Green Bay Packers Discussion - Page 299

TitleTown088 · 02-18-2008, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neko4

Im down with that plan, i dont even think we should draft another Safety this year. (Unless its a guy like Reggie Smith) The 3 will get better through competition with eachother. Maybe Collins hasnt improved since he was a rookie because no one ever challenged him for his spot. I mean think of all the crappy Safties to pass through here

Meh, Like you said it, depends on who's available. If a guy like Phillips/Smith is there, I'd be all for it.

umphrey · 02-18-2008, 11:45 PM

Allen got tagged. He was my dream FA. Oh well, maybe next year, I wasn't expecting us to get him anyway.

The Legend · 02-19-2008, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by umphrey

I would love that trade, not gonna get a player like him at the end of the second round, that's for sure. Assuming Lito would want a new contract with the trade, I think we might have to move him or Woodson to safety temporarily, but if he'd stay on the rookie contract for a few years it would probably be an acceptable deal for a nickel CB.

hes not in his rookie contract, he has 5yrs left for 25 million
also i was reading http://www.rrstar.com/sports/columnists/x469084867
they think we should go after Alan Flanca AND/OR Lance Briggs

ChezPower4 · 02-19-2008, 07:32 PM

Give Bigby a break, this was his first year starting and he played pretty well. I'll admit that he has things that he has areas he needs to improve in, but what player doesn't? He did give up a few TD's but he also made quite a few big plays for the team. The stats don't lie he had 5 picks (led team), 3 forced fumbles (lead team), 14 defenced passes (lead team) and he is great in run support. He's also a big hitter and that alone can cause opposing WR's to drop some balls. When it comes down to it he makes big plays.

I totally agree with getting Rouse on the field, he only got a few opportunities this year but he showed that he can be a playmaker and I can't wait to see if he wins one of the spots in camp!

RyanBraun8 · 02-19-2008, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChezPower4

Give Bigby a break, this was his first year starting and he played pretty well. I'll admit that he has things that he has areas he needs to improve in, but what player doesn't? He did give up a few TD's but he also made quite a few big plays for the team. The stats don't lie he had 5 picks (led team), 3 forced fumbles (lead team), 14 defenced passes (lead team) and he is great in run support. He's also a big hitter and that alone can cause opposing WR's to drop some balls. When it comes down to it he makes big plays.

I totally agree with getting Rouse on the field, he only got a few opportunities this year but he showed that he can be a playmaker and I can't wait to see if he wins one of the spots in camp!

wow ChezPower im pretty sure your my hero! All these people just hate on Bigby and just pisses me off! I hate it! Just watch all his film from after the Dallas game then try to pick him apart...wait you can't because we played just as good if not better than anyone on our defense! Yes, your all right in the beginning of the season he had alot of mistakes but he learned from them like MOST FIRST YEAR PLAYERS must do, its like all you forget that it was really his first year. People say you have to give Brandon Jackson time, and Harrell time but none of you think Bigby needs any time? A bad first half so he is a career back-up? WOW!

I mean he was playing like a poor mans Bob Sanders (hit hard, make plays all over the field and cover very well) toward the end of the season, to bad he was playing like a poor mans Roy Williams(could hit the crap outta ya but cover lol not there) in the beginning of it. Give him another season to see which one he is with more experience. Dont write him off so fast just because a bad first half and the fact he always looks stoned off his ass haha

neko4 · 02-19-2008, 09:32 PM

When it became apparant that we were good, we immediatly identified weaknesses. Those were Bigby and Jackson, but Jackson was replaced by Grant so now the next big weakness was Bigby. Especially when we saw Rouse come in and get a pick, it really made me doubt Bigby. I think he'll still beatout Rouse, but he needs to get better and fast. We're a team that can win it all next year and we cant have a single player fall behind. People were giving Jackson time, because at the begining of the year we didnt realize we were a 13-3 team and Harrell is sitting behind the deepest core of DT's in the league

GB12 · 02-19-2008, 09:51 PM

I actually really like Bigby. He has everything he needs to be a top safety he just has to put them together. We already know he can hit and tackle, I don't think anyone's concerned with that aspect of his game. His coverage needs work, but with practice he should be able to improve. He's been moved around from corner to linebacker to safety in his pro career so it make sense that he's a little rough. When he was placed at safety he was a practice squad player and the 5th or 6th guy in line. Now that he'll be getting the majority of the reps and working with the first team I think we could see a big improvement come next year. Like a few have already said it was basically his rookie season. If he was say a second round pick I have a feeling everyone would be in love with him, and we'd be in agreement that he should start next year. Rouse seems to have a good feel for both safety positions so he'll get a chance to compete for FS and SS. He might have a better chance unseating Collins than Bigby. I'm going to be a little upset if Bigby isn't the starter for 2008.

princefielder28 · 02-19-2008, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GB12

I actually really like Bigby. He has everything he needs to be a top safety he just has to put them together. We already know he can hit and tackle, I don't think anyone's concerned with that aspect of his game. His coverage needs work, but with practice he should be able to improve. He's been moved around from corner to linebacker to safety in his pro career so it make sense that he's a little rough. When he was placed at safety he was a practice squad player and the 5th or 6th guy in line. Now that he'll be getting the majority of the reps and working with the first team I think we could see a big improvement come next year. Like a few have already said it was basically his rookie season. If he was say a second round pick I have a feeling everyone would be in love with him, and we'd be in agreement that he should start next year. Rouse seems to have a good feel for both safety positions so he'll get a chance to compete for FS and SS. He might have a better chance unseating Collins than Bigby. I'm going to be a little upset if Bigby isn't the starter for 2008.

After his performance in the playoffs he must be the starter next year

RyanBraun8 · 02-19-2008, 10:05 PM

I actually think the bigger position battle is with Rouse and Collins, I really do. Collins is just so out of control coming in for tackles, hes a big liability and he really showed that in the play-offs. He's a loose cannon, he goes flying over there, puts his head down, then gets in bad position. I want to love Collins and was a huge fan but to me he just isn't progressing that much. He still makes a good amount of mistakes in coverage, and i don't feel comfortable with his tackling.

Know imagine Rouse and Bigby as our Safteys... lol wow what WR would want to come over the middle. I mean these guys hit and look like Linebackers!

TitleTown088 · 02-19-2008, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Legend

hes not in his rookie contract, he has 5yrs left for

When was Nick extended? I must have missed that.

RyanBraun8 · 02-19-2008, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TitleTown088

When was Nick extended? I must have missed that.

Think they were talking about Lito Sheppard

TitleTown088 · 02-20-2008, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RyanBraun8

Think they were talking about Lito Sheppard

Oh I see. too much brain work today. I'm a bit behind.

johbur · 02-20-2008, 02:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChezPower4

Give Bigby a break, this was his first year starting and he played pretty well. I'll admit that he has things that he has areas he needs to improve in, but what player doesn't? He did give up a few TD's but he also made quite a few big plays for the team. The stats don't lie he had 5 picks (led team), 3 forced fumbles (lead team), 14 defenced passes (lead team) and he is great in run support. He's also a big hitter and that alone can cause opposing WR's to drop some balls. When it comes down to it he makes big plays.

I totally agree with getting Rouse on the field, he only got a few opportunities this year but he showed that he can be a playmaker and I can't wait to see if he wins one of the spots in camp!

If stats don't lie for Bigby, then toss in that he lead the team in missed tackles at 15, the same amount that Marquand Manuel missed last year. Also from jsonline: Bigby had 8 penalties. Bigby's total was extreme for a safety. From 1991-'06, no Packers safety ever had more than four. Manuel had one last year. The most touchdown passes were allowed by Bigby with five, a notch less than Marquand Manuel's 5 1/2 last year. That is twice as many penalties as any safety the Packers have had over the last 15 years and he's a half TD upgrade as far as scoring defense.

Great for Bigby that he had the caused turnovers. At least he had more turnovers caused than TDs given up. Also great he lead the team in PDs, but he also had the most penalties (which means 8 first automatic first downs given up) and most missed tackles. That's 28 negative plays of penalties, missed tackles and TDs given up, as compared to 22 positive plays of picks, fumbles and passes defensed.

He's a nice story being a UDFA, but I would much rather see Rouse in with Collins, unless Kenny Phillips falls, which isn't going to happen.

RyanBraun8 · 02-20-2008, 12:17 PM

Yeah but most of those came early in the season, the fact is that he prgressed alot as the season went on. Starting after the Dallas game he really got going and played great football. We'll have to wait and see this August how its going to work out but we dont need to draft a saftey i dont think.

EvilMonkey · 02-20-2008, 02:30 PM

yeah Bibgy really improved later in the year. He still wasnt great in coverage or anything later in the year and in the playoffs (not terrible either) but he made plays and didnt give up the big play or get penalties like he did previously. I agree with Braun's statement that Rouse and Collins might be the battle for a safety spot next year. I'm not sold on Rouse but collins overpursues a lot and Rouse seemed more disciplined that I think that might be a better fit for our team than having collins and bigby both running free.

someone447 · 02-20-2008, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvilMonkey

yeah Bibgy really improved later in the year. He still wasnt great in coverage or anything later in the year and in the playoffs (not terrible either) but he made plays and didnt give up the big play or get penalties like he did previously. I agree with Braun's statement that Rouse and Collins might be the battle for a safety spot next year. I'm not sold on Rouse but collins overpursues a lot and Rouse seemed more disciplined that I think that might be a better fit for our team than having collins and bigby both running free.

Bigby and Collins will start next year. I will bet on that. Neither are as bad as you are making them out to be. Bigby was pretty bad in the beginning of the year, but he made tremendous strides.

02-20-2008, 03:01 PM

Bigby's picks came when he was out of position on pass coverage balls were tipped and were gift wrapped to him. He excelled against the run but i still see him as a liability. Our coverage against TE is also worth noting hawk and barnett matched up better than the safeties

EvilMonkey · 02-20-2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by someone447

Bigby and Collins will start next year. I will bet on that. Neither are as bad as you are making them out to be. Bigby was pretty bad in the beginning of the year, but he made tremendous strides.

i didnt necessarily mean they were bad, i just think they both have a tendency to overpursue too much and Rouse looked a little more disciplined and I'm hoping he can develop and possibly win one of the jobs next year so we can have a little more balance instead of 2 guys who both overpursue stuff a lot.

umphrey · 02-20-2008, 03:32 PM

The only safety we have that can man cover a TE is Rouse. Bigby and Collins are 5'11 so that's probably around a 5-6 inch height difference on your average TE. If we have those 2 starting we have to use LBs or a different kind of coverage. Not sure who the best 2 will be next year but Rouse definitely gives us that advantage.

Boston · 02-20-2008, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SunDevil450

Bigby's picks came when he was out of position on pass coverage balls were tipped and were gift wrapped to him. He excelled against the run but i still see him as a liability. Our coverage against TE is also worth noting hawk and barnett matched up better than the safeties

Meh, that was more earlier in the year. He was pretty much a beast in all aspects of the game during the playoffs.

ny10804 · 02-20-2008, 04:20 PM

Having Bigby, Rouse, and Collins fight for the two safety spots is a good thing. All can do some things very, very good (Bigby/hitting, Collins/speed, Rouse/ball hawking.

If anyone remembers the Seattle game, Bigby absolutely dominated. I think the starters will be him and Rouse. Collins should be tried as a corner. His mental abilities have always been a concern of mine, and IIRC it was the main knock on him when he was coming out. A corner's responsibilities are a lot simpler than a safety's, and he has the perfect build and speed to be a corner.

The Legend · 02-20-2008, 04:41 PM

Please God Give Us Brandon Flowers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsMNyu77Ld8

for god sake i saw him on NFLTA, saw him on ESPN, now on youtube

this kid is the real deal i think hes the next superstar

if god gives us him, i will FLIP THE F OUT

Boston · 02-20-2008, 05:09 PM

http://www.packers.com/news/releases/2008/02/20/1/

Corey Williams got tagged, Franks was released. Suprising...

TitleTown088 · 02-20-2008, 05:11 PM

He's trade bait... I hope.

jackalope · 02-20-2008, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boston

http://www.packers.com/news/releases/2008/02/20/1/

Corey Williams got tagged, Franks was released. Suprising...

Wow, surprised to see Franks cut, I was under the impression that we would take a major cap hit. Good move tagging Williams.