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Old 12-25-2012, 05:04 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bruschis4all View Post
Looks to me that unless you were graded a super, super prospect. Like the Manning Brothers or Andrew Luck. Most of the others just don't live up to their rep. Geno Smith fits the profile more of a Couch, Stafford or David Carr than either Manning or Luck. Time will tell.
Then it's settled, I'll take a QB as good as Stafford 100 times out of 100. He threw for 5k yards and 40 TDs last year and for over 4k yards this year. I would KILL for that.
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Old 12-25-2012, 05:59 PM    (permalink
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Then it's settled, I'll take a QB as good as Stafford 100 times out of 100. He threw for 5k yards and 40 TDs last year and for over 4k yards this year. I would KILL for that.
And, Detroit is 4-11. Because, judging qb's on passing yards is kinda silly.
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Old 12-25-2012, 06:01 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bruschis4all View Post
And, Detroit is 4-11. Because, judging qb's on passing yards is kinda silly.
And the Saints are 7-8. Does that mean Drew Brees is only an average NFL quarterback?

Judging qb's on team wins is kinda silly.
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Old 12-25-2012, 06:02 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bruschis4all View Post
And, Detroit is 4-11. Because, judging qb's on passing yards is kinda silly.
And last year Detroit was 10-6 and made the playoffs. Because, judging QBs on the team record of one season is kinda silly.
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Old 12-25-2012, 07:04 PM    (permalink
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The only "number one overall" type talents in this draft for me would be either Star Lotulelei or Luke Joeckel (and Joeckel is very borderline in this category). Kansas City has absolutely no need for another big defensive lineman as far as I'm aware, nor do they need to replace Branden Albert. Quarterback is the only option that makes sense at that spot.
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Old 12-25-2012, 07:08 PM    (permalink
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A little testy Lions fans, eh? When Stafford starts to win divisions, gets to championship games and finally wins super bowls. Get real. No comparision to the two. When Stafford steps up and leads his team during the off-season like Brees does call me. Matter of fact, call me when Stafford grows up. He gets his yardage because he's throwing to the best athlete in the history of the NFL. Not because he diligently prepares himself to becoming a championship quarterback. He's unable to even repeat his throwing motion on successive passes. Can't believe you guys had the nerve to compare Stafford to a team leader like Brees.
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Old 12-25-2012, 07:13 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bruschis4all View Post
A little testy Lions fans, eh? When Stafford starts to win divisions, gets to championship games and finally wins super bowls. Get real. No comparision to the two. When Stafford steps up and leads his team during the off-season like Brees does call me. Matter of fact, call me when Stafford grows up. He gets his yardage because he's throwing to the best athlete in the history of the NFL. Not because he diligently prepares himself to becoming a championship quarterback. He's unable to even repeat his throwing motion on successive passes. Can't believe you guys had the nerve to compare Stafford to a team leader like Brees.
Because i'm clearly a Lions fan.

And what the **** are you talking about, I never compared Drew Brees to Stafford. My point was that the number of wins a team has, doesn't determine how good the starting QB is. Which is what you were trying to say.
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Old 12-25-2012, 07:17 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bruschis4all View Post
A little testy Lions fans, eh? When Stafford starts to win divisions, gets to championship games and finally wins super bowls. Get real. No comparision to the two. When Stafford steps up and leads his team during the off-season like Brees does call me. Matter of fact, call me when Stafford grows up. He gets his yardage because he's throwing to the best athlete in the history of the NFL. Not because he diligently prepares himself to becoming a championship quarterback. He's unable to even repeat his throwing motion on successive passes. Can't believe you guys had the nerve to compare Stafford to a team leader like Brees.
I never even mentioned Brees.

Besides, you're the one making idiotic comparisons. Grouping Stafford with Tim Couch and David Carr, get the **** out of here with that ****.
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Old 12-25-2012, 07:20 PM    (permalink
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Because i'm clearly a Lions fan.

And what the **** are you talking about, I never compared Drew Brees to Stafford. My point was that the number of wins a team has, doesn't determine how good the starting QB is. Which is what you were trying to say.
When your quarterback rating drops to under 80pct despite throwing to Calvin Johnson and your win total drops from 10 to 4. The qb is damn well responsible for a big portion of that. I can't think of too many qb's in a position similiar to him who lead their team to 4-12 records. And, I wasn't talking to you. I was talking to the Lion fan in the thread.
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Old 12-26-2012, 06:04 AM    (permalink
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The Chiefs haven't drafted a QB in the first round in three decades. It's no wonder that the franchise has been largely irrelevant in that time. I'm sick of trading for another teams backup or off the scrap heap. We have to be done with that.

And you list Jacksonville and Minnesota as reasons to not do it. When I look at those teams I'm envious. At least they're attempting to fix the most important position in sports. At least they're trying.

And at #1, there are no other glaring needs for this team. There is no WR worthy of a top 10 selection, there is no need for another DT or an OT. QB is the biggest need and we'll be in the position to draft the best one. We have to do it.
There is more then drafting bad QB'S that is why they have been bad. Jacksonville and Minnesota are trying sure but failing so if what good is trying if it is not helping them? There is more then one way to get the QB you want you could trade or get one in free agency but overreaching for one is not it. Why are you assuming all the good QBs are in the first round plenty of good QBs have been found in later rounds just as many first overall picks have been busts.There is no other glaring need really how are you that bad and only need one position are you even watching the games?
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Old 12-26-2012, 08:57 AM    (permalink
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There is more then drafting bad QB'S that is why they have been bad. Jacksonville and Minnesota are trying sure but failing so if what good is trying if it is not helping them? There is more then one way to get the QB you want you could trade or get one in free agency but overreaching for one is not it. Why are you assuming all the good QBs are in the first round plenty of good QBs have been found in later rounds just as many first overall picks have been busts.There is no other glaring need really how are you that bad and only need one position are you even watching the games?
I'm honestly not sure how to respond to any of this.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:14 AM    (permalink
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There's always people that say "don't reach for a QB" before a Draft, yet many of the successful QBs in the league were viewed as "reaches" when they were drafted. You're only reaching if the QB doesn't turn out to be a quality starter. Cherry picking guys who have not played well doesn't mean it's always bad to "reach" for a QB.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:38 AM    (permalink
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I used to be that guy who hated reaching for qbs, but I realized that if you don't have a qb, your team isn't worth ****, and the longer you delay the process the more time you waste, because you're not going anywhere as a franchise if you don't have a quarterback.

So when you need a quarterback, get a quarterback. It's that simple. Unless you have a top 10 qb already in your possession, there's no excuse to pass on a potential franchise qb in the draft.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:48 AM    (permalink
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yeah, uuummmmm.... thanks, but no thanks. the Chiefs had every opportunity to draft Cousins if they liked him. they did not. of course keep in mind the talent evaluator hasn't been all that good @ his job. it isn't Cousins that makes the equation bad. its the Chiefs trading for anothers QB.

i will reiterate what EVERY Chiefs fans has already posted. this franchise needs to DRAFT a QB in the 1st round the they believe will be the best QB in this draft. there is no other choice here. this town will revolt. imma steal a lyric from Sublime trading for another teams BU isn't going to be the long term answer. can anyone remember the last time a QB the Chiefs drafted won a game? made a playoff appearance? exactly. it's been a while. gotta start now.

This was a trivia question recently. The answer is: Todd Blackledge 1987

Which is so sad it's almost funny.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:52 AM    (permalink
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I used to be that guy who hated reaching for qbs, but I realized that if you don't have a qb, your team isn't worth ****, and the longer you delay the process the more time you waste, because you're not going anywhere as a franchise if you don't have a quarterback.

So when you need a quarterback, get a quarterback. It's that simple. Unless you have a top 10 qb already in your possession, there's no excuse to pass on a potential franchise qb in the draft.
This, this, this, this.

Everybody wants to "build an awesome team" so the QB doesn't even have to do anything. Problem is that style has little-to-no margin for error to have any consistency season-to-season. Even if you catch lightning in a bottle with a David Garrard, it's still going to be really difficult to have any type of sustained success.

Good QBs reduce EVERYONE ELSE'S margin for error. Average/bad QBs force everybody else to be perfect. If you're a GM, which situation would you rather have?
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Tannehill was a better QB (than Gabbert) when he was still playing WR
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:55 AM    (permalink
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The Chiefs rushed for 350 yards and held Indy's offense to 13 points holding Andrew Luck in check all day....and we still lost.

And people still think KC shouldn't draft a QB with the first pick. Blows my mind.
The Chiefs are currently the 32nd ranked scoring offense in the NFL with 13.9 points/game. Almost 2 full points worse thanthe 31st ranked Jags in scoring. The Chiefs offense needs to be focused on STRONGLY in the offseason. And they better find a way to keep Albert. And, I know many will disgree, but they might also want to ink Bowe to a 4 or 5 year deal because he's the ONLY real receiving threat the Chiefs have short of swing passes to RBs and little dumpoffs to McCluster.

Chiefs need a QB desperately out of this draft. Probably 2. And they might also want to spend a pick or two on receivers.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:57 AM    (permalink
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Yes please to the 1-gap. I think RAC is the only coach still running a 2-gap, unless I'm mistaken?
You may be right. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I don't even think the Pats run that style of 3-4 any more, do they?
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:01 AM    (permalink
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We've done the veteran QB / add "talent" route for years. It doesn't work here.
Exactly v. That's been the Chiefs' formula for decades and it hasn't worked. The Chiefs are playing solid defense now and running the hell out of the ball and are still the favorite for the #1 pick in the draft.

In general, that formula of football doesn't work in the NFL. Sure there are exceptions. The 9ers almost pulled it off last year. And the Steelers did it with a similar formula. But the successful teams nowadays are winning through the air and racking up points.

It's time for the Chiefs to try a new formula.
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Old 12-26-2012, 11:09 AM    (permalink
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There is more then drafting bad QB'S that is why they have been bad. Jacksonville and Minnesota are trying sure but failing so if what good is trying if it is not helping them? There is more then one way to get the QB you want you could trade or get one in free agency but overreaching for one is not it. Why are you assuming all the good QBs are in the first round plenty of good QBs have been found in later rounds just as many first overall picks have been busts.There is no other glaring need really how are you that bad and only need one position are you even watching the games?
The Chiefs have tried finding QBs later in the draft with ZERO success. Also, they have tried getting FA QBs with ZERO success. They've tried trading for other team's backups with, again, ZERO success. They haven't spent a first round pick on a QB since 1983. And no DRAFTED Chiefs QB has won a game for this franchise since Todd Blackledge in 1987. Doesn't that just seem a little odd to you?

Between Dorsey, Tyson Jackson, and Dontari Poe, the Chiefs have 3 top 11 picks on their defensive line (although Dorsey is likely to be gone after this year). The Chiefs do not need to be spending another high pick on a defensive lineman. And if they re-sign Albert (which, if they know what's good for them they will), there really isn't any need to go after Joeckel with Albert and Winston on the edges.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:17 PM    (permalink
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Here's what I'm wondering. Since its a generally accepted that KC should draft a QB, what should Jacksonville do? They're sort of in the same spot, having drafted OL and DL recently. Is their QB situation any better? As a Charger fan I would gladly trade up with them for Joeckel and I'd imagine other teams would too. But perhaps they see themselves in the same boat as KC and just can't pass up a QB despite having just recently drafted one.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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Here's what I'm wondering. Since its a generally accepted that KC should draft a QB, what should Jacksonville do? They're sort of in the same spot, having drafted OL and DL recently. Is their QB situation any better? As a Charger fan I would gladly trade up with them for Joeckel and I'd imagine other teams would too. But perhaps they see themselves in the same boat as KC and just can't pass up a QB despite having just recently drafted one.
I would very much like them to draft a QB. Their entire roster is in much worse shape than KC's though.
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Tannehill was a better QB (than Gabbert) when he was still playing WR
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:39 PM    (permalink
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This, this, this, this.

Everybody wants to "build an awesome team" so the QB doesn't even have to do anything. Problem is that style has little-to-no margin for error to have any consistency season-to-season. Even if you catch lightning in a bottle with a David Garrard, it's still going to be really difficult to have any type of sustained success.

Good QBs reduce EVERYONE ELSE'S margin for error. Average/bad QBs force everybody else to be perfect. If you're a GM, which situation would you rather have?
Not only that, but it makes no sense because when your team peaks, your qb isn't ready to take advantage of them with a SB run, and by year 4 when your qb is ready, your talent is old and needs to be redone, so then you need another 3 years to rebuild around your qb, and you just wasted 3 years of your qb's prime because you didn't set the team up to peak with the qb at the same time.

So instead of potentially having a SB team in 4 years, you'll have 1 in 7 years. It's poor roster management.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:42 PM    (permalink
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I would very much like them to draft a QB. Their entire roster is in much worse shape than KC's though.
I'd play around with Tebow and Gabbert (a pair to draw to) next year, then go after a better QB in 2014 when that plan didn't work.

As for the Chefs i have been solidly in the camp that said there isn't a QB worthy of the top pick. Having thought about that, there isn't a non QB out there worthy of the top pick either. Go after the QB and let the chips fall where they may.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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I would very much like them to draft a QB. Their entire roster is in much worse shape than KC's though.
Let's make a deal.
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Old 12-26-2012, 01:51 PM    (permalink
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I'd play around with Tebow and Gabbert (a pair to draw to) next year, then go after a better QB in 2014 when that plan didn't work.

As for the Chefs i have been solidly in the camp that said there isn't a QB worthy of the top pick. Having thought about that, there isn't a non QB out there worthy of the top pick either. Go after the QB and let the chips fall where they may.
It's interesting, Russ Lande just came out with a top 200 yesterday (I'd link but I think it's against forum rules). He doesn't have a QB ranked in the first round range. Glennon is his top QB at #32. Also kinda surprising that he only has a second round grade on Damontre Moore at #49, while everyone else sees him going top 10. He also has Jones ranked very low. This is going to be one of those drafts without much consensus.
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