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Old 03-12-2013, 02:36 PM    (permalink
Old School
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I agree on the job Idzik has been doing so far. I'm not a big fan of Holmes, but maybe he'll be happier with some changes to the team this year, and turn in a good year. Looking for another paycheck of course.

I've seen the name Mike Goodson being floated out there as a potential compliment to Powell. Nothing too exciting there.

Also, I guess it has finally been leaked that TB is the team with an offer for Revis. Just waiting to find out what they're offering.
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Old 03-12-2013, 02:38 PM    (permalink
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Look at me guessing right on the team. I'd take the 2014 first, personally.

I do think Florio is talking out of his ass when it comes to the compensation though. Comparing Revis to Harvin is great, but Harvin has historically had injury issues, both wanted huge deals, and Revis is (IMO at least) a better player. I get that it's same conference vs. different conference, but it's not like they traded Harvin within the division - they took the best offer, just like the Jets are going to do. And in terms of leverage, Harvin can hold out (and probably would have) which Revis can't. The ability to franchise is nice, but Harvin wanted out and supposedly demanded a trade. I think it's a wash there too. Maybe he's right, but it seems like he's stretching in that writeup and he likes to bash on the Jets anyway.

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Old 03-12-2013, 02:50 PM    (permalink
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Jason La Canfora is saying Eagles are in on Revis too, especially after releasing Nnamdi today. I definitely like that two teams at least are serious about getting Revis. Only makes the compensation better on our end. Seems like things are coming together quickly. I also don't believe that San Fran is out on Revis, they could be a dark horse.

I've gotta agree I like what we're doing so far with signing Garrard, targeting Gibson from Stl, and Mike Goodson. Those could be three low risk, medium-high reward signings for an offense in need of some new blood.
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Old 03-12-2013, 04:06 PM    (permalink
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Because of their crazy owner and decent amount of cap space, I wouldn't be surprised if Indy threw in a bid as well. But I guess I happened to be right about TB haha. I think that one made too much sense not to to bring up though.

I feel like if a deal is going to happen, it will be tomorrow or Thursday, but that's just a hunch. As for compensation, I would rather have a 2014 1st over a 2013 2nd. In trades, future picks always get devalued, but I don't know why. This isn't like the NBA where there's a bunch of lottery protections on the picks. The 1st rounder will always be better than the 2nd and seeing as you're not in a one-year scenario, there's no reason to not take the future pick. However, if there was an escalator to reach that level on the future pick, then that would change things.

Sad to hear Pouha go just because of our lack of DL depth. If DeVito signs with KC (or even if he doesn't), then it would actually seem very likely that we will be drafting DL at some point. It would also make the transition to the 4-3 much more likely (which has recently been brought up as probable).

I hear Landry has 3 or so teams lined up. I figure he's gone. Hoping Shonn Greene strikes out and ends up on a bad team.

EDIT: Also, I know he left because of contract issues (among other things), but what would you guys think about Ryan Fitzpatrick? I doubt we would have the money for him, but maybe he would sign with us to try to stick it to the Bills. IMO, he would seem to be a good fit for the WCO.
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Old 03-12-2013, 06:28 PM    (permalink
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DeVito to the Chiefs. Very sad to see him go. We'll see what Coples is made of next season. Ironically, this reminds me a little of the Thomas Jones/Shonn Greene situation.
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:30 PM    (permalink
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I don't think it'll quite be like Jones/Greene. Jones wasn't particularly good once he left and Greene fell off too. DeVito should still be solid at least and hopefully Coples takes a step forward. Certainly are the similarities between Greene and Coples having big ends to the season before the team moved on from starters. I like Coples though, think if he adds some strength he can be a real monster - Greene never had or developed breakaway speed or pass catching ability and at the NFL level was more of a closer who beat up tired defenses than an every down back. Hopefully Coples can become an every down guy, certainly a step but I think it's possible.

Definitely a bummer to see DeVito go though, I liked him quite a bit. Just hope/think Coples ends up better than Greene. Mid-round picks on versatile DL guys seem likely now, although I wonder what positions they try to bring in starters at in FA. Seems like Idzik is going to try to get some up and coming younger guys and hit big on them rather than overpay for guys who had production because of good circumstances one year. I like that. We'll see where it goes but it'd be nice to get some bargain basement starters.

Also, does anyone else get the feeling that if Revis is getting traded now we'll get better than the compensation that's being talked about? I don't see all that much motivation to pull the trigger early on in FA for a second round pick. Worst case you gamble, wait, aren't able to trade him, and get a third as a comp pick.
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:39 PM    (permalink
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DeVito to the Chiefs. Very sad to see him go. We'll see what Coples is made of next season. Ironically, this reminds me a little of the Thomas Jones/Shonn Greene situation.


KC is getting a lot of praise for signing DeVito. Some have called it a steal, even though it's not one of the flashy signings people are paying attention to.

Last I read, the Revis deal to TB is just about a done deal. It's killing me to not know what we'd be getting yet. I agree a 1st next year vs a 2nd this year would most likely be better in the long run. But it would suck to not get anything out of this coming draft for him. This is also supposed to be a good year for rounds 2-4.
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:42 PM    (permalink
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Also, does anyone else get the feeling that if Revis is getting traded now we'll get better than the compensation that's being talked about? I don't see all that much motivation to pull the trigger early on in FA for a second round pick. Worst case you gamble, wait, aren't able to trade him, and get a third as a comp pick.

True, I hadn't thought about that. Makes sense, if they are going to pull the trigger quickly, the deal could be one that Idzik can't resist.
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Old 03-12-2013, 08:57 PM    (permalink
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True, I hadn't thought about that. Makes sense, if they are going to pull the trigger quickly, the deal could be one that Idzik can't resist.
I think if they do something right off the bat with Tampa there's a good chance 13 is involved. Just not really sure why they wouldn't wait otherwise and see if they could get, say, a 1 and a 2 from Denver, San Fran, or Atlanta. If Philly's involved I'm sure they've at least dangled 35, so for the Jets to be making a move I'd guess 13 is involved.

However, I could see making the deal for say their second and a 2014 first (which honestly wouldn't be bad - 13 this year is kind of in no man's land similar to 9 and unless they'd trade down with one of those I don't know where they go with those two picks, not the worst problem to have but still - a 2nd this year is a starter and a future first is always nice plus if they don't get their QB this year that's firepower to go up and get a guy if they're not as bad as we think but still don't get legit QB play) or their second and a 2014 second that could escalate to a first.

Maybe they'd settle for a 2 and a 3 or a 2 and a future 2/3, but I would be surprised if they made the deal for much less unless they tested the market and weren't getting anything close. Still you'd imagine some team that needs corner help and strikes out on guys this FA might get desperate as we get closer to the draft and make a move.

To me, unless I find a deal I'm pretty happy with right now I stand pat. We'll see what Idzik does, but he seems like he's approaching things logically and with a plan in mind.
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Old 03-12-2013, 09:13 PM    (permalink
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I think if they do something right off the bat with Tampa there's a good chance 13 is involved. Just not really sure why they wouldn't wait otherwise and see if they could get, say, a 1 and a 2 from Denver, San Fran, or Atlanta. If Philly's involved I'm sure they've at least dangled 35, so for the Jets to be making a move I'd guess 13 is involved.

Funny, Scott's Mock Draft has TB taking Milliner at 13. I'm feeling good about Idzik's approach at the moment. That could all change after the details of the deal are announced.
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Old 03-12-2013, 09:26 PM    (permalink
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Yeah I mean there's also a good chance that the market was set low and they won't get much. I'd roll the dice and wait it out and we've continued to hear they'd wait till draft day, but who knows. I just don't see the real benefit to trading him now for pennies on the dollar. Later, sure, but not now. But I've been wrong before and I'll be wrong many, many more times (just hope this isn't one of them).

Also, when the trade goes down and I'm inevitably unhappy with the compensation, I'm going to blame Woody. He really screwed this up from a few angles. Sucks that he's the owner.

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Old 03-12-2013, 10:57 PM    (permalink
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I don't think it'll quite be like Jones/Greene. Jones wasn't particularly good once he left and Greene fell off too. DeVito should still be solid at least and hopefully Coples takes a step forward. Certainly are the similarities between Greene and Coples having big ends to the season before the team moved on from starters. I like Coples though, think if he adds some strength he can be a real monster - Greene never had or developed breakaway speed or pass catching ability and at the NFL level was more of a closer who beat up tired defenses than an every down back. Hopefully Coples can become an every down guy, certainly a step but I think it's possible.

Definitely a bummer to see DeVito go though, I liked him quite a bit. Just hope/think Coples ends up better than Greene. Mid-round picks on versatile DL guys seem likely now, although I wonder what positions they try to bring in starters at in FA. Seems like Idzik is going to try to get some up and coming younger guys and hit big on them rather than overpay for guys who had production because of good circumstances one year. I like that. We'll see where it goes but it'd be nice to get some bargain basement starters.

Also, does anyone else get the feeling that if Revis is getting traded now we'll get better than the compensation that's being talked about? I don't see all that much motivation to pull the trigger early on in FA for a second round pick. Worst case you gamble, wait, aren't able to trade him, and get a third as a comp pick.
I don't know. People were talking up Greene quite a bit when Thomas Jones was around. I think the RBs are both more positive impacts, as TJ was one of the true leaders in the locker room and, to my knowledge, Greene has been just fine, while DeVito is a good hard worker and nice presence (but nothing special in that regard as a leader) and Coples has already been criticized for his lack of work ethic. The only saving grace I see is that all Coples has to do is see the field and he will at least be a part of an athletic DL rotation, and all we have to do is not give him a big contract when he has that inevitable monster contract year. But who knows. You might be right.

As with Revis... I'm not sure. I feel like the upside to trading him now is having a better idea of who we can target in FA. We weren't going to be bidders in the early going, but I assume we would at least like to get this figured out so we can attack those mid-low level guys later on. Since trading him gives us a negative cap hit, I figure they would want that accounted for (also, since he's due a 1 mil roster bonus this Saturday, that would be another incentive to get this done early). No one really knows if it's better or worse compensation than what has been discussed, but I don't think the timing has anything to do with it beyond the fact that the longer you wait, the worse the market will be.

Speaking of it being a lack of a leaky ship, I saw a tweet earlier from one of the Jets bloggers or beat writers saying that the Jets are doing some "interesting things" to tighten things up so that the Rich Cimini's, Mike Florio's, etc. of the world can't get all of our dirt from "unnamed source". And, that information came from an outside source from another team, not the Jets haha.

EDIT: I forgot. Cromartie! That seems like a huge restructure, but he probably gets his money all the same with that signing bonus. Looks a lot better for us though. With that and Santonio's restructure, it would seem that we have around 15 mil in cap space. Not too shabby!

Oh. I see that for Cro about 4 mil was pushed into 2014. I'm... going to assume we're cutting him before then.
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Old 03-13-2013, 08:24 AM    (permalink
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Oh, I agreed with you on the talking up Greene - was more talking about his game in retrospect. What would make them similar is if we continue to find Coples really can't hold up against the run and is a major liability there and they just keep him on the field on passing downs for the most part. Not sure how likely that is, but that's where I see him going from good end of the rookie year to only really should be a situational player like Greene. All he really has to do is add some strength though, so we'll see if that happens. Could be rough if we move to a 4-3 unless they play him inside a bunch on passing downs, which could actually work nicely although they don't really have ends. Think targeting a guy like Victor Butler indicates that they'd like to stick in the 3-4 though. I'm more being optimistic, but I do think Coples is much more talented than Greene. Hopefully the work ethic isn't an issue, but we'll see.

There are certainly upsides to trading Revis now, but at the end of the day I think compensation trumps those. They have like 15 million in space now (seems like it should be more with the restructures/cuts since I feel like between Pouha, Holmes, and Cro they should've saved around 11 million and they were 8-9 million under before, but maybe not), but are probably operating under the assumption it's more like 6 million if you assume 3 million for Revis and 6 million for rookies (assume additional picks). Not like they were going to do that much anyway. Grab a couple low-mid level guys for that money and if you have more left later on, great. Always will be guys who slip through the cracks or they can push unused space into the following year. Not that there's no incentive to move him now, but I don’t think it’s so important you’d take considerably less than you feel you should. The compensation is the most important factor. As for the market being best now, maybe. There are some FA corners, but none of them are nearly as good as Revis and won’t make close to the same impact. Plus some teams are going to come up blank in FA which would give the Jets additional leverage. If now is when you’re going to get the best offer and you legitimately get a good offer, great, take it. But if you’re getting offers of a second round pick, I’ll gamble and wait to see if that gets better. Odds are it’s still out there and if not you’ll still get something for him later on, but to me that’s not enough to pull the trigger right now.
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Old 03-13-2013, 12:48 PM    (permalink
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Unfourtanetly for the Jets this year has a ton of free agent CB's. The fact that Revis is coming off an injury and wants a huge contract does not help, the Buc's are not a CB away and would be better off signing FS Goldson and 2 second tier CB's then gambling on Revis. Only way I see a first round pick happening is if it's a late round pick to a contender.
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Old 03-13-2013, 01:12 PM    (permalink
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Unfourtanetly for the Jets this year has a ton of free agent CB's. The fact that Revis is coming off an injury and wants a huge contract does not help, the Buc's are not a CB away and would be better off signing FS Goldson and 2 second tier CB's then gambling on Revis. Only way I see a first round pick happening is if it's a late round pick to a contender.
Maaaaan... I hope this doesn't end up being an awkward post in the next few days...
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Old 03-13-2013, 01:22 PM    (permalink
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Maaaaan... I hope this doesn't end up being an awkward post in the next few days...
I kind of hope it does haha just from our perspective. We'll see. Rumor I saw that makes sense is the Bucs are offering their second and a conditional 2014 pick that could get escalated to a first (not sure what the conditions are) and the Jets are pushing for it to be their 2013 first and a conditional 2014 pick that could get escalated to a second. Personally I could live with the first deal if the 2014 pick is a straight up first and they extend him before finalizing the trade, that'd be a nice middle ground IMO...but that's coming from a Jets fan so I'm not sure Bucs fans would agree.
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Old 03-13-2013, 01:43 PM    (permalink
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I don't think No. 13 would be part of the package.

I think it will be two 2nds or a 2nd and a conditional 3rd. If they get more, good for them.
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Old 03-13-2013, 02:20 PM    (permalink
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Well, it looks like TB has signed Goldson. Hope this doesn't cancel out anything with the Revis deal. TB does need CB help, but they could go cheaper.
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Old 03-13-2013, 03:14 PM    (permalink
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Greene to the Titans and maybe Keller to the Dolphins? A lot of our players seem to go to teams we play the next year. I wonder if that's just a coincidence.

Also, on Twitter I saw that Revis had a Falcons hat on while in Paris. Maybe the news is on time delay... or maybe they don't want to steal the headlines away from the pope...
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Old 03-13-2013, 04:00 PM    (permalink
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We'll see on the compensation for Revis. Not sure he's worth that much less than Percy Harvin, but it depends who's interested I guess.

Think the Falcons hat thing was a few days ago.
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Old 03-13-2013, 05:31 PM    (permalink
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Considering the compensation for him and the fact that he's also coming off a season-ending injury (though admittedly not as bad), do you guys think the Harvin trade will benefit us? Since he'll also need a new contract and he's looking for something north of 10 mil, all the while not being near the player Revis is, I feel like that should up our price. Potential buyers might not see it that way though.

Greg Schiano was on NFLN and made it sound like they're probably still looking to trade for Revis. But who knows.
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Old 03-13-2013, 05:38 PM    (permalink
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To me, Revis should more or less get the same compensation as Harvin. Both unique players, Revis is the best player at his position (by a wide margin) and Harvin is definitely not the best at his position, but very good. Both wanted extensions, Revis will want more but Harvin still wanted a lot. Each has injury concerns coming off an injury, but Harvin's going to take a ton of hits and get nicked up which won't happen as much as Revis. To me all things considered it's about a wash, and that's why I'll set the bar for what the Jets get for Revis at what the Vikes got for Harvin. Maybe I'm being a homer though, who knows.

Think the Jets killed their leverage which to me would be the only reason why they wouldn't get as much as the Vikings. There were/are some solid FA WR's out there this season too, think much better than corners. If they had stayed hush hush about it and acted like they were trying to extend him only to trade him I think they would have done better than they will.
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Old 03-13-2013, 09:03 PM    (permalink
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To me, Revis should more or less get the same compensation as Harvin. Both unique players, Revis is the best player at his position (by a wide margin) and Harvin is definitely not the best at his position, but very good. Both wanted extensions, Revis will want more but Harvin still wanted a lot. Each has injury concerns coming off an injury, but Harvin's going to take a ton of hits and get nicked up which won't happen as much as Revis. To me all things considered it's about a wash, and that's why I'll set the bar for what the Jets get for Revis at what the Vikes got for Harvin. Maybe I'm being a homer though, who knows.

Think the Jets killed their leverage which to me would be the only reason why they wouldn't get as much as the Vikings. There were/are some solid FA WR's out there this season too, think much better than corners. If they had stayed hush hush about it and acted like they were trying to extend him only to trade him I think they would have done better than they will.
Seattle gave up a late first rounder, little different then the 13th pick. Not that I don't think Revis is worth it, just saying. If I'm not mistaken Revis is owed a bonus on Friday, both sides are waiting it out but my guess it gets done by then.
A 2nd a 4th and Blount. Throw in a conditional mid round pick in 2014 to.
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Old 03-13-2013, 09:11 PM    (permalink
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Seattle gave up a late first rounder, little different then the 13th pick. Not that I don't think Revis is worth it, just saying. If I'm not mistaken Revis is owed a bonus on Friday, both sides are waiting it out but my guess it gets done by then.
A 2nd a 4th and Blount. Throw in a conditional mid round pick in 2014 to.


2nd and 4th, you can keep Blount. Conditional 2014 pick, 2nd that could escalate to a 1st. Done deal.
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Old 03-13-2013, 09:27 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by kBuc5 View Post
Seattle gave up a late first rounder, little different then the 13th pick. Not that I don't think Revis is worth it, just saying. If I'm not mistaken Revis is owed a bonus on Friday, both sides are waiting it out but my guess it gets done by then.
A 2nd a 4th and Blount. Throw in a conditional mid round pick in 2014 to.
Not necessarily 13, but I still think they should get a similar value. And that trade is also considerably less than the Harvin trade, plus Blount is pretty useless in the Jets' new offense - I'm guessing you would just like to get rid of him. A 2 and a 4 in 2013 and a 2 and a 5 in 2014 would be about right. Or a 3 and a 7 in 2013, and a 2014 first. If you're trying to get even with the Harvin trade.
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