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Old 01-02-2013, 05:01 AM    (permalink
bored of education
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No thanks to a non-Qb pick.
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<+BOE> Scott, with Burfict's character concerns (whether legit or not) you think Pioli would draft him. :D
<+ScottWright> Why not. Baldwin does need a sparring partner...
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-02-2013, 05:02 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Scott Wright View Post
I can't see the wisdom in the Chiefs letting a young, talented left tackle like Branden Albert leave and even if they did they just spent a third round pick on Donald Stephenson. Regardless of what happens at left tackle that isn't going to fix the Chiefs. Look how bad they've been with Albert. It just doesn't matter if you don't have a quarterback. Look at the Dolphins, who took Jake Long with the #1 overall pick. Long has been everything Miami could have hoped for but the team has been awful his entire career. Don't get me wrong, I love Luke Joeckel and I believe left tackle is one of the four most important positions in the game. However, quarterback is the most important position in SPORTS and unless you have a solution there nothing else matters.
Scott, did I send you this response via email to post it? lol
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<+BOE> Scott, with Burfict's character concerns (whether legit or not) you think Pioli would draft him. :D
<+ScottWright> Why not. Baldwin does need a sparring partner...
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-02-2013, 06:33 AM    (permalink
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KC has to take a QB.
The Skins for instance have the same parts on along the oline they had last season. The only difference was the QB. Most Skins fans before the season started believed the Oline was a weak point. However a talented QB can change all that.
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Old 01-02-2013, 09:01 AM    (permalink
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KC has to take a QB.
The Skins for instance have the same parts on along the oline they had last season. The only difference was the QB. Most Skins fans before the season started believed the Oline was a weak point. However a talented QB can change all that.
Right. RG3 can probably make a lot of Olines look better, but in the past people would talk about setting your oline first then drafting a QB. Not anymore, as long as your QB isn't a statue back there. Geno Smith is in no way a running QB, but he has more than enough mobility to not get killed behind a decent oline. As does Tyler Wilson.
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Old 01-02-2013, 10:28 AM    (permalink
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The Chiefs have a very talented OL. Stephenson looked good in Albert's place. Aside from depth, OL is toward the bottom of the list of things the Chiefs need to improve.

QB and a legit offensive coach (get rid out Zorn) fixes pretty much everything.
After QB, it depends on who is running the offense and defense.
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Old 01-02-2013, 01:17 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
KC has to take a QB.
The Skins for instance have the same parts on along the oline they had last season. The only difference was the QB. Most Skins fans before the season started believed the Oline was a weak point. However a talented QB can change all that.
True, but there is nobody close to RG3 in this draft. Drafting a QB just for the sake of drafting a QB in round 1 isn't a good idea. The Skins needed a QB the year before as well, but they passed on all of them until they drafted Kerrigan. Obviously, they weren't interested in Ponder or Gabbert, or all that interested in Dalton either. I still think they wanted Kaepernick...
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Old 01-02-2013, 11:51 PM    (permalink
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There is a consensus among draftniks that KC must draft a QB with the 1st overall pick. At the same time, there is a consensus that the 2013 Draft lacks an elite QB prospect. I see a contradiction here. The Chiefs got burned by the trade for Matt Cassel, and reaching for a QB when you have the top pick in the Draft can be even more disastrous. If there isn't a clear franchise QB in this class, there is no reason to throw the big board away and make a desperate move.

Even though I'm not impressed by Mike Glennon, I can see a desperate team taking him high in the 1st round (including the Chiefs) if we start seeing comparisons to Matt Ryan. Glennon is leaving college with a poor performance against Vanderbilt, but I don't think one game will radically change the previous evaluation of his game film.
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Old 01-03-2013, 03:11 AM    (permalink
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There is a consensus among draftniks that KC must draft a QB with the 1st overall pick. At the same time, there is a consensus that the 2013 Draft lacks an elite QB prospect. I see a contradiction here. The Chiefs got burned by the trade for Matt Cassel, and reaching for a QB when you have the top pick in the Draft can be even more disastrous. If there isn't a clear franchise QB in this class, there is no reason to throw the big board away and make a desperate move.
Look at Oakland in 2007. All the studs in that draft taken after Jamarcus. Elevating Geno to the #1 spot just because you need a QB doesn't feel like the right move to me. But then again, who are you passing on a QB for? They are set at OLB so they don't need Jarvis Jones. They don't need Star. If they let Albert walk they could go with Joeckel and that would be a solid pick. I don't think anyone is trading for the pick.

There are a lot of mediocre QBs that are going to be on the market who are better than the QBs they currently have. I know he has a stigma on this board but I think Alex Smith would be a great fit for the Chiefs. SF won a lot of games with Smith. I think he'd manage games better than Cassell did for the Chiefs. He'd come for a late round pick.

Take the top talent in the draft, trade for Alex Smith, don't let Albert or Bowe walk. Run the ball and grind it out with your defense.

Chiefs can't keep letting their top end talent leave in free agency. They let Carr leave this year and now they are facing losing Albert and Bowe. Mostly likely one of those two. Its to hard to develop talent and its to hard to find talent in free agency. Have to pay your home grown guys.

If they are sold on Geno then by all means make the pick but I just don't buy it.
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Old 01-03-2013, 03:23 AM    (permalink
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I'm certainly the minority among fellow Chiefs fans, but if I'm if Pioli/Reid/Whoever the hell is calling the shots in April, give me Star Lotulelei with the first pick and Landry Jones in the second round.

I don't care if we've spent three first round picks on the DL already. Dorsey has been average at best and seems to be on his way out...Same could be said for Tyson Jackson as well. Poe seems like the only hit. Pair him with Lotulelei and a creative DC and you could do some crazy ****.

We need a franchise QB, but Lotulelei is far and away worth more than the drop-off between Geno Smith and the second tier (with Dysert and Jones showing the most promise imo). I wouldn't even be shocked if someone like Tyler Wilson dropped to the late first round/second round.
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Ok I'd almost rather spank my meat with sandpaper at this point.
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:15 AM    (permalink
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I'm certainly the minority among fellow Chiefs fans, but if I'm if Pioli/Reid/Whoever the hell is calling the shots in April, give me Star Lotulelei with the first pick and Landry Jones in the second round.

I don't care if we've spent three first round picks on the DL already. Dorsey has been average at best and seems to be on his way out...Same could be said for Tyson Jackson as well. Poe seems like the only hit. Pair him with Lotulelei and a creative DC and you could do some crazy ****.

We need a franchise QB, but Lotulelei is far and away worth more than the drop-off between Geno Smith and the second tier (with Dysert and Jones showing the most promise imo). I wouldn't even be shocked if someone like Tyler Wilson dropped to the late first round/second round.
It is going to be very interesting to see what effect the success of Dalton, Wilson and Kaepernick have had on the draft, prior to their success, only around 6% of 2nd round QB's had any success at all.

College QB's today are far more advanced than in any other era of drafting. They come to the NFL having thrown the ball in college 3 or 4 times as often as in previous generations and are far more advanced in their throwing and reading defenses. KC may well feel that there will be a 2nd round QB worth drafting and go in a different direction if they don't feel they will get much value taking a QB with the #1 overall pick.

Not saying they won't take a QB #1 overall, it will all depend on whether or not their GM falls in love with one in the post season, but I don't believe it is a sure thing. After all, they have 3 options RE: QB
1) draft one with the #1 overall pick
2) trade back to where they believe they can get one who they feel has a good chance to become a franchise QB
3) take a shot on a 2nd/3rd round QB as Cincy, SF and Seattle did.

The decision is wide open at this point in the draft process.
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:43 AM    (permalink
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I'm certainly the minority among fellow Chiefs fans, but if I'm if Pioli/Reid/Whoever the hell is calling the shots in April, give me Star Lotulelei with the first pick and Landry Jones in the second round.

I don't care if we've spent three first round picks on the DL already. Dorsey has been average at best and seems to be on his way out...Same could be said for Tyson Jackson as well. Poe seems like the only hit. Pair him with Lotulelei and a creative DC and you could do some crazy ****.

We need a franchise QB, but Lotulelei is far and away worth more than the drop-off between Geno Smith and the second tier (with Dysert and Jones showing the most promise imo). I wouldn't even be shocked if someone like Tyler Wilson dropped to the late first round/second round.
So you don't post for like a year and then come back and post this ****?! I'm disappointed with you ads!
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:56 AM    (permalink
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I can definitely see a 2nd tier QB prospect becoming the best of this class.
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:49 AM    (permalink
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With Andy Reid as your new coach it also brings Michael Vick into the equation. I think he'd be nuts for doing it, but if Reid wants Vick, I'm sure the Chiefs would sign him. Release Quinn and Cassel. That would be a signal to pick another player or trade down.

Reid drafted Donovan McNabb in his first year with Philly. A lot of people(self-included) thought he was nuts for picking McNabb that high. It worked out pretty good for him. I think Reid will draft Geno Smith and roll the dice.
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Old 01-03-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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So you don't post for like a year and then come back and post this ****?! I'm disappointed with you ads!
I bet Lions fans said than when the Lions drafted Megatron after Carlos Rogers, Roy Williams, and Mike Williams in the top 10 in 4 drafts.

(granted, I don't think Star is the kind of player that warrants the #1 pick...)
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:13 PM    (permalink
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I bet Lions fans said than when the Lions drafted Megatron after Carlos Rogers, Roy Williams, and Mike Williams in the top 10 in 4 drafts.

(granted, I don't think Star is the kind of player that warrants the #1 pick...)
Yeah, if this were Clowney we were talking about, I'd be on board. But it isn't a Megatron or Clowney level prospect, so no thank you.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:17 PM    (permalink
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One factor that you guys are overlooking is that if you draft a QB 1st overall, you are stuck with him for awhile.

That is a MAJOR long-term investment. You BETTER be sure.

And if next year there is a QB prospect that is MUCH better available to you, you CAN'T pick him.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:21 PM    (permalink
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One factor that you guys are overlooking is that if you draft a QB 1st overall, you are stuck with him for awhile.

That is a MAJOR long-term investment. You BETTER be sure.

And if next year there is a QB prospect that is MUCH better available to you, you CAN'T pick him.
The financial investment is not an issue anymore, so you can realistically cut ties with someone after a short time if you're absolutely sure a) the guy you have isn't the answer, and b) the guy you like in the draft is better.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:23 PM    (permalink
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The financial investment is not an issue anymore, so you can realistically cut ties with someone after a short time if you're absolutely sure a) the guy you have isn't the answer, and b) the guy you like in the draft is better.
Not within the first 2 years. Come on!

Not even within the first 3 years.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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If I'm the Chiefs, I try LIKE HECK to trade this pick.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:28 PM    (permalink
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One factor that you guys are overlooking is that if you draft a QB 1st overall, you are stuck with him for awhile.

That is a MAJOR long-term investment. You BETTER be sure.

And if next year there is a QB prospect that is MUCH better available to you, you CAN'T pick him.
You just assume you're going to have a high pick next season? With Andy Reid and their roster, they probably won't be in the #1 hunt next season. Then it's 2 years without a QB. And what happens if there isn't a great QB in the year after that? 3 years without a QB....

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If I'm the Chiefs, I try LIKE HECK to trade this pick.
Cause if they try a bit harder someone is definitely going to do it.

You really think in a year without any truly elite prospects, someone is going to trade up to the #1 pick? To pick who exactly? And who would even trade with them?
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:31 PM    (permalink
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If I'm the Chiefs, I try LIKE HECK to trade this pick.
If there is no one worthy of the Chiefs selection at #1, there is no way they're able to trade down.
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Old 01-03-2013, 01:33 PM    (permalink
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Tell them your scouts think Star Lotulelei is the next coming of Reggie White.

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Old 01-03-2013, 02:06 PM    (permalink
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The financial investment is not an issue anymore, so you can realistically cut ties with someone after a short time if you're absolutely sure a) the guy you have isn't the answer, and b) the guy you like in the draft is better.
I disagree, it's not so much the financial investment as it is the investment in a player. A QB drafted in the first round almost ALWAYS gets at least two years, typically three (and perhaps more). Sometimes missing on a QB that early kills your team for several years after it. That's why I believe you don't just take a QB for the sake of taking one.

Heck look at a team like the Jets. They picked Sanchez and saw just enough from him to make coaches, fans, etc. believe he was their franchise QB. Turns out he actually never got better and regressed and look how much it's set them back as a team for numerous years. Likely at least another 2-3. They will likely have no choice but to stick with Sanchez and even if they do get rid of him after next year they still have to draft a new QB and wait for him to develop.

If you pick a QB at the first pick, he will likely set you back at least 3-4 years (if not more) if you miss. That's my point when I've attempted to wage the discussion for the Chiefs picking someone else. Now I think Geno is pretty good but I understand an argument against him.

That's my whole point. Take a guy who think is worthy of the first overall pick, don't just take the best QB in this particular draft.
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Old 01-03-2013, 02:13 PM    (permalink
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That's my whole point. Take a guy who think is worthy of the first overall pick, don't just take the best QB in this particular draft.
This is what I, and many others, have been arguing with you about.

Tell me who the Chiefs should take instead of a QB. Tell me the position or player.

OLB? Nope. DT? Nope. OT? Nope. None of these are needs. No surefire stud WR at the top of the draft. RB isn't needed. ILB and CB aren't worthy of the top pick, and if you're going to reach on one of those, it'd make more sense reaching for a QB because of positional value.

Tell me who the Chiefs should take.
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Old 01-03-2013, 02:14 PM    (permalink
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This is what I, and many others, have been arguing with you about.

Tell me who the Chiefs should take instead of a QB. Tell me the position or player.

OLB? Nope. DT? Nope. OT? Nope. None of these are needs. No surefire stud WR at the top of the draft. RB isn't needed. ILB and CB aren't worthy of the top pick, and if you're going to reach on one of those, it'd make more sense reaching for a QB because of positional value.

Tell me who the Chiefs should take.
Since its Andy Reid - Geno Smith.

edit - he got the job right?
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