2013 Giants Draft Thread - Page 12

bigbluedefense · 01-23-2013, 01:53 PM

Man, I know he's undersized, but I just like Khasim Greene. He's just a good football player. Great instincts, great tackling ability, flies to the ball.

I would give him strong consideration in round 2.

DB could be a possibility in round 1.

Forenci · 01-23-2013, 02:54 PM

Eh, LB is isn't high enough on my radar to warrant a second round pick. I think Greene will be a pretty good NFL starter. I think his size will limit him quite a bit though. I guess I'm just picky about the type of LB I would want if we're selecting him in the first two rounds. I like high upside guys who can just engage with offensive linemen and shed them. Most LB's aren't like that these days but that's what I prefer.

I think our top two picks need to be in the trenches. I wouldn't be upset if we took a DB but I would be a little upset if we took a LB.

Giantsfan1080 · 01-23-2013, 02:54 PM

Logan Ryan>Khaseem Greene but I'd hate to choose.

Forenci · 01-23-2013, 02:59 PM

I'd like Ryan a lot in the second if he's there and doesn't run ultra slow or anything, which I don't suspect he will.

bigbluedefense · 01-23-2013, 03:56 PM

I'm just concerned about how battle tested Ryan was. That and his speed.

In round 2, if he runs 4.5 (even 4.55) I'd consider him. Maybe he can be a poor man's Brandon Flowers.

But he's not battle tested.

Forenci · 01-23-2013, 04:01 PM

That's true but I can't hold that against him. Guys have face lesser competition at small schools and been successful in the league.

bigbluedefense · 01-23-2013, 04:11 PM

It's just a risk when we're talking about CBs. When you're on that island, and you go against a guy that's just out of your league, how you respond to that is critical. You don't know how that effects a guy like Ryan bc he never had to really go against that.

With DLmen, it's simpler bc I honestly think pass rushing is 90% athleticism. Get a horse and tell him to chase the football. Pretty simple stuff.

But CB is just different. Maybe that's the DB in me talking, but I weigh that a lot more for CB than any other position outside of qb.

Giantsfan1080 · 01-23-2013, 04:42 PM

He shut down the VTech WR that is pretty good. I'm not buying the battle tested thing at all.

bigbluedefense · 01-23-2013, 04:51 PM

Whoopidy doo. Wake me up when he goes against the SEC. It's a different beast when you play those teams.

Let's be real, the Big East was a joke. He wasn't battle tested. No big east WRs are even close to 1st prospects. That's not being battle tested.

Giantsfan1080 · 01-23-2013, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

Whoopidy doo. Wake me up when he goes against the SEC. It's a different beast when you play those teams.

Let's be real, the Big East was a joke. He wasn't battle tested. No big east WRs are even close to 1st prospects. That's not being battle tested.

Then what do you say about a ton of small time CB's that come out and do well?

bigbluedefense · 01-23-2013, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giantsfan1080

Then what do you say about a ton of small time CB's that come out and do well?

I'm not denying that he can do well. I'm saying that it scares me a little bc it's more of a gamble. That's all.

I wouldn't mind Ryan at all in round 2 if he times 4.55 or faster. I'm just saying it's a gamble whenever you draft a CB who isn't battle tested.

BigBlueNorwegian · 01-23-2013, 05:36 PM

As for CBs, I would LOVE either Poyer or Trufant based on what i've seen at the Senior Bowl. Especially Trufant. He's just a really good corner. And he has that corner mentality and personality, wanting to compete against the best recievers in practice, and trash-talking. Plus he has NFL pedigree with his two brothers being in the NFL.

And Poyer seems like a nice fit for the cover 2. Absolutely dominates on short and intermediate routes, but struggles a bit with deep speed. But if we re-sign Kenny Phillips, that weakness should be somewhat negated.

bigbluedefense · 01-23-2013, 09:07 PM

I'm warming up to these CBs. I wouldn't mind a 1st round CB at all. Or a 2nd round CB.

The front 7 talent in the 1st round is starting to look underwhelming to me but the DB talent is growing on me, and the OL talent is as well.

Big_Pete · 01-23-2013, 09:34 PM

I actually like the idea of DJ Fluker as an option at 19

The top DEs will be long gone, we ideally want to upgrade LG and RT

We bring in Fluker who can play either and see how the line shakes out.

scottyboy · 01-23-2013, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

Man, I know he's undersized, but I just like Khasim Greene. He's just a good football player. Great instincts, great tackling ability, flies to the ball.

I would give him strong consideration in round 2.

DB could be a possibility in round 1.

I'm telling you right now, he may be my favorite Rutgers prospect ever. Perhaps behind Raymell, but still. I know my homer reputation and tendencies etc, but trust me on this one. Zak and I really rarely steer you guys wrong and Khaseem's just a flat out gamer. He does everything and makes plays. I'm telling you, you're gonna look back in a few years and be like "****, scotty was totally right'. Khaseem's my boy.

I love Logan too, but he doesn't have a huge ceiling. He'll be a very good #2 CB in the league for a while. Perfect Winfield replacement in Minny

bigbluedefense · 01-24-2013, 10:45 AM

Ansah is intriguing me again. The man, height/weight/length wise, is a JPP clone.

He's just stiff though. Damn. I'm so torn on this guy. I really need to study this dude some more. I don't know what to make of him.

Forenci · 01-24-2013, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

Ansah is intriguing me again. The man, height/weight/length wise, is a JPP clone.

He's just stiff though. Damn. I'm so torn on this guy. I really need to study this dude some more. I don't know what to make of him.

He was asked to play a very different role than JPP. I don't get the JPP comparisons. Other than size they are very different players. Ansah is stronger than JPP and is much more of a bull rusher.

bigbluedefense · 01-24-2013, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forenci

He was asked to play a very different role than JPP. I don't get the JPP comparisons. Other than size they are very different players. Ansah is stronger than JPP and is much more of a bull rusher.

That makes him more ideal to be a LE than JPP, which is fine for us, since we need a LE.

But at the same time, for a bullrusher, I really don't like how he disengages off of blocks so far. I don't think he has the same motor as JPP either.

Forenci · 01-24-2013, 11:10 AM

It's just going to be a really hard estimation. He was not used properly at BYU and suffered for that. I'm not sure about his motor just yet. For me, DL guys have to have non-stop motors. If he doesn't have one then he's not worth taking for me. I need to watch more of his game tape. I've only seen 2-3 full games on him.

bigbluedefense · 01-24-2013, 11:12 AM

That's why the Senior Bowl is so important for me when determining his worth. I want to see that motor. I want to see some of that coaching in action, I want to see him go against NFL caliber competition, and I want to see how he bends around the edge.

One thing I liked about JPP was you saw him learn and improve during the game. You saw him improving and learning things and picking things up as the game went on. I want to see that from Ansah. I don't want to see him bang his head against the wall for 4 quarters. I want to see that he has the ability to learn and improve with repetition and practice.

BigBlueNorwegian · 01-24-2013, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

But at the same time, for a bullrusher, I really don't like how he disengages off of blocks so far. I don't think he has the same motor as JPP either.

This is my main concern with him also. He does not disengage well at all once the OL gets their hands on him. And that is extremely important for a LE in general, but almost even more so in our division, with the runners and read option QBs we have to compete against. In my mind, our perfect LE would be a high-motor guy who disengages extremely well, and has a good feel for the game, with some added pass-rush ability as an extra bonus. We need to worry about the runners in our division, I hate to watch us get gashed on the read option and off tackle runs.

bigbluedefense · 01-24-2013, 01:08 PM

I'm not worried about the read option honestly. I want pass rushers. You can teach guys gap discipline.

But you can't teach athleticism, and to me pass rushing is 90% athleticism.

I want my linebackers to play the run and tackle. I want my edge players to rush the passer. Of course that's a gross simplification of it, but you get what i'm saying. I want pass rush from my edge guys. I'll worry about run fits after I evaluate their pass rush ability.

bigbluedefense · 01-24-2013, 01:13 PM

Again, Ansah looking stiff in these drills. He can't sink his hips. That's concerning to me. Great get off, but high and stiff. We can work on the high. But the stiff...I dunno.

Let's see you sink big boy. Gotta have hips to be a good pass rusher.

BigBlueNorwegian · 01-24-2013, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

I'm not worried about the read option honestly. I want pass rushers. You can teach guys gap discipline.

But you can't teach athleticism, and to me pass rushing is 90% athleticism.

I want my linebackers to play the run and tackle. I want my edge players to rush the passer. Of course that's a gross simplification of it, but you get what i'm saying. I want pass rush from my edge guys. I'll worry about run fits after I evaluate their pass rush ability.

I just feel like we've tried that for years with Osi. He sucks against the run, but offers great pass-rushing ability(in his prime) The Mccoy runs against Osi's side killed me inside, because they were so easy to read.

I mean, the Ideal player would be to get another JPP, who is a beast against the run AND pass, but that's not likely. I'm warming up to the idea of signing Bennett's brother at LE, and focus our draft picks toward OL, LB and CB. There are tons of talent at CB and OL in this draft at least. I'm thinking something like this as an Ideal offseason to improve our team:

FA: Sign Michael Bennett

DRAFT:

1st: Linebacker
2nd: OL/CB
3rd: OL/CB (opposite of round 2)
4th: DE/DT
5th: OL/LB/CB/DE/DT whatever we haven't adressed yet
6th: BPA
7th: BPA

scottyboy · 01-24-2013, 01:30 PM

Going over this class, there are some REALLY good guys on the Dline. Great depth. I'm intrigued by guys like Ziggy, Jordan, Short, Okafor, Montgomery and even some more guys I haven't read up on. I think we've got a REALLY good chance to grab some super solid guys for this team. Not needing skill players on O is really awesome for us. At this point, OT seems to be not a huge need. I'm fine with Beatty/Locklear with DD as backup swing next year. The interior's fine too. We need a young'n to groom at OG but that's meh at this point. Just go defense, defense, defense, defense this draft