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Old 07-08-2014, 10:56 PM    (permalink
niel89
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Being an NFL QB is about the grind and I don't think Manziel will enjoy the process enough to be successful. He doesn't have talent of Marino, Favre, or Big Ben.

Partying and then getting up and rocking it in college is not in the same world as doing it in the NFL. Maybe a running back or DE but not a QB.

This is some Matt Leinart ****. Love the fame more than the game.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:00 PM    (permalink
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Being an NFL QB is about the grind and I don't think Manziel will enjoy the process enough to be successful. He doesn't have talent of Marino, Favre, or Big Ben.

Partying and then getting up and rocking it in college is not in the same world as doing it in the NFL. Maybe a running back or DE but not a QB.

This is some Matt Leinart ****. Love the fame more than the game.
He's way better than Matt Leinart ever, ever was.

You can assume that fine. It's baseless though. I assume he loves the game based on how he plays it on the field.

"Partying and then getting up" implies that you believe he parties during the week, during the season, or even the night before a game. There are no traces that he's ever done that and I don't really believe he'd do that in the NFL. If he would, you'd be right. That would be very dumb.

But why do you believe that he'd do something like that? Because he blew coke in a club bathroom in July? lol
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:03 PM    (permalink
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Get off your high horse. Plenty of NFL QBs have done drugs, to think otherwise would be completely naive. Vick was a part of a ******* dogfighting ring while winning playoff games in Lambeu. Dan Marino. Joe Nammath. No one cares if you partake in recreational coke use during the offseason, lol. It's a non story. If Kaep has done coke before, would you really be surprised? Do you think that somehow affects his game? I care about what he does on the field. Not what soft drugs he uses while he parties lol.

I mean if you really question him based on this media portrayal of a kid partying, that's fine. They are feeding you it and everyone, including him, is eating it up. Nammath did the same ****. It just simply doesn't matter that much unless he gets arressted or something. And the truth is that blowing coke at a club is not a very risky activity in terms of getting arrested.

We have this image of NFL QBs that they have to be some sort of perfect robot. Let him be him. Being an egomaniac is part of what makes him great. He doesn't give a ****, just like on 3rd and long he doesn't give a **** so he runs around and makes incredible plays. This is what they signed up for. And it'll be fascinating on the field - and that's what matters.

Athletes have done drugs forever. It won't doom him. We had these same arguments heading into his Sophomore year. He's a party animal and ESPN loves to catch him in the act. He clearly doesn't care. ESPN then prods the Browns by asking them a million irrelevant and noise questions about him, creating the problem, to which the Browns respond. When in reality it doesn't matter. The fans give way too much credit to all the noise. The game is about preparation and execution. Not off-field storylines.
I think you summed it up perfectly sir, but the problem is that ESPN, fans, etc are looking for Manziel to be a boring old man ala Peyton Manning during the offseason. The party boy image that Manziel has as propogated by the media is something that Manziel obviously loves and plays into but fans and the media can't stand that he gives zero shits about his public image.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:06 PM    (permalink
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Because his owner asked him to tone it down and he said I will change for no one.

I didn't think he was a great prospect before the character concerns.

I don't think he has the physical or mental make up to be a long term successful QB.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:08 PM    (permalink
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Get off your high horse. Plenty of NFL QBs have done drugs, to think otherwise would be completely naive. Vick was a part of a ******* dogfighting ring while winning playoff games in Lambeu. Dan Marino. Joe Nammath. No one cares if you partake in recreational coke use during the offseason, lol. It's a non story. If Kaep has done coke before, would you really be surprised? Do you think that somehow affects his game? I care about what he does on the field. Not what soft drugs he uses while he parties lol.

I mean if you really question him based on this media portrayal of a kid partying, that's fine. They are feeding you it and everyone, including him, is eating it up. Nammath did the same ****. It just simply doesn't matter that much unless he gets arressted or something. And the truth is that blowing coke at a club is not a very risky activity in terms of getting arrested.

We have this image of NFL QBs that they have to be some sort of perfect robot. Let him be him. Being an egomaniac is part of what makes him great. He doesn't give a ****, just like on 3rd and long he doesn't give a **** so he runs around and makes incredible plays. This is what they signed up for. And it'll be fascinating on the field - and that's what matters.

Athletes have done drugs forever. It won't doom him. We had these same arguments heading into his Sophomore year. He's a party animal and ESPN loves to catch him in the act. He clearly doesn't care. ESPN then prods the Browns by asking them a million irrelevant and noise questions about him, creating the problem, to which the Browns respond. When in reality it doesn't matter. The fans give way too much credit to all the noise. The game is about preparation and execution. Not off-field storylines.
Vick is a horrible comparison. He is trash. He has won all of two playoff games in his career. He got by purely on his athletic abilities. He is and always has been a below average passer. Manziel won't be able to do the same in a league where defenders are bigger, faster, and more accustomed to running QBS.

You mention his sophomore year. Well, he did get suspended for half a game. And then he flaunted getting away with flagrant rule breaking by doing his little money hand gesture. His actions put his team in jeopardy and rather than own up to a mistake, he flaunted it. He didn't learn a thing from the autograph scandal.

Now all of the older guys around him (and the ones signing his paycheck) are asking him to cool it. And what does he do? He says screw you, I'm going to do me. I'm going to continue to party, I'm going to continue to flaunt it in pictures and videos. Again, he learned nothing.

That is my problem with him (and a guy like Josh Gordon too). He doesn't learn from his mistakes. You even see it when he plays. He makes a ton of highlight reel plays but he also continually heaves the ball in the air hoping Mike Evans catches it (good luck trying that in the NFL with Travis Benjamin and Nate Burleson) or throws across the field into coverage.

You say the NFL is all about preparation and execution. You are 100% correct. But it's a lot easier to prepare when you aren't hoped up on coke or spending all your time drunkenly partying. And it is a lot easier to execute in game when you actually learn from you mistakes rather than just repeating what you do because it worked out once or twice.
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Brilliant letting one of Scott Pioli's henchmen have his own team to ruin.  One of the premier GM jobs in the NFL and it gets handed to a stupid **** who makes three facepalm moves for every good one.  Awesome.  Just like handing a new Mercedes to a 16 year old girl who's already been in three wrecks. 
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:13 PM    (permalink
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Because his owner asked him to tone it down and he said I will change for no one.

I didn't think he was a great prospect before the character concerns.

I don't think he has the physical or mental make up to be a long term successful QB.
I respect your opinion about his physical makeup. We'll see if you're right. We can all agree he's very unique. I think he has some extremely important and special traits.

I don't respect your opinion of his mental makeup. Even if you are a psychologist, you don't actually know the kid. You can judge the actions you've seen from him, which is less than 1% of his life, and undoubtedly spun a certain way by the media. And he's clearly somewhat intelligent with the best QB wonderlic this year. And he's still a child. I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol. You simply don't have a developed brain at Manziel's age. If you aren't partying and making questionable decisions at some points, you are the extreme, extreme outlier. The difference here is that there is a demand to see all of his. Here's what we've seen from this 21-year-old.

Rash behavoir
Whining on twitter about something
Partying
Going to Vegas
Blowing coke
Missing an event because he's hungover

Yep, that's pretty much the standard questoinable decision quota for any teen/early20s male.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:18 PM    (permalink
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I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol. You simply don't have a developed brain at Manziel's age. If you aren't partying and making questionable decisions at some points, you are the extreme, extreme outlier. The difference here is that there is a demand to see all of his. Here's what we've seen from this 21-year-old.

Rash behavoir
Whining on twitter about something
Partying
Going to Vegas
Blowing coke
Missing an event because he's hungover

Yep, that's pretty much the standard questoinable decision quota for any teen/early20s male.
High standards...

I must have been boring. I never did coke in college. I made sure I actually stayed sober the days before I had class or had to work. I never told my bosses to piss off when they told me to correct my behavior that was having a negative effect on the company.
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Brilliant letting one of Scott Pioli's henchmen have his own team to ruin.  One of the premier GM jobs in the NFL and it gets handed to a stupid **** who makes three facepalm moves for every good one.  Awesome.  Just like handing a new Mercedes to a 16 year old girl who's already been in three wrecks. 
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:19 PM    (permalink
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Vick is a horrible comparison. He is trash. He has won all of two playoff games in his career. He got by purely on his athletic abilities. He is and always has been a below average passer. Manziel won't be able to do the same in a league where defenders are bigger, faster, and more accustomed to running QBS.

You mention his sophomore year. Well, he did get suspended for half a game. And then he flaunted getting away with flagrant rule breaking by doing his little money hand gesture. His actions put his team in jeopardy and rather than own up to a mistake, he flaunted it. He didn't learn a thing from the autograph scandal.

Now all of the older guys around him (and the ones signing his paycheck) are asking him to cool it. And what does he do? He says screw you, I'm going to do me. I'm going to continue to party, I'm going to continue to flaunt it in pictures and videos. Again, he learned nothing.

That is my problem with him (and a guy like Josh Gordon too). He doesn't learn from his mistakes. You even see it when he plays. He makes a ton of highlight reel plays but he also continually heaves the ball in the air hoping Mike Evans catches it (good luck trying that in the NFL with Travis Benjamin and Nate Burleson) or throws across the field into coverage.

You say the NFL is all about preparation and execution. You are 100% correct. But it's a lot easier to prepare when you aren't hoped up on coke or spending all your time drunkenly partying. And it is a lot easier to execute in game when you actually learn from you mistakes rather than just repeating what you do because it worked out once or twice.
I'd love to continue evaluating his on-field decision-making, and I like how you see the parallel between his attitude on the field and his perceived attitude off of it based on his quotes and actions.

But come on, that's some mean hyperbole. It's July. Like I said, wake me up when the report of him JR Smithing before a game on a Saturday night happens. Then I'll agree and say - this kid really doesn't care. This doesn't prove that and so many are jumping to that conclusion. And we know everytime the kid does ANYTHING. If you really believe he's spending ALL HIS TIME partying, then I guess I could see why you think he's destined to fail. I think it's much more likely that we see most of his partying because everyone loves to talk about it. And we don't see the daily workout regimen or playbook studying because no one cares about that.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:22 PM    (permalink
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High standards...

I must have been boring. I never did coke in college. I made sure I actually stayed sober the days before I had class or had to work. I never told my bosses to piss off when they told me to correct my behavior that was having a negative effect on the company.
That's fine for you. But if there was a kid who did the things I listed, would you say that he's destined to fail in life or on the wrong path? Probably not. You'd say he was a kid who unsurprisingly made some questionable decisions. It's going to happen and if he ruins his career with a REALLY bad decision, that will be unfortunate. But that hasn't happened yet.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:27 PM    (permalink
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Him being young is a cop out. He should be handling his **** better. He has a lot of opportunities and responsibilities and he isn't handling them as well as he should. He is acting like a boy and the NFL is a mans game.

Him partying in college wasn't a big deal but he should have shut it down after the draft. He hasn't done anything in the NFL yet so act like it. He is an NFL Quarterback and needs to start acting like it.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:37 PM    (permalink
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That's fine for you. But if there was a kid who did the things I listed, would you say that he's destined to fail in life or on the wrong path? Probably not. You'd say he was a kid who unsurprisingly made some questionable decisions. It's going to happen and if he ruins his career with a REALLY bad decision, that will be unfortunate. But that hasn't happened yet.
It depends on the person. If he comes from a trash family, makes the same mistakes as his trash relatives, flaunts his mistakes instead of owning up to them, and tells people trying to help him to shut up, then yes, I would say he is destined to fail and is on the wrong path.
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Brilliant letting one of Scott Pioli's henchmen have his own team to ruin.  One of the premier GM jobs in the NFL and it gets handed to a stupid **** who makes three facepalm moves for every good one.  Awesome.  Just like handing a new Mercedes to a 16 year old girl who's already been in three wrecks. 
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:38 PM    (permalink
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Him being young is a cop out. He should be handling his **** better. He has a lot of opportunities and responsibilities and he isn't handling them as well as he should. He is acting like a boy and the NFL is a mans game.

Him partying in college wasn't a big deal but he should have shut it down after the draft. He hasn't done anything in the NFL yet so act like it. He is an NFL Quarterback and needs to start acting like it.
You are basically on the internet telling this kid what he should do in his free time.

Not critiquing his game. Not even attacking his work ethic based on rumors or game preparation in college or anything.

No. You have an opinion about what he should do in his free time.

Come on. I'd almost guarantee that even the Browns brass didn't tell him to "shut it down." He's a young kid. He should be out partying in the offseason. No NFL team is going to encourage a player to not go out lol.

He is a boy. Most NFL players are. Very coddled, stubborn, arrogant boys. That's why so many of them make bad decisions. The key is not letting those decisions jeopardize your career. None of Manziel's have done that to this point. When he does something bad in season or gets suspended, I'll criticize him for it. So far all he's done is been himself, someone we knew, the Browns knew, and everybody knew. If you predicted he was going to bust beforehand, this is not the time to claim victory.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:39 PM    (permalink
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In the past, when I did coke:

What I wanted to do: keep partying for an ungodly amount of hours

What I didn't want to do: study, read, work
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:56 PM    (permalink
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In the past, when I did coke:

What I wanted to do: keep partying for an ungodly amount of hours

What I didn't want to do: study, read, work
In a strange and maybe sick twist, Manziel might just do enough to help him keep his job if he wants to continue this lifestyle.
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Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:04 AM    (permalink
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Somewhere Ryan Mallett is hating life.lol


All I can say is, if Manziel managed to keep it under the table during the predraft process that he regularly does blow when he's getting plastered off his drink of choice, the coke is going to catch up with him sooner than later.

For those interested, look for early warning signs like Manziel oversleeping/missing meetings, or suspensions on gamedays, even when he isn't starting.

That's the typical progression of a cokehead with a job. They start having a really difficult time keeping up with basic professional responsibilities.
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Old 07-09-2014, 04:13 AM    (permalink
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I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.
You can't be serious. Talk about low expectations.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:51 PM    (permalink
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I wonder if Colt Lyerla was in the stall with Johnny.
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Old 07-09-2014, 05:11 PM    (permalink
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There's a big difference in being a "cokehead" and doing cocaine recreationally. If Manziel busts, it won't because he likes to party, it will be because he's an undersized QB for a ****** franchise.

Manziel has always been this way. Just while at A&M, no one had the benefit to snap a picture and send it to the tabloids.

How many of you guys have been to college? Drugs are everywhere, and even more so when you're a high profile person. I'd venture to say that 50% of high profile athletes dabble in recreational drugs.

If the internet was prevalent in the 80s and 90s, I think it would explode with everyone's GLOREEE BOYS were found out to be drug users.
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Old 07-09-2014, 10:25 PM    (permalink
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The problem with recreational coke users is eventually they start snorting alone at home, not just parties. Then they start snorting a little before work, maybe a little more once they get home.
An 8-ball a week can EASILY become an 8-ball a day habit.

Why do people do coke?? Because it's an awesome high and highly addictive. That's why it such a problem habit.

If you are dumb enough to let yourself be seen in a bathroom mirror at a club rolling up bills into straws, you're on the verge of having a coke problem you're going to have to kick if you want to have any kind of life.

My problem with the pic is, who knew Manziel was doing coke?? It never came out in the draft process, and I bet Mallett's 'habit' was no worse than Manziel's.

Manziel needs to know going through life thinking you're smarter than everyone else and can BS your way out of anything is the perfect setup to fall hard face first on the concrete of real life.
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Old 07-09-2014, 10:53 PM    (permalink
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I disagree with Manziel's coke issues being equal to.Mallett's. From everything I heard while living where Mallett is from, he was a huge coke head. Everybody knew it. If Manziel was a habitual user, we would have at least heard rumors.
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Brilliant letting one of Scott Pioli's henchmen have his own team to ruin.  One of the premier GM jobs in the NFL and it gets handed to a stupid **** who makes three facepalm moves for every good one.  Awesome.  Just like handing a new Mercedes to a 16 year old girl who's already been in three wrecks. 
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Old 07-09-2014, 11:18 PM    (permalink
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I disagree with Manziel's coke issues being equal to.Mallett's. From everything I heard while living where Mallett is from, he was a huge coke head. Everybody knew it. If Manziel was a habitual user, we would have at least heard rumors.

But Manziel is the one with disposable cash at College Station. Which one really had the money to support a coke habit as a collegian??

Again, from my experience the guys really going in hard on blow in college were the kids either dealing or those who had too much money in their school bank accounts courtesy of rich mommy and daddy.

The pic alone to me says Johnny as a problem. At what level, I don't know. A low key, casual user isn't snorting blow in a bathroom in public with a bunch of randoms.

Neither tested dirty at the combine, so I think it's fair to speculate or even assume that Manziel has/had equal if not greater issues with blow than Mallett.
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Old 07-10-2014, 12:03 AM    (permalink
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That's fine for you. But if there was a kid who did the things I listed, would you say that he's destined to fail in life or on the wrong path? Probably not. You'd say he was a kid who unsurprisingly made some questionable decisions. It's going to happen and if he ruins his career with a REALLY bad decision, that will be unfortunate. But that hasn't happened yet.
I think the big difference is that in your example of another kid... He has the remainder of his life to build success in the job market.

An NFL QB only has a few short years to make that impact.
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Old 07-10-2014, 03:16 PM    (permalink
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Maybe I'm just being naive, but I really think that he's just snorting Adderall. I imagine it isn't very difficult for a college football player to receive a prescription from their universities student health center and once they have the prescription, they can submit it to the NFL and no longer have to worry about an errant positive test.
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Old 07-10-2014, 04:18 PM    (permalink
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Maybe I'm just being naive, but I really think that he's just snorting Adderall. I imagine it isn't very difficult for a college football player to receive a prescription from their universities student health center and once they have the prescription, they can submit it to the NFL and no longer have to worry about an errant positive test.
Snorting adderall and snorting coke is the same idea without the numbness in your face lol

Taking adderall is one thing, snorting adderall is abuse

I used to, but now i value my adderall very very much for when i need to get work done. Its a miracle drug lol
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Old 07-10-2014, 04:59 PM    (permalink
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as long as his teeth don't start turning brown, i'm okay with not caring. actually, even that seemed to work for michael irvin. just as long as he doesn't start throwing interceptions.
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