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Old 05-16-2013, 10:35 AM    (permalink
mightytitan9
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Originally Posted by Denver Bronco56 View Post
LOCKS
Brady
Manning
Rodgers


MOST LIKELY
Brees



MEDIA LOVE WILL HELP, BUT IM NOT SURE
Eli Manning
Big Ben
This is the best list excluding the guys that are simply too young to rate yet. I believe Eli and Ben will both get in, they each have 2 superbowl wins and play for very popular teams that are represented well in Canton. It's not like we're talking about someone who plays for the Panthers or Jaguars
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:48 AM    (permalink
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20 years ago there was 7 + Favre
And I think the same will apply for today's NFL when we look back in 2033.

Montana, Marino, Elway were the locks 20 years ago, much like Peyton, Brady and Brees. Aikman was about to enter his 5th season and won his 2nd Super Bowl that year. He compares to Big Ben and Eli with their multiple titles.

Steve Young was still trying to get the monkey off his back but was about to go on a statistical tear, win a Super Bowl and finish his career with the best passer rating ever. Aaron Rodgers is ahead of that pace already. He has the SB, MVPs and is the only QB with a career passer rating over 100.

Jim Kelly and Warren Moon were well established starters who both started their careers in other leagues. Kelly had the 4 AFC titles and Moon had huge career numbers for that era. Brett Favre was still a young pup much like Luck and RG3.

And somebody will end up with a fine career but missing out like Boomer Esiasin and Randall Cunningham did from 20 years ago.
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Old 05-16-2013, 10:54 AM    (permalink
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Agreed. I'm surprised people don't think Brees is a lock. He has the Super Bowl, the individual awards, the huge career numbers and individual season records. He's the guy that broke Marino's 5,084 yds AND Unitas' 47 game streak with a TD pass. There's not much more he can do except win multiple Super Bowls. Brees might finish his career by breaking Favre's yardage record, not unless Peyton gets there first. If Jim Kelly and Warren Moon were 1st ballot HOFers, Brees will waltz into Canton.

I think Breeds gets in. but I guess the opposing argument would be he compiles stats because he has more pass attempts then anyone else year after year. Same way with Brett F. BF leads all QBs in passing attempts. So what's that mean if you are have more attempts then anyone in history? More completions, Yards , TDs And ints. He has the record for all of them.

Brees has a lot of passing attempts year after year. So its only natural he will compile stats at a insane rate. 658 times throwing year after year is flat out nuts!

Perhaps people see him in that light. Brees in that system, throwing a million times a year, with produce j
insane stats and he has.

So I can understand that point of view because it is valid. However, he is getting in without a doubt.


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Old 05-16-2013, 11:14 AM    (permalink
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Oh I think Brees is lock. It's just off all of the 6 guys who already have HOF resumes, his you can post the most holes in because he hasn't had much team success in the postseason outside of the superbowl year and hasn't dominated his division every year like Peyton to make up for it. He'll still be a hall of famer, even if he doesn't return to the postseason again.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:00 PM    (permalink
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Strange that people sort of question Brees' HOF resume. He's not only Canton bound, he's gonna go first ballot.

He took a perennial cellar dweller franchise to the SB and WON IT.
The Saints are one of those franchises if you quarterback them to a SB, you're going to get all kinds of love from the HOF.
And his numbers as sick. No question about Brees at all.

If people remember that you don't need to be a first ballot selection to get into the HOF, I don't see how any of these guys isn't inducted into Canton 10-20 years after their retirement.

Guys like Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco are on HOF career tracks IMO. If Ryan wins a SB for the Falcons, the first in franchise history, his ticket is punched.

I hate to say it, but if Romo ever wins a SB, he's getting in at some point too.


These guys collectively are so much better than their peers it's easy to see from a distance why their HOF candidacies are so strong.

There's no way I'm putting a rookie or 2nd year QB from 2012 on this list. And I'd loan RG3 my lunch money and be happy about it, but there are several forks in the road guys like CK, RG3 and Luck's careers could take in the near future.

If they trend like they played last season, yeah all three have Canton potential. Until then it's too soon.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:06 PM    (permalink
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Jay Cutler bout to go on a ten year run that looks like Rich Gannon's 2002 and get in on the first ballot, of course. That's my Stone Cold Lock of the Century...of the Week

































































Ok, maybe don't put money on that.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:09 PM    (permalink
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You know all Jay has to do is win(!) a Lombardi and play top 10 QB football statistically for about 6 years and he's probably getting in too.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:13 PM    (permalink
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Strange that people sort of question Brees' HOF resume. He's not only Canton bound, he's gonna go first ballot.

He took a perennial cellar dweller franchise to the SB and WON IT.
The Saints are one of those franchises if you quarterback them to a SB, you're going to get all kinds of love from the HOF.
And his numbers as sick. No question about Brees at all.

If people remember that you don't need to be a first ballot selection to get into the HOF, I don't see how any of these guys isn't inducted into Canton 10-20 years after their retirement.

Guys like Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco are on HOF career tracks IMO. If Ryan wins a SB for the Falcons, the first in franchise history, his ticket is punched.

I hate to say it, but if Romo ever wins a SB, he's getting in at some point too.


These guys collectively are so much better than their peers it's easy to see from a distance why their HOF candidacies are so strong.

There's no way I'm putting a rookie or 2nd year QB from 2012 on this list. And I'd loan RG3 my lunch money and be happy about it, but there are several forks in the road guys like CK, RG3 and Luck's careers could take in the near future.

If they trend like they played last season, yeah all three have Canton potential. Until then it's too soon.
So if that's the case, then in this offensive football era, more so the guys younger than 30 years old, how many can go?

We have to assume all these guys like Ryan, Stafford, and Luck will compile insane numbers as their careers unfold. So where does that new average or benchmark form?

So in the next let's say 15-20 years, we can have like half these QBs in the league, starting now, as HOFers? LOL. That's a lot, and would be amazing for football if that happens.

I still think though that for guys with 1 SB to make it they need insane stats and personal awards like league MVPs to aide them.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Denver Bronco56 View Post
LOCKS
Brady
Manning
Rodgers


MOST LIKELY
Brees



MEDIA LOVE WILL HELP, BUT IM NOT SURE
Eli Manning
Big Ben
What does Rodgers have over Brees that makes him a lock to you?
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:20 PM    (permalink
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Eli and Big Ben will get in but they shouldn't.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:20 PM    (permalink
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The one thing about Brees for me is how bad he was with the Chargers.... it wasnt until he got in Sean Peyton's system that he has been elite... he to me is a GREAT system player
Brees had two pretty good years in San Diego his final two seasons there. He turned it around before he hooked up with Sean Payton.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:21 PM    (permalink
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I think the thing that might keep brees from becoming a first ballot HOF is that he never won the MVP, he should have but he hasnt.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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Brees had two pretty good years in San Diego his final two seasons there. He turned it around before he hooked up with Sean Payton.
you beat me to it. brees in his last two years witht he chargers wasnt just " not bad" he legitimately was good. Its what made the saints gamble on him even though he was injured. If the guy you responded to was even remotely right he wouldve been out of the league after that five year stint at the charges with such an injury.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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I think the thing that might keep brees from becoming a first ballot HOF is that he never won the MVP, he should have but he hasnt.
I think his records that people gush over will make up for it though. Like someone else said, if Dan Fouts and Warren Moon got in on the first try (both never won an MVP award or a Super Bowl), Brees should as well.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:26 PM    (permalink
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See thats my point...the NFL today is soooo pass happy that throwing for 4500 yards is not that great, 10 years ago even that was MVP status.

John Elway went to the SB 3 times with SCRUB teams in the 80's... that is impressive alone. But when Dan Marino threw for 5000 yards back in 84' that was INSANE... now we have had 4 people in the last 2-3 years put up those kind of numbers..I think the stats are inflated and it still comes down to rings, MVPs, and actually being an elite QB.


For someone to mention Romo being a HOF qb is a joke.... he might put up the stats, but alot of time he is not the best QB in the game.

When Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers take the field there is NO DOUBT they are the best player on the field that day.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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See thats my point...the NFL today is soooo pass happy that throwing for 4500 yards is not that great, 10 years ago even that was MVP status.

John Elway went to the SB 3 times with SCRUB teams in the 80's... that is impressive alone. But when Dan Marino threw for 5000 yards back in 84' that was INSANE... now we have had 4 people in the last 2-3 years put up those kind of numbers..I think the stats are inflated and it still comes down to rings, MVPs, and actually being an elite QB.


For someone to mention Romo being a HOF qb is a joke.... he might put up the stats, but alot of time he is not the best QB in the game.

When Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers take the field there is NO DOUBT they are the best player on the field that day.
You have a point, but how many of the voters are going to seriously look at that ballot and think about the pass happy league we live in now compared to just looking at the stack of numbers Brees put up and just approving him? I think everyone now and days gets carried away by the huge numbers that are put up in the NFL. I never hear very many people saying "yeah, but the rules make it easier now and days". We live in the fantasy football era and 99% of the talking heads, reporters, or whomever just seem to embrace it.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:40 PM    (permalink
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You have a point, but how many of the voters are going to seriously look at that ballot and think about the pass happy league we live in now compared to just looking at the stack of numbers Brees put up and just approving him? I think everyone now and days gets carried away by the huge numbers that are put up in the NFL. I never hear very many people saying "yeah, but the rules make it easier now and days". We live in the fantasy football era and 99% of the talking heads, reporters, or whomever just seem to embrace it.
Oh no doubt the voters are very biased/opinionated and big market teams and players that "talk" are highlighted, there are people like Randy Gradishar that played for the Broncos that no question had a HOF career but get overlooked since he played in Dever and not somewhere like NY.

But back to the point, I feel like stats are one of the worst things now days to be sole justification for the HOF with the way the game is played, passing yards and receiving yards are off the roof. Im not saying they should be overlooked but taken with a grain of salt.. because you have rookies coming in and throwing for what would have been league setting numbers 10 years ago. But i do find what say Adrian Peterson did last year impressive to have such a dominate rushing season in a pass happy league.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:40 PM    (permalink
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The inflation of QB stats isn't as relevant when the numbers Brees puts up are still near the top of the league year after year. He's still putting up great numbers relative to the rest of the league, the difference is just that you can't put his numbers up against Montana or Elway and compare them without context.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:40 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by NY+Giants=NYG View Post
So if that's the case, then in this offensive football era, more so the guys younger than 30 years old, how many can go?

We have to assume all these guys like Ryan, Stafford, and Luck will compile insane numbers as their careers unfold. So where does that new average or benchmark form?

So in the next let's say 15-20 years, we can have like half these QBs in the league, starting now, as HOFers? LOL. That's a lot, and would be amazing for football if that happens.

I still think though that for guys with 1 SB to make it they need insane stats and personal awards like league MVPs to aide them.
Injuries will do a lot of the sorting out here. If you go back about 20 years you'll also see a bunch of guys who looked like they could be on a HOF trajectory, but their bodies just couldn't hold up. Carson Palmer is a very recent example of this. Longevity is vastly overstated at the QB position.

Hell, people are only talking about Aaron Rodgers as a lock or near-lock because they're projecting his numbers over the next six years or so. At the same time, the guy might be one concussion away from hanging it up.

This is why we can't assume that guys like Ryan, Stafford, and Luck are going to compile insane numbers.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:42 PM    (permalink
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To be honest I don't see how Aaron Rodgers is a lock if Drew Brees isn't

Drew Brees's resume

7 Pro Bowl (2004, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012)
4 All-Pro (2006, 2008, 2009, 2011)
Super Bowl champion (XLIV)
Super Bowl MVP (XLIV)
2 AP NFL Offensive Player of the Year (2008, 2011)
2 NFC MVP (2008, 2009)
3 NFC Offensive Player of the Year (2006, 2008, 2009)
All-time single season passing yard leader (5,476)
Fastest ever to reach 40,000 yards passing
Co-Walter Payton Man of the Year Award (2006)
First player to reach back to back 5k seasons.

Aaron Rodgers Resume

3 Pro Bowl (2009, 2011, 2012)
First-team All-Pro (2011)[1]
Second-team All-Pro (2012)
AP NFL MVP (2011)
Super Bowl champion (XLV)
Super Bowl MVP (XLV)
Season passer rating record (I hate passer rating as a statistic but I added it anyway)
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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Injuries will do a lot of the sorting out here. If you go back about 20 years you'll also see a bunch of guys who looked like they could be on a HOF trajectory, but their bodies just couldn't hold up. Carson Palmer is a very recent example of this. Longevity is vastly overstated at the QB position.

Hell, people are only talking about Aaron Rodgers as a lock or near-lock because they're projecting his numbers over the next six years or so. At the same time, the guy might be one concussion away from hanging it up.

This is why we can't assume that guys like Ryan, Stafford, and Luck are going to compile insane numbers.
100% of this is true... People forget that Injuries are what separate people like Sterling Sharpe and Terrell Davis from Jerry Rice and Emmitt Smith type of careers. One injury can take you from HOF bound to what could have been.
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Old 05-16-2013, 01:53 PM    (permalink
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Injuries will do a lot of the sorting out here. If you go back about 20 years you'll also see a bunch of guys who looked like they could be on a HOF trajectory, but their bodies just couldn't hold up. Carson Palmer is a very recent example of this. Longevity is vastly overstated at the QB position.

Hell, people are only talking about Aaron Rodgers as a lock or near-lock because they're projecting his numbers over the next six years or so. At the same time, the guy might be one concussion away from hanging it up.

This is why we can't assume that guys like Ryan, Stafford, and Luck are going to compile insane numbers.
That's true, but if AR were to hang it up tomorrow do you think people vote him in? He has 1 SB and 1 MVP. Does he make it if he were to hang it up tomorrow?

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SuperPacker Eli and Big Ben will get in but they shouldn't.
Only 2 time SB winner who hasn't is Plunkett. Do you think Eli and Big Ben are better than Plunkett? That's the only multiple SB winner who isn't in the HOF.
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Old 05-16-2013, 02:19 PM    (permalink
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To be honest I don't see how Aaron Rodgers is a lock if Drew Brees isn't

Drew Brees's resume

7 Pro Bowl (2004, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012)
4 All-Pro (2006, 2008, 2009, 2011)
Super Bowl champion (XLIV)
Super Bowl MVP (XLIV)
2 AP NFL Offensive Player of the Year (2008, 2011)
2 NFC MVP (2008, 2009)
3 NFC Offensive Player of the Year (2006, 2008, 2009)
All-time single season passing yard leader (5,476)
Fastest ever to reach 40,000 yards passing
Co-Walter Payton Man of the Year Award (2006)
First player to reach back to back 5k seasons.

Aaron Rodgers Resume

3 Pro Bowl (2009, 2011, 2012)
First-team All-Pro (2011)[1]
Second-team All-Pro (2012)
AP NFL MVP (2011)
Super Bowl champion (XLV)
Super Bowl MVP (XLV)
Season passer rating record (I hate passer rating as a statistic but I added it anyway)
if you do records brees' season completion percentage record needs to be there as well
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Old 05-16-2013, 03:36 PM    (permalink
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Eli and Big Ben will get in but they shouldn't.
This is dumber than when you almost killed yourself and your whole family.
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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Originally Posted by abaddon41_80 View Post
Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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Old 05-16-2013, 03:40 PM    (permalink
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See thats my point...the NFL today is soooo pass happy that throwing for 4500 yards is not that great, 10 years ago even that was MVP status.

John Elway went to the SB 3 times with SCRUB teams in the 80's... that is impressive alone. But when Dan Marino threw for 5000 yards back in 84' that was INSANE... now we have had 4 people in the last 2-3 years put up those kind of numbers..I think the stats are inflated and it still comes down to rings, MVPs, and actually being an elite QB.


For someone to mention Romo being a HOF qb is a joke.... he might put up the stats, but alot of time he is not the best QB in the game.

When Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers take the field there is NO DOUBT they are the best player on the field that day.
I'm assuming you mean unless he's facing this handsome devil:

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JPP is a better and more productive player than Brandon Graham
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Is Shaun Hill a top 10 QB? Definitely not. Is he a top 20 one? Almost certainly.
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Originally Posted by JBCX View Post
Most misleading 10+ sack season EVER.
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