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Old 10-26-2008, 02:43 AM    (permalink
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Default Major Changes in Offseason?

With Mike Brown like selling out every game last couple years i doubt a lot of bengal fans will go watch them next year with this happing will mike brown change the team to bring the fans back to the seats or will it go back the way it was before 2004 season and i put my bengals stuff back in closet and let it collect dust
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Old 10-27-2008, 07:49 AM    (permalink
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You guys go ahead and keep seeing things through your rose tinted glassed, but this team sucks. I'm not going to stop being a fan, but this is just ridiculous. This team has quit. No other way to put it...

The JJoe play of just tagging Walter after he was already up from making the catch and running in for the TD shows just how undisciplined this team is. THAT play personifies the whole season up to this point... LAZY !!!

Someone go ahead and tell me how we are just a couple plays from being a .500 team or some crap....
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Old 10-27-2008, 09:16 AM    (permalink
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Well they aren't good and its obvious theyve given up on this season and on Marvin Lewis. That said, it doesn't mean the talent isn't there. Not having your franchise QB is rough as well.
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Old 10-27-2008, 09:21 AM    (permalink
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The way they're playing right now is somewhat comparable to the Celtics from 2 years ago (before they won the title). It's as though there is really nothing left to play for except the top pick in the draft.
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Old 10-27-2008, 11:54 AM    (permalink
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Well they aren't good and its obvious theyve given up on this season and on Marvin Lewis. That said, it doesn't mean the talent isn't there. Not having your franchise QB is rough as well.
Can't have it both ways. This team does lack talent. 5 sacks after 7 games? If there's talent on the defensive side, it ain't being coached. The problem is, we select players that are draftable, but over and over and over, we take players 2 rounds before they are going to be picked by other clubs. Once they are here, they overpay the wrong players and absolutely refuse to admit mistakes by releasing their mistakes.
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Old 10-27-2008, 12:07 PM    (permalink
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Can't have it both ways. This team does lack talent. 5 sacks after 7 games? If there's talent on the defensive side, it ain't being coached. The problem is, we select players that are draftable, but over and over and over, we take players 2 rounds before they are going to be picked by other clubs. Once they are here, they overpay the wrong players and absolutely refuse to admit mistakes by releasing their mistakes.
It's not that we don't have talent, because we definitely do. We are only missing a few pieces, and without those, we can't be ass effective as we really could be. Agreed for the most part about the poor drafting. THat goes hand in hand with Brown's ineptitude to perform as owner.
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Old 10-27-2008, 01:45 PM    (permalink
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Can't have it both ways. This team does lack talent. 5 sacks after 7 games? If there's talent on the defensive side, it ain't being coached. The problem is, we select players that are draftable, but over and over and over, we take players 2 rounds before they are going to be picked by other clubs. Once they are here, they overpay the wrong players and absolutely refuse to admit mistakes by releasing their mistakes.
Ehh that whole "drafting them two rounds early" is just pure speculation. The only one I can think of off the top of my head that was blatantly obvious was probably Frostee. But even if we did take him early I like what I see from him (now if he could just be healthy). Overpaying Odom was probably a bad move but we'll see with some time. And just because Mel Kiper or Scott Wright say their value is at a certain point doesn't mean the scouts in the NFL do(but then again our lack of a scouting department may play into that). By all accounts the Steelers were gonna jump all over Jerome Simpson had we not taken him. I wouldn't call him much of a reach as he has probably the freakiest measurables at WR in that draft. Drafting in recent years (aside from character issues) from a talent standpoint has not been very bad. I remember when it was much, much worse. Even if we have "reached" for some players we have also found good value in the later rounds to kind of even that out.

The talent is there, the coaching and the tenacity is not. The defense has seen some improvement and is not far away from being a solid unit. It's obvious the team just doesn't have much confidence in Marvin anymore. I've never really questioned this team's heart, but now I think I am starting to do just that.
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Old 10-27-2008, 04:46 PM    (permalink
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Ehh that whole "drafting them two rounds early" is just pure speculation. The only one I can think of off the top of my head that was blatantly obvious was probably Frostee. But even if we did take him early I like what I see from him (now if he could just be healthy). Overpaying Odom was probably a bad move but we'll see with some time. And just because Mel Kiper or Scott Wright say their value is at a certain point doesn't mean the scouts in the NFL do(but then again our lack of a scouting department may play into that). By all accounts the Steelers were gonna jump all over Jerome Simpson had we not taken him. I wouldn't call him much of a reach as he has probably the freakiest measurables at WR in that draft. Drafting in recent years (aside from character issues) from a talent standpoint has not been very bad. I remember when it was much, much worse. Even if we have "reached" for some players we have also found good value in the later rounds to kind of even that out.

The talent is there, the coaching and the tenacity is not. The defense has seen some improvement and is not far away from being a solid unit. It's obvious the team just doesn't have much confidence in Marvin anymore. I've never really questioned this team's heart, but now I think I am starting to do just that.
I agree with this post. We have the talent, its just the ownership and coaching isnt good. The drafting has been solid...I feel the most current draft was exceptional. We have found great value late in rounds.

You guys know what you are in for being a Bengal fan. You know that they have a great chance to be the worst team in the league every year. So why all the whining about them being so bad? It happens...and with the Bengals it happens alot. O well...be a fan and still cheer for them. Find good things about the team and hope that we can build on them in the future. It will feel a hell of alot better when we finally win a Superbowl because we have waited so long. They are going to do it one day and I will be sitting there watching.
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Old 10-28-2008, 07:37 AM    (permalink
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I honestly think the greater frustration comes from the fact that it wasn't long ago that the Bengals were at the top of the Division and looking for long term success with a coach (at the time) who appeared to have exactly what this team had been waiting for.

Fast forward to this 0-8 nightmare and what you have is the despair of having a team with talent that is HORRIBLY underachieving. Yes, I believe they have the talent, yes, I believe they should be doing better than they are, yes, I believe they will be improved next year with a healthy Carson and the picks that will come at the top of each round.

All that being said, we have a right to b*tch and moan even more in my book, because of that lack of production and the appearent lazy attitude that this team brings to the field each week. I still wear my jerseys and support this team, but I will also come here to share my disgust because at least here (if nowhere else) I have people that understand my pain.

Are there things that will improve with this team ?? Yes, but I refuse to be the homer that takes a big whiff of a pile of sh*t and tell you how much it smells like roses. Oh yeah, I have my tickets for the Chiefs game when I am home for Christmas and I will be there rooting that we don't go 0-16. No, I'm NOT selling them !!!
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Old 10-28-2008, 09:44 AM    (permalink
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Ehh that whole "drafting them two rounds early" is just pure speculation. The only one I can think of off the top of my head that was blatantly obvious was probably Frostee. But even if we did take him early I like what I see from him (now if he could just be healthy). Overpaying Odom was probably a bad move but we'll see with some time. And just because Mel Kiper or Scott Wright say their value is at a certain point doesn't mean the scouts in the NFL do(but then again our lack of a scouting department may play into that). By all accounts the Steelers were gonna jump all over Jerome Simpson had we not taken him. I wouldn't call him much of a reach as he has probably the freakiest measurables at WR in that draft. Drafting in recent years (aside from character issues) from a talent standpoint has not been very bad. I remember when it was much, much worse. Even if we have "reached" for some players we have also found good value in the later rounds to kind of even that out.

The talent is there, the coaching and the tenacity is not. The defense has seen some improvement and is not far away from being a solid unit. It's obvious the team just doesn't have much confidence in Marvin anymore. I've never really questioned this team's heart, but now I think I am starting to do just that.
I think Keiwan Ratliff who was a 4.6 CB taken in Rd 2 was way too high, I think the problem people he has taken proved WHY others passed on them and WHY we should have. As far as finding some talent in later rounds, I agree BUT, other teams find quality players in early and late rounds. I saw Charlie Casserly on TV the other day and he stated that a 3rd rd pick becomes a starter in this league only 30% of the time and move on down the % from there as the draft goes on, so you have to hit big on the early rounds. How many All-Pros have we on this club after all of the early picking over the years?????
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Old 10-28-2008, 06:20 PM    (permalink
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As much as we want to analyze it, the draft really is pretty much a crapshoot. We've done ok in my book in recent years and if it weren't for unfortunate injuries/drafting bad character we'd probably be in a much better place right now. We have TWO 7th rounders on this team that are VERY good players. TJ is an All-Pro caliber type player and I for one think Ndukwe will be.

I don't think drafting is really our big concern at this point. I think if someone actually went and looked at it I'd say we've drafted rather well considering our lack of a scouting department/GM. We need to bring in a coach not unlike Mike Zimmer who is going to light a fire under this teams ass like Marvin did when he first got here. We need some more pieces(OL,DL, LB) but the biggest piece we need is a HC.
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Old 10-28-2008, 07:50 PM    (permalink
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Zimmer for HC. Then we could pick up San Diego's ex-DC. We would have all kinds of fire being lit under the team's ass.
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Old 10-28-2008, 11:10 PM    (permalink
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The thing is, we all knew we would fall down drastically with Fitzpatrick at QB... That was a given. However, to be getting stomped like this and unable to even win a game is just ridiculous. They've given up, no matter what the situation that is unacceptable.

There obviously need to be massive changes, will they happen? I've never been one to say Marvin is amazing or anything but he's not the root of our concerns. With that said, it couldn't get worse with anyone else. We need someone to take control of the locker room.

The talent is here, I'm honestly not concerned with that... It's just the atmosphere is slipping to the level that it was pre-Marvin. Part of what made the '03 team have such a great turn around was the change in atmosphere.... This is what we need once again. I feel with the right changes (not exactly linked to players) this team could easily make the playoffs next year. We don't have a ton of holes and have high draft picks.

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Old 10-29-2008, 08:43 AM    (permalink
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There is always the question of when Marvin leaves do you believe the new coach will have success if Mike Brown is still the owner ?? Many think not, but at 0-8, does it get worse ??

I'm not in the locker room or the front office meetings, so I won't go into Marvin losing the locker room or how things actually go, but you can't tell me that something isn't wrong when players just don't appear to give a sh*t when they walk on the field. When Marvin says "the effort is there", I have to wonder if he keeps his eyes open when he is on the sidelines during a game ??
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Old 10-29-2008, 10:29 PM    (permalink
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I agree.

While I think we'll always be limited long term by ownership there's no way this team should be 0-8. I know we're going to suck with Fitzpatrick but don't tell me we can't win at least 2-3 games. Losing Marvin would be nothing but a positive.

I really can't say I think he'll be gone though, you know how Brown works.
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Old 10-29-2008, 11:01 PM    (permalink
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The only real reason I could see Lewis being let go is tons of public attention gets directed at Brown and the organization, thus forcing him to fire him. Other than that, I think he's too cheap to do it by himself without some outside pressure.
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Old 10-30-2008, 08:06 AM    (permalink
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We (this organization ) go thru this same scenerio about every 5-6 years. Why anyone would think there could be massive change is beyond me. We'll see a new OC maybe. I betcha we see nothing else change unless maybe he hires another retiree friend of his and labels him a scout as long as the guy promises to agree with everything MB says.
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Old 10-30-2008, 10:53 AM    (permalink
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A massive change in my mind would be Mike Brown selling the team to a local group. Or him dying and taking his god forsaken children with him.
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Old 10-30-2008, 10:54 AM    (permalink
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Or him dying and taking his god forsaken children with him.
Wow, and I thought I hated the guy !!!
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Old 10-30-2008, 03:42 PM    (permalink
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A massive change in my mind would be Mike Brown selling the team to a local group. Or him dying and taking his god forsaken children with him.
Is there anyone out there that would buy the team? It would be sweet if all the Cincy fans out there could put all their money together and buy the team. That would cause alot of probs though I would bet. Would be cool if the city of Cincy could buy the team.
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Old 10-30-2008, 05:43 PM    (permalink
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When I make my fortune I will purchase the team.
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Old 10-30-2008, 08:31 PM    (permalink
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Would be cool if the city of Cincy could buy the team.
Like Green Bay? That would be awesome.
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:32 AM    (permalink
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PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.PalmerToCJ is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
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It sucks so bad to know he has family waiting to take over. We can only hope that they sell it but it's not happening.

I wish Castellini owned the Bengals. He would get the job done, it's a whole lot easier to turn around a football team than a baseball team. If we had our own Jocketty and an owner that's at least not a penny pincher.... sigh.... no sense in dreaming.
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Old 10-31-2008, 01:02 PM    (permalink
themaninblack
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themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.themaninblack is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
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Sucks living in a city that is so talented at the amateur level in many different sports including football and baseball only to have very (at least recently in the Reds case) weak pro franchises.
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Old 10-31-2008, 01:08 PM    (permalink
hobbes2053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themaninblack View Post
Sucks living in a city that is so talented at the amateur level in many different sports including football and baseball only to have very (at least recently in the Reds case) weak pro franchises.
You speaketh the truth.
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