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Old 09-13-2008, 12:27 AM    (permalink
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im going to have to disagree on freeman. he threw more oin target lasers in tight spots than anyone not even close. he definitely has the best throwing arm. has the best body. just as athletic as tebow as far as throwing on the move and far better at it. plays in an nfl offense under center and can throw from under center. if i was to name a #1 overall pick right now i think hed be it. sanchez and stafford are kind of the same player. overrated arm, undersize, just happen to play on a good team. but better nfl wise than tebow
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Old 09-13-2008, 06:41 PM    (permalink
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Stafford is so inconsistent at this point that I personally wouldnt touch him till the 2nd round but I'm sure teams will fall in love with his "potential" and draft him top 10.
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Old 09-13-2008, 07:24 PM    (permalink
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How are Mark Sanchez and Stafford undersized? They're both 6'3 225ish.
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Old 09-13-2008, 07:31 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by VoodooMonkey View Post
How are Mark Sanchez and Stafford undersized? They're both 6'3 225ish.
I'd say 6'2", which IMO is undersized.
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Old 09-13-2008, 07:34 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BamaFalcon59 View Post
I'd say 6'2", which IMO is undersized.
I wouldn't say undersized, but both are very average. We've just been spoiled by Russell, Ryan, Flacco, and all these other 'big' guys.
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Old 09-13-2008, 07:39 PM    (permalink
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They're both listed as 6'3 and IMO that's just fine. Hell, there's a lot of good 6'2 QB's in the league as well.
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Old 09-13-2008, 07:57 PM    (permalink
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Matt Stafford is incredibly overrated. He hasn't been able to do anything to suggest to me that he has more than just tools. Late first round value at this point.

2006 vs. SEC

South Carolina - 8/19, 171 yards, 3 INT
Mississippi - 7/18, 91 yards
Tennessee - 2/5, 11 yards, INT
Vanderbilt - 9/13, 86 yards
Miss. St. - 20/32, 267 yards, 2 TD, 3 INT
Florida - 13/33, 151 yards, 2 INT
Kentucky - 16/28, 230 yards, TD, 3 INT
Auburn - 14/20, 219 yards, TD

Bowl (not included): Virginia Tech - 9/21, 129 yards, TD, INT

Yards per game: 152.7
TD: 6
INT: 12

2007 vs. SEC

South Carolina - 19/44, 213 yards, INT
Alabama - 19/35, 224 yards, 2 TD, 2 INT
Mississippi - 13/21, 144 yards, TD
Tennessee - 16/33, 174 yards, 2 TD, INT
Vanderbilt - 16/31, 201 yards, TD
Florida - 11/18, 217 yards, 3 TD, INT
Auburn - 11/19, 237 yards, 2 TD, INT
Kentucky - 12/22, 99 yards, 2 INT

Bowl (not included): Hawaii - 14/23, 175 yards, TD, INT

Yards per game: 188.6
TD: 11
INT: 8

So that's a total of 17 TDs and 20 INTs over two seasons vs. SEC opponents. Additionally, he averages less than 200 yards per game. Keep in mind this guy plays for one of the best teams in the league. I don't see the production there to suggest he would play well against NFL defenses.
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Old 09-13-2008, 11:25 PM    (permalink
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You can't view a players NFL stock based just on stats espically when you look at his overall stats when he was true freshman starting in the SEC. What you will not see on those stats are him padding it agianst weak teams. He is a much better QB now then he was his freshman and sophmore year. Today he had 10 incomplete passes and atleast 4 of those was drops by the WR and another one was basically thrown away. Even though he plays with a top ranked team his WR have been one of the worst groups in the SEC. Also the OL has been anything special. I'm not saying he is a finished product, but he still has 2 years to meet the expections
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Old 09-14-2008, 11:52 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by georgiafan View Post
You can't view a players NFL stock based just on stats espically when you look at his overall stats when he was true freshman starting in the SEC. What you will not see on those stats are him padding it agianst weak teams.
True, stats aren't the only measure. But if you're an NFL team that's going to be drafting a player in the first round and paying them (if Stafford is drafted where expected) $50-70 million, you want them to at least have been a top college player as well. Matt Stafford wouldn't even make my top 10 list of college quarterbacks at this point. Could he be a great pro? Sure he could. But I doubt it happens unless he shows marked improvement. At this stage, he's a potential first round pick, but I don't take unproductive players in the first round.

About the weak teams...you're right, he wasn't that good against those, either.
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Old 09-14-2008, 01:10 PM    (permalink
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I still don't get the hype Stafford gets. He's so overrated it's pathetic.
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Old 09-14-2008, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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I still don't get the hype Stafford gets. He's so overrated it's pathetic.
No offense but you obviously cant judge talent at the QB position.
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Old 09-14-2008, 02:20 PM    (permalink
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No offense but you obviously cant judge talent at the QB position.
No offense taken, since I think you're the one you obviously can't judge talent at the QB position.

Now I didn't say he's a bad QB. But I did say he's grossly overrated.

This is why he gets hyped:

1. He has prototypical size that scouts love.
2. He has an over the top throwing motion.
3. He's on a good team.
4. He's young and scouts think he's moldable.
5. He plays against top competition.

This is what people overlook that make him overhyped.

1. He has mediocre vision/QB instincts.
2. His TD/INT ratio is horrendous.
3. Georgia has(and has had) a great running game that takes a lot of pressure of Stafford.
4. When teams scheme to stop Georgia, they think about stopping the run.
5. Stafford has proven to be nothing but a bus driver QB so far.


He still has time to show more, but as of right now, he's overrated. Tell me why he's not.
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Old 09-14-2008, 02:25 PM    (permalink
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It's alright D, the majority of us know Sanchez is the better QB prospect by now anyways ..
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Old 09-14-2008, 02:26 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit View Post
No offense taken, since I think you're the one you obviously can't judge talent at the QB position.

Now I didn't say he's a bad QB. But I did say he's grossly overrated.

This is why he gets hyped:

1. He has prototypical size that scouts love.
2. He has an over the top throwing motion.
3. He's on a good team.
4. He's young and scouts think he's moldable.
5. He plays against top competition.

This is what people overlook that make him overhyped.

1. He has mediocre vision/QB instincts.
2. His TD/INT ratio is horrendous.
3. Georgia has(and has had) a great running game that takes a lot of pressure of Stafford.
4. When teams scheme to stop Georgia, they think about stopping the run.
5. Stafford has proven to be nothing but a bus driver QB so far.


He still has time to show more, but as of right now, he's overrated. Tell me why he's not.
And I agree with everything you just said
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Old 09-14-2008, 02:41 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit View Post
No offense taken, since I think you're the one you obviously can't judge talent at the QB position.

Now I didn't say he's a bad QB. But I did say he's grossly overrated.

This is why he gets hyped:

1. He has prototypical size that scouts love.
2. He has an over the top throwing motion.
3. He's on a good team.
4. He's young and scouts think he's moldable.
5. He plays against top competition.

This is what people overlook that make him overhyped.

1. He has mediocre vision/QB instincts.
2. His TD/INT ratio is horrendous.
3. Georgia has(and has had) a great running game that takes a lot of pressure of Stafford.
4. When teams scheme to stop Georgia, they think about stopping the run.
5. Stafford has proven to be nothing but a bus driver QB so far.


He still has time to show more, but as of right now, he's overrated. Tell me why he's not.
I like your reply, well thought out. Regardless of our dissagreement he will be the top QB taken this year and if it's a team like KC, Tampa Bay or Miami then he probably goes #1, time will tell.
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Old 09-14-2008, 03:29 PM    (permalink
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I have never been a fan of his. When he is back there, he just doesn't look natural.
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Old 09-14-2008, 04:07 PM    (permalink
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John Parker Wilson ftw.
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Old 09-14-2008, 04:19 PM    (permalink
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I think this year is a big year for Stafford. It's still really early. I'm not sure it's exactly fair to judge his NFL future based off the stats of his Freshman season. Not many true freshman are going to succeed in the SEC. What is more important is his improvement. So what if he did struggle as a freshman? How many freshman QB's do you know that light it up in the premiere defensive conference?

Like I said, his improvement is a lot more telling than his career TD:INT ratio. In his sophomore season he threw 12 more TD's and 3 less INT's than he did in his freshman season. So far this year he is off to a pretty good start. He didn't light up a tough South Carolina defense, but he was fairly efficient and mistake free. So far on this season he's completed 62% of his passes and has yet to throw an interception. Against a great South Carolina secondary he completed 60% of his passes and three or four of his incompletions were dropped passes.
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Old 09-14-2008, 04:25 PM    (permalink
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This is my little scouting report on Stafford:

Stafford, Matthew (Ben Roethlisberger) – 4.65-4.70 – Stafford is more athletic than given credit for. His release is good but not great: it would not something that would be listed as one of his strengths, but it is not a weakness either (high but not particularly quick). He always keeps his head up and his eyes downfield, but his overall field vision is rather lacking (doesn’t see the whole field). His arm strength is fantastic and good enough to thread the needle or make throws when off-balance, in the air, or when his feet aren’t set. He is a slipstream scrambler with pretty good pocket presence, but his speed is more straight-line than anything else (not very shifty). He is very effective with pump fakes, which improves his ball security on throws where linebackers and safeties are playing in reactionary zones (Cover 2). His drops are a little bit short and choppy which may need work when he transitions to the NFL. When faced with a pass rush he is usually quite composed and doesn’t panic easily. As evidenced by his completion percentage, his accuracy and decision-making, two of the more important attributes for any quarterback, are not at an elite level. As of now (beginning of junior season) everything physically about Stafford is on an NFL level and he has an adequate TD:INT ratio (considering his freshman year a wash and observing the improvement in his sophomore season), but his completion percentage marks the biggest question about him. If he can complete over 60% of his passes this year he’ll have gone a little ways settled one of the biggest concerns critics have about him. His specific accuracy on short throws is not great, which is a concern. Furthermore, Stafford shows little touch on shorter throws, preferring to launch bullets at his receivers (at being the choice word because of his aforementioned accuracy on shorter throws). Those two issues are certainly reasons for his poor completion percentage, but in his defense his receivers drop an inordinate amount of passes, both short and long). He has a tendency to predetermine his throws, which is a problem. He does throw a great deep ball in terms of both power and accuracy.

Value: Overall, the upper extent of Stafford's value as a mid-to-late first round pick. As long is the investment in him is not exorbitant, the potential he has is worth gambling on.

This is of course right now, and it could certainly change.
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Old 09-14-2008, 05:00 PM    (permalink
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I would say he's at the same level as Troy Aikman at a similar stage. Remember when talking completion % keep in mind the talent level of his receivers.
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Old 09-14-2008, 05:36 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Race for the Heisman View Post
This is my little scouting report on Stafford:

Stafford, Matthew (Ben Roethlisberger) – 4.65-4.70 – Stafford is more athletic than given credit for. His release is good but not great: it would not something that would be listed as one of his strengths, but it is not a weakness either (high but not particularly quick). He always keeps his head up and his eyes downfield, but his overall field vision is rather lacking (doesn’t see the whole field). His arm strength is fantastic and good enough to thread the needle or make throws when off-balance, in the air, or when his feet aren’t set. He is a slipstream scrambler with pretty good pocket presence, but his speed is more straight-line than anything else (not very shifty). He is very effective with pump fakes, which improves his ball security on throws where linebackers and safeties are playing in reactionary zones (Cover 2). His drops are a little bit short and choppy which may need work when he transitions to the NFL. When faced with a pass rush he is usually quite composed and doesn’t panic easily. As evidenced by his completion percentage, his accuracy and decision-making, two of the more important attributes for any quarterback, are not at an elite level. As of now (beginning of junior season) everything physically about Stafford is on an NFL level and he has an adequate TD:INT ratio (considering his freshman year a wash and observing the improvement in his sophomore season), but his completion percentage marks the biggest question about him. If he can complete over 60% of his passes this year he’ll have gone a little ways settled one of the biggest concerns critics have about him. His specific accuracy on short throws is not great, which is a concern. Furthermore, Stafford shows little touch on shorter throws, preferring to launch bullets at his receivers (at being the choice word because of his aforementioned accuracy on shorter throws). Those two issues are certainly reasons for his poor completion percentage, but in his defense his receivers drop an inordinate amount of passes, both short and long). He has a tendency to predetermine his throws, which is a problem. He does throw a great deep ball in terms of both power and accuracy.

Value: Overall, the upper extent of Stafford's value as a mid-to-late first round pick. As long is the investment in him is not exorbitant, the potential he has is worth gambling on.

This is of course right now, and it could certainly change.
Good scouting report! +rep.
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Old 09-14-2008, 05:52 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by P-L View Post
Against a great South Carolina secondary he completed 60% of his passes and three or four of his incompletions were dropped passes.
It was auctally worse then that 5 of the 10 incomplete were drops. TE Tripp Chandler droped 3, WR Kris Durham droped one, and WR Tavares King droped one. Two of Chandlers dropes would have been first down. Durham's pass would have been a TD. The two others would have prevented 3rd and long that we ended up punting on. Another thing thats hurt is the WR by committe that UGA does. Even though Massaquoi and A.J Green are the 2 best WR's on the field they don't see the field enough.
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Old 09-14-2008, 06:01 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by georgiafan View Post
It was auctally worse then that 5 of the 10 incomplete were drops. TE Tripp Chandler droped 3, WR Kris Durham droped one, and WR Tavares King droped one. Two of Chandlers dropes would have been first down. Durham's pass would have been a TD. The two others would have prevented 3rd and long that we ended up punting on. Another thing thats hurt is the WR by committe that UGA does. Even though Massaquoi and A.J Green are the 2 best WR's on the field they don't see the field enough.

All of what you said is accurate which makes it hard for the average fan to evaluate, scouts seem to take those things into consideration.
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Old 09-14-2008, 09:19 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Babylon View Post
All of what you said is accurate which makes it hard for the average fan to evaluate, scouts seem to take those things into consideration.
Staffords stock is starting to remind me of of Matt Ryan's last year. Where the scouts are much higher on him then fans.
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Old 09-14-2008, 11:01 PM    (permalink
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Ok Stafford is a flat out stud! Reminds me exactly of Eli Manning as a JR at Mississippi in terms of his stock. People loved his potential but as a JR were not ready to say just how good he was. Stafford can make ALL the throws, what a ******* arm on that kid, wow! And now he can run the football and shows he has some athletic ability!

What is there not to like about him, and show me a better QB prospect with a better arm than him in college right now. Because there is no one!
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