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Old 07-12-2007, 01:27 PM    (permalink
VY10
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Um because players want to play at the highest level, and the NCAA is the highest level. We're not asking to integrate the CIS and NCAA, it's just asking to give Canadian kids a look. Come on think a little next time.
whoa there! didn't mean to offend you. Get a sense of humor.
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:35 PM    (permalink
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No matter how you put it, Canadian football players are extremely raw when they go to college. Many Canadian are sprinkled throughout the NCAA and some make it to the pros but it is a long process. There simply isn't the training or competition in Canada to prepare him for an NCAA career. What you do find when a Canadian kid goes south of the border for football, is a very good athlete, who is raw and needs lots of work. Many become starters eventually based on their athletic ability and some make it to the pros, but for the most part, Canadian kids are miles behind in technique when the enter American colleges and need at least 2 years to become servicable players. Many second tier colleges take them because of their athletic ability and are willing to work with them and develope them as players. The top American football powers don't have that patience and only a few every make those teams.
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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On a serious note....

It is too hard to recruit in Canada. No coaches want to make that trip and if Canadians aren't coming down to do American camps that can't complain about not getting recruited. I really doubt if a player is "that good" that college coaches won't consider him just because he is Canadian. If these Canadian players want to play at a school like Notre Dame, Souther Cal, or Texas they are insane, but if they are willing to go and camp at a couple of schools close to the border I don't see why teams up North would have any problem taking a Canadian player if they actually had talent. On a further note think about how much real talent there is in Canada..... They have less football talent in their entire country than there is in almost any one of the U.S. states. It isn't worth a coaches time to have to go and sift through all the players just to find one "jewel." Again Canadians as a general population not having many great football players is not discrimination, it is just a fact.
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Old 07-12-2007, 01:39 PM    (permalink
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On a serious note....

They have less football talent in their entire country than there is in almost any one of the U.S. states.
Canadian talent > Alaskan talent. :)
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:52 PM    (permalink
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so rather than just sitting back and whining about how us teams ignore canadian players, do any of them take the initiative to, you know, walk on to a team? or do they all just talk about how the US doesn't care, and then go play for some unspectacular canuck college squad?
honestly njx, do you think before you write things?? Serious question! Do you take into account how much it costs for an International Student to attend a D1 NCAA college in the states cost? Have you taken into consideration living expenses? How about transportation? Probably not or else you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement. On average for an International student to walk-on to a school, you are looking at paying 35-40,000 dollars a year! Do you have that much money njx? Please think before you make such remarks, as this is not the first time. A lot of people go to "unspectacular canuck teams" because that is the only REALISTIC option left. It is very nice to talk about walking on to a team, but it isnt reality for 97% of people. The other 3% have to look at the chance they are gonna ahve once they go down there. Please take everything into consideration before posting something stupid like you did previously.
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:54 PM    (permalink
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On a serious note....

It is too hard to recruit in Canada. No coaches want to make that trip and if Canadians aren't coming down to do American camps that can't complain about not getting recruited. I really doubt if a player is "that good" that college coaches won't consider him just because he is Canadian. If these Canadian players want to play at a school like Notre Dame, Souther Cal, or Texas they are insane, but if they are willing to go and camp at a couple of schools close to the border I don't see why teams up North would have any problem taking a Canadian player if they actually had talent. On a further note think about how much real talent there is in Canada..... They have less football talent in their entire country than there is in almost any one of the U.S. states. It isn't worth a coaches time to have to go and sift through all the players just to find one "jewel." Again Canadians as a general population not having many great football players is not discrimination, it is just a fact.

I guess thats why Canada seems to beat the USA during the Global Championships at the SuperBowl!

BTW, there are a few teams who go down to the states for an ex game, but there are never any good ones that go down. I would love to see how St. Michaels College School or St. Andrews or perhaps Lorne Park fare against your teams. Honestly, these are the REAL schools with real coaching. Thats what it comes down to in Canada is coaching.
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:04 PM    (permalink
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OMFG IT COSTS MONEY!?!?!?!?!?!

blow me. i took loans out for every cent that i couldn't pay during college, walked onto an out of state football team that i never got a scholarship for and am still a functioning member of society afterwards. does everything need to be spoonfed to you? does someone need to give you everything for you to have any hope of achieving? i'm thoroughly and utterly disgusted by both the fact that you think this garbage is in any way a thoughtful response and more, that you seem to have no initiative to do anything to better your own situation without someone doing it for you.

speaking of posting something stupid. tell me again how some international student from canada stands no chance of paying all those bills when he walks on to follow his dream of playing football in the states? because i have actual counter examples from my own life that prove you have no idea what you're talking about.

Tell me something...how long is it until you are done paying for all your school fees? Secondly, did you have to pay 40,00 dollars to go to school each year? Thats even dumber considering you said you went to a state school which they cut the costs by soo much. So who sounds like the idiot now? You probably paid less than $5000 to go to school each year.

For your information I looked into walking on to Troy University, but found out it wasnt worth it, dont tell me I dont have iniative, so I am doing something about it, and had you read the infor previously you would;ve heard that I was doing something about it you idiot. Im going to a juco to get my name out in that sense. Good enough for you? At some it goes past what your dreams are, especailly when you dont have $40,000 a year to pay for school. Think about it.
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:05 PM    (permalink
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On the wbsite it said up in 9 days, that was when I posted the link to it. Once I clicked on it, it said there was no story. So who knows.

LB51, where are you from?
i'm from wininpeg
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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thanks for making moronic generalizations without having any vague clue wtf you're talking about. do us all a favor and look up out of state costs for some US state universities. start with the University of Colorado, which, a few years ago, was running around $38k a year for an out of state student. it's further absolutely none of your business how long i'll be re-paying those loans, as that's tied very closely with my current income level. something i have less than no interest in sharing with some 14 year old who's already proven multiple times in this thread that he has no idea what he'as talking about and is instead trying to carry out a ridiculous personal vendetta simply because i've told him he's wrong a few times. grow up.



so you're going to a juco for a year or two? great! that's the bloody point. i went to a small school in colorado, and even though we won the state championship, scouts from d-1 schools were not taking an interest. rather than whine about how unfair it is, a number of our guys went to small schools and jucos for a year or two, then transferred to better universities to play. some of us walked on to programs we wanted to play for. my desire to play college football made it worth me re-paying my college loans today. but hey, keep up the personal attacks! calling me an idiot really makes you look smarter!
So if it is 38k a year for an outta state student tack on Internation Student fees, along with the exchange rate (getting higher but still a pain) and your looking at easily over 55k a year. OUTRAGEOUS!! Obvioulsy you had your heart desired on playing football at a certain school, and I respect that, and to some degree I do too, but not to the point when Im paying for the rest of my life. I would soon rather play at a juco for a year or two, then catch on with another school. Finally we have agreed on one thing.

I still feel you aren't understanding my point about an International student paying that much to go to school. Take your Colorado example. 55k minimum to go to school each year! Come on, how long does one want to pay that off during their life? I want to live my life with as minimum debt as possible.
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Old 07-12-2007, 03:27 PM    (permalink
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CU was an example. there are certainly far cheaper state schools with, at this point, better football programs. again, I understand not wanting to pay that much. but it's seriously obnoxious to read some of the "woe is us" comments in this thread. there are *always* options if one wants something enough.
That I do agree with. Hence why I have turned down many, many CIS schools and am going juco. I think others shouls follow.
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Old 07-12-2007, 04:21 PM    (permalink
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I got the chance to play against Trey Henderson (USC Commit) in the Provincial Championship Game (which we won as underdogs). He is a physically gifted player with great size and strength but isn't as dominant as you'd expect. He's the kind of guy when "on" he's unstoppable but a lot of the time he looks average. He probably wasn't eve the best D-Lineman in BC. But the the thing about him was the exposure. He went to several camps in the States including USC and Washington. There he had the opportunity to be scouted by American Scouts and get into their database. Also, there was a rumour that he sent his highlight tape to every Div 1A. He wasn't nesscesarily an amazing player, although he has lots of poetential but Div 1A coaches were aware of who he was and what he could do. He ended up getting a full ride to SC. The main difference between scholorship opportunities for American and Canadian Players is exposure. There is guy named named Ron Dias is the only guy in all of Canada who scout the players talks to American coaches about Canadian players. Canadian athletes need to take more initiative and make an effort to get seen.
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Old 07-12-2007, 04:43 PM    (permalink
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Here's the thing though. How many players that were actually offered in that article turned out to be academically ineligible later on? The guy's talking like no one ever gets a chance. Clearly some guys did, and they blew it by not making the grades. I can think of at least 3 different examples like that from the article.
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Old 07-12-2007, 05:09 PM    (permalink
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I guess thats why Canada seems to beat the USA during the Global Championships at the SuperBowl!

BTW, there are a few teams who go down to the states for an ex game, but there are never any good ones that go down. I would love to see how St. Michaels College School or St. Andrews or perhaps Lorne Park fare against your teams. Honestly, these are the REAL schools with real coaching. Thats what it comes down to in Canada is coaching.
Honestly Billingsley26 do you think before you write things!
Congradu****lations Canada has all of the "elite" football coaches. Considering I have never heard of any of the teams you mentioned I don't know how they would fair against Hoover High who ACTUALLY produces NCAA talent. **** Hoover even has its own TV show in the states. I'm pretty sure teams like Southlake Carroll and any highschool powerhouse would love to get behind and mount any team in Canada. If you think for one second that any football program in Canada is worth warm spit you are sadly mistaken. And anyways if your teams are so ****ing good with such top tier talent why don't all your Canadian universities start powerhouse football teams? That seems to be the theme of this thread... That Candian football talent is so ****ing good except all American football coaches hate Canadians and refuse to give them scholarships.

Then I notice you attack njx which is completely uncalled for. Honestly Billingsley, do you take into account that no one ****ing cares if Canadians have to pay lots of money to go to an AMERICAN university. Awww boohoo some Canadian football player can't get a scholarship to play at a big time American program. WAHHHHHH. So now "all Americans are racist against Canadian football players and it isn't because they suck, it is because they simply are from Canada." **** they don't even look different.

Get over it Canada. You have inferior football talent. Stop ****ing and complaining and stop insulting people that actually know what they are talking about. Send all of your players to the CFL where they will stay and get to play with the undrafted Americans coming out of college

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Old 07-12-2007, 05:13 PM    (permalink
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So if it is 38k a year for an outta state student tack on Internation Student fees, along with the exchange rate (getting higher but still a pain) and your looking at easily over 55k a year. OUTRAGEOUS!! Obvioulsy you had your heart desired on playing football at a certain school, and I respect that, and to some degree I do too, but not to the point when Im paying for the rest of my life. I would soon rather play at a juco for a year or two, then catch on with another school. Finally we have agreed on one thing.

I still feel you aren't understanding my point about an International student paying that much to go to school. Take your Colorado example. 55k minimum to go to school each year! Come on, how long does one want to pay that off during their life? I want to live my life with as minimum debt as possible.
WHO CARES! You don't pay American taxes to go to our cheaper public universities. Your argument is totally irrelevant. If you don't get a scholarship go to some Canadian college. Stop *****ing about how it is so expensive for a foreigner to go to a school that Americans pay for every year. If it is too expensive, don't go.
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Old 07-12-2007, 06:11 PM    (permalink
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Why don't they just go play football for colleges in Canada. This is the N(National)CAA. Not the I(International)CAA. :p
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so rather than just sitting back and whining about how us teams ignore canadian players, do any of them take the initiative to, you know, walk on to a team? or do they all just talk about how the US doesn't care, and then go play for some unspectacular canuck college squad?
The two of you simply don't understand the concept of the Canadian athlete wanting to attend American university on a full scholarship. It's quite simple actually: full scholarship! Canadian universities can only give up to about $3000 "bursary" to incoming athletes, and that hinges on an 80+ average in Grade 12 and maintaining a 70 in university. Canadians strive to play in the US because they can get a free education and play on the highest level, does that not make sense? Walking onto a team defeats the purpose because American tuition is far more expensive and you don't even get the small amount that Canadian schools offer, you get $0. Many of these players I mentioned would walk on at a university with the confidence and expectation of earning a scholarship, however they can't even afford that initial year of paying.
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Old 07-12-2007, 06:15 PM    (permalink
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On a serious note....

It is too hard to recruit in Canada. No coaches want to make that trip and if Canadians aren't coming down to do American camps that can't complain about not getting recruited. I really doubt if a player is "that good" that college coaches won't consider him just because he is Canadian. If these Canadian players want to play at a school like Notre Dame, Souther Cal, or Texas they are insane, but if they are willing to go and camp at a couple of schools close to the border I don't see why teams up North would have any problem taking a Canadian player if they actually had talent. On a further note think about how much real talent there is in Canada..... They have less football talent in their entire country than there is in almost any one of the U.S. states. It isn't worth a coaches time to have to go and sift through all the players just to find one "jewel." Again Canadians as a general population not having many great football players is not discrimination, it is just a fact.
Trust me, American scouts (Northern teams) know about the top Canadian prospects and they are not difficult to scout or find. In many cases these prospects actually come to the camps and the schools yet they still fail to offer. A 4.29 is a 4.29, no matter where you are from. 6'1 220 LBs with 4.4 speed and incredible leaping ability are the same in Canada as they are in the States.
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:07 PM    (permalink
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ETK qre u sure about the bursary's only goin up 2 3000$ becuz i was at a U of M football camp and i could have sworn i heard brian Dobie talk about full scholorships but it was awhile ago so i met b mistaken
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:16 PM    (permalink
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ETK qre u sure about the bursary's only goin up 2 3000$ becuz i was at a U of M football camp and i could have sworn i heard brian Dobie talk about full scholorships but it was awhile ago so i met b mistaken
By U of M you mean Manitoba, right?

Not all schools have the same limits, I believe, as different universities have different requirements and allocated spending, but 3000 is about what one should expect.
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:24 PM    (permalink
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By U of M you mean Manitoba, right?

Not all schools have the same limits, I believe, as different universities have different requirements and allocated spending, but 3000 is about what one should expect.
chyea i meant Manitoba still 3000 isn't bad considering Uof M is only 2000 $ a yr to attend i'n not sure about other cis skools but they can't b much more
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:28 PM    (permalink
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Sorry, I can't believe this. A recruiters main objective is to build the best team possible, regardless if he is from South Dakota, Arizona, or Canada. I can't say a person residence overrides his abilities.

What about Daryn Colledge or Mark Schlereth? I have alot more respect for a Canadian team than a Alaskan team. Yet Colledge went to a D1 program in Boise State and Mark to Idaho. Once again, Idaho is not a powerhouse but definitely better than some JUCO school.

Gaines Adams played 8 man football. I think that is totally different than 11 man football we are used to here in USA/Canada. (I do gotta admit that I can't say that I have ever seen an 8 man football game.)

How did Brett Romberg go play for the U? A Canadian playing for the powerhouse Hurricanes. Josh Bourke played for Grand Valley State, albeit a D2 program, but GVSU has been one hell of a team in D2.

For you Canadians, I say just play in your own college football system, go to the CFL. If you are good enough, I am sure that recruited will add you
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:32 PM    (permalink
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Sorry, I m not trying to start a fight.

I am just saying, if you dont get selected, go play in Canada. Make your way to CFL or whatever team and make the college regret not picking you up
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:35 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by VY10 View Post
Honestly Billingsley26 do you think before you write things!
Congradu****lations Canada has all of the "elite" football coaches. Considering I have never heard of any of the teams you mentioned I don't know how they would fair against Hoover High who ACTUALLY produces NCAA talent. **** Hoover even has its own TV show in the states. I'm pretty sure teams like Southlake Carroll and any highschool powerhouse would love to get behind and mount any team in Canada. If you think for one second that any football program in Canada is worth warm spit you are sadly mistaken. And anyways if your teams are so ****ing good with such top tier talent why don't all your Canadian universities start powerhouse football teams? That seems to be the theme of this thread... That Candian football talent is so ****ing good except all American football coaches hate Canadians and refuse to give them scholarships.

Then I notice you attack njx which is completely uncalled for. Honestly Billingsley, do you take into account that no one ****ing cares if Canadians have to pay lots of money to go to an AMERICAN university. Awww boohoo some Canadian football player can't get a scholarship to play at a big time American program. WAHHHHHH. So now "all Americans are racist against Canadian football players and it isn't because they suck, it is because they simply are from Canada." **** they don't even look different.

Get over it Canada. You have inferior football talent. Stop ****ing and complaining and stop insulting people that actually know what they are talking about. Send all of your players to the CFL where they will stay and get to play with the undrafted Americans coming out of college
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Originally Posted by njx9 View Post
....

let the flaming commence.
I won't even bother flaming with ignorant posts like this one above, they're not worth my time. It was very difficult to contain myself from personally attacking this "person", so let's leave it at that.
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:39 PM    (permalink
PeterWarrick9
 
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Sorry, if I am really making you mad etk. I am trying to you know start a debate. I have seen a lot of Canadian players play and there are some damn good ones.

I just cannot see a recruiter sayin know because they are Canadian. My back up, Brett Romberg. He had no trouble of making it to the U. Now if he walked on to the U, I will admit my mistake for bringing him up.

Born Brett Christopher Romberg in Windsor, Ontario, Canada...Canadian Junior Football League Offensive Lineman of the Year as senior at Belle River High in Windsor...active in community while with Jacksonville, making school visits, participating in charity golf tournaments, helping deliver turkeys to local soup kitchens and homeless shelters, and supporting team community initiatives...married to Emily.

http://www.stlouisrams.com/team/players/57074/
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Old 07-12-2007, 07:55 PM    (permalink
etk
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Originally Posted by PeterWarrick9 View Post
Sorry, I can't believe this. A recruiters main objective is to build the best team possible, regardless if he is from South Dakota, Arizona, or Canada. I can't say a person residence overrides his abilities.

What about Daryn Colledge or Mark Schlereth? I have alot more respect for a Canadian team than a Alaskan team. Yet Colledge went to a D1 program in Boise State and Mark to Idaho. Once again, Idaho is not a powerhouse but definitely better than some JUCO school.

Gaines Adams played 8 man football. I think that is totally different than 11 man football we are used to here in USA/Canada. (I do gotta admit that I can't say that I have ever seen an 8 man football game.)

How did Brett Romberg go play for the U? A Canadian playing for the powerhouse Hurricanes. Josh Bourke played for Grand Valley State, albeit a D2 program, but GVSU has been one hell of a team in D2.

For you Canadians, I say just play in your own college football system, go to the CFL. If you are good enough, I am sure that recruited will add you
I'm not mad at you, your post has some sensibility to it.

I agree that a recruiter's main objective is building a team of talent, but that makes it even more appalling that some of the aforementioned players in the thread didn't get offers. Many could argue that there were extraordinary circumstances that prevented some Canadians from "making it", but eventually one has to look at the quantity of talented Canadians without scholarships and wonder "Maybe they tried their best and discrimination was a factor". Like Billingsley said, many American scouts will laugh at you and walk away when you say you're from a Canadian High School. It's a serious problem. Most talented basketball players from Canada that I know of managed to get American scholarship offers, so how come this problem really exists in football almost exclusively. American hockey players aren't discriminated against by Canadians.

Gaines Adams is American.
On a typical scale: American + athletic ability=full scholarship, pending on grades meeting requirments. Canadian + sub 4.4 40 + A average + good SAT + standout tape=full scholarship to a good 1AA school...

You use the example of Romberg, which is fine (he wasn't the only Canadian on their OLine), but there are many more big, strong athletic linemen where that came from. Using a few rare exceptions of Canadians making it to "big programs" does not change the fact that players with even more talent and potential, like Matt Adetuyi, Justene Edwards, Jamaal George, etc. probably will end up falling off the map or dominating CIS play.

I plan on going through the CIS system and wouldn't strongly pursue American football myself, mainly because my body type and skill set suit my specific position which does not exist in America.

Edit: If this is considered flaming, I apologize in advance
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Old 07-12-2007, 08:06 PM    (permalink
Billingsley26
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Originally Posted by VY10 View Post
Honestly Billingsley26 do you think before you write things!
Congradu****lations Canada has all of the "elite" football coaches. Considering I have never heard of any of the teams you mentioned I don't know how they would fair against Hoover High who ACTUALLY produces NCAA talent. **** Hoover even has its own TV show in the states. I'm pretty sure teams like Southlake Carroll and any highschool powerhouse would love to get behind and mount any team in Canada. If you think for one second that any football program in Canada is worth warm spit you are sadly mistaken. And anyways if your teams are so ****ing good with such top tier talent why don't all your Canadian universities start powerhouse football teams? That seems to be the theme of this thread... That Candian football talent is so ****ing good except all American football coaches hate Canadians and refuse to give them scholarships.

Then I notice you attack njx which is completely uncalled for. Honestly Billingsley, do you take into account that no one ****ing cares if Canadians have to pay lots of money to go to an AMERICAN university. Awww boohoo some Canadian football player can't get a scholarship to play at a big time American program. WAHHHHHH. So now "all Americans are racist against Canadian football players and it isn't because they suck, it is because they simply are from Canada." **** they don't even look different.

Get over it Canada. You have inferior football talent. Stop ****ing and complaining and stop insulting people that actually know what they are talking about. Send all of your players to the CFL where they will stay and get to play with the undrafted Americans coming out of college

WOW! VY10, I have lost all respect I ever had for you!!!! You are arguing and being a big baby over something that wasnt even brought up in this arguement between myself and njx9. We were arguing over different opportunities one could have, and he brought up the fact of walking on to a team but......enough of you. Honestly like etk said, this is ignorance at its FINEST! Im done talking about this with you, read all the posts and udnerstand.

Oh BTW, its very understandable that you dont know who St. Mikes, or St. Andrews or Lorne Park are.....YOU LIVE 5000 MILES AWAY YOU DUMBASS!
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