Why delay it? Eli vs. Ben vs. Rivers - Page 2

steelernation77 · 02-07-2008, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CutlerChris

I'll take Eli. He deserved the SB, playing well throughout the playoffs while Ben did everything he could to lose the SB. Eli was the main staple of the offense, while both Ben and Rivers are caretakers.

Sorry but that "caretaker" or "game manager" argument for Ben is just tired BS. Ben WAS our offense this year. Yeah Parker ran for a lot of yards but his YPC was crap. Ben kept the ball moving down the field and won more than a few games pretty much by himself.

Bills2083 · 02-07-2008, 10:04 PM

Where's JP Losman? lol, j/k

1.) Eli Manning
2.) Ben Roethlisberger
3.) Philip Rivers

Santonio10 · 02-07-2008, 10:07 PM

Big ben is the best no doubt. i dont know if any of you guys recall the play when eli escaped that sack and completed that pass. The first thing that popped into my mind was wow, that looked just like Ben Roethlisberger. Ben made plays like that ALL year long behind a horrible pass blocking line. I dont think theres any question about whos the best of the three

Number 10 · 02-07-2008, 10:08 PM

Obviously I'll add more as this debate goes on for the next couple of months.

But I'll say this...Eli at his best is better than Ben at his best. Ben at his worst is worse than Eli at his worse. In terms of consistency I don't think either of them have really gotten to that elite level of showing up every Sunday yet.

M.O.T.H. · 02-07-2008, 10:08 PM

Eli is quickly becoming one of the most overrated players in the league. Funny turn around in 5 weeks.

steelersgirl5 · 02-07-2008, 10:09 PM

The homer inside me wants to pick Roethlisberger but the non-homer has to go with Big Ben.

AlexDown · 02-07-2008, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

Ben at his worst is worse than Eli at his worse.

I don't know about that. I don't recall Ben throwing 3 TD passes, to another team. I could be wrong though.

Number 10 · 02-07-2008, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexDown

I don't know about that. I don't recall Ben throwing 3 TD passes, to another team. I could be wrong though.

So what a defender does with the ball in his hands after an INT is the basis of your opinion?

You'll get far with that one.

steelernation77 · 02-07-2008, 10:15 PM

I find it amusing that Eli was being touted as a bust by many on this board and now is considered better than Ben despite throwing for 9 less touchdowns and 9 more INTs this season. His passer rating this season was 73.9 compared to Bens 104.1. Due to Willies low YPC, Ben had to be called on to pick up first downs, which he did on 41.6% of his passes, tops in the league followed by Brady, Romo, Peyton Manning, Garrard. Eli was 31.2% of all throws, behind Griese and in front of Trent Edwards, #28 overall.

AlexDown · 02-07-2008, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

So what a defender does with the ball in his hands after an INT is the basis of your opinion?

You'll get far with that one.

Well, I could say 4 INTs, 3 of which were TDs. Certainty not putting your team in a position to win that game.

We can pull up some stats of all their careers. But I know that won't satisfy a lot of people.

Im_a_Romosexual · 02-07-2008, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

So what a defender does with the ball in his hands after an INT is the basis of your opinion?

You'll get far with that one.

Ben is the better tackler... (AFC game vs Indy) sarcasm

Seriously though, I dont like any of 'em, but If I were to rank them it would go

1. Big Ben
2. Eli
3. Rivers

Rich Jr · 02-07-2008, 10:16 PM

I love Eli (See sig) but Big Ben is the best of the 3.

GB12 · 02-07-2008, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

Oh I will. Just wanted to see some of you accuse me of you know what.

Wait until you see my opinion next time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

This is going to be fun......

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

So what a defender does with the ball in his hands after an INT is the basis of your opinion?

You'll get far with that one.

I might take your opinion somewhat seriously if you weren't a pompous jackass in your responses.

steelersgirl5 · 02-07-2008, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

So what a defender does with the ball in his hands after an INT is the basis of your opinion?

You'll get far with that one.

I am going to have to agree with most people on here that because Eli HELPED the Giants win this Superbowl all you Giant fans are getting a hard on for your boy Eli. He isn't as good as Big Ben. He isn't close to as good as Big Ben. What could you possibly use as argument for that?? Eli has won a Superbowl?? Well Big Ben is the youngest QB to ever win a Superbowl?? Eli was the 5th seed and went on the road during the playoffs to get to the Superbowl?? Check that one off for Ben as well except add a seed. Ben might not have helped win the Superbowl but he didn't lose it and sure as hell was the reason we were there. This argument is getting ridiculous. Its been Big Ben since his rookie season. Get over it. It's not like you have a bad QB, you just don't have one as good as the Steelers. You still have a ring though. So enjoy it.

Mr. Stiller · 02-07-2008, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skiinginNJ

yea and a #1 reciever on one leg, no #3 reciever, a #2 who had a case fo the yips, a RB who couldnt stay healthy, a TE that was used only as a decoy, a LT who struggled with allowing sacks and a LG who shouldnt have been a starter.

not to mention that the giants lead the nfl in drops

and thats not even touching the scheme

I would say Steve Smith is a pretty good and more Reliable WR than Nate Washington.

Amani Toomer = Hines Ward
Plax > Holmes at this point.
..

You want to talk about OL?

Ben was sacked 47 Times on 404 attempts..

Eli was sacked 27 times on 529 attempts.

Ben has been sacked 93 times the past 2 years, Eli? 52.

I don't think OL should go in Bens Favor.

Number 10 · 02-07-2008, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steelernation77

I find it amusing that Eli was being touted as a bust by many on this board and now is considered better than Ben despite throwing for 9 less touchdowns and 9 more INTs this season. His passer rating this season was 73.9 compared to Bens 104.1. Due to Willies low YPC, Ben had to be called on to pick up first downs, which he did on 41.6% of his passes, tops in the league followed by Brady, Romo, Peyton Manning, Garrard. Eli was 31.2% of all throws, behind Griese and in front of Trent Edwards, #28 overall.

So if that is the basis...which is what the notion you are letting out....do you think Eli is worse then Griese and barely better than Edwards?

Jughead10 · 02-07-2008, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Stiller

I would say Steve Smith is a pretty good and more Reliable WR than Nate Washington.

Amani Toomer = Hines Ward
Plax > Holmes at this point.
..

You want to talk about OL?

Ben was sacked 47 Times on 404 attempts..

Eli was sacked 27 times on 529 attempts.

Ben has been sacked 93 times the past 2 years, Eli? 52.

I don't think OL should go in Bens Favor.

A lot of times I notice Ben takes sacks from holding onto the ball too long. And if a Giants fan said Amani Toomer = Hines Ward in the middle of this season, we would have caught crap.

San Diego Chicken · 02-07-2008, 10:27 PM

My opinion has been pretty much the same since last year -

1) Ben
2) Rivers
3) Eli

Eli Manning has to put together a quality 16 game season before he moves up out of the basement of the 04 QB rankings. He had a great playoff run, worthy of praise, but so did Jake Delhomme for example in the 03-04 playoffs.

Number 10 · 02-07-2008, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GB12

I might take your opinion somewhat seriously if you weren't a pompous jackass in your responses.

Oh chill out I'm trying to lighten the mood....it's early and you'll see how serious this gets in a week.

skiinginNJ · 02-07-2008, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Stiller

I would say Steve Smith is a pretty good and more Reliable WR than Nate Washington.

Amani Toomer = Hines Ward
Plax > Holmes at this point.
..

You want to talk about OL?

Ben was sacked 47 Times on 404 attempts..

Eli was sacked 27 times on 529 attempts.

Ben has been sacked 93 times the past 2 years, Eli? 52.

I don't think OL should go in Bens Favor.

steve smith missed a majority of the time in the regular season. he played in 5 games, 3 of which he had 1 catch or less

burress played all year on a torn ankle ligament and was severly impacted by it for a while.

toomer equal to ward? maybe in his prime

yea theres a large discrepency in the sack numbers, but the fact that big ben holds on to the ball way to long might have something to do with that

Mr. Stiller · 02-07-2008, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skiinginNJ

steve smith missed a majority of the time in the regular season. he played in 5 games, 3 of which he had 1 catch or less

burress played all year on a torn ankle ligament and was severly impacted by it for a while.

toomer equal to ward? maybe in his prime

yea theres a large discrepency in the sack numbers, but the fact that big ben holds on to the ball way to long might have something to do with that

That happens.. but there's plays where he barely snaps the ball and a DL is in the backfield (See Either Jags game, NE game, etc.)

and it also has to do with the fact his WR's can't get open.

Number 10 · 02-07-2008, 10:32 PM

For the Steelers fans to say Ben is better and it isn't even close is atrocious.

I don't mind you saying he is better...hell I have them neck and neck and until this postseason I had Ben rated above Eli...but you guys act like he is the 2nd coming of Bradshaw. Holy cow.

steelernation77 · 02-07-2008, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

For the Steelers fans to say Ben is better and it isn't even close is atrocious.

I don't mind you saying he is better...hell I have them neck and neck and until this postseason I had Ben rated above Eli...but you guys act like he is the 2nd coming of Bradshaw. Holy cow.

Actually statistically his numbers are much better than Bradshaw's at this point in their careers with a worse supporting cast so I'd say that isn't a very big stretch.

GB12 · 02-07-2008, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Number 10

Oh chill out I'm trying to lighten the mood....it's early and you'll see how serious this gets in a week.

No thanks. I know how this thread will end up and it's nothing worth reading.

Number 10 · 02-07-2008, 10:34 PM

I will certainly say Eli has a better line, and the skill players were at a draw. But Eli plays in one of the most complicated systems in the NFL, according to backup QBs that have been all over the place, that demands more out of a QB than anywhere else.