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View Poll Results: Is Channing Frye the most influential NBA PLAYER EVER?
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:23 AM    (permalink
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Dominic James was so awesome, he just couldn't stay healthy.

Kinda pissed about that too, because I met him once and it would be cool to have been able to say I had like a 10 minute conversation with an NBA player.
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Old 12-06-2010, 11:36 AM    (permalink
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I wasn't just referring to FG%. Paul is better from 3 point land (smaller sample size though), as well as shooting 91% from the free throw line. Also, Deron averages 3 more minutes than Paul, which doesn't seem like much, but could easily help close the scoring gap.

And yes, it is debatable who is the better player.
That was the whole point of my previous post. You were saying Deron was better. I was saying that's not really true because they're both pretty equal and a case can be made for either.

I also don't know how being considered the best or second best PG in the league for the past several years constitutes being underrated, but okay.

In regards to your other post about "winning" as being the most important aspect for a point guard...well, that's weak. But it's a pretty weak argument in any sport. A team oriented stat like winning is just that...team based. I don't care how good Paul and Deron are, they can't win by themselves. But up until this point, Deron has always had much better players to play with.
That was the entire point of his post too. He was saying that Paul wasn't clearly better, and presented reasons why you could argue for Deron too in reply to a statement that Paul is better than D-Will. You misinterpreted him saying that Deron outplays Paul head to head - not overall.
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Old 12-06-2010, 11:45 AM    (permalink
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cp3 and dwill wish they could pass like Nash
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Old 12-06-2010, 11:46 AM    (permalink
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That was the entire point of his post too. He was saying that Paul wasn't clearly better, and presented reasons why you could argue for Deron too in reply to a statement that Paul is better than D-Will. You misinterpreted him saying that Deron outplays Paul head to head - not overall.
I know what he was saying, but most of his post seemed to infer Deron was better, which Sweetness himself admits he's bias on.

I just think most of his reasons for Deron being better were weak in general. Being a winner? Being a floor general? To me those aren't really definable, nor can they be significantly or fairly measured, so using them to compare between two players is pretty shaky.
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Old 12-06-2010, 12:05 PM    (permalink
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Interesting week in fantasy for me.





We you go with the tank FT% it is pretty amazing how it can be 20 points lower than another team.
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Old 12-06-2010, 03:47 PM    (permalink
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The Pats-Jets bore me. So I am going to Bucks-Heat tonight! Lets go Heat!
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Old 12-06-2010, 03:54 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Forenci View Post
I know what he was saying, but most of his post seemed to infer Deron was better, which Sweetness himself admits he's bias on.

I just think most of his reasons for Deron being better were weak in general. Being a winner? Being a floor general? To me those aren't really definable, nor can they be significantly or fairly measured, so using them to compare between two players is pretty shaky.
Even if I did say he was better how is that any different? It can be argued and debated. Paul is very good, but so is Deron. They remain 1A and 1B.

My post was mainly directed at yo who said that Paul was clearly the best PG in the league, which is IMO false.

Most of my reasons are shaky? Paul is a ball dominant player, whereas Deron is more of an orchestrator. His intangibles are top notch, whereas I question this area with Paul. Intangibles aren't really definable, but they are important. Paul is the better playmaker, passer and for his career has posted better offensive numbers in terms of efficiency. He also averages more steals and rebounds than Deron. I question Paul's leadership and mettle though.

Winning isn't about solely about stats. It's also about doing the little things. Some guys just have a knack for winning games and Deron is one of them. Has he had help? Sure, but there isn't a player in the history of the game that has won by himself.

This is a debate that will likely rage on for the duration of their careers (until Rose takes both of them over). :D
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Old 12-06-2010, 04:00 PM    (permalink
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Or until Ricky Rubio takes them both over :)
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Old 12-06-2010, 04:09 PM    (permalink
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Too bad Ricky Rubio sucks.
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Old 12-06-2010, 04:10 PM    (permalink
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Too bad Ricky Rubio sucks.
U watch ur mouth about the Roobster!
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Old 12-06-2010, 04:18 PM    (permalink
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Or until Ricky Rubio takes them both over :)
For the Knicks.
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Old 12-06-2010, 04:19 PM    (permalink
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Even if I did say he was better how is that any different? It can be argued and debated. Paul is very good, but so is Deron. They remain 1A and 1B.

My post was mainly directed at yo who said that Paul was clearly the best PG in the league, which is IMO false.

Most of my reasons are shaky? Paul is a ball dominant player, whereas Deron is more of an orchestrator. His intangibles are top notch, whereas I question this area with Paul. Intangibles aren't really definable, but they are important. Paul is the better playmaker, passer and for his career has posted better offensive numbers in terms of efficiency. He also averages more steals and rebounds than Deron. I question Paul's leadership and mettle though.

Winning isn't about solely about stats. It's also about doing the little things. Some guys just have a knack for winning games and Deron is one of them. Has he had help? Sure, but there isn't a player in the history of the game that has won by himself.

This is a debate that will likely rage on for the duration of their careers (until Rose takes both of them over). :D
Fair enough. I'd argue Paul is just as much of a leader as Deron is, but again, it's really impossible to quantify.

I personally have gone back and forth on who I think is the better PG, but Paul is currently the best in league by a slim margin, imo. He scores so efficiently, has improved his outside game, his steal numbers are absurdly good, and he never turns the ball over. Plus I think he's a fiery leader and is tough/strong for being a rather small guy.

I do like Deron's ability off the ball and his size more, though, among other qualities you've mentioned.

There isn't a right or wrong though because they're closely matched. It's not like arguing between Deron/Paul and Rose/Westbrook right now, because most people know the former two are better as it stands.
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Old 12-06-2010, 05:58 PM    (permalink
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Too bad Ricky Rubio sucks.
Hey now, he'll be an above average player and you know it! If nothing else, he can't be any worse than Luke Ridnour.
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Old 12-06-2010, 06:11 PM    (permalink
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Hey now, he'll be an above average player and you know it! If nothing else, he can't be any worse than Luke Ridnour.
You'll be surprised at how little he's grown in the last couple of years. He's not a good defender or shooter at this point.
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Old 12-06-2010, 06:14 PM    (permalink
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You'll be surprised at how little he's grown in the last couple of years. He's not a good defender or shooter at this point.
Sadly, I've seen a couple of Barcelona's games this year and for the most part I agree. Also, he's one of the most passive players I've ever seen, especially for all the hype he's gotten. Oh well, the Wolves' backcourt situation really can't get any worse. I'm really just hoping for Irving in the upcoming draft.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:28 PM    (permalink
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Westbrook and Rose are playing each other to a stalemate and not in a good way LOL. Both are guarding each other extremely well and they are having bad shooting nights.

Brooks took out Durant for 8 minutes in the 3rd for an unknown reason. Boozer's having a pretty beastly night. Good to see him playing well in only his 4th game back.

Oh and Kevin Love rocks my socks off.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:31 PM    (permalink
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Heat beat the Bucks by 10, Wade with a career high 14 rebounds (and 25 pts, 5 asts), 16/12 for Bosh.
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Old 12-06-2010, 09:33 PM    (permalink
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Sadly, I've seen a couple of Barcelona's games this year and for the most part I agree. Also, he's one of the most passive players I've ever seen, especially for all the hype he's gotten. Oh well, the Wolves' backcourt situation really can't get any worse. I'm really just hoping for Irving in the upcoming draft.
I've got a friend that's been teaching in Barcelona and he told me that Rubio has been lighting it up.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:21 PM    (permalink
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I wonder how long before Kevin Love says "Enough of this ****, I want out of here." I can't blame him when it happens.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:22 PM    (permalink
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I wonder how long before Kevin Love says "Enough of this ****, I want out of here." I can't blame him when it happens.
trade him to the lakers, he'll fit like a glove here
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:28 PM    (permalink
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trade him to the lakers, he'll fit like a glove here
Only if it's for Ron Artest, I'd love to see a bat **** crazy headcase contest between those two.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:30 PM    (permalink
yo123
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I wonder how long before Kevin Love says "Enough of this ****, I want out of here." I can't blame him when it happens.

I'd blame him. It's his third ****** year and we're headed in the right direction.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:33 PM    (permalink
Forenci
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Haha, it was a great game by Love and the Wolves were pretty solid in general. You can tell they've come a long way from last year, even if it isn't always transitioning into wins.

Still, Knicks had a pretty beast game. Amare continues to **** on people and Felton has been superb. Chandler is quietly having a superb year.
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:39 PM    (permalink
Vikes99ej
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I didn't see the game, but I saw Ridnour had five turnovers. I really can't wait until Flynn and Webster come back. Maybe then we can beat our first team that is over .500
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Old 12-06-2010, 10:46 PM    (permalink
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I wonder how long before Kevin Love says "Enough of this ****, I want out of here." I can't blame him when it happens.
Taj Gibson, James Johnson, and 2 firsts?
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