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Old 05-15-2007, 10:15 PM    (permalink
robert_in_bigd
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JJT May Article on the DMN 4/24, TITLED = "Ireland, Phillips must rein in Jerry at draft"

>>>>> "Jeff Ireland and Wade Phillips have one task this weekend: Keep owner Jerry Jones in line. That's the best thing Bill Parcells did. He (Parcells) wasn't afraid to tell the owner he was about to screw up. He wasn't afraid to disagree. He wasn't just happy being a part of the Dallas Cowboys. Now that doesn't mean Parcells always got the player he wanted because he didn't. Neither did the owner. " >>>>>>

http://www.cowboysplus.com/sharedcon...r.97966aa.html


Now from JJT's last article TITLE = "Record Says Failed in Dallas" on May 15 ....

>>>>>"Don't be fooled when it comes to Bill Parcells: He controlled every facet of the Cowboys' organization. Yes, that includes giving his blessing when Jerry Jones broached the subject of adding Terrell Owens to the roster. Sooner or later, you knew this was going to happen. " >>>>>>

http://www.cowboysplus.com/sharedcon...r.2c12299.html

So JJT which is, Is it true "that doesn't mean Parcells always got the player he wanted because he didn't" or that "Don't be fooled when it comes to Bill Parcells: He controlled every facet of the Cowboys' organization."

JJT is mentally ********. Did he actually graduate with a degree from High School?
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Old 05-15-2007, 10:17 PM    (permalink
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Jesus Christ.. is there a single Dallas-area journalist you guys actually respect?

I mean.. calling a guy a *** because of his name is a bit much.
JJT is a jerk-off. A quota hire gone bad.
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Old 05-16-2007, 11:56 AM    (permalink
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I was just looking at some tape of San Diego highlights because Im bored out of my mind, and heres some things I noticed to add onto what we already know:


-lots of weakside/strongside blitzes. Ie they like the overload one side of the oline. Sometimes both pass rushers will be on the same side, sometimes they will be on opposite sides. He likes moving around his lb core to create confusion for pass protection

-I think Ive said this before, but lots of flat 4 out of the secondary. The CBs funnell the WRs to the safeties if they run crossing/quckslant routes. Man coverage on the TE with the SILB. The pass coverage could get porous at times. He likes to use alot of feast or famine type of blitz/coverage technqiues, although thats not always the case. I saw some Cover 2, saw some 4 man rushes. He'll throw the playbook at you.

-When you see the line one gapping, it almost always means (from the stuff I saw) blitzing is going down. He likes causing disruption by breaking the "links" of the offensive line. If you see one gapping going down, expect a blitz out of the 3-4 shell. But I shouldnt say always. More often than not you should expect it, but he'll trick you sometimes and come with 4 at the qb with the one gap front.

-He does a decent amount of 2 gapping. Not as much as Parcells, but its not totaly whiped out of the playbook. I noticed he likes doing it against the 2 TE set. Again, this is based on the stuff I saw, I can't say that he'll always do this.

-Here's the catch though. That front 7 SD had was amazing. More often than not, it wasn't the scheme that wowed me so much, but the push the players got. It was amazing. They have a very dominant front, and I think thats a huge reason why they got such great pressure.


Overall after pausing, evaluating presnap/post snap analysis of alot of the plays I got to see from studying a game of the Chargers vs KC in 2005 (this is the game Im basing my analysis off of), what impresses me alot about Phillips defense is how he uses confusion to really throw off the pass protection of the offense. He moves guys around alot, and does lots of stunts, over/under with the dline to confuse the snot of the offense.

He's great when it comes to getting pressure and disrupting at the point of attack. But if you can block his fronts, his defense is dead in the water. The pass coverage is porous at times. Its feast or famine. More often than not, its feast, but don't be surprised to see your team give up more big plays than last year. Theyll make more big plays, but they'll also give up more big plays.

If front 3 and Ware and Spencer don't improve their individual technique, it could get ugly. If they do, the defense could be beastly. Only time will tell how it works out.

Thule, I noticed you have a good understanding of the Philips 3-4. Is there anything you wanna add? Or is there anything you disagree with what I said? Im curious to learn more about this defense. I know basics, but I don't get to see enough tape of it to really understand it in great detail.

anybody? Thule? LSUAlum? Duckseason? DMW? D-Unit? Ward? Paul? Burns? Anyone?
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Old 05-16-2007, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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anybody? Thule? LSUAlum? Duckseason? DMW? D-Unit? Ward? Paul? Burns? Anyone?
I've found some intersting things

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Now that free agency and the draft have concluded, I’m going to reassess the Cowboys’ front seven, based on the rotations Wade Phillips announced yesterday in his first post-practice presser. (Say that five times real fast.) Here then is a reprint of Phillips’ scheme from February, with the newbies added:

Perhaps the most intriguing comment in Wade Phillips’ inaugural presser was his declaration that he would call the defensive plays for his “Phillips’ 3-4? next season. The players, as Emmitt>>Barry noted in his morning thread, are excited by the change.

What exactly is a Phillips’ 3-4 and how does it differ from Bill Parcells’ scheme?

I went to the tape and saw that Phillips in San Diego used almost identical personnel to Dallas, but ran a very different attack.

Parcells’ defense has been referred to as vanilla this week, and in some respects it was. He drafted big front seven people, linemen and linebackers and set them up in a straight-forward, one-on-one defense. Look at Dallas in most 3-4 first and second down situations last year and you saw:

a.) three linemen always, and I mean always, lined head up over the opponent’s center and tackles. That’s because Parcells was one of the few coordinators who ran a true “two-gap” defense. Most of the other 3-4 teams like Pittsburgh and San Diego don’t run this scheme.

This means that on run plays, the three linemen are given responsibility for the two gaps to either side of them. They are to control the lineman directly in front of them, read which way the play is going, shed the blocker and fill the appropriate lane. It’s a read-and-react scheme and it depends on big, strong, smart line play.

b.) It also puts a premium on big linebackers, since they are not protected in the ways that middle and weakside linebackers are in the speedier 4-3 schemes that Dallas used to run or that the many Tampa-2 teams use. The inside linebackers have to take guards head on and the outside linebackers need the bulk to control tight ends and take away the outside run.

San Diego takes a very different approach. I watched tape of their 2005 game against the Cowboys and saw a decidedly one-gap approach.

The first dramatic difference comes in the placement of the linemen. Rather than lining head up like the Dallas three, the Chargers guys lined up in gaps or did a lot of shading, lining up on a lineman or tight end’s inside or outside shoulder. In fact, I rarely saw a Chargers lineman or linebacker taking an opponent head on.

Here’s one typical front that gave the Dallas running game trouble. With Dallas lined up in a strong left formation (meaning TE Jason Witten was lined up next to LT Flozell Adams) the Chargers deployed this way: RE Igor Olshansky lined up on Adams’ inside shoulder. NT Jamal Williams shaded C Andre Gurode’s left shoulder. LE Jacques Cesare lined up wide of RT Rob Petitti.

ROLB Steve Foley lined up wide of TE Witten. SILB Randall Godfrey lined four yards off the ball and over Adams’ left shoulder, in a stacked position behind Olshansky, who was lined up immediately over Adams’ right shouder.

WILB Donnie Edwards was also four yards deep and lined up over the C/RG gap. LOLB Ben Leber was, like Godfrey, lined up over the RT Petitti, but off the ball.

Draw this up on a piece of paper and then look at the lane assignments. There are seven gaps around and between the Cowboys’ line. Foley has the gap to Witten’s left; Godfrey the gap between Witten and Adams; Olshansky the LT/LG gap; Williams the LG/C gap; Edwards the C/RG gap; Leber the RG/RT gap and Cesare the gap outside RT.

And that’s if the linemen stay in their positions. The Chargers would sometimes give this look and then make a lot of last second shifts. Williams at NT would flop from being on the Center’s left shoulder to his right. The other linemen and linebackers would also change their alignments late.

One aspect of the linemen shading is that it allows the Chargers to stack their inside linebackers. This was especially beneficial to the 227 lb. Edwards, who is too small to handle the pounding he would take in Parcells’ system.

(Note: Phillips said yesterday that Bobby Carpenter and Kevin Burnett were working inside. If Phillips keeps his scheme, expect the 250+ lb. Carpenter to line up on the strong side of a team’s formation and the 235 lb. Burnett to play the protected role Edwards fulfilled in San Diego.)

Furthermore, the Chargers do not play a passive front. S.D.’s guys do a lot of slanting and looping, trying to shoot the gaps and get in the backfield.

And notice it does not require any major changes in personnel. While a more active, stunting system appears to favor smaller, quicker people, San Diego and Dallas are on the same page with personnel.

Here’s San Diego’s starting line for ‘06:

LE — Luis Castillo, 6?3?, 303 lbs.
NT — Jamal Williams, 6?3?, 348 lbs.
RE — Igor Olshansky, 6?6?, 309 lbs.

Compare them to Dallas’ line:

LE — Marcus Spears, 6?4?, 298 lbs.
NT — Jason Ferguson, 6?3?, 310 lbs.
RE — Chris Canty, 6?7?, 300 lbs.

And the linebackers. For San Diego:

LOLB — Shaun Phillips, 6?3?, 262 lbs.
SILB — Randall Godfrey, 6?2?, 245 lbs.
WILB –Donnie Edwards, 6?2?, 227 lbs.
ROLB — Shawne Merriman, 6?4?, 272 lbs.

For Dallas:

LOLB — Greg Ellis, 6?5?, 271 lbs., Anthony Spencer, 6?3?, 266 lbs.
SILB — Bradie James, 6?2?, 250 lbs., Bobby Carpenter, 6?2?, 257 lbs.
WILB — Akin Ayodele, 6?2?, 250 lbs., Kevin Burnett, 6?2?, 235 lbs.
ROLB — Demarcus Ware, 6?4?, 257 lbs.

The Chargers, with the noticable exception of Edwards, are even bigger than the Cowboys’ front seven. However, it is Phillips’ offset, one-gap schemes that made Edwards possible. (Edwards has returned to the Chiefs this offseason.)

One important question will be Roy Williams’ role in a new scheme. Only one of San Diego’s 61 sacks this past season came from the secondary. The remaining 60 were divided among front seven players. Williams’ best seasons came in ‘02 and especially in ‘03, when Mike Zimmer ran a blitz-happy 4-3 that kept him close to the line of scrimmage. Will Phillips find ways to get Roy involved in the action?

We’ll see. From my initial impressions, he’ll definitely give the linemen freer rein, which explains why Marcus Spears sounded so happy yesterday.
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Old 05-16-2007, 03:37 PM    (permalink
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anybody? Thule? LSUAlum? Duckseason? DMW? D-Unit? Ward? Paul? Burns? Anyone?
Oooops I missed your post or I would have posted sooner.

I guess if I had to breakdown the basics...it would be this.
  • They aren't the most blitz-happy team that I've seen; it wasn't like every play was a bring-the-house blitz. But they sent odd combinations of people from different areas, giving the offenses unfamiliar choices about who to block during a play. It wasn't the number of people they sent, but the different angles the pressure came from.
  • They wanted to be physical with receivers. They wanted to play some bump-and-run to knock the receivers off their stride.
  • Parcells always preached about wasted energy in between plays, he hated to do things that would cause his players to expend excess energy between snaps. The San Diego defense was constantly in motion, guys were moving everywhere pre-snap.
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Old 05-16-2007, 03:43 PM    (permalink
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I also had this tucked away on my computer. This comes from a guy who has a copy of phillips playbook.

The opening line states that the defense is an attacking defense. Music to your ears? I thought so.

It further states we will play zone, man-to-man and blitz in any situation. In all situations we will defend the inside or middle of the field first - defend inside to outside. We will not allow the ball to be run inside, we want to force the ball outside. We will not allow the ball to be thrown deep down the middle or inside. We want to force the ball to be thrown short and/or outside.

It also talks about eliminating mental mistakes, using different personnel packages in different situations, the importance of communication between the players, and being a physical defense. The final section of the philosophy chapter ends with this - Finally, our job is to take the ball away from the opponents offense and score or set up good field position for the offense. We must knock the ball loose, force mistakes, and cause turnovers. Turnovers win games!
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Old 05-16-2007, 03:50 PM    (permalink
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Another great breakdown for you BBD. Comes right from the SD/Patriots game.

New England

Prior to the snap of the ball, the Patriots are very similar to Dallas. They don't move around a lot except for flipping the ILB's to the strong and weak side of the formation. Dallas does the same thing with James and Ayodele. They tend to line up in position and are not interested in trying to disguise much. What they do that works better than Dallas is time their blitzes. They run a lot of the same ILB blitzes that the Cowboys do, but they are better at not giving them away to early. Against the Cowboys, teams line up, take a pre-snap read, and then do a hard count. Inevitably, the Dallas defense bites on the hard count and reveals where the blitz is coming from. The Patriots do a better job of holding back and timing the blitzes. In truth though, they weren't all that effective blitzing up the middle, only on a few occasions did they generate pressure that way.

The Patriots were better at getting some outside pressure, and they used their defensive backs to do this. They got a sack from one of their corners on a blitz and they involved their strong safety more in the box. New England isn't an all-out blitz team; they spend a lot of time rushing only four guys.

When they do get aggressive is when the other team is faced with a passing 3rd down. Then New England tends to stuff the box/line of scrimmage with 8-9 men and they bring pressure. Several times they brought the house and relied on their secondary to cover. Usually when they did this, if they were rushing seven or more guys, they ran a tight man-to-man coverage. Even on a third and 17, the Patriots brought eight guys and managed to get a sack. I don't know for sure if they did this over the entire season, but for this one game they decided that on 3rd down instead of sitting back in zone coverage, they would force the QB to make a quick decision. Of course, getting pressure on the QB is a requirement, something Dallas didn't do well even when they blitzed.

The Patiots LB's were very good about covering the backs in the passing game. Sometimes they used the ILB's to cover the backs, other times the OLB would read the pattern and peel off into coverage. When the OLB had read/react coverage on a back, they tended to modify their rush so that they weren't going full-speed at the QB from the start. Instead, they moved upfield under control and were in position to get into coverage when the backs flared out.

They also believe strongly in their 3-4 defense, they rarely got out of it even on short yardage or down around the goal line.

I came away with the impression that this is how Dallas wants to run their 3-4, but the personnel we have isn't experienced enough to get it done. They also have two defensive ends that are very effective in getting penetration, forcing the offense to account for them in the passing game. But here's one huge difference that I complained about over the latter part of the season, the ILB's don't drop so deep in coverage that underneath routes become a pitch-and-catch situation for the offense. They have enough confidence in their secondary to allow the LB's to play closer to the line and stop the passes over the middle that killed Dallas.

San Diego

San Diego is a much different 3-4 team. They believe in a lot of movement and fakes to confuse the offense. Before the snap of the ball, they have linebackers and defensive backs moving all over the place. They move up to the line of scrimmage to fake a blitz, they move the OLB's from one side to the other, and they generally look like they are confused - but they are carefully crafting their fakes. They do blitz more than the average defense, but they also spend a lot of time faking the blitz from one area and bringing it from another. All this movement did hurt them occasionally when they weren't lined up properly at the snap of the ball, but that's the price they're willing to pay for trying to disguise their actual play-call. The Patriots looked like a better team when they went to the hurry-up offense because the Chargers were unable to do all their movement.

Like the Patriots, the Chargers believe in being very aggressive on 3rd downs. They sometimes move their secondary up for press coverage and send the blitz, while playing man-to-man in coverage. The corners also tried to be physical with the Patriots receivers by knocking them off their routes at the snap of the ball. Overall, it looked like the Chargers do play a lot of zone in coverage, but they aren't afraid to expose their secondary in man-to-man situations while trying to bring pressure in the pass rush.

San Diego was not shy about moving their defensive line, too. Instead of always lining up on top of the center and on top of the tackles, they would move into the gaps. Occasionally they did this to one side while bringing the blitz from the other side, trying to make the offensive line choose who and where they would slide the protection. They also did a lot of slanting with their defensive ends, something a Parcells 3-4 never does.

The Chargers try to overload a side of the line with their blitzes. They send their safety into the pass rush on occasion, and like to bring a linebacker with him into the same area on the offensive line. They are also extremely quick around the edges with their OLB's. They do ask the OLB's to get into coverage on occasion, and from what I saw they were not very good at it. But the ILB's were very good about covering underneath, once again closer to the line of scrimmage than the Dallas ILB's, and they also ran with the TE pretty well, something Bradie James can't do. Now, the Patriots TE's are very good and they were able to exploit the coverage by the LB's on occasion, but seemed to find a lot of that success on the outside.

Summary

Watching the New England defense was a lot like watching the Dallas defense. They play straight-up pre-snap and generally have a lot of the same defensive calls. The difference was their willingness to get aggressive in situations where Dallas usually chooses to sit back, like 3rd and long. They also have more experience with their defensive players and they react better and quicker than Dallas does. They also trust their secondary more by keeping the front seven closer to the line on pass plays.

San Diego is a very different beast. They believe in confusion and overloading blitzes to cause havoc with the opposing QB. They are a much more aggressive scheme and are very physical with the offense, including the wide receivers. They depend on their front seven to be playmakers because they risk a lot with their blitzes. When they don't get pressure on a play though, they can be in trouble with a suspect secondary.

Under Bill Parcells, it's doubtful you'll ever see a 3-4 scheme that resembles the Chargers. But if you want a blueprint for how Parcells wants the 3-4 defense to work, watch the New England Patriots.
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Old 05-16-2007, 08:07 PM    (permalink
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Thule/BBD/et al

What I find interesting in all the discussion is not read react versus attacking in terms of philosophy but the fact that Tom Landry's Flex D, which I am sure fans fondly love, is philosophically the same as the D's Belichick and Parcells run.

All three believed fundamentally that Defense was about reacting intelligently to what the Offense was doing and being tough enough to beat your assignment at the Point of Attack.

I would say that Buddy Ryan revolutionized this strategy with increasinging D focus on forcing mistakes and "making plays."

To me all modern D's pretty much are based on the Landyr Flex and Ryan 46 in one shape (3-4 / 4-3) or another.
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Old 05-16-2007, 09:11 PM    (permalink
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I wonder how Phillips' scheme will look with a downgrade of the front 3, and an upgrade in the secondary. I really hope Ferg and the rest of the big guys can get the job done in a major way this year. That Charger front is unreal, and I don't believe that we'll be on that same level with our current personnel. So assuming our push up front is slightly lacking, would you guys predict that Phillips will be even more inclined to blitz with this group? Damn I can't wait to see this new look. I'm especially interested to see how we'll use Roy and Ware. Not a knock on Parcells at all, but I think Wade will do a better job of utilizing each players specific strengths. I think he'll love Henry's ability to play close, he'll love Roy and Ham's ability to illicit fear over the middle of the field (and blitz), and he'll especially love Ware's potential as a great pass rusher. I think he'll love pretty much everything about our LB's and DB's. I think he's gotta be excited about the level of talent and depth. So how do you guys think he feels about the guys up front? I'm wondering how much he will alter the scheme he used in SD to fit our guys. Seems like a lot is riding on the play of our big men. How much do you think they'll benefit from all the pre-snap movement and lining up in the gaps?

Sorry I couldn't add much to the discussion. I still have a lot to learn about the nuance of this scheme. Thanks a lot to everybody who is contributing these insights into what makes Wade's D tick. It's exciting to sit and imagine our players frothing at the mouth pre-snap and then flying around with reckless abandon causing turnovers- ala recent SD teams. I couldn't be happier with the possibilities our new coaching staff brings to the table. As much as I love and respect the Tuna, I was more than frustrated on numerous occasions last year when it came to our conservative style. Especially on 3rd downs.
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Old 05-16-2007, 09:16 PM    (permalink
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Wow, thanks Thule and Modano for that. I really enjoyed reading that. And I agree wholeheartedly with what was said. Great write ups.

Robert I agree. Landry and Ryan have introduced aspects to defense that forever changed the game. Theyre not the only ones though. Chuck Fairbanks, Parcells, LeBeau, Knoll...they also forever changed the scope of defense.

What I loved about those writeups was how accurate they were in assessing both defenses. I couldnt agree more. I won't go into detail because Im sure we've beaten it to death, but its nice to read others points of view on both defenses coincide with what Ive been saying. Im looking forward to seeing Phillip's scheme in more detail now that he's coaching a division rival.
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Old 05-16-2007, 09:34 PM    (permalink
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Here's a question for you guys- Which individual player do expect to make the biggest improvement as a direct result of the new scheme? Why?
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Old 05-16-2007, 09:42 PM    (permalink
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Here's a question for you guys- Which individual player do expect to make the biggest improvement as a direct result of the new scheme? Why?
Hmmm...thats a good question. Its hard to say. Lots of young guys. Will the scheme help them, or is it experience and development, or a combination of both?

I think Im gonna go with Burnett if he starts. He's been a disappointment thus far, but if he is used as Wade's Donnie Edwards as being said thus far, I think he'll do better than years past.

If Burnett doesn't start, I think the scheme change will benefit Henry the most.

I don't think it helps Spears that much honestly. If Spear's issues were simply the 2 gap technique, then why was he benched in favor of Hatcher et all in the nickel? Wouldn't it make sense to use him inside in the nickel and allow him to penetrate? He simply wasn't that great last year. I think he needs to develop those individual skills.
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Old 05-16-2007, 09:49 PM    (permalink
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I wonder how Phillips' scheme will look with a downgrade of the front 3, and an upgrade in the secondary. I really hope Ferg and the rest of the big guys can get the job done in a major way this year. That Charger front is unreal, and I don't believe that we'll be on that same level with our current personnel. So assuming our push up front is slightly lacking, would you guys predict that Phillips will be even more inclined to blitz with this group? Damn I can't wait to see this new look. I'm especially interested to see how we'll use Roy and Ware. Not a knock on Parcells at all, but I think Wade will do a better job of utilizing each players specific strengths. I think he'll love Henry's ability to play close, he'll love Roy and Ham's ability to illicit fear over the middle of the field (and blitz), and he'll especially love Ware's potential as a great pass rusher. I think he'll love pretty much everything about our LB's and DB's. I think he's gotta be excited about the level of talent and depth. So how do you guys think he feels about the guys up front? I'm wondering how much he will alter the scheme he used in SD to fit our guys. Seems like a lot is riding on the play of our big men. How much do you think they'll benefit from all the pre-snap movement and lining up in the gaps?

Sorry I couldn't add much to the discussion. I still have a lot to learn about the nuance of this scheme. Thanks a lot to everybody who is contributing these insights into what makes Wade's D tick. It's exciting to sit and imagine our players frothing at the mouth pre-snap and then flying around with reckless abandon causing turnovers- ala recent SD teams. I couldn't be happier with the possibilities our new coaching staff brings to the table. As much as I love and respect the Tuna, I was more than frustrated on numerous occasions last year when it came to our conservative style. Especially on 3rd downs.
I live in SD and have a chance to view alot of the games. One thing that stuck out the most to me was the turn around for the secondary. Jammer was a hated player here in San Diego and was known for alot of Pass Interference calls as well as getting beat deep. He was a labeled a bust to say the least.

They switched to the 3-4 a few years back and with the addition of Merriman and the emergence of Shaun Phillips, accompanied by an awesome front 3, Wade Phillips was able to mask alot of the secondarys problems. Like BBD already pointed out they switch the blitzes up alot, and the blitzes come from many different players, but they were consistant with always bringing atleast 5 guys. This is something that we were very hesitant to do last year. If Wade runs these linebackers like he ran the LB's in SD, our secondary should have a much easier job. Last year they were hung out in coverage for anywhere from 4-7 seconds on a consistant basis, whereas in SD they generated enough pressure to always flush the QB out of the pocket or force him to make a bad/quick throw.

Donnie Edwards was also a key to the success of the defense because he was so versatile in the middle. Edwards was actually a very underratted player, he has lead the team in tackles for multiple years, including Seau's last 2 seasons as a charger and does an exceptional job in coverage. He really helped to close down the passing lanes in the mid-deep inside portion of the field, which is key in Phillips D. I dont think we really have a guy to fit that Edwards role that was so crucial to Wade's D in SD unless Carpenter ends up being better in coverage than I expect, or we actually allow Burnett to get some PT which i doubt due to big money invested in James and Ayodele.

Wade also allows his corners to play very physical, which is why Jammer flourished this last year. The combination of his strong pass rush and his corners rerouting recievers at the line, always has the opposing QBs finding themselves in unfavorbale postions. However without an Edwards or a Williams (NT) on our team I'm not sure if he scheme will translate as well as we all hope it will.

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Old 05-16-2007, 10:33 PM    (permalink
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I missed the forum. I went to Mexico for a vacation, and came home to a house that got a couple of hail storms while I was gone. And some rain. I have been busy with that.

I have really enjoyed reading the posts. They were insightfull.

I think Roy Williams will benefit the most, if the scheme works the way it is supposed to. I think he is a playmaker (good and bad, but more good than bad.) With the quarterback feeling more pressure, Roy will capitalize on the quarterback's mistake more than any one player on our defense. IMO.

By the way, has there been any insight into the offense while I was gone? Dont mean to change the subject, but if it has been discussed, tell me where and I will go back and read the older posts.
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Old 05-16-2007, 11:21 PM    (permalink
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Here's a question for you guys- Which individual player do expect to make the biggest improvement as a direct result of the new scheme? Why?
I would think it could be Burnett if he is given the opportunity. IMO Wade could help turn Burnett into his Donnie Edwards, given the surrounding talent in the LB core.

I personally would like to see bradie james on the bench and ayodele/burnett/carp working in a 3 man rotation in the middle. I think Burnett and Carp could make huge strides as players given the opportunity.

However, due to contracts that have been given to James and Ayodele, I am not sure how realistic it is to assume that they may take a back seat or atleast decreased roles to integrate carpenter and burnett into the system. Hopefully wade can get them in.

If it isnt those guys in the middle than I assume either Roy or Henry will benefit the most. Henry should be able to play a more physical style which should work better with his skill set (I think the D could benefit him in the same way that it benefit Jammer last season) and of course Roy should be playing closer to the line this year which should also work better with his skill set as opposed to using him in coverage.

I hope the end's play can improve as well, but the cry baby attitude of spears leads me to believe that he may just not have it in him to play at a high level in the NFL. Only time will tell

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Old 05-17-2007, 12:27 AM    (permalink
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Here's a question for you guys- Which individual player do expect to make the biggest improvement as a direct result of the new scheme? Why?
This is an easy one for me.
Akin Ayodele...he will be in his second year in the 3-4. We saw how much he improved just over one year from start to finish. He is down a couple of lbs. and should translate into a bit more quickness. Akin was a DE in college and a Sam backer in Jacksonville. I really think that translates well into how Wade uses his WILB. This defense is everything that complements Ayodele so it'll be interesting to see if it translates on the field.

For anyone who claims henry...beware he was torched a couple of times in mini camp...now I'm not buying alot in shorts type stuff...but you would think that he might have had some good write-ups...and I haven't seen any.

Spears is getting great reports...so I think that's reassuring. If I had to pick a DE tho...it's going to be Hatcher...seems to me like an ideal one gap DE.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Furgy puts up a year just as good as any top 3 NT in a 3-4 scheme this year. A couple of people around here really didn't appreciate what he accomplished last year...if I had one knock...it would be too much penetration from him last year...which hosed the middle of our defense...but that wasn't often.

Our OLB's are going to get to the QB...I'm not worried about that.

Our cb's are fine...but Henry is on my hotseat. I want to see him put up this year. Glenn need to continue showing he hasn't lost a step. I really want to see Butler and Ball make strides and even see some occasional nickel action towards the end of the year.

Roy is going to be at home...Wade realizes minimizing a players weakness's. However Roy will probably have more of an effect this year that goes on noticed. I can't see him having a huge sack total. I think he'll be right around that 5 int's spot. I think he'll be just about average in one on one coverage. I just don't think he will improve enough to be called the most improve. I mean if he is not playing deep and stopping the deep play you can't say he improved in that area. I think he will have a good year...but that just has more to do with getting him out of his weak zones and keeping him up.

Hamlin is going to earn himself a nice pay check this year...count it. The only way this doesn't happen is if Watkins really turns it on...which isn't that much of an outside shot. But Hamlin is going to have a hell of a year...and whether he gets his paycheck from us or not is up to Watkins imo.
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Old 05-17-2007, 01:15 AM    (permalink
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Here's a question for you guys- Which individual player do expect to make the biggest improvement as a direct result of the new scheme? Why?
This maybe the easiest or most obvious pick, but I would say Spears. He actually sounds happy with the new scheme and has gotten some rave reviews by some of the correspondents at mini-camp. Plus, I really believe he wants the shake the word "bust" from the discussion when his name is brought up. It maybe just wishful thinking, since I was big fan of his at LSU, but I aspect a vast improvement this season....


...God I hope he improves.
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Old 05-17-2007, 02:21 AM    (permalink
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If i could pick one guy that i would hope to have improve the most, i think i may go with julius jones. im not sure but i might take the julius jones who played in those 8 games his rookie season over an improved defensive player.

If i had to go defense i would pick henry as the player i would HOPE to have improved his game or at least the player i would hope to benefit the most from wades scheme because im not sold on him. We all know i was looking for his replacement in the first round this year...like i said earlier, he will have a chance to play more physical this year and wont have to rely on his speed, or lack there of, to chase guys up and down the field.

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Old 05-17-2007, 02:34 AM    (permalink
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Talking about coaches' approach, what type of coach do you think its Bellichick? You don't see him yelling at his players, but you don't compare him to Tony Dungy too...
I sure hope Wade's philosophy will work well, the thing I like of that is its "family approach". I think the thing we should appreciate in him is that is trying to create a peaceful group. If he can do that and still be an effective coach, allowing his players to be more relaxed on practice but still aggressive and concentrated on the field we should have a good season.
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Old 05-17-2007, 09:01 AM    (permalink
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Wow, thanks Thule and Modano for that. I really enjoyed reading that. And I agree wholeheartedly with what was said. Great write ups.

Robert I agree. Landry and Ryan have introduced aspects to defense that forever changed the game. Theyre not the only ones though. Chuck Fairbanks, Parcells, LeBeau, Knoll...they also forever changed the scope of defense.

What I loved about those writeups was how accurate they were in assessing both defenses. I couldnt agree more. I won't go into detail because Im sure we've beaten it to death, but its nice to read others points of view on both defenses coincide with what Ive been saying. Im looking forward to seeing Phillip's scheme in more detail now that he's coaching a division rival.
Le Beau is a bit a hybrid guy in the sense he runs a read react but the react part allows for players (mainly LBs) to try and make plays behind the LOS (zone blitzing for example) if they notice their assignment is not integral to defending the play.

What would be also an interesting discussion is how do Coverage schemes blend with each style.

For example I think the Read/React approach lends itself nicely to zone based schemes. Schemes where guys have real estate they need to defend but can freelance (ala LeBeau) if they think it appropriate. For example corner blitz off a Cover-4 if the WR goes into motion to overload the oppositte side of the field.

The Buddy pressure scheme much more so Cover1/0 or Cover-2 Man. **Not sure how Cover-2 became a zone scheme when in reality is was a man scheme, Cover plus 2 back hence Cover 2.**

So I think the interaction between using the front 7 to penetrate and create pressure with how you mix up coverage is very interesting to discuss.

I am a big proponent of Cover 4 in the 3-4 allowing the LBs to make reads and blitz as needed as long as 2 of the 4 LB pick up the TE and the RB out of the back field.

The strong side backers make their call on the line prior to the snap in terms of who covers the TE. The weak side in terms of who covers the RB. If they overload one side with a TE and RB then overload the blitz with the Backers on the other side.

Anyway..... been so long doing the math that I forget the actual on field stuff.
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Old 05-17-2007, 09:03 AM    (permalink
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If i could pick one guy that i would hope to have improve the most, i think i may go with julius jones. im not sure but i might take the julius jones who played in those 8 games his rookie season over an improved defensive player.

If i had to go defense i would pick henry as the player i would HOPE to have improved his game or at least the player i would hope to benefit the most from wades scheme because im not sold on him. We all know i was looking for his replacement in the first round this year...like i said earlier, he will have a chance to play more physical this year and wont have to rely on his speed, or lack there of, to chase guys up and down the field.

Romo on Offense
Bradie James on Defense

JMHO.
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Old 05-17-2007, 09:07 AM    (permalink
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...... However without an Edwards or a Williams (NT) on our team I'm not sure if he scheme will translate as well as we all hope it will.

And this is exactly why he can't run the SD system here IMHO.

I think our expectations are flat out wrong on this. I assume Wade can see it already so he will need to make some adjustments.

Starting with the NT (the most important position in a 3-4 IMHO) we are no where near as good as Williams. Which is more a stopping the run issue. I think Fergie/Ratliff are as good as Williams in getting to the QB.

On the ILB, we just don't have a Donnie Edwards but we all have proposed Burnett for the role. My big thing their is WTF are we then doing with James and Ayodele and Carpenter but anyway............
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Old 05-17-2007, 09:17 AM    (permalink
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Talking about coaches' approach, what type of coach do you think its Bellichick? You don't see him yelling at his players, but you don't compare him to Tony Dungy too...
I sure hope Wade's philosophy will work well, the thing I like of that is its "family approach". I think the thing we should appreciate in him is that is trying to create a peaceful group. If he can do that and still be an effective coach, allowing his players to be more relaxed on practice but still aggressive and concentrated on the field we should have a good season.
Family approach only works if a tight group of Vets make it work. Not sure we have that. Maybe the Ware's, Witten's and Newman's can do this. They produce, aren't flawed football players and are sufficiently experienced. Maybe a Romo if he can be consistent this year.

The TO's, Roy Williams and Bradie James guys just have too much baggae or too flawed on the field IMHO.
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Old 05-17-2007, 11:32 AM    (permalink
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Le Beau is a bit a hybrid guy in the sense he runs a read react but the react part allows for players (mainly LBs) to try and make plays behind the LOS (zone blitzing for example) if they notice their assignment is not integral to defending the play.

What would be also an interesting discussion is how do Coverage schemes blend with each style.

For example I think the Read/React approach lends itself nicely to zone based schemes. Schemes where guys have real estate they need to defend but can freelance (ala LeBeau) if they think it appropriate. For example corner blitz off a Cover-4 if the WR goes into motion to overload the oppositte side of the field.

The Buddy pressure scheme much more so Cover1/0 or Cover-2 Man. **Not sure how Cover-2 became a zone scheme when in reality is was a man scheme, Cover plus 2 back hence Cover 2.**

So I think the interaction between using the front 7 to penetrate and create pressure with how you mix up coverage is very interesting to discuss.

I am a big proponent of Cover 4 in the 3-4 allowing the LBs to make reads and blitz as needed as long as 2 of the 4 LB pick up the TE and the RB out of the back field.

The strong side backers make their call on the line prior to the snap in terms of who covers the TE. The weak side in terms of who covers the RB. If they overload one side with a TE and RB then overload the blitz with the Backers on the other side.

Anyway..... been so long doing the math that I forget the actual on field stuff.

Very nice Robert. Someone's been doing their hw.

To me, what makes a great defense is adjustibility. A defense that can be effective against anything thrown at it. Thats why I love the BP 3-4 so much. Its passive in nature, but it can get aggressive if need be. People forget, that just bc it was not as effective in Dallas doesn't mean that it was a passive scheme.

Fun fact of the day. The 1985 Bears are historically known as being one of the best if not the best pass rushing defense in NFL history. Everytime you hear people talk about them, they mention how they "killed" the quarterback. Well guess what? The Bears didnt lead the NFL in sacks in 1985. That stat belonged to the New York Giants.

My personal favorite schemes currently being run in the NFL are the BP 3-4 and John Fox's 4-3. Fox's 4-3 is almost like a BP 3-4 in a 4-3 shell, thats why I like it so much. Adjustability is the name of the game. Being able to do everything and not live and die on one principle. I like Rob Ryan's scheme for this reason as well.

I like Wade's scheme alot too. Saban's scheme is very similar to BPs. Dom Capers is another brilliant mind. I like Caper's and Saban's flex scheme alot.
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Old 05-17-2007, 12:24 PM    (permalink
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Very nice Robert. Someone's been doing their hw.

To me, what makes a great defense is adjustibility. A defense that can be effective against anything thrown at it. Thats why I love the BP 3-4 so much. Its passive in nature, but it can get aggressive if need be. People forget, that just bc it was not as effective in Dallas doesn't mean that it was a passive scheme.

Fun fact of the day. The 1985 Bears are historically known as being one of the best if not the best pass rushing defense in NFL history. Everytime you hear people talk about them, they mention how they "killed" the quarterback. Well guess what? The Bears didnt lead the NFL in sacks in 1985. That stat belonged to the New York Giants.

My personal favorite schemes currently being run in the NFL are the BP 3-4 and John Fox's 4-3. Fox's 4-3 is almost like a BP 3-4 in a 4-3 shell, thats why I like it so much. Adjustability is the name of the game. Being able to do everything and not live and die on one principle. I like Rob Ryan's scheme for this reason as well.

I like Wade's scheme alot too. Saban's scheme is very similar to BPs. Dom Capers is another brilliant mind. I like Caper's and Saban's flex scheme alot.
This is why people who say Ware should rush everydown have no clue what they are talking about. It renders the very strength of a 3-4 useless.

How your Linebackers read the play and adjust their assignments at the LOS is fundamental to playing great 3-4.

If every play Ware must rush then he is just another DE in a 4-3. An ineffective one at that too.

For example, if a TE is lined up weak side with a FB on the strong side what the hell is wrong with Ware taking the TE and shotting the WILB (James) into the G/T gap, giving Hatcher or Canty the outside rush. Let Ayodele and Carpenter on the strong side cover the underneath with a 4 man rush.

If you want to blitz shoot Roy Williams into 3/5 gap and shoot Carpenter into the 9/7 with Sears occupying the 5/7. Let the remaining LB (Ayodele) play short zone to pick up the FB/RB if he goes on a pattern or the QB scrambles ... if your CB and FS can cover three WR you will get a sack or generate pressure. Big IF though

So many things you can do out of 3-4 with the right backers playing smart. Hell Jimmy Johnson Mr 4-3 used his DEs much like 3-4 OLB so ......... this is nothing new to folks except those who don't know the game.

Some folks here in D just constantly complian about going 3-4 because they hate Parcells and are more interested in DeMarcus getting sacks than playing good D. Never knowing BP 3-4 and Flex Landry are similar and that Jimmy Johnson employed Dick LeBeau 3-4 concepts into those 90s Ds.

So frustrating to hear the folks down here. Just plain dumb.

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