LOST Discussion

[Whistler6]

Originally Posted by adschofield

Easily the worst episode of the season.

Is anyone actually enjoying this? Because honestly at this point, I just want all my questions answered.

The movie Adaptation...It's a parody of the ridiculousness of Hollywood. A man, Charlie Kaufman, attempts to write a screenplay based solely on the beauty of flowers void of ALL the recycled Hollywood cliches.

But it's not until he adds sex, drugs, and murder to his script that both his script and the movie itself takes off. "Wow them with a big-ending and all is forgiven" says the guy who is known for his successful scripts that have been sold and made into movies.

I'm seeing too many similarities here. The LOST creators are going so crazy, so out-of-the-box, that I can't help but feel like they are trying to end with a massive "Wow" including all the build up in an attempt to grasp for every possible viewer before the ending inevitably implodes.

I think they are in way over their head, and have conceded to try and symbolize every possible aspect within the show to completely baffle us...So in the end, we might actually think, "Woah all of that really actually meant something significant."

...Or does it turn out to be Law Abiding Citizen? God help me.

[Xiomera]

This episode left a lot of things ambiguous and abstract, but I thought it was good.

I don't know what you guys are bitching about.

[iowatreat54]

Originally Posted by Shane P. Hallam

The light will get fleshed out a bit more I imagine, may not be what you want though. In this faith vs. science arc, the light will be on both sides. It will be the power the island has and how special it is on one end, and the electromagnetisim on the other end. May not get much past that.

Probably won't get much to the second piece, I don't think that is needed, at least for me.


And Nick Mangold liked the episode, that is all I care about.

So you're just happy knowing that "the light" is just powerful and turned MIB into smokey?

It's fine if you do, but to me, that's an incredibly weak explanation and is a giant cop out. I'm fine with "the light" being the driving force behind the island, and being left up to interpretation what it is/stands for. But what does that have to do with turning someone into a smoke monster? It doesn't fit. If you are going to have it change someone, by what is for all intents and purposes essentially "magic", why into smoke? At least explain that. Idc if they don't explain how it happens or why, just why is it smoke. At least give us that. If not, it just makes absolutely no sense to a pretty huge piece of the story.

[Shane P. Hallam]

Originally Posted by Whistler6

Is anyone actually enjoying this? Because honestly at this point, I just want all my questions answered.

The movie Adaptation...It's a parody of the ridiculousness of Hollywood. A man, Charlie Kaufman, attempts to write a screenplay based solely on the beauty of flowers void of ALL the recycled Hollywood cliches.

But it's not until he adds sex, drugs, and murder to his script that both his script and the movie itself takes off. "Wow them with a big-ending and all is forgiven" says the guy who is known for his successful scripts that have been sold and made into movies.

I'm seeing too many similarities here. The LOST creators are going so crazy, so out-of-the-box, that I can't help but feel like they are trying to end with a massive "Wow" including all the build up in an attempt to grasp for every possible viewer.

I know, they are so out of the box now. This bright light is so crazy compared to the time travel and polar bears!

Honestly, this is LOST. This has always been LOST. This will be LOST for the last 3 and a half episodes remaining. As Carleton said about tonight's episode: "This is how we give answers."

[Xiomera]

There are 3.5 hours left of LOST. More things will be explained. We can criticize it after we know that it won't answer all of our major qualms.

[Shane P. Hallam]

Originally Posted by iowatreat54

So you're just happy knowing that "the light" is just powerful and turned MIB into smokey?

It's fine if you do, but to me, that's an incredibly weak explanation and is a giant cop out. I'm fine with "the light" being the driving force behind the island, and being left up to interpretation what it is/stands for. But what does that have to do with turning someone into a smoke monster? It doesn't fit. If you are going to have it change someone, by what is for all intents and purposes essentially "magic", why into smoke? At least explain that. Idc if they don't explain how it happens or why, just why is it smoke. At least give us that. If not, it just makes absolutely no sense to a pretty huge piece of the story.

*shrug* Just me. I don't need every detail and I care more about the character arcs and how that plays out than the explanation of why smoke. It'd be nice, but I have bigger fish to fry than the Hurley bird and glass eye.

We'll get something though, some at least partial hint of why the smoke and why the ash stops him. There is still a very slim piece of the puzzle that will be inserted.

[iowatreat54]

Originally Posted by Shane P. Hallam

*shrug* Just me. I don't need every detail and I care more about the character arcs and how that plays out than the explanation of why smoke. It'd be nice, but I have bigger fish to fry than the Hurley bird and glass eye.

We'll get something though, some at least partial hint of why the smoke and why the ash stops him. There is still a very slim piece of the puzzle that will be inserted.

Right. If we get at least something about why smoke, why things stop him, etc. then idc about how he changed. Just why smoke of all things.

I guess I'm just worried because while yes we have 3 amazing hours left, we only have 3 hours left. We still don't know exactly what the light is (which is ok), why it's there (maybe ok?), how Allison Janney got there in the first place, what "power" she had that she passes to Jacob/MIB (like how they live so long, can't hurt eachother, etc.). All this in addition to the main story and all it's questions. Do I think they can take care of everything they need to, while making it good and not telling everything in black and white? Absolutely. But I'm just worried that they are trying to do too much and overlooking things.

[adschofield]

The reason why I'm complaining is that the season that claims to "have all answers," just spewed ambiguous, vague ******** for the past hour during an episode that was supposed to answer a lot of questions. Seriously? The light's "powerful"? ****, I could have told you that before the episode started.

[B-Dawk]

is the finale all new content and no silly look back time?

[Xiomera]

Originally Posted by B-Dawk

is the finale all new content and no silly look back time?

There is 2.5 hours of new show from 9 to 11:30 pm et on May 23rd.

From 7 to 9 that night, it's a full series recap to refresh everyone's memory one final time.

[iowatreat54]

Originally Posted by Xiomera

There is 2.5 hours of new show from 9 to 11:30 pm et on May 23rd.

From 7 to 9 that night, it's a full series recap to refresh everyone's memory one final time.

Well, there goes 4.5 hours of my night. I'll get home from work at like 5:55 CT, so perfect.

[Brown Leader]

Originally Posted by Shane P. Hallam

The light will get fleshed out a bit more I imagine, may not be what you want though. In this faith vs. science arc, the light will be on both sides. It will be the power the island has and how special it is on one end, and the electromagnetisim on the other end. May not get much past that.

Probably won't get much to the second piece, I don't think that is needed, at least for me.


And Nick Mangold liked the episode, that is all I care about.

My guess-The light-It's Gaia, the soul of the Earth-who's seen Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within? Water flowing to it is the water of life-grants immortality. Falling into the heart of the Earth incinerates you but the water gives you everlasting life = smoke monster? I liked that episode too-maby it's an artist thing.;) Explained well what the motivation of each is and how the others and castaways factor in. I agree the faith vs science arc seems key-it's like Shyamalan's do you choose to see signs or coincidences.

What's interesting is this notion that she thought she was righteous or good-that's complete ********. It's been said before but it makes the good vs evil ambiguous and left up to the choices you make.

[Jughead10]

Originally Posted by Jughead10

So I'm wondering how long MIB in smoke monster form was able to use his "original" body. Last time we saw him as his original form was when Ricahrd landed on the island. I suppose eventually his and his adopted mother's body decomposed to skeletons and then he was no longer able to use it?

Any thoughts about this?

[McGahee]

Anyone else think that their mom (the one that raised them, NOT the birth mother) was initially the smoke monster. She seemed to know everything (i.e., about MIB's board game), and killed others without thinking twice. It seems like she had a plan all along to raise Jacob and MiB and somehow try to get one of them to throw the other into that pot of gold to have their soul enslaved as the next smoke monster, freeing herself. Hence her saying 'thank you' when MiB killed her.

How else did she kill that whole village of people? How else would she know if 'anyone else is on the island' when the pregnant woman asked? How else would she get into the well without any of the villagers stopping her?

Why did she know where the well was? Maybe because that is where SHE came from. We never did learn where she came from.

[iowatreat54]

Originally Posted by McGahee

Anyone else think that their mom (the one that raised them, NOT the birth mother) was initially the smoke monster. She seemed to know everything (i.e., about MIB's board game), and killed others without thinking twice. It seems like she had a plan all along to raise Jacob and MiB and somehow try to get one of them to throw the other into that pot of gold to have their soul enslaved as the next smoke monster, freeing herself. Hence her saying 'thank you' when MiB killed her.

How else did she kill that whole village of people? How else would she know if 'anyone else is on the island' when the pregnant woman asked? How else would she get into the well without any of the villagers stopping her?

Why did she know where the well was? Maybe because that is where SHE came from. We never did learn where she came from.

This is very interesting.

I was also wondering how she somehow completely demolished/imploded the well. As well as how she torched the whole village/killed all those people. There's no way she could have done all those things just as a single person...

And especially since she seemed to favor MIB, called him special, etc. Maybe she was grooming him to take her place? Maybe you have to be forced into the light to turn to smokey, but if you go by yourself it's not the same. But then idk why she would get all upset over MIB's decisions and what not. Unless she is incredibly manipulative and always plotting, which it seems smoke monster constantly does. Hmmm very interesting.

[Brown Leader]

Originally Posted by iowatreat54

This is very interesting.

I was also wondering how she somehow completely demolished/imploded the well. As well as how she torched the whole village/killed all those people. There's no way she could have done all those things just as a single person...

Yea MACGAHEE HAD A great point. And maby why she loved him more?

[eaglesalltheway]

Originally Posted by McGahee

Anyone else think that their mom (the one that raised them, NOT the birth mother) was initially the smoke monster. She seemed to know everything (i.e., about MIB's board game), and killed others without thinking twice. It seems like she had a plan all along to raise Jacob and MiB and somehow try to get one of them to throw the other into that pot of gold to have their soul enslaved as the next smoke monster, freeing herself. Hence her saying 'thank you' when MiB killed her.

How else did she kill that whole village of people? How else would she know if 'anyone else is on the island' when the pregnant woman asked? How else would she get into the well without any of the villagers stopping her?

Why did she know where the well was? Maybe because that is where SHE came from. We never did learn where she came from.

That is the only thing that I have a real major issue with. As far as why smoke, I don't really care why smoke, but would like to know (and why ash stops him) but would live if those things aren't answered. Though I think Brown Leader may have found a possible legit explanation.

[McGahee]

Who's brown leader?

To add to the mother-smoke monster theory. When Jacob and MiB were fighting, she found them and showed up just like that. How did she know where they were/get there so fast?

[Brown Leader]

Originally Posted by Jughead10

Any thoughts about this?

I think he's been ghost form since becoming smoke-until he jumped into Locke.

Originally Posted by McGahee

Who's brown leader?

...don't know the the GOAT and I?. lol

[Jvig43]

I thought I knew what was going on, and no I have no clue. And yes, this episode was very disappointing, especially for an episode like this one which should have answered more questions and held more significance.

[Whistler6]

Alan Sepinwall is an absolutely fantastic writer. His review of tonight's LOST is brilliant. I don't toss those words around a lot, but Sepinwall is worthy. Either he's incredibly smart, or I'm much dumber than I thought. Or both... Worth checking out.

When you answer a question, you take away the suspense that comes from waiting for that answer, but you also rob that question of its power over the listener.

After years of watching characters suffer at the hands of neglectful, abusive or downright homicidal fathers and father figures, we discover that the "Lost" mythology is ultimately fueled by mommy issues - by one son betrayed to learn that who he thought was his mother murdered the real one, and by another who never got over the belief that mom always liked Smokey best.

This one I just liked, because it's so true. Here's the rest:

http://www.hitfix.com/blogs/whats-al...sed-by-another

[gpngc]

I completely accept the Magic Light. If you're a man of science, it is a pocket of electromagnetism with properties yet to be discovered or understood by men. If you're a man of faith, it's special/magic. Either way, it explains why the Island is so crazy.

My questions are:

-Why did "Mother" (I swear I kept hearing Buster from Arrested) say "Thank You" when Brother killed her?

-Is Brother really the entity inhabiting Locke's body in present day or is the Smoke Monster an entity of it's own that just needed a body to be released from the Light?

-Assuming that Brother (MIB) is actually the Smoke Monster/Flocke, why can't he leave? Why didn't he work with the DI or the Others to get off the Island? Is he inherently evil? Why did Mother seem to only make the decision to kill the biological mother of the twin boys AFTER Brother was born?

-Did anyone else notice that the scene where Mother knocked out Brother he was moving the rocks with his knife and it made the EXACT same sound we hear with the Smoke Monster.

AHHH crazy stuff.

[Shiver]

Remember guys, they aren't going to explain things in too a way that is too literal. They don't want to give Lost its own "midi-chlorian" moment. I totally respect that. However, they are a few fundamentals that need to be ironed out. I tend to think the finale will give us the major ones, but if your expecting everything to be laid out then I wouldn't suggest holding your own breath. A little more clarity on a few things is all I want or expect, but all the little tidbits and things being put into context made this a good episode (no Ab Aeterno or The Constant obviously) in my opinion. I especially like how they are tying in things from Season 1: Locke seeing "the Island" as a bright light, the fact that the smoke monster, mother, and the game all were included from the beginning, for example.

[sbh15]

that episode was decent, but really really disappointing

[Shiver]

Interesting idea:

Can someone with a better sense of Craphole Island topography tell me if the golden spring is supposed to lie in the same location where The Others built the Temple? Given what the water did to Smokey, it doesn't seem like the sort of healing pool Dogen and Lennon talked about, but it seems odd that one mystical island would have two entirely unrelated pools of yellow, magical water, no?