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Old 07-06-2006, 03:36 PM    (permalink
cunningham06
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Originally Posted by D-Unit
I'm not going to buy it.... I don't buy or read books...

BUT... I think that TO is right about a lot of things. Including how the Eagles are a piss poor management, how Donovan is NOT a good leader and how he rightly deserved a bigger contract.

...anybody wanna debate me on those issues?
In what way is Eagles management piss poor? They haven't had problems like TO in the past. Donovan is a fine leader, TO was out of place trying to challenge him. It's TO's fault he signed the contract. He should have asked to get more money in the early years of the contract rather than the later years. TO is an idiot, he should stick to playing football and not writing books.
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Old 07-06-2006, 03:44 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by D-Unit
I'm not going to buy it.... I don't buy or read books...

BUT... I think that TO is right about a lot of things. Including how the Eagles are a piss poor management, how Donovan is NOT a good leader and how he rightly deserved a bigger contract.

...anybody wanna debate me on those issues?
In what way is Eagles management piss poor? They haven't had problems like TO in the past. Donovan is a fine leader, TO was out of place trying to challenge him. It's TO's fault he signed the contract. He should have asked to get more money in the early years of the contract rather than the later years. TO is an idiot, he should stick to playing football and not writing books.
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Old 07-06-2006, 03:44 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Nerv
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Originally Posted by D-Unit
I'm not going to buy it.... I don't buy or read books...

BUT... I think that TO is right about a lot of things. Including how the Eagles are a piss poor management, how Donovan is NOT a good leader and how he rightly deserved a bigger contract.

...anybody wanna debate me on those issues?
I don't think he deserved a bigger contract. He had just signed his current contract 1 year previous, did he not expect himself to have a good season? He should have been more angry at Drew Rosenhaus than the Eagles for getting a backloaded contract with all the big money on the last years of it.
Terrell Owens was underpaid if you compare his contract to other top WRs. Fact.

I'm not gonna argue on who he should blame, but the fact of the matter is that he was underpaid.

Here's a guy who broke his leg during the season and EVERYONE said there was no way in hell that he would be able to come back in time for the Superbowl. Doctors simply told him it wasn't possible. Here's a guy that rehabs like a mad man to get back to playing shape and even when doctors and everyone (who cares about him) tells him not to play... to not risk the chance of reinjuring himself... to not put his career at stake, yet still goes out there and ends up being the best player on the field for the Eagles. He risked it all to be out there to try to help his team win the SB.

When any employee goes above and beyond in their work, puts their career on the line, puts their health on the line, puts everything at stake and does an amazing job, is it not right for management to reward that employee? Is it not deserving of a promotion? Is it uncalled for for that worker to expect more from management? Is there no reciprocation, no appreciation, no acknowledgement or bonus or nothing?

You better bet your ass that if TO had sustained a career threatening injury that the Eagles would've cut him faster than you can say good-bye.

TO deserved more from the Eagles front office. TO simply wanted to renegotiate a new contract. The Eagles did it twice before for Donovan. Why not for TO?
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Old 07-06-2006, 03:45 PM    (permalink
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Old 07-06-2006, 03:56 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by D-Unit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nerv
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit
I'm not going to buy it.... I don't buy or read books...

BUT... I think that TO is right about a lot of things. Including how the Eagles are a piss poor management, how Donovan is NOT a good leader and how he rightly deserved a bigger contract.

...anybody wanna debate me on those issues?
I don't think he deserved a bigger contract. He had just signed his current contract 1 year previous, did he not expect himself to have a good season? He should have been more angry at Drew Rosenhaus than the Eagles for getting a backloaded contract with all the big money on the last years of it.
Terrell Owens was underpaid if you compare his contract to other top WRs. Fact.

I'm not gonna argue on who he should blame, but the fact of the matter is that he was underpaid.

Here's a guy who broke his leg during the season and EVERYONE said there was no way in hell that he would be able to come back in time for the Superbowl. Doctors simply told him it wasn't possible. Here's a guy that rehabs like a mad man to get back to playing shape and even when doctors and everyone (who cares about him) tells him not to play... to not risk the chance of reinjuring himself... to not put his career at stake, yet still goes out there and ends up being the best player on the field for the Eagles. He risked it all to be out there to try to help his team win the SB.

When any employee goes above and beyond in their work, puts their career on the line, puts their health on the line, puts everything at stake and does an amazing job, is it not right for management to reward that employee? Is it not deserving of a promotion? Is it uncalled for for that worker to expect more from management? Is there no reciprocation, no appreciation, no acknowledgement or bonus or nothing?

You better bet your ass that if TO had sustained a career threatening injury that the Eagles would've cut him faster than you can say good-bye.

TO deserved more from the Eagles front office. TO simply wanted to renegotiate a new contract. The Eagles did it twice before for Donovan. Why not for TO?
Again if Owens didn't like the contract he could have chose not to sign it. He decided to go to Philadelphia, and he decided to sign that contract.

As for playing hurt, back in the old days it was extremely common. I believe it was Merlin Olsen who played with a broken leg. If TO was able to play he should, he's the only one who can make that call. I assure you that is not going above and beyond his duties. Any respectable receiver would have done the same. If Jerry Rice fractured his back he would probably still try to get onto the field. Also playing hurt, qb's do it all the time? Why shouldn't receivers. McNabb had a sports hernia all season but didn't sit out. And you still call him a bad leader? TO was causing problems ever since the superbowl. The reason he didn't get a new contract was because he was making the whole thing into a media circus. He has no discipline and showed no respect for his quarterback and coach. He was a locker room cancer, and Philly is much better off without him. Football is a team sport, one person is not more important than the team, and football players understand that. If you can't play, don't expect to get paid. What if TO had a career ending injury? Boo Hoo he can go live in one of his mansions and take it easy for the rest of his life. TO was just plain greedy, and lashed out at everyone even though it is only his fault for signing that contract.
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Old 07-06-2006, 03:58 PM    (permalink
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dude, to was not greedy. management was just cheap. He wanted what he was worth. That's fine IMO.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:07 PM    (permalink
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TO should have:

a) signed a shorter contract.
b) kept his crap in house.

the problem was not so much that he wanted more money, it's how he went about trying to get it. everytime you thought he was being reasonable and saying more or less what d-unit said, all of sudden he'd be out on his driveway doing crunches.

i think what lost him the deal more than anything was the media circus he intentionally created. that's also why no one thinks he should get the money. because he turned everything into the TO show, instead of going to the front office sans rosenhaus and saying, "look guys, here's what i did for you. now can we work something out to reward me?"

regardless of the eagles' stance on renegotiation, they would've been far mroe receptive to that that him parading around calling their franchise player a quitter, etc.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:08 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by CGF 216/137
dude, to was not greedy. management was just cheap. He wanted what he was worth. That's fine IMO.
If it wasn't enough in the first place why did he agree to it? He was practically begging to go to the Eagles, and he is a great player, but his locker room influence was so bad he didn't deserve anything more.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:09 PM    (permalink
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Again if Owens didn't like the contract he could have chose not to sign it. He decided to go to Philadelphia, and he decided to sign that contract.

As for playing hurt, back in the old days it was extremely common. I believe it was Merlin Olsen who played with a broken leg. If TO was able to play he should, he's the only one who can make that call. I assure you that is not going above and beyond his duties. Any respectable receiver would have done the same. If Jerry Rice fractured his back he would probably still try to get onto the field. Also playing hurt, qb's do it all the time? Why shouldn't receivers. McNabb had a sports hernia all season but didn't sit out. And you still call him a bad leader? TO was causing problems ever since the superbowl. The reason he didn't get a new contract was because he was making the whole thing into a media circus. He has no discipline and showed no respect for his quarterback and coach. He was a locker room cancer, and Philly is much better off without him. Football is a team sport, one person is not more important than the team, and football players understand that. If you can't play, don't expect to get paid. What if TO had a career ending injury? Boo Hoo he can go live in one of his mansions and take it easy for the rest of his life. TO was just plain greedy, and lashed out at everyone even though it is only his fault for signing that contract.
You sound like a salty fan that got burnt... and well... I don't blame you, you did. You guys got absolutely nothing for TO. You could've traded him during the season, but didn't (ie. piss poor management move).

Your "back in the old days" rebuttle is simply out of context. In today's game rarely do you see players put their health/career on the line so soon after injury. What he did was a modern day miracle. He wasn't supposed to be able to return so soon.

...LOL... IF Jerry Rice fractured his back he would probably still try to get onto the field??? So now you wanna talk hypotheticals?

QBs play injured all the time.... Since when does a QB return 6 weeks after breaking their leg?

McNabb played all season with a sports hernia??? Everyone knows that was a lame ass excuse for the Eagles to blame their God awful season. The Eagles were the biggest disappointment in the league last year. From NFC Champs to NFC East Chumps.

...oh and btw, McNabb didn't play ALL season with his hernia... He shutdown at the end of the season and quit like the terrible leader that he is. ...and you say QBs play hurt all the time??? Laughable. Especially when your own quarterback, your own hero doesn't step up. He could've played out the rest of the season if he wanted to. ...but he didn't want to step up like TO did and put his health/career on the line. Donovan gave up like a panty that he is. The Eagles will NEVER win a SB with McNabb.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:09 PM    (permalink
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:11 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by njx9
TO should have:

a) signed a shorter contract.
b) kept his crap in house.

the problem was not so much that he wanted more money, it's how he went about trying to get it. everytime you thought he was being reasonable and saying more or less what d-unit said, all of sudden he'd be out on his driveway doing crunches.

i think what lost him the deal more than anything was the media circus he intentionally created. that's also why no one thinks he should get the money. because he turned everything into the TO show, instead of going to the front office sans rosenhaus and saying, "look guys, here's what i did for you. now can we work something out to reward me?"

regardless of the eagles' stance on renegotiation, they would've been far mroe receptive to that that him parading around calling their franchise player a quitter, etc.
I agree nearly 100%. Well put njx.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:12 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by njx9
TO should have:

a) signed a shorter contract.
b) kept his crap in house.

the problem was not so much that he wanted more money, it's how he went about trying to get it. everytime you thought he was being reasonable and saying more or less what d-unit said, all of sudden he'd be out on his driveway doing crunches.

i think what lost him the deal more than anything was the media circus he intentionally created. that's also why no one thinks he should get the money. because he turned everything into the TO show, instead of going to the front office sans rosenhaus and saying, "look guys, here's what i did for you. now can we work something out to reward me?"

regardless of the eagles' stance on renegotiation, they would've been far mroe receptive to that that him parading around calling their franchise player a quitter, etc.
As far as TO and the way he handled his business, I don't agree with his tactics. He was wrong the way he spoke of McNabb and tried to get his way.

...as far as him being right about what he was fighting for... He was.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:13 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cunningham06
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Originally Posted by CGF 216/137
dude, to was not greedy. management was just cheap. He wanted what he was worth. That's fine IMO.
If it wasn't enough in the first place why did he agree to it? He was practically begging to go to the Eagles, and he is a great player, but his locker room influence was so bad he didn't deserve anything more.
He initally wanted a chance to prove himself with a top team and once he did his value sky rocketted, add onto that his toughness and leadership in coming back and he was worth much more than his original deal permitted.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:19 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit
Quote:
Originally Posted by njx9
TO should have:

a) signed a shorter contract.
b) kept his crap in house.

the problem was not so much that he wanted more money, it's how he went about trying to get it. everytime you thought he was being reasonable and saying more or less what d-unit said, all of sudden he'd be out on his driveway doing crunches.

i think what lost him the deal more than anything was the media circus he intentionally created. that's also why no one thinks he should get the money. because he turned everything into the TO show, instead of going to the front office sans rosenhaus and saying, "look guys, here's what i did for you. now can we work something out to reward me?"

regardless of the eagles' stance on renegotiation, they would've been far mroe receptive to that that him parading around calling their franchise player a quitter, etc.
As far as TO and the way he handled his business, I don't agree with his tactics. He was wrong the way he spoke of McNabb and tried to get his way.

...as far as him being right about what he was fighting for... He was
.
meh, i think this comes down to general NFL philosophy.

if a team can get rid of a player any time with zero penalty (assuming they were "smart" about his guaranteed money), then absolutely he was right.

i don't happen to agree with that philosophy at all, but since that's how the world works, then sure, he probably deserved a raise.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:22 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by D-Unit
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Originally Posted by cunningham06
Again if Owens didn't like the contract he could have chose not to sign it. He decided to go to Philadelphia, and he decided to sign that contract.

As for playing hurt, back in the old days it was extremely common. I believe it was Merlin Olsen who played with a broken leg. If TO was able to play he should, he's the only one who can make that call. I assure you that is not going above and beyond his duties. Any respectable receiver would have done the same. If Jerry Rice fractured his back he would probably still try to get onto the field. Also playing hurt, qb's do it all the time? Why shouldn't receivers. McNabb had a sports hernia all season but didn't sit out. And you still call him a bad leader? TO was causing problems ever since the superbowl. The reason he didn't get a new contract was because he was making the whole thing into a media circus. He has no discipline and showed no respect for his quarterback and coach. He was a locker room cancer, and Philly is much better off without him. Football is a team sport, one person is not more important than the team, and football players understand that. If you can't play, don't expect to get paid. What if TO had a career ending injury? Boo Hoo he can go live in one of his mansions and take it easy for the rest of his life. TO was just plain greedy, and lashed out at everyone even though it is only his fault for signing that contract.
You sound like a salty fan that got burnt... and well... I don't blame you, you did. You guys got absolutely nothing for TO. You could've traded him during the season, but didn't (ie. piss poor management move).

Your "back in the old days" rebuttle is simply out of context. In today's game rarely do you see players put their health/career on the line so soon after injury. What he did was a modern day miracle. He wasn't supposed to be able to return so soon.

...LOL... IF Jerry Rice fractured his back he would probably still try to get onto the field??? So now you wanna talk hypotheticals?

QBs play injured all the time.... Since when does a QB return 6 weeks after breaking their leg?

McNabb played all season with a sports hernia??? Everyone knows that was a lame ass excuse for the Eagles to blame their God awful season. The Eagles were the biggest disappointment in the league last year. From NFC Champs to NFC East Chumps.

...oh and btw, McNabb didn't play ALL season with his hernia... He shutdown at the end of the season and quit like the terrible leader that he is. ...and you say QBs play hurt all the time??? Laughable. Especially when your own quarterback, your own hero doesn't step up. He could've played out the rest of the season if he wanted to. ...but he didn't want to step up like TO did and put his health/career on the line. Donovan gave up like a panty that he is. The Eagles will NEVER win a SB with McNabb.
Ok if you don't believe that McNabb plays hurt like he has several times during his career what about Byron Leftwich? He's played hurt all the time. Check your facts the doctors didn't say it was impossible for him to play, they just advised against it. Also he didn't break his leg, it was a high ankle sprain. Don't make it sound more heroic than it is. The hatred of the eagles and the defense of TO can mean only one thing. You are undoubtedly a cowboys fan.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:25 PM    (permalink
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Theres probably gonna be nothing we already don't know in the book so there really isn't a point.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:30 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by cunningham06
Ok if you don't believe that McNabb plays hurt like he has several times during his career what about Byron Leftwich? He's played hurt all the time. Check your facts the doctors didn't say it was impossible for him to play, they just advised against it. Also he didn't break his leg, it was a high ankle sprain. Don't make it sound more heroic than it is. The hatred of the eagles and the defense of TO can mean only one thing. You are undoubtedly a cowboys fan.
Don't bring Leftwich's name into this. He has nothing to do with the conversation.

It doesn't matter if his ankle was sprained or broken. Fact of the matter is doctors told him not to play and did not give him clearance to play.

Quote:
Dr. Mark Myerson said that he would not give the All-Pro receiver clearance to play on Feb. 6. According to espn.com
Quote:
"Terrell Owens needs to listen to his doctor and not play in the Super Bowl. There are too many risks if he plays and he will be jeopardizing his long term career for just one game," said freshman radio television major Krystle Champaign.
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Yes, I am a Cowboys fan and that only means one thing... I'm right.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:51 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit
Don't bring Leftwich's name into this. He has nothing to do with the conversation.

It doesn't matter if his ankle was sprained or broken. Fact of the matter is doctors told him not to play and did not give him clearance to play.

Quote:
Dr. Mark Myerson said that he would not give the All-Pro receiver clearance to play on Feb. 6. According to espn.com
Quote:
"Terrell Owens needs to listen to his doctor and not play in the Super Bowl. There are too many risks if he plays and he will be jeopardizing his long term career for just one game," said freshman radio television major Krystle Champaign.
Source

Yes, I am a Cowboys fan and that only means one thing... I'm right.
8)
I disagree Leftwich does have something to do with this, he plays hurt all the time, but in your mind he doesn't count because he isn't TO.

A high ankle sprain and a broken leg are two completely different things, if his bone in his leg were broken he wouldn't be able to run, and the though of a bone mending itself that quickly and then being able to run on it is laughable. Fact of the matter is doctors don't give players clearance just to cover their own @$$ because if they get hurt because the injury somehow wasn't fully healed they are responsible.

Since you are throwing out conspiracy theories about how McNabb wasn't really injured heres one of mine. TO asked his doctor to not give him clearance and tell the media that because TO has a flair for the dramatic, and it would convince fools that he was heroic and brave.

As for being a cowboys fan, no that doesn't mean you are right, just that you are a hypocrit. TO has mocked the cowboys for several years and has been widely acknowledged as a nuisance in the locker room and not a team player. But suddenly he comes to Dallas and all the fans put that other stuff in the past. OH TO HAS CHANGED!! HE'S A NEW MAN! He hasn't changed, he's the same old TO and when Bledsoe can't get him the ball enough from behind that pathetic offensive line TO will lose it. Dallas is a powder keg with enough problems (Greg Ellis), and TO is the match.
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Old 07-06-2006, 04:51 PM    (permalink
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No, it'll be all about how he got mistreated and all that.
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Old 07-06-2006, 05:21 PM    (permalink
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Good point on the radio today. Jose Canseco's came out this time last year and everyone bashed him and it, and he turned out right. TO may not act in the right manner, but he is right about some things...
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Old 07-06-2006, 05:31 PM    (permalink
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personally i agree with cunningham06 in this matter
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