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Old 05-18-2010, 04:38 PM    (permalink
RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES
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Come one Wizards need a top 2 pick. We are desperate.
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Originally Posted by Metsox
mo drew gets about 16 touches a game on offense (on a good day), and will run circles around ray rice. rice has no speed, 2nd burst or agility. he's a strong midget. How can anyone be excited about that.
John Wall
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Old 05-18-2010, 05:02 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by yo123 View Post
You kind of contradicted yourself there when you said he has a bust factor but at the very least will be solid. I think he's a very safe pick, he's way too skilled and has to much of a well rounded game to just flat out bust. His ceiling is Brandon Roy (without the injuries) which is damn good. I'd still take Wall because he has the potential to be the best at his position which I don't think Turner has but I wouldn't be too upset if we passed on Wall for him. We've certainly done dumber.
Well you're not drafting a player #2 overall to be solid, so I don't see the contradiction to be honest. By bust I meant more relative to draft position than Vernon Gholston-ing and doing absolutely nothing. Would you say Michael Beasley is a bust? Maybe you wouldn't but I would and he's no more than solid.

Brandon Roy is a nice ceiling, but not a massive one. Roy himself went what, #6? Turner isn't a great athlete or a great shooter, he's got nice size and can do a lot of stuff on the basketball court. But the rebounding and assist numbers probably aren't going to translate, and he's going to have a hard time scoring at the same rate he did in college against NBA athletes without great athleticism or shooting. Like I said he could, even should be a good player, but I think he could just be mediocre also and that isn't really a common opinion on him. Kind of similar to James Harden only a little more skilled overall and not as good of a shooter. Just strikes me as the type who could be a better college player than pro despite not really fitting any of the typical molds for that. I don't think all his skills translate, and he's going to have to land with a team that's going to have him on the ball a lot too.

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Old 05-18-2010, 05:15 PM    (permalink
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Well you're not drafting a player #2 overall to be solid, so I don't see the contradiction to be honest. By bust I meant more relative to draft position than Vernon Gholston-ing and doing absolutely nothing. Would you say Michael Beasley is a bust? Maybe you wouldn't but I would and he's no more than solid.

Brandon Roy is a nice ceiling, but not a massive one. Roy himself went what, #6? Turner isn't a great athlete or a great shooter, he's got nice size and can do a lot of stuff on the basketball court. But the rebounding and assist numbers probably aren't going to translate, and he's going to have a hard time scoring at the same rate he did in college against NBA athletes without great athleticism or shooting. Like I said he could, even should be a good player, but I think he could just be mediocre also and that isn't really a common opinion on him. Kind of similar to James Harden only a little more skilled overall and not as good of a shooter. Just strikes me as the type who could be a better college player than pro despite not really fitting any of the typical molds for that. I don't think all his skills translate, and he's going to have to land with a team that's going to have him on the ball a lot too.

Roy was taken 6th but if they did that draft over he would be the easy choice at #1 or #2 behind Rondo. Also on his shooting he doesn't have the long range jumper down but his mid range game is outstanding, and he is crafty enough to get his shot off despite his athleticism, which I would actually say is a little underrated. His vertical isn't anything special but he's deceptively quick and has a good first step. Roy really isn't anything special athletically either.
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Old 05-18-2010, 05:29 PM    (permalink
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Dear NBA Gods,

Please let the Raptors win the lottery. PLEASE.

That is all
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Old 05-18-2010, 05:31 PM    (permalink
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Roy never had great potential, and he's close to his ceiling. He's still the best player from that class, and it isn't close.
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Old 05-18-2010, 05:45 PM    (permalink
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Roy never had great potential, and he's close to his ceiling. He's still the best player from that class, and it isn't close.


Itís close.
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Old 05-18-2010, 05:49 PM    (permalink
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Not even close. Rondo benefits greatly from simply the threat of the big 3. He'll never be a number 1 scorer.

Brandon Roy is a top 10 player in basketball. The complete game offensively. Can play 3 positions. Has probably the best BBall IQ of any guy drafted in the past 5 years. He's an elite talent. Rondo is a good not great player.
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Old 05-18-2010, 05:52 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by EvilNixon View Post
Not even close. Rondo benefits greatly from simply the threat of the big 3. He'll never be a number 1 scorer.

Brandon Roy is a top 10 player in basketball. The complete game offensively. Can play 3 positions. Has probably the best BBall IQ of any guy drafted in the past 5 years. He's an elite talent. Rondo is a good not great player.


Since when do you have to be a number 1 scorer to be a great player? That's not his game. And it's hardly a big three anymore.

I agree that Roy is better but Rondo is on the verge of becoming maybe a top 3 PG.
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Old 05-18-2010, 06:03 PM    (permalink
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I love Rondo it's crazy to me how good he is and the fact that he does have a ring, Chris Paul is really dope too but he's coming off an injury he has some question marks

as for top 3 PG in the NBA I would go

1. Deron Williams
2. Rajon Rando
3. Chris Paul
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Old 05-18-2010, 06:06 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by KCJ58 View Post
I love Rondo it's crazy to me how good he is and the fact that he does have a ring, Chris Paul is really dope too but he's coming off an injury he has some question marks

as for top 3 PG in the NBA I would go

1. Deron Williams
2. Rajon Rando
3. Chris Paul
Woah, Rondo over CP3?

1. Deron Williams
2. Chris Paul
3. Rajon Rondo
4. Steve Nash
5. Derrick Rose

CP3 would be number 1 if it wasnít for his injury plagued season IMO.
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Old 05-18-2010, 06:08 PM    (permalink
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This is exactly what they were referring to. It puts too much power in the hands of the player, when the draft is supposed to help the teams that are lacking talent. If it were like you are saying, the Knicks and Celtics would offer other incentives for players to openly refuse to sign with the crappy teams. It would just create too much trouble and the point of the draft wouldn't be met.
What other incentives could NBA teams offer? They shouldn't be able pay more than the draft slot is allocated.
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Old 05-18-2010, 06:25 PM    (permalink
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I agree that the draft needs to do away with one and dones and work the same way as baseball. But if they're going to do that, they need a better minor league system than just the D-League, since the talent pool will be much larger. They can still use a slot system, but give a little more (but not much) leeway for a signing bonus, instead of having it set in stone. With high schoolers allowed to sign, the athletes who go to college, do so because they actually want to. They would have to play in college for at least 2 years though. The slotting system is so the low market teams don't draft for if they can sign the player, instead of how good he is.
I would expand the draft to 5 rounds, have a AA and AAA team. Enough players will be there as long as they love the game and there is a steady paycheck with it.
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Old 05-18-2010, 06:27 PM    (permalink
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Roy was taken 6th but if they did that draft over he would be the easy choice at #1 or #2 behind Rondo. Also on his shooting he doesn't have the long range jumper down but his mid range game is outstanding, and he is crafty enough to get his shot off despite his athleticism, which I would actually say is a little underrated. His vertical isn't anything special but he's deceptively quick and has a good first step. Roy really isn't anything special athletically either.
Well if we're going to focus on Roy, while Roy is a very talented NBA player having him as an absolute best case scenario isn't a great ceiling. If a player with a ceiling of Brandon Roy (namely, Brandon Roy) and a pretty high floor was drafted #6 overall in what was not the strongest draft as you pointed out, Turner doesn't have ridiculous upside. I would also say Roy is a superior shooter, and a pretty good athlete.

Not like I'm saying Turner isn't going to succeed in the NBA. He's a very good basketball player who brings a lot of skills to the table. I'm just not sure I see him being such a high level player. The one area were Turner stands out in terms of what he can bring to an NBA squad is his versatility, and those kinds of players can tend to be mediocre if they don't have high level NBA skills in a lot of areas. Turner's going to have to do most of his scoring inside the arc despite being a less than ideal athlete and probably won't be able to get the same kind of assist and rebound numbers at the 2 in the NBA with superior athletes and other players who will dominate the ball (in all likelihood). If he continues to improve he could be a very, very good player but I'm just not seeing what skill besides ball handling and versatility really sticks out big time for him right now and think he's got some question marks surrounding him and isn't as safe a pick as everyone thinks. Sometimes safe picks who were great in college (Beasley and Harden continue to be the examples who come to mind) just don't have tremendous success in the NBA, and I wonder if Turner is going to be that kind of player as well.
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Old 05-18-2010, 06:47 PM    (permalink
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Since when do you have to be a number 1 scorer to be a great player? That's not his game. And it's hardly a big three anymore.

I agree that Roy is better but Rondo is on the verge of becoming maybe a top 3 PG.
Rondo is a good player, but he's not a great player. Brandon Roy is a great player. Roy has no flaws in his game. Can you say the same for Rondo?
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Old 05-18-2010, 06:51 PM    (permalink
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Rondo is a good player, but he's not a great player. Brandon Roy is a great player. Roy has no flaws in his game. Can you say the same for Rondo?
Overall this "statement" is right as far as Roy being better than Rondo. Rondo is on his way to being a great player, and Roy does have flaws (always seems to be hurt/playing hurt, not known for his defense). Rondo is on the rise and is a pass first point guard but has shown he can score and rebound, to start a franchise you can personally give me Rondo at this point.
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Coples is that dude.
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:00 PM    (permalink
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i am so ******* nervous right now. everyone here bitching about how they need a top 3 pick...shut up, we won 12 games last season and were only in the news because we were almost the worst team in history.

only wolves fans can complain with me, they won what? 16 games?
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BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:01 PM    (permalink
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UGHHH lets get this started!!! First time I've been excited for the Wizards all year.
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:25 PM    (permalink
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GS having the 6th pick? FML!!!!!!
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:26 PM    (permalink
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Wall is a very nice building block for the Wiz. Arenas has to go now right?
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:28 PM    (permalink
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Wall is a very nice building block for the Wiz. Arenas has to go now right?
If someone will take him. I honestly think that a big name FA might come to us now.
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:30 PM    (permalink
yo123
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i am so ******* nervous right now. everyone here bitching about how they need a top 3 pick...shut up, we won 12 games last season and were only in the news because we were almost the worst team in history.

only wolves fans can complain with me, they won what? 16 games?


15. At least you guys don't suck dick at drafting. Not only are we not getting Wall or Turner but we're going to draft an epic bust like Al Farouq Aminu at #4. **** this sport.
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:32 PM    (permalink
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We need to give the 30th pick to a team to take on Arenas's contract. Then LBJ and Bosh can come play with King Wall!!!
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:33 PM    (permalink
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15. At least you guys don't suck dick at drafting. Not only are we not getting Wall or Turner but we're going to draft an epic bust like Al Farouq Aminu at #4. **** this sport.
yea **** this system hard. we should be getting wall, you should be getting turner and everyone is happy. but noooo. we'll probably get favors. who i like and has to replace Yi...but are you ******** me?
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BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:34 PM    (permalink
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Getting 4th isn't that big of a deal for Minnesota. Turner, Favors, or Johnson all would have been fine. They need a swing man, and they can get a good one at 4.
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Old 05-18-2010, 07:37 PM    (permalink
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It's a huge deal. There are two players in this draft who have the ability to be superstars, and we're missing out on both. Wesley Johnson has a Rudy *** type ceiling and Derrick Favors has no post moves and is just a power guy right now. Same goes for Cousins.
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