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Old 11-19-2007, 11:37 AM    (permalink
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The proper game to evaluate Roy will be against the Packers. If he doesnt give up any big plays against them then I guess we can all shut up.
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Old 11-19-2007, 12:11 PM    (permalink
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The proper game to evaluate Roy will be against the Packers. If he doesnt give up any big plays against them then I guess we can all shut up.
That is as arbitrary as saying because he gave up plays yesterday he is the worst of all time. Enuff is enuff, his body of work as an NFL SS is poor -- that is why he is bashed.

We used to measure Roy's worth in TFL, Fumbles and INTs .... now we say "Ooooh, great tackle for a 15 yard gain."

How far the mighty have fallen.

What he does v Greenbay will not change any right minded non-Cowboy fans' opinion.

And factually speaking, Greenbay is a WR driven system with a below average running game and non-existant TE.

So, I would not expect to see much of Roy in a positive light at all (or negative). He should be inconspicuous..... unless he gets caught in coverage...

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Old 11-19-2007, 01:33 PM    (permalink
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I really have nothing more to add about Roy other than he should not be playing in anything other than Special Teams. He does not look like a professional football player out there.

Other Observations (Negative):
1) We are not run blocking AT ALL. Especially the Tackles.
2) We played very conservatively on D.
3) Our Kickoff Coverage is going backawards
4) Tank is horrid versus the Run. Just abysmal.
5) Where were our other 3 LB this game?

Positive:
1) TO is being used deep effectively
2) Ware
3) Miles Austin looks to break one soon. Much much better than Thompson. Looks so much faster.
4) Ratliff
5) 9-1


Why is it when Austin returns kicks you can say he "looks to break one soon", you could say the same for any return man...I wouldnt say off this game he was much better then Thompson, and you could also say for Thompson that he looks 2 break one soon as well...


and as far as our pass coverage, im just curious why we didnt attack the qb, campbell has shown he will make mistakes under pressure and it seemed like we were sitting back all game, I thought we were supposed to be doing the exact opposite this year? no new packages, no confusing pre snap movement, stunts or inside blitzes, I just saw a majority of 4 man rushes with Ware playing out of his mind
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Old 11-19-2007, 01:35 PM    (permalink
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Did Tank Johnson play yesterday? I don't remember seeing him at all.
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Old 11-19-2007, 02:03 PM    (permalink
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Did Tank Johnson play yesterday? I don't remember seeing him at all.
He got in a little...Couldnt really give you a number of how many snaps he got but, it wasnt many. He was really a non-factor out there but, his assimilation has just begun.
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Old 11-19-2007, 03:25 PM    (permalink
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As always, that's just your idea. You don't know why Carpenter or Burnett don't start, maybe it's because for the coaches they're not good enough. I want to see Carpenter succeed like you, but so far he hasn't shown anything, other than that single performance against Seattle. Wade Phillips makes a great job with his LB, a lot of players had their beast season under Phillips. So there's a reason if Carpenter barely see the field.
And Bradie James hasn't been bad in coverage this year...

Yesterday we didn't give up so many pass yards because of poor coverages by James or the other LB's, it was because the WR's were wide open on the underneath routes all day.
I don't know why, but we played vanilla, we sat back and Campbell picked us apart. With the exception of the first drive, our defense wasn't bad until the Redskins had the ball with us leading 28 to 16. That drive really made me mad. We were afraid of getting beat deep, and we allowed the reskins WR's to be open in short and intermediate routes. It was sort of a prevent defense, and it sucked.
We need Anthony Henry back, Reeves can't cover the short routes...
I would disagree with your assessment of Burnett. Regarding this post and the one you made above, how has he been downright awful in coverage? He makes sure tackles and keeps his man in front of him. Sure, he hasn't gotten any interceptions but he hasn't really been given a fair shot yet. One thing I know for sure is that Burnett hasn't been fully or even partially responsible for a broken coverage that led to a TD or even a big gain. What more can you ask for? yes, he's given up some first downs but to call him awful is a far cry from what is actually going on.

Over the last 2 games, Burnett has played as much as Bradie and far more than Akin. In response to your "they would see the field if the coaches thought they were good enough comment" -- Well I think they are starting to show you that Burnett is a better player than Akin and is the best cover linebacker we have.

Give him more game experience and the plays will come. I believe we have Burnett locked up for awhile and I expect him to be a big part of this D for a while.

If you want to know where the problem is, it's with Jacque reeves and roy williams. Sure we can cover up for roy and stick him at in passing situations which is fine. But we cant cover up for Reeves and Roy, it takes away from our blitzing and that is what you saw against washington. Dware was the only one getting pressure and I dont think we ever brought more than 5. We are having to hold up to protect both of them.

Lets hope henry returns soon.
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Old 11-19-2007, 04:24 PM    (permalink
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I would disagree with your assessment of Burnett. Regarding this post and the one you made above, how has he been downright awful in coverage? He makes sure tackles and keeps his man in front of him. Sure, he hasn't gotten any interceptions but he hasn't really been given a fair shot yet. One thing I know for sure is that Burnett hasn't been fully or even partially responsible for a broken coverage that led to a TD or even a big gain. What more can you ask for? yes, he's given up some first downs but to call him awful is a far cry from what is actually going on.

Over the last 2 games, Burnett has played as much as Bradie and far more than Akin. In response to your "they would see the field if the coaches thought they were good enough comment" -- Well I think they are starting to show you that Burnett is a better player than Akin and is the best cover linebacker we have.

Give him more game experience and the plays will come. I believe we have Burnett locked up for awhile and I expect him to be a big part of this D for a while.

If you want to know where the problem is, it's with Jacque reeves and roy williams. Sure we can cover up for roy and stick him at in passing situations which is fine. But we cant cover up for Reeves and Roy, it takes away from our blitzing and that is what you saw against washington. Dware was the only one getting pressure and I dont think we ever brought more than 5. We are having to hold up to protect both of them.

Lets hope henry returns soon.
I'm curious what formations Bradie James plays that Akin Ayodele doesn't play. Because you said
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Burnett has played as much as Bradie and far more than Akin
I'm pretty sure that statement isn't true.
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Old 11-19-2007, 04:29 PM    (permalink
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He got in a little...Couldnt really give you a number of how many snaps he got but, it wasnt many. He was really a non-factor out there but, his assimilation has just begun.
Yeah well I hope that as he assimiliates, coach realizes that he needs more snaps and that he should be the starter.
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Old 11-19-2007, 05:25 PM    (permalink
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I would disagree with your assessment of Burnett. Regarding this post and the one you made above, how has he been downright awful in coverage? He makes sure tackles and keeps his man in front of him. Sure, he hasn't gotten any interceptions but he hasn't really been given a fair shot yet. One thing I know for sure is that Burnett hasn't been fully or even partially responsible for a broken coverage that led to a TD or even a big gain. What more can you ask for? yes, he's given up some first downs but to call him awful is a far cry from what is actually going on.

Over the last 2 games, Burnett has played as much as Bradie and far more than Akin. In response to your "they would see the field if the coaches thought they were good enough comment" -- Well I think they are starting to show you that Burnett is a better player than Akin and is the best cover linebacker we have.

Give him more game experience and the plays will come. I believe we have Burnett locked up for awhile and I expect him to be a big part of this D for a while.

If you want to know where the problem is, it's with Jacque reeves and roy williams. Sure we can cover up for roy and stick him at in passing situations which is fine. But we cant cover up for Reeves and Roy, it takes away from our blitzing and that is what you saw against washington. Dware was the only one getting pressure and I dont think we ever brought more than 5. We are having to hold up to protect both of them.

Lets hope henry returns soon.
I said he was awful at times, not Modano. Yes, that was being a little harsh...but, Burnett has not been great overall in coverage this year. His zone coverage is nothing to brag about. He may be the best "cover" linebacker we have but, that's not saying much. Some people on here talk about him as though he is brilliant in coverage. That's not the case. He gets beat in the middle of the field all the time. He has given up his fair share of wide open receptions in the middle of the field. Burnett has been solid against the run this season but, he's been getting beat a lot in coverage. I like him but, he seems to get too much praise for his coverage ability on here, when it is something he has not been that great at this season.
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Old 11-19-2007, 06:40 PM    (permalink
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Why is it when Austin returns kicks you can say he "looks to break one soon", you could say the same for any return man...I wouldnt say off this game he was much better then Thompson, and you could also say for Thompson that he looks 2 break one soon as well...
Because Austin seems faster into the wedge and is a "one cut" type guy. Thompson seems to juke more. But only time will tell as he gets opportunities.

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and as far as our pass coverage, im just curious why we didnt attack the qb, campbell has shown he will make mistakes under pressure and it seemed like we were sitting back all game, I thought we were supposed to be doing the exact opposite this year? no new packages, no confusing pre snap movement, stunts or inside blitzes, I just saw a majority of 4 man rushes with Ware playing out of his mind
I think WP assumed that A) Campbell could not hurt us, b) teh WR could not hurt us and c) Skins where playing with two backups at RG and RT so we would get pressure regardless.

But I was asking the same question as I saw Campbell getting in a groove.
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Old 11-19-2007, 08:11 PM    (permalink
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Yeah well I hope that as he assimiliates, coach realizes that he needs more snaps and that he should be the starter.
Tank has been bad against the run so far. Hopefully that will change as he picks things up and he has shown a little pass rush ability, but he's not even close to Ratliff right now.
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Old 11-19-2007, 08:25 PM    (permalink
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Tank has been bad against the run so far. Hopefully that will change as he picks things up and he has shown a little pass rush ability, but he's not even close to Ratliff right now.
Really? Where did his bad play stick out for you? I'm curious cause I guess I haven't paid enough attention to notice.
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Old 11-19-2007, 08:37 PM    (permalink
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Really? Where did his bad play stick out for you? I'm curious cause I guess I haven't paid enough attention to notice.
I'll admit that I don't watch him every play he's in, but whenever I do he seems to get pushed back and occassionally end up on his back. Taking a double team doesn't do as much when you get pushed back 4 yards. When he's going up against a tough lineman or a double team he needs to stick his butt up more and dig in to not give ground. I still think he has the ability to play the run in this defense, it will just take a little more time.

There's one play that sticks out in my mind where he showed his pass rush ability on Sunday and I think for the next couple weeks that's all he's going to be able to add to our defense other than giving Ratliff a breather.

It may have happened, but I can't think of one running play this year where Ratliff was pushed back 4 yards and ended up on his back.
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Old 11-19-2007, 08:39 PM    (permalink
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Tank is going to be fine...he's a stud against the run. It's going to take a while to get back on track...this is his preseason.
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Old 11-19-2007, 08:58 PM    (permalink
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I'll admit that I don't watch him every play he's in, but whenever I do he seems to get pushed back and occassionally end up on his back. Taking a double team doesn't do as much when you get pushed back 4 yards. When he's going up against a tough lineman or a double team he needs to stick his butt up more and dig in to not give ground. I still think he has the ability to play the run in this defense, it will just take a little more time.

There's one play that sticks out in my mind where he showed his pass rush ability on Sunday and I think for the next couple weeks that's all he's going to be able to add to our defense other than giving Ratliff a breather.

It may have happened, but I can't think of one running play this year where Ratliff was pushed back 4 yards and ended up on his back.
Definitely something to try to watch out for I guess. I tried looking for him on Sunday, but I didn't see him in on one single snap. Though I know he had to have been.

It may have happened, but I can't think of when, but has anyone ever seen Ratliff take on double team? ...I know he doesn't "command" one, but I'm sure there has to have been a time when the opposing offense threw one at him... right?
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Old 11-19-2007, 09:09 PM    (permalink
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Tank is going to be fine...he's a stud against the run. It's going to take a while to get back on track...this is his preseason.
I thought we were going to see more of him, especially after sacking Eli 5 times last week. We hadn't had that kind of pressure all year.

I think him not playing much and our low sack total against WAS is pretty telling. But that's just me.
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Old 11-19-2007, 09:10 PM    (permalink
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What about trying him at DE ? Ratliff is having a pretty good year at NT. Maybe a package with Tank(DE), Ratliff(NT), Canty(DE)? Just a thought.
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Old 11-19-2007, 10:01 PM    (permalink
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What about trying him at DE ? Ratliff is having a pretty good year at NT. Maybe a package with Tank(DE), Ratliff(NT), Canty(DE)? Just a thought.
Thoughts are nice... but we aren't the coaches and we can't send them memos. lol. I like it better like this: Ratliff (DE), Tank (NT), Canty (DE).
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Old 11-19-2007, 10:27 PM    (permalink
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Well the comments from the DMN Blog is he has been on the field on quite a few good runs by the opposition in the last few weeks. Read Albert Breer I think who pointed this out while praising Ratliff's play.

NT maybe the hardest position to learn. No surprise it takes years to develop one that is any good.
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Old 11-19-2007, 10:44 PM    (permalink
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I'm curious what formations Bradie James plays that Akin Ayodele doesn't play. Because you said I'm pretty sure that statement isn't true.
good point...
Well it must be because Akin doesnt do **** when he is in the game and I dont even realize he is playing. thats funny, i didn't think of that when I wrote it but Akin really is invisible. I see always see bradie around the ball and never see akin.

Either way, Burnett has been getting equal playing time over the last 2 games and its only a matter of time before he takes akin's spot.

On the stuff about him being able to cover... I wouldn't expect an LB to be able to cover a TE for extended periods of time, and against the skins we lacked pressure and forced Burnett to do exactly that. I dont blame Burnett for anything in that game. Our pass rush was weak because we were trying to hide too many players incapabilities with big cushions and vanilla coverage. People were playing man when they should of been playing zone and vice versa. Campbell had all day to throw and really didn't have to worry about anyone other than Ware. So Im not sure what you expected from him in that game.

If you look back to the giants game, he kept everything in front of him and made sure tackles. Gave up nothing big or down the middle of the field. Do you have examples of him actually getting beat? The holes in the Giants game were from shockey getting between ellis and roy, reeves and roy, james and roy, and in front of roy... There seems to be a common theme involved but whatever.

Burnett has done plenty well in coverage and has made in impact with qb hurries on the blitz and has made sure tackles in the run game. The dude should be in our base formations. There is a reason he is playing in our Pass formations -- its because he has good recognition and is good in coverage.

Last edited by Burns336 : 11-20-2007 at 01:20 AM.
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Old 11-19-2007, 10:50 PM    (permalink
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Thoughts are nice... but we aren't the coaches and we can't send them memos. lol. I like it better like this: Ratliff (DE), Tank (NT), Canty (DE).
Wade said something along the lines of being open to the Idea of moving ratliff back and forth between DE and NT and letting tank start at NT if he progressed well enough. He said he didn't know though because he didnt expect ratliff to be this good and he also said ratliff in probably the best NT at getting to the QB in the league..
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Old 11-19-2007, 11:19 PM    (permalink
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...... The holes in the Giants game were from shockey getting between ellis and roy, reeves and roy, james and roy, and in front of roy... There seems to be a common .......
Funny. True. Funny.
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Old 11-20-2007, 12:30 AM    (permalink
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Funny. True. Funny.
Funny. True. Unfixable.

Roy's contract makes him a permanent issue that we have to learn to live with.
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Old 11-20-2007, 01:16 AM    (permalink
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Funny. True. Unfixable.

Roy's contract makes him a permanent issue that we have to learn to live with.
This is true, and I agree... although the sting tends to last with me for a day or two right after a bad game. and it just bothers me that my RW jersey is the bad ass thanksgiving one and now I never even feel like wearing it.

Im trying to take your stance on the whole thing though.
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Old 11-20-2007, 01:32 AM    (permalink
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This is true, and I agree... although the sting tends to last with me for a day or two right after a bad game. and it just bothers me that my RW jersey is the bad ass thanksgiving one and now I never even feel like wearing it.

Im trying to take your stance on the whole thing though.
It's the same with every fan on every team. ...well except for maybe Patriots fans... Any time you have a weakness on the team, fans criticize the players responsible and search for a fix. Roy certainly isn't the only problem on the team, but his contract makes him an issue not worth wasting breath on.
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