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Old 01-15-2013, 04:07 PM    (permalink
Gay Ork Wang
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Mike Martz was hired cause:

a. Lovie wanted him.
b. Angelo was still there.
c. Was OC so all that mattered was his system.

No **** im comparing Trestman and McCarthy. You are saying Trestman is horrible cause when he had success with the teams, the teams were loaded and on other teams he was bad. McCarthy wasnt a great coordinator but still ended up being a great HC.

If you read the article he wrote about Bill Walsh, you can see that that man is eager to learn. EVERYONE I have heard so far that has worked with him is praising him. That to me is much more important than what you think. Players liked him. This is something you need in a HC especially in a veteran lockerroom that just lost their "beloved" HC.
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Old 01-15-2013, 04:15 PM    (permalink
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When you use exactly contrasting arguments with Steve Young and Rich Gannon it gets to be a little over the top.

They threw more when Trestman was calling plays but they also increased their YPA and completion %. Gannon also increased his QB rating under Trestman.
No, Steve Young's completion %, YPA, and QB rating all took big hits under Trestman's playcalling. Gannon's completion % and passer rating each went up a whopping 1.8 points. I'll grant you the increased 0.6 YPA, but that's all he had better than before.

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Now you say it's because of all the extra passes Gannon threw. Well you were against all the stats for Steve Young, even though when they dropped in passing from 95 to 96. It might be that he would be calling a different game depending on his personnel or something?
Yes, Gannon's giant jump in yards was directly a result of throwing more. He wasn't throwing significantly more effectively than he had the three years prior. Steve Young had the same personnel from before Trestman when Trestman's started calling shorter plays for no reason.

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I am willing to take the vote of confidence given by the players that worked with him rather than critiquing his ability to get very good results out of these players. I am not as smart and Emery or any of these coaches. I am not going to pretend like I am.
Players heap undeserved praise on bad coaches all the time. No one ever says "Oh, my old coach? He sucks. He'd be a terrible hire."
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Old 01-15-2013, 04:30 PM    (permalink
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I love all this. Statistical pissing contests abound around here. Even though everyone says something they think is true enough then someone opposes it and they both run to the record books to find a couple stats that can be applied to whatever inane argument you're having with another (non!) know-it-all.

The only way to judge a persons play calling is in game with all the knowledge of the team, injuries, players, score, time of regulation, weather, everything. Game day bucket go boom.
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Old 01-15-2013, 04:34 PM    (permalink
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Players heap undeserved praise on bad coaches all the time. No one ever says "Oh, my old coach? He sucks. He'd be a terrible hire."
They also don't have to go out of their way to heap praise on him. It is easy to say he is a good coach and I enjoyed my time with them. They have instead said that he is not an offensive coordinator, he is a Head Coach. He is a gifted offensive mind, etc, etc.

It's not like Bruce Arians has some sort of dazzling resume. Was a QB coach with the Colts for Peyton's first two years. He used Manning's success to get an OC job with Cleveland and Tim Couch. He was unable to have success with a poor team and became a WR coach with the Steelers. He became the OC when Tomlin took over and led the team to middle of the road offensive stats.

Of course he did a good job in a tough spot with the Colts where he had a very talented QB and play makers. However, he also has had health issues and is 60 years old.
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Old 01-15-2013, 05:59 PM    (permalink
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No, Steve Young's completion %, YPA, and QB rating all took big hits under Trestman's playcalling. Gannon's completion % and passer rating each went up a whopping 1.8 points. I'll grant you the increased 0.6 YPA, but that's all he had better than before.

Yes, Gannon's giant jump in yards was directly a result of throwing more. He wasn't throwing significantly more effectively than he had the three years prior. Steve Young had the same personnel from before Trestman when Trestman's started calling shorter plays for no reason.



Players heap undeserved praise on bad coaches all the time. No one ever says "Oh, my old coach? He sucks. He'd be a terrible hire."
Who do you feel is good enough for the job?
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:54 PM    (permalink
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Who do you feel is good enough for the job?
Of the people we've been connected to, my top tier right now would be Dennison, Clements, Sullivan. One of these would make me happy.

Tier two would be Arians. I'd be like "yeah, ok, whatever, Emery" if he was announced as the guy. He doesn't excite me one bit and I don't think there's a chance he'd make us a superpower, but I do think he's a boring and steady average type of guy we'd have a chance to win a super bowl with...kind of a "safe" pick.

Tier three is Bevell, Carmichael, Toub. With any of these, I'd have reservations, but I'd be more or less ambivalent and accepting of them as longshots who could pay off.

Tier four is Trestman, Priefer, DeCamillis, Armstrong. These would infuriate me.

Tier five is Mike Singletary. This would put me in full-blown start-ignoring-football mode.

McCoy would have been in tier two, but he's not available any more. Re-hiring Lovie would be above Tier 4 for me.

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Old 01-16-2013, 02:08 AM    (permalink
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Congrats! You're going with Tier Four! (Personally, I think it could be a fine choice.)
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:29 AM    (permalink
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****.

I miss Lovie now.

Bring back Jerry Angelo.
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Old 01-16-2013, 03:47 AM    (permalink
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In Emery we Trest.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:57 AM    (permalink
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Alright, we will see how Trestman does. I always enjoy the out of the box thinking and this hire is definitely that.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:59 AM    (permalink
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Just posted in the coaching change thread that Rod Marinelli and the defensive staff is expected to remain, as is Jeremy Bates as QB coach.
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:03 AM    (permalink
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http://www.windycitygridiron.com/201...-search-update
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:13 AM    (permalink
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Anyone know much about Kromer? How good of a o-line coach is he? It doesn't really matter if we don't improve the talent on our line though.
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Brilliant letting one of Scott Pioli's henchmen have his own team to ruin.  One of the premier GM jobs in the NFL and it gets handed to a stupid **** who makes three facepalm moves for every good one.  Awesome.  Just like handing a new Mercedes to a 16 year old girl who's already been in three wrecks. 
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:16 AM    (permalink
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Anyone know much about Kromer? How good of a o-line coach is he? It doesn't really matter if we don't improve the talent on our line though.
The Saints o-line seemed to get the job done well enough. Had two pro bowl caliber guards...hard to tell how much of that was just those guys being talented and how much of it was development though.

Saints LT Jermon Bushrod will be a free agent this year as well. I wonder if we'll target him with Kromer now on the staff. It'd be very difficult for him to not be an immediate upgrade at LT over Webb.
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:27 AM    (permalink
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The Saints o-line seemed to get the job done well enough. Had two pro bowl caliber guards...hard to tell how much of that was just those guys being talented and how much of it was development though.

Saints LT Jermon Bushrod will be a free agent this year as well. I wonder if we'll target him with Kromer now on the staff. It'd be very difficult for him to not be an immediate upgrade at LT over Webb.
The Bears have about 13 million in cap space (more if they can redo a few deals like Cutler or Marshall) so hopefully Emery spends some on the offensive line in free agency. Sign a tackle then drafting a guard would be fine with me.
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Old 01-16-2013, 03:59 PM    (permalink
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The Saints o-line seemed to get the job done well enough. Had two pro bowl caliber guards...hard to tell how much of that was just those guys being talented and how much of it was development though.

Saints LT Jermon Bushrod will be a free agent this year as well. I wonder if we'll target him with Kromer now on the staff. It'd be very difficult for him to not be an immediate upgrade at LT over Webb.
Bushrod was almost exactly average this year, but he has tremendous name recognition. I think it's just one of those situations in which a guy gets an inexplicably outsized contract. His contract could end up having one of the worst money-to-performance ratios of this offseason's free agents. I hope Kromer doesn't convince Emery to get him.

This season's left tackle market is really top-heavy in brand value. The good ones who are available are almost all "names." It'll be tough fitting a Clady, Albert, or Beatty into our cap space. Sam Baker had a fantastic year, but his history is shaky. Bushrod and Jake Long were both right around average but their reputations are disproportionate to their recent play. I'm a bargain shopper. The only guy I see who performed at an average or better level and is a relative unknown is King Dunlap. He was very, very good last season filling in for 838 snaps for an injured Jason Peters. If Peters returns, Philly will likely elect to lowball him with a backup contract. If we can't get Dunlap...well, Webb was pretty bad, but he's no longer a bottom-10 tackle, so at least there's that. We had bigger problems on the line. We could possibly scrape by one more year here if we absolutely have to.

Might as well look at the rest of the offensive line while I'm at it.

At left guard, the guys who'll be expensive are Andy Levitre (awesome) and Louis Vazquez (really good, but really a RG who just has a bunch of college LG experience). I see three potential bargains, though. There's Donald Thomas, who was excellent for New England when Mankins was injured (614 snaps). Matt Slauson is perfectly average and the Jets are in an incredible cap hell, so he'll probably hit the market. Ramon Foster played at about the same level as Slauson in Pittsburgh. This position is bargain city and one of our black holes.

At Center, the good young ones are all RFAs. Their teams know they're good. They'll match the contracts. If we could get a good ancient guy in McClure or Koppen on a cheap one year contract, that's great, but I think they're going to get bigger money than we can fit in. The best option I can see here is to go ahead and take Barrett Jones at #20.

At RG, the market kind of sucks. I know everyone loves Lance Louis. He was slightly below average, which looks god-like on our line. I'd have no problem signing him for a pittance, but what I read a couple of days ago is that he may not be ready for training camp. I'd hold off on that decision until he's cleared to play. I would go with Carimi here. His pass blocking at guard was a lot better than it was at tackle. His run blocking at both positions was among the best in the league. This pretty much the only spot on the line where circumstances line up for us to save money.

At RT, Phil Emery was dead wrong about what he said regarding Jonathan Scott. You can't just point to his number of sacks and claim he's a good tackle. He gave up a ton of pressures. His pass blocking was a little better than Carimi's, but it was still atrocious. His run blocking was practically nonexistent. I'd let him walk in free agency. RTs available this year are Andre Smith, Gosder Cherilus, Sebastian Vollmer, Phil Loadholt, Ryan Harris, Barry Richardson, and Winston Justice. Smith and Vollmer are going to cost. Cherilus may be undervalued because he built up a reputation as a bust before turning things around over the last two years. Loadholt was great as a rookie, below average for two seasons, and then really good this year. Maybe he's still got the stink of the middle two years on him, driving down his price? Ryan Harris saw time as a backup in Houston due to injuries. He played 416 snaps and was good. He was on Cutler's line in Denver. The only problem I see with him is that he's been a ZBS guy for a long time. He has averagish size. Can he make the switch? Richardson and Justice are kind of scary because they were bad for a long time and suddenly became average last season, but they're going to be cheap.

I think a decent plan for the OL would be to spend 7.5 mil. We could retain Webb at LT and Carimi at RG, draft Jones at C, upgrade LG with someone like Slauson (2.5 mil?) and RT with Cherilus or Loadholt (4 mil). I think that would make the line roughly league average, leaving the only issue on offense being a free agent TE (nicest FA TE class I've ever seen) and possibly one more bargain #2-3 type of WR (if Knox doesn't look ready to come back and we have leftover cap after taking care of the defense).

We have some stuff we can do to open up a good deal of cap, too. I'm looking at extending Marshall/Spaeth/Tillman, restructuring Peppers, and cutting Davis/Hester/Garza/Spencer/Bush.
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:03 PM    (permalink
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@BradBiggs: Word I hear is Cowboys DC Monte Kiffin is hopeful he can get Rod Marinelli to join him.
**** you, Monte Kiffin.
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Old 01-16-2013, 11:18 PM    (permalink
Monomach
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**** you, Monte Kiffin.
I don't think Rod's gonna want to drop a high profile DC job that comes with a lot of autonomy to be a D line coach.

So...I'm not the only one to have connected some concerning dots, btw:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...-destinations/
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Old 01-17-2013, 12:10 AM    (permalink
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I don't think Rod's gonna want to drop a high profile DC job that comes with a lot of autonomy to be a D line coach.

So...I'm not the only one to have connected some concerning dots, btw:
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...-destinations/
I've been connecting that dot for days now. It pains me physically.

I don't particularly care for his views and don't care for the fact that he is so open to sharing them. I don't see value in him as an NFL QB. And I don't see the headache and attention he brings being worth it for another position.

I couldn't be happier if he announced today that he was giving up football to go be a missionary in some godawful country.
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:02 AM    (permalink
Monomach
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I've been connecting that dot for days now. It pains me physically.

I don't particularly care for his views and don't care for the fact that he is so open to sharing them. I don't see value in him as an NFL QB. And I don't see the headache and attention he brings being worth it for another position.

I couldn't be happier if he announced today that he was giving up football to go be a missionary in some godawful country.
Jesus. There's yet another dot.

"Trestman tried to recruit Tebow to North Carolina State in 2006, and they stayed in touch."

Guy has a serious love affair with Timmy.
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Old 01-17-2013, 03:09 AM    (permalink
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I don't think Rod's gonna want to drop a high profile DC job that comes with a lot of autonomy to be a D line coach.
La Canfora says all signs point to him leaving. JLC's a dolt, but he's usually right at least once a day.

Podlesh on Joe DeCamillis: "He's the reason Jacksonville drafted me in 2007. I really enjoyed my two years with him in JAX." And Podlesh was drafted in the 4th round.. Please keep him away from the draft room.

@ESPNChiBears: "Heard Bruce Arians made a strong push last night before Trestman got the job. Arians went down swinging...Arians was prepared. Had an impressive coaching staff prepared from what I hear. But in the end, Phil Emery went with Trestman." What could have been...
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Old 01-17-2013, 06:22 AM    (permalink
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I doubt that Emery tries to get Tim Tebow. He doesn't seem like the type of GM who is going to go that far to make his new HC happy.
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who retires first: brett favre or aaron rodgers?
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Old 01-17-2013, 07:14 AM    (permalink
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Can't begin to express how disappointed I am that Marc Trestman doesn't have a comical Canadian accent. That would have made this year so entertaining.
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Old 01-17-2013, 12:09 PM    (permalink
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So Marinelli is out, I hope we're getting a new 4-3 DC given the players we have.
Trestman also said during the press conference that he plans to be very hands on with the QB's. Sounds good to me.
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Old 01-17-2013, 02:41 PM    (permalink
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‏Talking to @ClaytonESPN. He just told us the #Bears turned down the trio of Arians, Whisenhunt, and Grimm. Wouldve been a great staff.
Wouldn't want Grimm, but Arians + Whiz would have been great.

Trestman's bringing 2 of his CFL assistants to the team. Shouldn't he be surrounding himself with people who have NFL experience?

Also, he follows Tebow and Te'o on Twitter..
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