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Old 03-20-2014, 11:17 PM    (permalink
niel89
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It's not like its a surprise. He was recruited with the intention to do both.
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Old 03-21-2014, 02:16 PM    (permalink
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http://www.tomahawknation.com/2014/3...al-logo-change

At the request of the Seminole Tribe, Florida State will be getting a new school logo that makes Osceola look less "war like". When I read this, I worry we'll get something ridiculous like the Cleveland Indians logo.
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Old 03-25-2014, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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Strong rumors this will be FSU's new logo come April 11. Can't say I prefer it, but I've had 35 years of indoctrination to the old logo, but on the same hand I don't hate. But if it is true the Seminole Tribe wanted a less "war like" logo, I don't see how they got their wish versus
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Old 03-25-2014, 03:22 PM    (permalink
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Strong rumors this will be FSU's new logo come April 11. Can't say I prefer it, but I've had 35 years of indoctrination to the old logo, but on the same hand I don't hate. But if it is true the Seminole Tribe wanted a less "war like" logo, I don't see how they got their wish versus
To me it looks like it's laughing. Is it supposed to be yelling or something?
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Old 03-25-2014, 03:23 PM    (permalink
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To me it looks like it's laughing. Is it supposed to be yelling or something?
To me it looks like it is mid-war cry more than the old one. I am relieved since the original description was something akin to the Cleveland Indians logo.
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Old 03-25-2014, 11:35 PM    (permalink
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It's not bad just more cartoonish. He has some chubby cheeks.
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Old 03-26-2014, 01:17 PM    (permalink
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So FSU lost nearly $250k by playing in the ACCCG while bringing in millions for a BCSCG birth for everyone else in the conference. Great business model the ACC has to benefit the crap teams while screwing the good ones.
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Old 03-26-2014, 04:12 PM    (permalink
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This is too funny not to share....



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Old 03-26-2014, 04:40 PM    (permalink
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So, Northwestern players are going to be able to unionize? Don't want to make this political, but that could potentially destroy a lot of non-big time programs if it catches on.
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Old 03-26-2014, 04:57 PM    (permalink
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So, Northwestern players are going to be able to unionize? Don't want to make this political, but that could potentially destroy a lot of non-big time programs if it catches on.
It is absolutely ridiculous to say they are employees of the school and that sets an extremely dangerous precedent in its potential application to public universities. However IF they want to hold this, then the scholarships should count as taxable income to the players (bet that shuts up their whining). Currently a year's tuition runs about $60,000. If they are school employees, then they need to pay taxes on that money like REAL school employees to both Illinois and the IRS.

I am sick of this notion college players aren't compensated, in a time where college tuition is becoming more and more expensive (my alma mater is up 100% from when I graduated in 2001) the players are increasingly more compensated. If they choose to forego the value of the education provided to them, that is on them and no one else.
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Old 03-26-2014, 05:01 PM    (permalink
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I'm interested to see the outcome of this now. They aren't really seeking to be paid. They want better health care coverage, concussion help, and 4 year scholarships.
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Old 03-26-2014, 05:02 PM    (permalink
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It certainly opens up a can of worms.
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Old 03-26-2014, 05:12 PM    (permalink
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I'm interested to see the outcome of this now. They aren't really seeking to be paid. They want better health care coverage, concussion help, and 4 year scholarships.
It is even one thing with private schools, but the implications for public universities could be terrifying.

I'll use UMass (and Massachusetts) as an example because I know the policies best. Once you work there 20 years you are eligible for full retirement benefits. IF the players are held to be state employees, this would mean if they took any state job in Massachusetts, they'd be eligible for retirement benefits in 15-16 years. It could also cause severe issues with state contributions to 403(b) retirement plans, which theoretically the players would be eligible for. Not to mention the other issues it would cause for the REAL employees.
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Old 03-26-2014, 05:47 PM    (permalink
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I'm interested to see the outcome of this now. They aren't really seeking to be paid. They want better health care coverage, concussion help, and 4 year scholarships.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/26/us/nor...html?hpt=hp_c2

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The athletes have said they're seeking better medical coverage, concussion testing, four-year scholarships and the possibility of being paid.
They aren't looking for it now, but I think you'd have to be pretty naive to think it wasn't coming eventually.
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Old 03-26-2014, 05:51 PM    (permalink
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So, Northwestern players are going to be able to unionize? Don't want to make this political, but that could potentially destroy a lot of non-big time programs if it catches on.
I do feel that college players should get some of the money that schools make off of them, especially in jersey sales and television deals. But when I looked at a chart on the NCPA website which determined a fair market value for a FB player I was amazed at some of the figures that players would be getting paid. The players at Alabama, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, LSU, Ohio State, Oklahoma, Michigan, Notre Dame, Penn State, South Carolina, Tennessee would make between 300k and 400k. Players at Texas would make over 500k based on what this group has calculated as fair value based on 2010 revenue numbers.

Meanwhile, these numbers have Mississippi State not being able to pay their kids more than 80k in this scenario. I can't imagine Mississippi State, and several other schools,being able to compete in their conferences anymore if students were to get paid based on the revenue of the football program. I think we're a long way off from this happening, but it does sort of seem inevitable.

I'm not sure how these numbers were calculated but if you want to see the chart and maybe look into it further, it's the link at the end of this page.
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Old 03-26-2014, 06:03 PM    (permalink
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It could also cause severe issues with state contributions to 403(b) retirement plans, which theoretically the players would be eligible for. Not to mention the other issues it would cause for the REAL employees.
Part of what the NCPA wants is for guarantees to be made about the duration of an athlete's scholarship when he signs. The NLRB regional director cited the ties between a players performance and his scholarship as a reason for granting them union rights. I guess it's because they are essentially working on year to year contracts like a lot of other employees while also bringing in a sizable amount of money for the school. I think if they were to be guaranteed their four year scholarship and if scholarships weren't tied to performance that it would be a harder to consider them employees. That's one of the missions/goals on the NCPA's website and something they urge recruits to ask for in writing before signing with a school.
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Old 03-26-2014, 06:10 PM    (permalink
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Part of what the NCPA wants is for guarantees to be made about the duration of an athlete's scholarship when he signs. The NLRB regional director cited the ties between a players performance and his scholarship as a reason for granting them union rights. I guess it's because they are essentially working on year to year contracts like a lot of other employees while also bringing in a sizable amount of money for the school. I think if they were to be guaranteed their four year scholarship and if scholarships weren't tied to performance that it would be a harder to consider them employees. That's one of the missions/goals on the NCPA's website and something they urge recruits to ask for in writing before signing with a school.
So could a non-athlete student who receives an academic scholarship with the stipulation that he or she keeps his GPA above a 3.0 start a union since the scholarship was tied to academic performance? I'm not just trying to play devil's advocate, but think of all the issues this will bring.

Also, what about the non-big time sports athletes who aren't generating revenue? And what about women's sports? How does this affect Title IX?
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Old 03-26-2014, 06:24 PM    (permalink
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So could a non-athlete student who receives an academic scholarship with the stipulation that he or she keeps his GPA above a 3.0 start a union since the scholarship was tied to academic performance? I'm not just trying to play devil's advocate, but think of all the issues this will bring.

Also, what about the non-big time sports athletes who aren't generating revenue? And what about women's sports? How does this affect Title IX?
I thought about your first point as well initially but I believe the difference is that the Northwestern football players are generating a considerable amount of revenue for the school via merchandising, TV deal etc. Where as the academic student on scholarship isn't really bringing money into the school. I understand what you're saying and I thought the exact same thing when I read the article.

Non revenue generating sports are another reason I think it's going to be very hard to pay football players without dramatically effecting the structure of college sports. If they are going to pay football players what this group says is fair I think it's most definitely going to come at the expense of student athletes of non revenue sports. Which seems to be something that the NCAA is seizing on in this debate, continuously citing the statistic that 99% of college athletes don't go on to play in the pros.
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Old 03-26-2014, 07:03 PM    (permalink
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This is going to be awful for college football. Should players get better medical coverage and concussion protection? Probably, but this will lead to them fighting for money. I really hope either Northwestern wins their appeal or the players vote not to unionize.
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:50 PM    (permalink
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Meh. $100M/year revenue programs paying out $4M/yr in "salary".

Either let outside entities pay players above board however they want or you have this ****. Congrats doofuses. Way to try and limit the earning potential of kids that are bringing in massive amounts of dollars.

Most players aren't going to get more than a scholarship. The elites will get a ton of money.

Now there is going to be some union that will completely screw things up.

Universities wanted their gravy train to never end but it will, in likely the worst way because they wouldn't let kids get money legally from boosters or sponsors.
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:52 PM    (permalink
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Anything from this only applies to private schools apparently. This is going to be really tricky to sort out. The Northwestern players aren't making any push for money.

Football isn't like the other sports or regular students. It's just something entirely different so they really don't compare evenly. I think players should get more from a system that gets so much from them but I have no idea how to give it to them.
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:55 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by niel89 View Post
Anything from this only applies to private schools apparently. This is going to be really tricky to sort out. The Northwestern players aren't making any push for money.

Football isn't like the other sports or regular students. It's just something entirely different so they really don't compare evenly. I think players should get more from a system that gets so much from them but I have no idea how to give it to them.
Let boosters, businesses, etc pay whomever they want. The amateur rules are stupid. It's not been an amateur sport for decades. Maybe ever.
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Old 03-27-2014, 12:41 AM    (permalink
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The reasons for trying to unionize are very good. They recognize that they are being paid in the form of free tuition, but they want guaranteed healthcare and better programs designed to improve graduation rates. These are not issues that the NCAA or individual universities would enact without leverage against them.
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Old 03-27-2014, 01:26 AM    (permalink
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Pretty good explanation of the decision by Lester Munson.
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Old 03-27-2014, 08:16 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by JoeJoeBrown View Post
Universities wanted their gravy train to never end but it will, in likely the worst way because they wouldn't let kids get money legally from boosters or sponsors.
Interestingly this is an issue of huge NCAA hypocrisy. I am going to guess many don't know this (and I only do because my college roommate was on the ski team) but the NCAA DOES allow for Skiers to get sponsorship money and maintain "amateur" status. As he explained it to me, the "logic" is because of the cost of training.

This is what caused an eligibility hiccup for former Colorado WR (and Skier) Jeremy Bloom.
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