his contract and get a team willing to pick it up? it seemed like their was no team really wanting to do that. Plus they wouldn't get fair value in return. They could have swallowed their pride, trade Bradford, for picks. Draft RGIII, and they might be alot better for it. Jeff Fisher saw something in Bradford that many people see in him and many people don't see, a franchise QB. Fisher believed Sam is the guy and they committed to him, hence them trading the pick #2 pick. But you also have to look what they got in return for the #2 pick. The Rams got the Washington Redskins next 1st round picks for the next two years. Depending on who they draft or trade for, will ultimately help decide if the Rams indeed made a mistaken with this. We have to see Bradford & RGIII fully pan out, how both teams do in the draft/FA, and we need to see how the teams do for the next couple of years.