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Old 08-12-2008, 09:44 PM    (permalink
Paranoidmoonduck
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I still really like McNabb, but he's an exceptional year away from being a real threat to crack most top 5 lists.
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Old 08-12-2008, 09:45 PM    (permalink
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top 10 yes, top 5 no
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Old 08-12-2008, 11:13 PM    (permalink
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No. Manning, Brady, Brees, Romo, Favre, Palmer, and more are better.
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Old 08-13-2008, 02:12 AM    (permalink
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Not even close to a top 5 QB anymore.
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Old 08-13-2008, 02:39 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by MetSox17 View Post
I love how people are quick to replace Romo, when Palmer has been on a downward slope since his career started and everyone ignores it. He put up Eli Manning numbers last year.
Eli Manning Numbers? Eli Threw for 23 TDs, 20 INts at 56.1% Completion Rate, and a 73.9 Passer Rating.

Carson Palmer threw for 4,131, 26 TDs, 20 INTs, at 64.9 % completion rate, and a 86.7 Passer Rating.

That is Eli's career best and Carson's career worst (both last season).
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Old 08-13-2008, 07:04 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by eaglesfan_45 View Post
Eli Manning Numbers? Eli Threw for 23 TDs, 20 INts at 56.1% Completion Rate, and a 73.9 Passer Rating.

Carson Palmer threw for 4,131, 26 TDs, 20 INTs, at 64.9 % completion rate, and a 86.7 Passer Rating.

That is Eli's career best and Carson's career worst (both last season).
haha I ignore the Palmer hate arguments. A lot of people on these boards see one bad year for a guy (which would be a hopeful year for other guys) and all the sudden he's terrible.

Its the same people who see Brady's one great year and think he's all the sudden the top QB in the league. Don't get me wrong, Brady has been solid before, but he never threw for over 30 TDs and he never had a passer rating of above 95 before. And for reference Manning has had 4 seasons of over 95 passer rating and over 30 TDs before last year.

Its the same people who argue guys like Larry Johnson are done with their careers after starting 37 games. He's had 1 season with an injury and everyone is crying he's been overworked lol.

Its the same people who think once you're 30 years old you're to old to play anymore. People say Randy Moss has lost a step - hell tell that to T.O. and Marvin Harrison who are 4 and 5 years older than Moss, respectively.

Anyways, you'd think this league is a year old with how some people feel about players. Guys get injuries and bounce back; guys have bad years and bounce back; guys get old and still move fast. Its ridiculous to think that a guy is going to be a complete opposite player after 1 year, even if his coming off an injury, 1 bad performance or even if he's just 1 year old.
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Old 08-13-2008, 07:36 AM    (permalink
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Nice Post Rocket, I too still say Peyton is over Brady, LJ is still a top 5 RB. (5, behind LT, Westy, AD, and Steven Jackson) The case could be made that he is better than Jackson though too, so there you go. I do think that players slow down with age (duh) but with that age, they gain other advantages in the mental aspect of the game that compensate for minor drops in athletecism.
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Old 08-13-2008, 08:07 AM    (permalink
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Nice Post Rocket, I too still say Peyton is over Brady, LJ is still a top 5 RB. (5, behind LT, Westy, AD, and Steven Jackson) The case could be made that he is better than Jackson though too, so there you go. I do think that players slow down with age (duh) but with that age, they gain other advantages in the mental aspect of the game that compensate for minor drops in athletecism.
You're right, I didn't mean to say they don't slow down at all, but rather that the minor speed / strength they may lose generally is negligible especially when giving the fact they do gain experience and wisdom of the game (as you mentioned) :).

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Old 08-13-2008, 04:02 PM    (permalink
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Nice Post Rocket, I too still say Peyton is over Brady, LJ is still a top 5 RB. (5, behind LT, Westy, AD, and Steven Jackson) The case could be made that he is better than Jackson though too, so there you go. I do think that players slow down with age (duh) but with that age, they gain other advantages in the mental aspect of the game that compensate for minor drops in athletecism.
People call me crazy for saying Peyton is better then Brady.

Peyton is surgical with approach to quarterbacking, he's the best of this generation without question
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Old 08-13-2008, 04:09 PM    (permalink
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Not to turn this into Peyton vs Brady but in my eyes Peyton's the better passer and individual player while Brady's a better leader and more clutch, not to say Peyton isn't a leader or Brady isn't a great passer, but when comparing them that's how I think they stack up.
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Old 08-13-2008, 04:16 PM    (permalink
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So the consesus pretty much is that a healthy McNabb is possibly a top 5 QB, but he needs to actually be healthy first.
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Old 08-13-2008, 04:23 PM    (permalink
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Eli Manning Numbers? Eli Threw for 23 TDs, 20 INts at 56.1% Completion Rate, and a 73.9 Passer Rating.

Carson Palmer threw for 4,131, 26 TDs, 20 INTs, at 64.9 % completion rate, and a 86.7 Passer Rating.

That is Eli's career best and Carson's career worst (both last season).
Throwing 20 interceptions in a season is horrible, no matter what way you put it. The yards don't mean anything to me cause all the Bengals could do last year was chuck it up, without a running game. When you have Chad Johnson, TJ Houshmandzadeh and Chris Henry, you better be putting up more than 25 touchdowns.

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haha I ignore the Palmer hate arguments. A lot of people on these boards see one bad year for a guy (which would be a hopeful year for other guys) and all the sudden he's terrible.

Its the same people who see Brady's one great year and think he's all the sudden the top QB in the league. Don't get me wrong, Brady has been solid before, but he never threw for over 30 TDs and he never had a passer rating of above 95 before. And for reference Manning has had 4 seasons of over 95 passer rating and over 30 TDs before last year.
I'll ignore the idiotic assumptions you made after your first paragraph and make my statement on the argument at hand.

"one bad year". Hey, open your eyes kid, he's been on a steady downfall since his second year in the league. His touchdowns have gone down every year, all the while his interceptions have gone up. Every single year. His average per attempt is down. He makes some horrible decisions sometimes. Forcing balls everywhere.

That's not a top notch quarterback for me. Is he one of the most gifted quarterbacks in the league? Absolutely. Can he turn it around and get back to his playing level from his second year? Of course. Will he? Who knows. As of right now, from what i've seen from him, he's not the third or fourth best quarterback in this league.
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Old 08-13-2008, 08:23 PM    (permalink
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Throwing 20 interceptions in a season is horrible, no matter what way you put it. The yards don't mean anything to me cause all the Bengals could do last year was chuck it up, without a running game. When you have Chad Johnson, TJ Houshmandzadeh and Chris Henry, you better be putting up more than 25 touchdowns.
Except we didn't have Chris Henry for the first 8 games, but whatever.

Quote:
I'll ignore the idiotic assumptions you made after your first paragraph and make my statement on the argument at hand.

"one bad year". Hey, open your eyes kid, he's been on a steady downfall since his second year in the league. His touchdowns have gone down every year, all the while his interceptions have gone up. Every single year. His average per attempt is down. He makes some horrible decisions sometimes. Forcing balls everywhere.

That's not a top notch quarterback for me. Is he one of the most gifted quarterbacks in the league? Absolutely. Can he turn it around and get back to his playing level from his second year? Of course. Will he? Who knows. As of right now, from what i've seen from him, he's not the third or fourth best quarterback in this league.
I don't want to say your argument is plain ********, but you did all call me "kid". In 2004 he threw 18 INT's. in 2005 he threw 12 INT's. in 2006 he threw 13 INT's. in 2007 he threw 20 INT's. I'll ignore the fact that this is only a 4 year sample size to test your little theory on, which is in fact a stupidly small sample size.

So he starts his NFL career off with 18. Then in his second year goes down to 12 INT's (with 32 TD's might I add). His third year in the league he throws 13 INT's; now tell me, "kid", do you really think going from 12 INT's, a number most QB's would get on their knees to have, to 13 INT's is in any form a decline??

I didn't think so. So then his last year, 2007, he goes up to 20 INT's. Essentially being his first bad year since his 2004 start (18 INT's).

Hey again, he had a bad year, no one is disagreeing with you. But he's certainly not on the decline. His 06 year was in fact more yards and more yards per a throw average then his 2005 year despite his decline in completion percentage and TD's.


Edit: grr this is why I hate getting into debates on where Palmer stands. It doesn't even matter - I don't care if people think he's top 3, top 5, top 10, top 20 or top 50. He only has 4 years under his belt, and no QB would be criticized for his 07 performance after 4 years if they didn't do as well as he did in 05' and 06'.

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