Mock Draft 5.0 - 2/14/13

[Nastradamus]

I"ve soured a little on all the pass rushers at the top of the draft. Not sure Werner or Moore are quite elite level prospects, maybe more like 8 sack types. I'm curious about the combine though. Jones has the red flags and Jordan is very raw.

For those reasons, I think the Lions end up going with Millner. Its a big need and I think it ends up as the best value. The LTs are the sleepers for them.

[bitonti]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

Left Tackle is such an overrated commodity.

people said this all last year and then the Vikings used a top 5 pick on Matt Kalil, and it drastically improved their team. The LT is still a much needed position. I understand if the Chiefs keep Albert it's not a huge need for that team, but teams who lack LT definitely need these guys. AZ for example at 7 is desperate for a LT. SD at 11 is another atrocious OL team.

[killxswitch]

RE: Colts, Cooper is a fine enough pick. I am concerned about his fit in a power runblocking OL, but he is a clear talent upgrade over anybody we have on the roster including 2011 1st rounder Anthony Castonzo. I do think I prefer either Frederick or Warford but without a 2nd rounder it might be difficult to acquire either without reaching. I'm sad you gave Fluker to the Rams, I'd love to bring him in.

You are also right that we lack playmakers on the DL. I've talked myself into being OK with Kawann Short as long as he drops some weight. I would also say OLB is an option, though by the 24th pick the best ones might be all gone.

I think a week after free agency you'll have a clearer picture of where the Colts will look on draft day. We might fill 3 starter slots on the OL with free agents and make all defensive picks. I'm excited.

[bigbluedefense]

Originally Posted by bitonti

people said this all last year and then the Vikings used a top 5 pick on Matt Kalil, and it drastically improved their team. The LT is still a much needed position. I understand if the Chiefs keep Albert it's not a huge need for that team, but teams who lack LT definitely need these guys. AZ for example at 7 is desperate for a LT. SD at 11 is another atrocious OL team.

It's overrated for several reasons:

1. Teams move their pass rushers all over the field. The days of having a LT protect you against the pass rush are over. You need a complete OL, bc teams will just move their pass rusher to the other side or up the gut and eliminate the effectiveness of the LT.

2. With teams using the gun more and more, and the pistol now, the "blind side" isn't as blind as it used to be.

3. The money. When you have a 10 million dollar LT it dramatically influences your cap and how you can spend on other more impactful positions.

4. Good quarterbacks don't need a great left tackle. Rodgers, Eli, Ben, Brady (when he had a declining Light), Peyton, Brees, I can go on and on. They don't need good left tackles. When you invest 15 mill a season in qb it's stupid to invest another 15 mill a season in LT. That's 30 million dollars in 2 players, one who's job is much easier when you have a 15 million dollar qb.

5. Ok cool, Khalil is a good draft pick. He's a great Left Tackle. Did he help Christian Ponder any? Ponder still sucks. And guess what, when your qb sucks your team isn't going anywhere.

[Nastradamus]

Originally Posted by Menardo75

I am kind of set on Jesse Williams right now for San Fran but I can't be upset with Jenkins.

There is no way that Williams gets a first round grade from any NFL team IMO. Jenkins on the other hand is on a different level in terms of natural ability. SF can probably get Williams at the end of the 2nd.

[mightytitan9]

The Titans pick is fine, but I honestly see the Titans passing on OL there and drafting more of a playmaker and addressing the line later in the draft.

In the end I see them signing either Andy Levitre or Brandon Moore or waiting until at least the 2nd. Afterall, you have to go back to 93 before the Titans spent a first round pick on an offensive lineman

[Cigaro]

Floyd's a better pick than Richardson, but he still doesn't fit our overall needs. We need a NT, not an UT.

[coordinator0]

Minter is still a really nice pick for Baltimore. Even with the concerns about his range and coverage ability he would still be the best ILB that can play in space on the team.

[Menardo75]

Originally Posted by Nastradamus

There is no way that Williams gets a first round grade from any NFL team IMO. Jenkins on the other hand is on a different level in terms of natural ability. SF can probably get Williams at the end of the 2nd.

What makes you say that? I've heard the exact opposite.

[Nastradamus]

For one he's a 2 gap DL, probably a NT. The value on those is a lot lower than it used to be. He'll probably never get more than 2 or 3 sacks in a season and he isn't scheme versatile at all. He's a good effort guy, he can occupy multiple blockers and he has a decent bull rush. I don't hate him or anything. He just doesn't have 1st round pedigree. I'd argue he's closer to the 3rd than the 1st, but most likely settles in the 2nd somewhere on a team who can afford to reach for need, like SF as we discussed.

[xstamper13]

Mocking Star to the Raiders is just lazy. I get that we need a DT but we have a greater need at pass rusher. I don't see Reggie spending a high pick on a guy with huge question marks regarding his work ethic and passion for the game. This is a guy who's already quit football once and has issues with his weight. He played well against USC but it seems like everybody forgets that Holmes was playing on one leg. I would much rather see the Raiders take Jones, Moore or Werner at that spot. Hell, I'd rather us take Warmack at 3 than Star. And don't give me that 'it's too high to take a Guard' nonsense...getting a future All-Pro with your first round pick is a good thing right? Go back and do a re-draft on the past 8 drafts and you will see that about 50% of first rounders flop and that many of the players from so called 'lower value positions' would be top 5 and top 10 picks.

[bitonti]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

5. Ok cool, Khalil is a good draft pick. He's a great Left Tackle. Did he help Christian Ponder any? Ponder still sucks. And guess what, when your qb sucks your team isn't going anywhere.

they went from 3-13 to 10-6. that's going places.

No Peyton Manning doesn't need an elite left tackle. Unfortunately there's like 3 of those guys in the league at any given time.

[RStriff27]

Milliner falling to the Bucs at 13?! first time ive seen that.

I still think theres a chance that Xavier Rhodes jumps up and turns heads.

I think Tampa may take Rhodes OVER Millner even if they have the choice.
Scheme wise i think Rhodes is a better fit.

[mightytitan9]

Originally Posted by bitonti

they went from 3-13 to 10-6. that's going places.

No Peyton Manning doesn't need an elite left tackle. Unfortunately there's like 3 of those guys in the league at any given time.

Peyton still plays better when he has a top LT

[Attyla the Hawk]

Hard time seeing Montgomery to Seattle. The LEO position is one of those that you don't really need to spend a first round pick on. It's a tweener position that typically gets filled by guys from the day 2/3 ranks.

Our pass rush needs really stem from an inability to get push between the tackles. I don't see a DE being taken before round 4 for this team -- and there are several that I think will be good candidates. The earliest may be day 3 (Jaime Collins). He's a guy that seems more of a LEO.

On the right track with the pass rush or coverage prospects. I think they're going defense too. But I doubt it'll be at DE. At least early on. Clemons will be PuPed almost assuredly. But we'll likely plug in a short term solution there, while getting a long term prospect later.

[Scotty D]

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

It's overrated for several reasons:

1. Teams move their pass rushers all over the field. The days of having a LT protect you against the pass rush are over. You need a complete OL, bc teams will just move their pass rusher to the other side or up the gut and eliminate the effectiveness of the LT.

2. With teams using the gun more and more, and the pistol now, the "blind side" isn't as blind as it used to be.

3. The money. When you have a 10 million dollar LT it dramatically influences your cap and how you can spend on other more impactful positions.

4. Good quarterbacks don't need a great left tackle. Rodgers, Eli, Ben, Brady (when he had a declining Light), Peyton, Brees, I can go on and on. They don't need good left tackles. When you invest 15 mill a season in qb it's stupid to invest another 15 mill a season in LT. That's 30 million dollars in 2 players, one who's job is much easier when you have a 15 million dollar qb.

5. Ok cool, Khalil is a good draft pick. He's a great Left Tackle. Did he help Christian Ponder any? Ponder still sucks. And guess what, when your qb sucks your team isn't going anywhere.

Look how many times Rodgers got hit last year. Do you want your franchise QB getting hit that often? Teams do move their pass rushers around more now around but I think that just increases the need for a good RT.

Yes, he helped Christian Ponder. Adrian Peterson had the year he did because of two good offensive tackles.

[Scott Wright]

Originally Posted by xstamper13

Mocking Star to the Raiders is just lazy. I get that we need a DT but we have a greater need at pass rusher. I don't see Reggie spending a high pick on a guy with huge question marks regarding his work ethic and passion for the game.

Wasn't McKenzie in Green Bay when they selected B.J. Raji in the Top 10?

[Scott Wright]

Originally Posted by Chris

Why on Earth would you mock Sylvester Williams to the Denver Broncos? Probably the worst fit out of the defensive tackles in round one for a heavy two-gapping scheme that Jack Del Rio runs. It makes absolutely no sense. Our defense is built from the outside in. While getting a pass rush from the interior of our defensive line would be ideal, that isn't really the responsibilities of our guys on the interior of our defensive line.

Schematically, it is a terrible pick and I highly doubt that Denver would even consider someone who runs as hot and cold as he does. It just isn't the way our new front office operates.

Sylvester Williams isn't just a one-dimensional penetrator, the guy can play the run too.

May even get some looks as a five-technique.

[Scott Wright]

Originally Posted by thebow305

As always, LOVE Mingo to the Dolphins Scott!

Just curious though, if Mingo was gone, who would have been the next two you would have considered for Miami?

Hmm, I might have gone Ezekiel Ansah...

[Scott Wright]

Originally Posted by coordinator0

Minter is still a really nice pick for Baltimore. Even with the concerns about his range and coverage ability he would still be the best ILB that can play in space on the team.

I've heard that Baltimore really likes Minter.

I've had those two matched up for well over a month now.

[PossibleCabbage]

Originally Posted by princefielder28

The Packers' defense has a huge need inside at linebacker so Kevin Minter would make a lot of sense with the way the mock played out.

Honestly, the only ILB in this draft that I think brings anything that Green Bay doesn't already have is Ogletree (who's almost certainly off the board at 26.) Te'o doesn't upgrade Hawk and Minter doesn't upgrade Bishop.

As for defensive needs for Green Bay, I could both DE and S as higher priorities than ILB.

With the board as it stacks at 26 in Scott's Mock, I would try to trade back here if I were Ted Thompson.

[princefielder28]

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage

Honestly, the only ILB in this draft that I think brings anything that Green Bay doesn't already have is Ogletree (who's almost certainly off the board at 26.) Te'o doesn't upgrade Hawk and Minter doesn't upgrade Bishop.

As for defensive needs for Green Bay, I could both DE and S as higher priorities than ILB.

With the board as it stacks at 26 in Scott's Mock, I would try to trade back here if I were Ted Thompson.

Why can't Bishop and Minter play next to each other?

I would love for the Packers to address their issues at defensive end but after Thompson spent picks on Worthy and Daniels, there's little chance they'll use a high pick on the position.

I'd be all for Jonathan Cyprien in the first round to Green Bay if Minter isn't an option.

[holt_bruce81]

If the Rams pass on Lane Johnson for Kenny Vaccaro, I'm gonna be pretty pissed.

[eliasrapp98]

Eagles Need Defense!

[WCH]

Originally Posted by mightytitan9

Peyton still plays better when he has a top LT

LT's look better when they get to block for Peyton Manning.