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Old 01-16-2013, 01:19 PM    (permalink
WCH
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If that happens then I'm fine with that pick. CB is a need. ILB is a huge need. 3-4 DE (who can actually rush the passer) is a need. They're not as big of a need as a QB, but you could make the case for those positions.. and all anyone wants to talk about is us drafting Joeckel #1 and moving a top 10 LT over to Guard, who will replace 2 top 100 picks.. and for what?

So yes, I do see the potential. I honestly do. But the players that people are honing in on RIGHT NOW make no sense, and I've been saying that from the start.
On paper, that would be almost identical to drafting a OG #1 overall. When you think about it like that, it would be pretty stupid. Nobody uses the #1 pick to upgrade their left guard.
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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Who are we kidding. The Chiefs are going to trade the pick to Philadelphia for Philly's 1st, 2nd, and Nick Foles.
Sure, I'd do that, and still draft Geno 4th overall. Foles can be his backup, and we'd get another second rounder out of it. Sign me up.
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:20 PM    (permalink
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On paper, that would be almost identical to drafting a OG #1 overall. When you think about it like that, it would be pretty stupid. Nobody uses the #1 pick to upgrade their left guard.
Exactly, and that is forgetting that Allen and Asamoah have looked pretty damn good since entering the lineup, so you're basically drafting a guard first overall and replacing two young, promising players. There is no way that the pick makes sense for this team.
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:30 PM    (permalink
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Sure, I'd do that, and still draft Geno 4th overall. Foles can be his backup, and we'd get another second rounder out of it. Sign me up.
No, Philly would then draft Geno first overall.
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Brilliant letting one of Scott Pioli's henchmen have his own team to ruin.  One of the premier GM jobs in the NFL and it gets handed to a stupid **** who makes three facepalm moves for every good one.  Awesome.  Just like handing a new Mercedes to a 16 year old girl who's already been in three wrecks. 
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:31 PM    (permalink
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Just so we're clear, everyone does realize that drafting Joeckel and moving Albert to guard is not an option. Albert is not going to turn down LT money so he can take less money to learn a new position for a team that's telling him he's not good enough to play tackle for them.


And on the same line of thinking as the posts above that bring up the idea that drafting Joeckel is essentially just upgrading the guard position....

Would anyone here take a left side of Joeckel and Jeff Allen over Albert and Warmack?
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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SP you should go get drunk again.
Why is Forenci trying to get me drunk?
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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^not me.premiere LT's are rare.we have one so we have to keep him
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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No, Philly would then draft Geno first overall.
This whole scenario suddenly seems *very* possible.
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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No, Philly would then draft Geno first overall.
ok so then we take Tyler Wilson either way we win :)
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:40 PM    (permalink
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Why is Forenci trying to get me drunk?
So you can insult your mother again.
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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Tells someone to not get drunk and insult their mother....

Has a Sterling Archer avi.



SP, don't let Lamenci get to you!
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Old 01-16-2013, 01:49 PM    (permalink
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So you can insult your mother again.
I never insulted my mother!

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SP, don't let Lamenci get to you!
It's okay. I know what she's trying to do.
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Old 01-21-2013, 01:04 PM    (permalink
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Geno Smith, anyone who has them taking Joeckel is just screwing up their mock draft.
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Old 02-04-2013, 05:12 AM    (permalink
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Absolutely. It could easily be a LB or a DE or a WR who breaks out during the next two months and not a QB, and then I'd probably be a little miffed but eventually okay with the pick, especially if Reid gets his QB with the early second pick.

Honestly, I don't care if we get Geno or Tyler 1st overall or 34th overall, as long as we get one, but I'm worried about skipping on that franchise potential guy and having him go before we pick. That is my biggest fear.
I have been reading these threads about the Chiefs #1 pick for some time now, and you have expressed on several occasions your frustration for the Chiefs never seriously addressing the QB position. I did some research on the Chiefs draft record, and I have to say...and I don't mean this as an insult...the Chiefs have to have the worst luck of any team in regards to quarterbacks coming out when they have high draft picks.

Since the last time the Chiefs used a first rounder on a QB, they have had a top 10 pick 8 times. In those drafts, the best QB they have passed on was Joe Flacco, who was taken #19 in 2008. The Chiefs drafted #5 that year. No one really considered Flacco a top 5 pick coming out, and he has exceeded expectations. Other QB's that the Chiefs passed on with top 10 picks...Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman, Patrick Ramsey, Mike Elkins, and Chuck Long. In two such drafts, there were no QB's taken within the next round after the Chiefs picked, which suggests that they were very weak QB classes.

In drafts when the Chiefs had a lower pick, they have passed on a few good QB's, namely Aaron Rodgers, Brett Favre, Randall Cunningham and Jim Harbaugh. A LOT of teams passed on Rodgers. Favre and Cunningham both went in the 2nd round, and would have been considered a reach when the Chiefs picked in the 1st in their respective years. Maybe they should have taken Harbaugh at #19 in 1987? That looks like the only real "error" in their search for a franchise QB, at least where the draft is concerned.

I admit that I am not an expert when it comes to the Chiefs and their draft history. I don't follow them closely enough to know all the details of bad trades, poor free agent signings, etc., so I won't comment on those areas. I guess I'm just saying that I feel your frustration. But at the same time, you should feel somewhat good about the fact that your team has not drafted the Weedens and Tebows of the world simply in the name of taking a QB. The list of losers that were available when the Chiefs were on the clock is extremely long.
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Old 02-04-2013, 05:57 AM    (permalink
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The Chiefs have drafted only two quarterbacks in the last 15 years. They haven't even tried to develop qb's. That's going to change under Reid and John Dorsey who is a Ron Wolf disciple. Look for KC to draft a QB every year until they hit. It starts this year with them taking a QB (likely Geno Smith when the smoke clears) with their 1st pick.
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:58 AM    (permalink
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FWIW I wasn't trying to defend the way the organization has gone about addressing the situation, just saying that they haven't had much go their way as far as the draft is concerned.
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Old 02-04-2013, 09:42 AM    (permalink
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Do it!

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Old 02-04-2013, 09:54 AM    (permalink
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Sure, I'd do that, and still draft Geno 4th overall. Foles can be his backup, and we'd get another second rounder out of it. Sign me up.
I dunno if moving back behind three teams that also need QBs is such a great idea.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:13 AM    (permalink
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FWIW I wasn't trying to defend the way the organization has gone about addressing the situation, just saying that they haven't had much go their way as far as the draft is concerned.
Oh I agreed with you. I had no issue with your post. I was merely adding on to it, pretty much.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:39 AM    (permalink
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At least we can agree on one thing, awaiting for who KC picks will be one of the real highlights of the draft and have a lot to do with determining how the top 5 plays out. It's going to be real exciting to hear the name called out.
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Old 02-04-2013, 10:43 AM    (permalink
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I admit that I am not an expert when it comes to the Chiefs and their draft history. I don't follow them closely enough to know all the details of bad trades, poor free agent signings, etc., so I won't comment on those areas. I guess I'm just saying that I feel your frustration. But at the same time, you should feel somewhat good about the fact that your team has not drafted the Weedens and Tebows of the world simply in the name of taking a QB. The list of losers that were available when the Chiefs were on the clock is extremely long.
Great post, but I will say that what is bolded here is only one side of the coin. You're right about the draft history, and the free agent acquisitions at QB haven't been great, though we did land Joe Montana and Trent Green for a time.

The biggest thing for most Chiefs fans isn't that we've skipped drafting bad QBs in the first or second, it's that we haven't TRIED to draft and develop our own guy in 30 years. There comes a point where you'd rather try and fail than not try at all, and we're at that point now. It's just getting old.

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I dunno if moving back behind three teams that also need QBs is such a great idea.
It isn't a great idea no matter how you slice it, and if someone is good enough to take at #4 then he's good enough to take at #1, I was just spitballing with some of the people in this thread.
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Old 02-04-2013, 11:03 AM    (permalink
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I dunno if moving back behind three teams that also need QBs is such a great idea.
Exactly!!! And that's why the Chiefs won't pass on a QB in the first round. It would be way too risky for a team that has nothing on the roster that even resembles an NFL quarterback. Waiting around for the "right guy" to come along is part of what got Scott Pioli fired.

The best chance the Chiefs have is to draft the best guy available. A guy with upside, who fits your system and who can be developed. It isn't a coincidence that they hired Andy Reid, a fellow who has some experience developing quarterbacks. BTW...the best guy isn't always the top rated guy. Back in 1979, the Chiefs traded up to take "the best guy" in Steve Fuller (23 overall). Well, he was the top rated guy, the best guy that year was actually Joe Montana who wasn't taken until the 3rd round (82 overall). Of course, Joe Montana wouldn't have been Joe Montana without Bill Walsh and the west coast offense.
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Old 02-04-2013, 11:13 AM    (permalink
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Great post, but I will say that what is bolded here is only one side of the coin. You're right about the draft history, and the free agent acquisitions at QB haven't been great, though we did land Joe Montana and Trent Green for a time.

The biggest thing for most Chiefs fans isn't that we've skipped drafting bad QBs in the first or second, it's that we haven't TRIED to draft and develop our own guy in 30 years. There comes a point where you'd rather try and fail than not try at all, and we're at that point now. It's just getting old.



It isn't a great idea no matter how you slice it, and if someone is good enough to take at #4 then he's good enough to take at #1, I was just spitballing with some of the people in this thread.
I would have to agree with you on that. I think that will be Andy Reid's priority and I don't see him not getting his way.
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Old 02-04-2013, 11:22 AM    (permalink
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It isn't a great idea no matter how you slice it, and if someone is good enough to take at #4 then he's good enough to take at #1, I was just spitballing with some of the people in this thread.
Strongly agree that if he's worth taking at 4, he's worth it at 1, but that wasn't my point. My point is that there's about a 0% chance that he'd be there because you moved behind three teams that would want him. In fact, you'll probably miss out on the second best guy, too.

You overthought that, lol. The correct answer to that trade wasn't "sure, sign me up and I'll take Geno, anyway." The correct answer was "**** no, we'd lose out on our best-rated QBs and havce to settle for the guy we like 3rd or 4th-most." :P
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Old 02-04-2013, 11:53 AM    (permalink
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Strongly agree that if he's worth taking at 4, he's worth it at 1, but that wasn't my point. My point is that there's about a 0% chance that he'd be there because you moved behind three teams that would want him. In fact, you'll probably miss out on the second best guy, too.

You overthought that, lol. The correct answer to that trade wasn't "sure, sign me up and I'll take Geno, anyway." The correct answer was "**** no, we'd lose out on our best-rated QBs and havce to settle for the guy we like 3rd or 4th-most." :P
I've been arguing with people who say "just trade back up or pick one at 34!1!11" for about two months now. In a "weak" QB class I don't get why people are advocating taking the 5th best QB instead of the best QB in the class, but some people don't understand why that makes no sense and keep saying we need to take an OT, that isn't a need, first overall. It's maddening! :D
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